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#1 Posted by Sci_Fi_Rulez (1059 posts) - - Show Bio

Using EU of both characters and using current superman and green latern

Random encounter

Rules:

-Hand to Hand and weapon combat,Luke and Sidious equipped with their Lightsabers

-All at full strength

-All powers and abilities on

-No prep time,Everything is set

-Morals on

-No blood lusted

and

vs

and

Battle Location:Down Town Los Angeles

#2 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't see team 2 doing anything if Luke achieves Oneness. That being said, Superman could speedblitz Sids, but he would just possess him afterwards.

#3 Posted by WillPayton (9035 posts) - - Show Bio

How many midi-chlorians does Hal have? LOL...

#4 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton said:

How many midi-chlorians does Hal have? LOL...

NONE.... :D

#5 Posted by Sci_Fi_Rulez (1059 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton said:

How many midi-chlorians does Hal have? LOL...

From my knowledge from Darth Sidious he can create force storms that will suck Green Latern,Thats kind of a one shot or he can use force fear and have him driven insane.I could be wrong though

#6 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sci_Fi_Rulez: He can but I don't think he will. Speedblitz or wormhole or possession are going to be his main tools.

#7 Posted by WillPayton (9035 posts) - - Show Bio

I was hoping that just mentioning midi-chlorians would mean that no one would take the rest of this thread seriously... but I seemed to have failed.

Oh well, on with the discussion I guess.

#8 Posted by Sci_Fi_Rulez (1059 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@Sci_Fi_Rulez: He can but I don't think he will. Speedblitz or wormhole or possession are going to be his main tools.

Does Luke have crazy speedblitz too?I heard he fought Sidious in the EU or something that and he was too fast and it showed like 20 of himself.

#9 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton said:

I was hoping that just mentioning midi-chlorians would mean that no one would take the rest of this thread seriously... but I seemed to have failed.

Oh well, on with the discussion I guess.

I do hate the entire concept of Midi-Chlorians, good thing it was abandoned mainly in the EU.

@Sci_Fi_Rulez said:

@ShootingNova said:

@Sci_Fi_Rulez: He can but I don't think he will. Speedblitz or wormhole or possession are going to be his main tools.

Does Luke have crazy speedblitz too?I heard he fought Sidious in the EU or something that and he was too fast and it showed like 20 of himself.

He moves just as fast as Sidious, both moving at near-relativistic speeds. Perhaps later in his prime he may have been faster.

#10 Edited by Sci_Fi_Rulez (1059 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@WillPayton said:

I was hoping that just mentioning midi-chlorians would mean that no one would take the rest of this thread seriously... but I seemed to have failed.

Oh well, on with the discussion I guess.

I do hate the entire concept of Midi-Chlorians, good thing it was abandoned mainly in the EU.

@Sci_Fi_Rulez said:

@ShootingNova said:

@Sci_Fi_Rulez: He can but I don't think he will. Speedblitz or wormhole or possession are going to be his main tools.

Does Luke have crazy speedblitz too?I heard he fought Sidious in the EU or something that and he was too fast and it showed like 20 of himself.

He moves just as fast as Sidious, both moving at near-relativistic speeds. Perhaps later in his prime he may have been faster.

nice...Oh plus Darth Sidious knows Sith magic too.

#11 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sci_Fi_Rulez: And Sith Alchemy also. And is a master of both.

#12 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman and Green Lantern.

#13 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: What' stopping Superman from getting possessed as soon as he kills Palpatine?

#14 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

For 1 Green Lantern and number 2, doesn't pre new 52 Superman have a protective aura?

#15 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: That doesn't stop him. Sidious mind-wiped 20 billion people instantly, created wormholes that rip through time-space continuum and destroy fleets/planets/moons and moves at near-relativistic speeds, so does Luke. Luke knocks over AT-AT's with a single push, can shut down his presence so nobody knows he exists (unless he wants them to) and has instakill Electric Judgment. If Luke achieves Oneness, team 2 gets owned.

#16 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman has resisted mental attacks and body possesion from the likes of Brainiac, Manchester Black, Despero, and Maxima to name a few. I also think it depends on what universe this is taking place in. There is no reason to believe that the SW characters powers would be as effective in an alternate universe. Same goes for the DC guys. Also didn't Superman defeat Dominus, a high end reality warper? Supes won't go down easy!

#17 Edited by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: They will be as effective in any universe. They have instakilled beings who have been cut off from the Force and are from different galaxies and are supposedly immune to it. Supes can't resist someone who has mindwiped an entire world's populace of 20 billion with a mere wave of his hand. Palatine's wormholes will become insta-kills if he can cast them. Luke's Electric Judgement also. If Luke achieves Oneness, he can defeat either of Team 2.

