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#1 Posted by KingOfAsh (3621 posts) - - Show Bio

Who do you think wins?

#2 Posted by Stompa (1291 posts) - - Show Bio

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

#3 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (18816 posts) - - Show Bio

This is interesting.. I will sit out and see how this plays out..

#4 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

#5 Posted by HereComesTheBoom_Headshot (321 posts) - - Show Bio

Probably Franklin.

#6 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio
#7 Posted by Stompa (1291 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

And usually plays around and comments about how great he is before grabbing around on some boobs......and a Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping but it can´t simply stop it entirely.

#8 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

And usually plays around and comments about how great he is before grabbing around on some boobs......and a Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping but it can´t simply stop it entirely.

Please, stop it with this "in character" nonsense. Don't try to use the things that DS does in the manga for gag comedy as a realistic depiction of how he would fight in a real battle. I never understood why people try to use "in character" arguments as a reason why someone would win by fiat. In character arguments are what people use when they realize a weaker character will lose if the stronger character fights to the best of their ability. Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway. If you genuinely want to make a match to see who would win, then it's common sense to assume that each side is fighting to the best of their abilities and trying to win the fight. And if DS takes somebody seriously, like he did to Konron and Uriel the fight will be over before Franklin Richards can blink.

Also, if Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping, what's the point of claiming it can't stop reality warping? Even if what you say was true it wouldn't help Franklin in this fight because Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping.

#9 Edited by Stompa (1291 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

And usually plays around and comments about how great he is before grabbing around on some boobs......and a Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping but it can´t simply stop it entirely.

Please, stop it with this "in character" nonsense. Don't try to use the things that DS does in the manga for gag comedy as a realistic depiction of how he would fight in a real battle. I never understood why people try to use "in character" arguments as a reason why someone would win by fiat. In character arguments are what people use when they realize a weaker character will lose if the stronger character fights to the best of their ability. Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway. If you genuinely want to make a match to see who would win, then it's common sense to assume that each side is fighting to the best of their abilities and trying to win the fight. And if DS takes somebody seriously, like he did to Konron and Uriel the fight will be over before Franklin Richards can blink.

Also, if Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping, what's the point of claiming it can't stop reality warping? Even if what you say was true it wouldn't help Franklin in this fight because Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping.

Please stop to adjust battle forum rules to make this a stomp. Battle forum rules state that characters will fight "in character" unless otherwise stated so please check the OP is it otherwise stated? No? Wow then it is in character and thus means his more showings of taking a fight not seriously compared to two speedblitzes makes it unlikely this will happen. Yes as i said it protects but dispel bounds have been destroyed before when an attack was hitting them so you would just need enough raw power to breach the bounds and you can hurt Schneider so i don´t see why it would be impossible.

#10 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

And usually plays around and comments about how great he is before grabbing around on some boobs......and a Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping but it can´t simply stop it entirely.

Please, stop it with this "in character" nonsense. Don't try to use the things that DS does in the manga for gag comedy as a realistic depiction of how he would fight in a real battle. I never understood why people try to use "in character" arguments as a reason why someone would win by fiat. In character arguments are what people use when they realize a weaker character will lose if the stronger character fights to the best of their ability. Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway. If you genuinely want to make a match to see who would win, then it's common sense to assume that each side is fighting to the best of their abilities and trying to win the fight. And if DS takes somebody seriously, like he did to Konron and Uriel the fight will be over before Franklin Richards can blink.

Also, if Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping, what's the point of claiming it can't stop reality warping? Even if what you say was true it wouldn't help Franklin in this fight because Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping.

Please stop to adjust battle forum rules to make this a stomp. Battle forum rules state that characters will fight "in character" unless otherwise stated so please check the OP is it otherwise stated? No? Wow then it is in character and thus means his more showings of taking a fight not seriously compared to two speedblitzes makes it unlikely this will happen. Yes as i said it protects but dispel bounds have been destroyed before when an attack was hitting them so you would just need enough raw power to breach the bounds and you can hurt Schneider so i don´t see why it would be impossible.

Like I said before, PIS and CIS are always turned off. It doesn't matter if this is specified in the OP or not. You can't use a character's idiosyncrasies as reasons why they would lose a fight. It defeats the purpose of verses matches to decide who would win a fight, not based on the combatants' actual abilities, but based on whether or not they'll start the fight by performing gag comedy. It's disingenuous and silly.

Moreover, you're abusing what "in character" means. In character doesn't mean that a character acts exactly as they do in their respective fictional universes, otherwise turning off CIS would contradict what it means for someone to be "in character." In character refers to how a character fights (their battle strategy, for example), what kind of morals they have, etc. You can't abuse the "in character" rule by arguing that D.S. will give gag comedy speeches. Like I said before, people like you abuse the "in character" rule as a way to slither out of scenarios where one opponent is clearly superior to the other opponent and will win if they start the fight using their full abilities.

Second, even if it was true that DS has only ever speed blitzed two times, so what? If DS has speed blitzed then you can't argue that it's out of his character to speed blitz. So, you're flat out contradicting yourself.

Furthermore, in his most recent incarnation, i.e., in his most recent fights DS has speed blitzed. He did it to both Konron and Fallen Uriel. Which means that going by his most recent characterization, it's more reasonable to conclude that DS will speed blitz as soon as the fight starts. And I would argue that given how Dispel Bound works DS must speed blitz because he has to use Dispel Bound before his opponents attack him.

