Goku, Nappa and Z fighters vs. Vegeta

All Saiyan Saga Z fighters + Nappa

Saiyan Saga Vegeta

Nappa decides to betray Vegeta, and he teams up with the Z-fighters to help defeat Vegeta. Goku wants his buds to get some experience, so decides not to use kaio-ken.

-Completely in-character, as in Saiyan Saga

-Z-fighters do not do battle with Nappa or Saibamen; Nappa joins them instantly

-Victory by death or bfr via retreat (as in Saiyan Saga); suicide counts as a tie/stalemate

-Fight in the same wasteland as in the Saiyan Saga

Scenario 1:

Goku is there from the beginning of the battle

No kaio-ken

Scenario 2:

Goku arrives five minutes into the battle

No kaio-ken

Scenario 3:

Goku is there from the beginning

Nappa and Gohan's tails are cut off

Goku can use kaio-ken

Spite.

R1 team stomps

R2 vegeta wins

R3 team stomps

Team all rounds.

1, Vegeta stomp

2. Vegeta stomp

3. Close fight, it would be Goku vs Vegeta all over again, the others would be barely any help.

lol, I get the first guy claim spite and then a bunch of mixed responses. Sign of a good thread?

@amendment50: Well let's see... Goku is really the only person here who can give a healthy Vegeta a good fight. Not giving him Kaioken until round 3 would tip the scale in Vegeta's favor by a large margin imo. It also doesn't help that Vegeta can transform whenever he sees fit.

So the first 2 rounds would be a stomp in Vegeta's favor.

The last round would be a stomp in the teams favor.

Either way, it seems like a mismatch to me.

Team.

Oh I didn't see the no kaioken Vegeta wins round 2.

I don't see Vegeta winning unless he manages to go Great Ape. Even then, Gohan and Nappa will as well, and Vegeta can still have his tail removed like he had happen in the real fight. Round 1 goes to team.

Round 2 is a lot harder. If Vegeta were bloodlusted instead of enjoying battle then it would be a guaranteed victory for him, but in-character, I think 5 minutes will not be too much of a problem...tough call, 50/50.

Round 3 is a stomp, team wins with ease.

Scenario 1: They all die a horrible death.

Scenario 2: Goku arrives after everyone dies a horrible death. He to dies a horrible death.

Scenario 3: They beat Vegeta. But Vegeta turns Oozaru and they all die a horrible death

I don't know, would all the others even help Goku? They would as likely hurt him if they tried to help against Vegeta, they would all be 1 shots for Vegeta, i see Goku taking hits he otherwise wouldn't protecting people that have zero chance to hit Vegeta, if they did land a hit against him it would do almost no damage. Rnd 3 = Goku vs Vegeta

Oh, and 1 last thing. Goku couldn't match Vegeta without using Kaioken× 3.

1: Vegeta

2: Team

3: Team

Vegeta ~ 18,000

Goku ~ 8,000 - One shot range

Nappa ~ 4,00 - One shot range

Everyone else ~ Fodder

@alphapunk: The others could be useful in round 3, since Goku would have Kaioken. After Goku and Vegeta had their fight, all it took was Gohan, Krillin and Yajirobe to tip the scale in their favor. Since Nappa is stronger than all of the Z fighters, he could definitely help out if Vegeta becomes tired. Since Goku has no Kaioken in the first 2 rounds, I don't see them doing much against a full power Vegeta.

That's just my opinion though.

Fodder? Lol. Solar Flare and Destructo disc say hi.

Power Levels alone don't dictate how battle turn out. Goku could do what he did against Raditz and hold Vegeta in place (maybe after a Solar Flare) and then Destructo Disc can cut them both in half.

Vegeta told Nappa to avoid the Disc. Not a valid argument.

Solar Flare didn't work against Nappa and wasn't useful in the Saiyan Saga. It won't work against Vegeta whose 4x+ stronger. Also not a valid argument.

Goku only did that after Gohan (who had a PL of 1,307) severely damaged Radditz (1,500) enough to make him weak enough to hold. Nobody is close enough in power to do this. Also not a valid argument.

When has the numbers advantage ever worked in DBZ? Oh yeah...

Vegeta almost stomps the first 2 rounds because Goku (the strongest fighter there) won't have a chance without Kaio-ken besides the Spirit Bomb which isn't a guaranteed option if Vegeta hits him while gathering the energy or if Goku doesn't use the Solar Flare enough.

I'll give the third round to the Team, but Vegeta could get the chance to use Oozaru which would make him stomp.

There's a lot of factors based on how smart the characters fight tho which is hard to pinpoint cause of frequent CIS.

What does Vegeta telling Nappa to avoid something have to do with anything?

Solar Flare worked on Frieza (1,000,000+ PL) when Krillin (75,000 max) used it on him. Solar Flare would work, I don't know where you are getting that it wouldn't. Also, Goku used it on Vegeta, IIRC. Maybe both of those were anime only, which people don't like to use, I don't recall. If so, then I still think they can win without it. Goku didn't need it to get hold of Raditz afterall.