#18 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@DrEgonSpengler: They will be as effective in any universe. They have instakilled beings who have been cut off from the Force and are from different galaxies and are supposedly immune to it. Supes can't resist someone who has mindwiped an entire world's populace of 20 billion with a mere wave of his hand. Palatine's wormholes will become insta-kills if he can cast them. Luke's Electric Judgement also. If Luke achieves Oneness, he can defeat either of Team 2.

I was under the impression that Electric Judgement was just the lightside version of Force Lightning. Does it have superior feats? I doubt Force Lightning would slow Superman down too much or even get through GL's force field.

If the Superman team hits them hard and fast they could take them out, but I don't see them resisting Sidious' telepathic attacks for long. As this fight isn't blood lusted I think I'd side with the SW team.

#19 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: Bloodlusted or not, Sidious' spirit possesses either of team 2 when he dies and Luke's spirit can harass them. If Luke achieves Oneness, he can maybe solo, but can definitely beat either of team 2.

Electric Judgement has been used by Luke as an instakill.

#20 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

How do you know this? A different galaxy is not the same as an alternate universe, there would be no telling how their abilities would be effected. Also I don't recall SW characters ever encountering a being as physically powerful or as fast and durable as Superman. The guy held a black whole in the palm of his hand. Also even if someone waves their hand and mindwipes a populace of 20 billion doesn't mean it would work on Superman who is more than your average joe.

#21 Edited by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: SW beings still move at near-relativstic speeds. Superman can't hurt spirits. If Luke achieves Oneness, he can defeat him. Of course Superman isn't my average person but he isn't more than twenty billion. Sidious did that effortlessly. He could do much, much better.

Luke has manipulated Black Holes (not black wholes) and crushed in upon itself.

OP is using EU feats, neutral universe unless stated otherwise, the Force will still be there.

#22 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman stomps.

#23 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

How?

#24 Edited by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@Baldy: Bloodlusted or not, Sidious' spirit possesses either of team 2 when he dies and Luke's spirit can harass them. If Luke achieves Oneness, he can maybe solo, but can definitely beat either of team 2.

Electric Judgement has been used by Luke as an instakill.

I only remember he using it once against the Vong and you can't really compare a Vong's durability with Superman. If the battle is blood lusted the the Emperor would get heat vision through his brain before he can think, never mind body swap. He might have exceptionally good reflexes with the force, but not on the scale of Superman.

@DrEgonSpengler said:

How do you know this? A different galaxy is not the same as an alternate universe, there would be no telling how their abilities would be effected. Also I don't recall SW characters ever encountering a being as physically powerful or as fast and durable as Superman. The guy held a black whole in the palm of his hand. Also even if someone waves their hand and mindwipes a populace of 20 billion doesn't mean it would work on Superman who is more than your average joe.

Your argument is nonsense. By your logic how can we know that GL's ring would have any effect on the SW characters? Or that Superman would retain his powers in the SW universe.

In a battle you have to assume, unless stipulated otherwise, that all characters abilities are at full effect.

Also, there is no point pretending that Superman is immune to mind control. I just have to point at Max Lord toying with Superman to prove that isn't the case.

#25 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

Fail.

#26 Edited by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: Of course it won't instakill Superman, but it can do something is my point.

Its not body swap. When he dies, his spirit is anchored to someone nearby (Superman, GL) and he possesses them. They aren't hurting his spirit, it took all the Jedi in the present and the past to overpower Sidious. They don't even possess a connection to the Force.... If Luke enters a state of Oneness, he could potentially solo.

Plus Palpatine could potentially already see that long before it happened and reacted already.

#27 Posted by HBKTimHBK (5240 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler said:

For 1 Green Lantern and number 2, doesn't pre new 52 Superman have a protective aura?

Too bad this battle is using current Supes, which is New 52.

#28 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

How?

He steps on them...

#29 Edited by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam: And Sidious possesses him afterwards...

#30 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam: And Sidious possesses him afterwards...

How can you be so sure that would work?

#31 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@Baldy: Of course it won't instakill Superman, but it can do something is my point.

Its not body swap. When he dies, his spirit is anchored to someone nearby (Superman, GL) and he possesses them. They aren't hurting his spirit, it took all the Jedi in the present and the past to overpower Sidious. They don't even possess a connection to the Force.... If Luke enters a state of Oneness, he could potentially solo.

Plus Palpatine could potentially already see that long before it happened and reacted already.

No prep time, so Palpatine wouldn't be able to see it coming. It would just be a simple reaction time test. Not that it particularly matters here as the fight isn't blood lusted anyway.

Yeah sorry, I don't know why I said body-swap as the person involved doesn't get to live on in Palpatine's body, simple slip of words there. My point being that I don't know that he can do this after he'd been killed. Unfortunately, unless there is some example of him switching mind transfer targets after death or a direct mention to him starting the process after he'd been killed, it'd be difficult to prove either way.

I'm not sure Luke becoming one with the force is quite as easy as that, though if he did he would certainly be very powerful.

#32 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam: Because he is anchored to any nearby presence. His essence hits Superman, he lives inside Superman. Considering his presence turned a world of growth into a dark side nexus, it might boost him a little also.

#33 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam said:

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

How?

He steps on them...

How could he possibly do that if he's busy being mind wiped by one of the most powerful telepaths to exist in the SW universe?

#34 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: Umm.....

There are examples. He possesses clone after clone after clone after he has been killed.

Luke entering Oneness is going to be rare, but if he did.....

#35 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

I dont think posession is necessarily going to work. As I stated before on the other page, Superman has resisted things like that before.

#36 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy said:

@AweSam said:

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

How?

He steps on them...

How could he possibly do that if he's busy being mind wiped by one of the most powerful telepaths to exist in the SW universe?

Superman could speedblitz any telepath

#37 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam: Not while he's fighting Luke.

#38 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: And he isn't going to do that against a person who instantly controls others through essence.

#39 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@Baldy: Umm.....

There are examples. He possesses clone after clone after clone after he has been killed.

Luke entering Oneness is going to be rare, but if he did.....

I'm aware of this, but he possessed a clone before he went on and possessed another one, and was thus alive in the time before changing targets.

@AweSam said:

@Baldy said:

@AweSam said:

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam said:

Superman stomps.

How?

He steps on them...

How could he possibly do that if he's busy being mind wiped by one of the most powerful telepaths to exist in the SW universe?

Superman could speedblitz any telepath

Oh right, I guess this is why he loses every fight against Martain Manhunter. Oh wait....

Also, this isn't a blood lusted battle.

You might gain more traction on your argument if they didn't consist of a single sentence that blatantly ignores the rules of the battle.

#40 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: No, that was him simply transferring his essence. He can do so after death also because it has been stated.

#41 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam: Not while he's fighting Luke.

While Hal watches?

@Baldy: Martian Manhunter can match his strength and speed. He doesn't sit there trying to mess with Superman's head.

#42 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam:So Hal goes at relativistic speeds now? He could also be dominated mentally by Sidious.

#43 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler said:

I dont think posession is necessarily going to work. As I stated before on the other page, Superman has resisted things like that before.

Oh, whew, you should probably tell Batman that. He'll be glad to know that his almost getting beaten to death by a mind controlled Superman was apparently a day dream.

@AweSam said:

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam: Not while he's fighting Luke.

While Hal watches?

@Baldy: Martian Manhunter can match his strength and speed. He doesn't sit there trying to mess with Superman's head.

What do you mean trying? Palpatine is so powerful telepathically that he was personally controlling the entire fleet outside of Endor while still being able to screw with Luke and Vader. To the degree that when his control stopped the fleet crumbled almost instantly.

Just look at Joruus when he tried the same thing, he could barely speak when he was doing it and all he did was link them up to improve performance.

#44 Posted by DrEgonSpengler (473 posts) - - Show Bio

Assuming that will work on kryptonian biology which is from another universe. SW has never encountered a being like him. Possession is the taking over of someone's body and mind by another entity. But its pretty well known that certain people who are strong willed can resist and dispell posession. Has Luke tried this on a kryptonian like Superman before?

#45 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: He effortlessly dominated the minds of an entire world with a populace of 20 billion also.....

#46 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler: They have encountered worse beings.

#47 Posted by AweSam (7360 posts) - - Show Bio

@ShootingNova said:

@AweSam:So Hal goes at relativistic speeds now? He could also be dominated mentally by Sidious.

Lantern can block telepathic attacks.

@Baldy: I don't know anything about the EU version, I'm just trying to get a good argument out of you guys instead of "he possesses him".

#48 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam:So? Sidious effortlessly owned people who can resist telepathic attacks. He effortlessly owned 20 billion people simultaneously.

#49 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio

@DrEgonSpengler said:

Assuming that will work on kryptonian biology which is from another universe. SW has never encountered a being like him. Possession is the taking over of someone's body and mind by another entity. But its pretty well known that certain people who are strong willed can resist and dispell posession. Has Luke tried this on a kryptonian like Superman before?

Yeah, he's tried it on a Kryptonian, you know... the race that doesn't even exist in SW.

Are you for real?

You keep ignoring the fact that Max Lord owned Superman, and he's nowhere near as powerful as Sidious.

@ShootingNova said:

@Baldy: He effortlessly dominated the minds of an entire world with a populace of 20 billion also.....

Yeah I know, but that'd been mentioned before so I thought I'd throw another feat in there.

#50 Posted by ShootingNova (15239 posts) - - Show Bio

@Baldy: Well, okay.