Gohan did do good damage to Raditz, but he wasn't crippled. Android 16, well below Cell's power, held Cell. I see zero reason for Goku not to hold Vegeta. Valid argument.

@irhp87: Goku used Solar flare on Vegeta in the manga.

Android #16 was about the same as Cell.

If you watch DBZ you'll realise numbers help F all

17 stated all the Z warriors could beat 18.

Frieza states Zarbon & Dodoria could beat Vegeta, who was stronger at the time.

Whiss states Goku & Vegeta could beat Beerus & Golden Frieza if they fight together.

Happy?

a) It means Vegeta is aware of the attack. It won't work.

b) Grabbing Vegeta's trail is useless. Piccolo tried it. He almost went into a comma.

e) Cell stated in the Manga that 16's attack wouldn't do anything and presumes to effortlessly shoot him away. Not a valid argument.

Rnd 1 and 2 aren't even up for debate in my books.

Rnd 3 though could go so many ways, it comes down to: Is Nappa and the others going to help Goku or actually hurt his chances, being in character he will no doubt be taking powerful blasts to protect his friends, Vegeta will no doubt take full advantage, this could enrage Goku as well so i really don't know. I see them as more of a handicap for Goku who already was beat by Vegeta on Earth.

With Goku not using Kaio Ken they can't beat Vegeta, sorry but it's the simple truth.

Yeah, this is one of the reasons I hate DBZ threads.

@pr0d1gy: Statements aren't feats m8. Numbers in DBZ really only amount to distractions. If someone is vastly more powerful, numbers don't count for jack.

Even with the others in play. Vegeta only need grab Gohan and Goku won't do shit.

There's a reason why Goku wanted to fight Vegeta by himself. That and everyone else is fodder.

It worked when they beat Vegeta the first time lol

I understand, some people just aren't awesome enough to handle the Dragon Ball hype. Best anime in the world and whatnot.

@keenko: lol, You're here though.

Statements in the manga are true until contradicted. But thanks for your opinion anyways.

Round 1- team stomps.

Round 2- team barely. The other fighters lose but make vegeta use some energy.

Round 3- team stomps.

They hold validity in the original Manga.

Nice try though.

POWER LEVELS ARE NOT A LAUGHING MATTER

They actually mattered quite a lot in the Saiyan and Namek saga.

@nickzambuto:

>implying dbz is better than boku no picu

@thedarkpaladin: Eh, occassionally theyre can be good debates in here but too many people use power levels and ridiculous power scaling.

@keenko: I agree. Power scaling is definitely iffy.

lul nerd

@pr0d1gy: @solarpowered: @amendment50:They are still bullshit. Even tho they are valid

Anyone with DBZ knowledge knows Vegeta stomps first 2 rounds, wins a tough battle third round after going Oozaru (at which point he stomps).

Round 1 - Too tough to call, could go either way, if team manages to win (through Kienzan, Makkako Sanpo or Genki Dama) most of the z fighters will have died.

Round 2 - Vegeta, he will toy for a while, but when his scouters tells him the PL of the approaching Goku he will kill everyone fast and then dispatch Goku.

Round 3 - I don't get it, Its the canon fight again, but with nappa, picollo, tien and yamcha helping, team with less casualties than canon.

Rounds 1 and 2: Goku doesn't get KK. He has no chance of doing anything to Vegeta. It took literally 3x Goku's power to stalemate Vegeta. Without it he might as well be Nappa.

Round 3: Gohan and Nappa get their tail cut off. That mean no Gohan going Oozaru, which in itself wasn't even enough to beat Vegeta. Also, there's no Yajirobe, so it's debatable that once Vegeta goes Oozaru that he will be stopped in the first place, but even if he does get his tail cut off again, he has enough power to down everyone bar Nappa for sure. That's if he doesn't already kill/cripple Nappa before then.

Round 1 - He still gets the Genki Dama, an incomplete one failed to kill him but trashed him, a complete one might do the trick or trash him harder. At this point in the series numbers still made a difference (vegeta's downfall were gohan, krillin and yajirobe)

Round 3 - It says "All Saiyan Saga Z fighters + Nappa", im counting yajirobe in that group.

Awareness doesn't nullify anything. It could work.

I didn't say anything about grabbing Vegeta's tail, just removing it.

I'm not talking about Android 16's attack, I'm talking about Android 16 keeping him in place in order TO attack him. He was only equal to Cell's first form, he wasn't anywhere near as strong as Perfect Cell yet was able to hold him in place long enough to apologize to his allies and attempt to kill Cell. Cell is trapped and looks scared, he cannot immediately escape and is in the hold for a few pages. I will post the scared looking Cell page only at the end of my post.

Admit it, you're wrong. Awareness of a technique means nothing if you're immobilized, and he doesn't even know they have it anyway in this scenario. Also,.weaker characters CAN hold stronger characters long enough for at least one attack.

vegeta stomp in all rounds.

This, and raditz was also weakened due to tail grabbing.

Agreed with you.

@amendment50 add raditz here too. then we have a fair battle.