Edit:

I never said that Dispel Bound can protect you from all reality warping or that Dispel Bound couldn't be broken. That would be a no limits fallacy. You can break Dispel Bound, Fallen Uriel did it to Majin Dark Schneider in their fight. But it's clear that you need at least galaxy busting level power. And even then Majin Dark Schneider wasn't even K.O.'d by Fallen Uriel's attack. He was bleeding, but he got right back up and summoned the DKL, which puts immense stress on the user's physical, astral, and spiritual body. And on top of all this, DS went on to beat Fallen Uriel even after Uriel became 130x more powerful.

#11 Edited by Stompa (1291 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

@uberhikari said:

@stompa said:

In character Franklin wins reality warping should take care of Schneider. Schneiders only chance would be a speedblitz but that would be out of character.

You're clearly wrong on both counts. Dark Schneider speed blitzed both Konron and Fallen Uriel. And Dispel Bound stops reality warping.

And usually plays around and comments about how great he is before grabbing around on some boobs......and a Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping but it can´t simply stop it entirely.

Please, stop it with this "in character" nonsense. Don't try to use the things that DS does in the manga for gag comedy as a realistic depiction of how he would fight in a real battle. I never understood why people try to use "in character" arguments as a reason why someone would win by fiat. In character arguments are what people use when they realize a weaker character will lose if the stronger character fights to the best of their ability. Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway. If you genuinely want to make a match to see who would win, then it's common sense to assume that each side is fighting to the best of their abilities and trying to win the fight. And if DS takes somebody seriously, like he did to Konron and Uriel the fight will be over before Franklin Richards can blink.

Also, if Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping, what's the point of claiming it can't stop reality warping? Even if what you say was true it wouldn't help Franklin in this fight because Dispel Bound protects you from reality warping.

Please stop to adjust battle forum rules to make this a stomp. Battle forum rules state that characters will fight "in character" unless otherwise stated so please check the OP is it otherwise stated? No? Wow then it is in character and thus means his more showings of taking a fight not seriously compared to two speedblitzes makes it unlikely this will happen. Yes as i said it protects but dispel bounds have been destroyed before when an attack was hitting them so you would just need enough raw power to breach the bounds and you can hurt Schneider so i don´t see why it would be impossible.

Like I said before, PIS and CIS are always turned off. It doesn't matter if this is specified in the OP or not. You can't use a character's idiosyncrasies as reasons why they would lose a fight. It defeats the purpose of verses matches to decide who would win a fight, not based on the combatants' actual abilities, but based on whether or not they'll start the fight by performing gag comedy. It's disingenuous and silly.

Moreover, you're abusing what "in character" means. In character doesn't mean that a character acts exactly as they do in their respective fictional universes, otherwise turning off CIS would contradict what it means for someone to be "in character." In character refers to how a character fights (their battle strategy, for example), what kind of morals they have, etc. You can't abuse the "in character" rule by arguing that D.S. will give gag comedy speeches. Like I said before, people like you abuse the "in character" rule as a way to slither out of scenarios where one opponent is clearly superior to the other opponent and will win if they start the fight using their full abilities.

Second, even if it was true that DS has only ever speed blitzed two times, so what? If DS has speed blitzed then you can't argue that it's out of his character to speed blitz. So, you're flat out contradicting yourself.

Furthermore, in his most recent incarnation, i.e., in his most recent fights DS has speed blitzed. He did it to both Konron and Fallen Uriel. Which means that going by his most recent characterization, it's more reasonable to conclude that DS will speed blitz as soon as the fight starts. And I would argue that given how Dispel Bound works DS must speed blitz because he has to use Dispel Bound before his opponents attack him.

DS not only makes gag comedy he is an arrogant ass that on a regular basis underestimates everybody and everything. If something is written on a regular basis it´s neither PIS nor CIS it´s just how this character is. I think the future Franklin from the picture has the raw power to use his reality warp on DS even through his bounds but of course it´s out of the question that if DS uses his superior reaction and speed he just shoots one Helloween and it´s over.

#12 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@stompa: I'm starting to think that you haven't read Bastard!! in quite a long time, because you seem confused. It's true that D.S. is arrogant, but exactly when has he underestimated somebody? And when has his underestimation ever caused him to lose a fight? Going by the biggest battles he's had, he didn't do it with Gara, Abigail, Kallsu, Konron, or Fallen Uriel. So what exactly are you talking about? In his fight with Abigail the fight didn't last more than a couple of minutes before he used Led Zeppelin, which summons starving souls from Hell to devour everything inside the spell bound. He's started his fights by blowing chunks off people's body, like when he used Vegeance against that Cyclops and when that didn't work he used Black Sabbath, which is basically a pocket nuke.

Second, I've already explained that because of the way Dispel Bound works, DS will use it as soon as the fight starts because he has to have Dispel Bound in place to protect himself from his opponent's spells. That's the way Dispel Bound works.

Third, again, PIS and CIS is turned off. CIS is defined as character induced stupidity, and it includes everything about a person's character that doesn't allow them to use their full abilities in a fight. This includes, arrogance, giving speeches, gag comedy, holding your power back for plot purposes, forgetting you have certain powers (a la Flash), etc. For the last time, you can't use idiosyncrasies in somebody's character as a justification for why they would lose a fight. It's an abuse of the "in character" rule.

#13 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

Adult FR wins

#14 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

#15 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

#16 Posted by Dredeuced (5724 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

He's actually quite a bit more powerful than Galactus.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

#17 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

@rolldestroyer said:

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

He's actually quite a bit more powerful than Galactus.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

that's why i said he's above galactus.......

when someone is above galactus we could only assume that their reaction time should be superb

#18 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@dredeuced said:

@rolldestroyer said:

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

He's actually quite a bit more powerful than Galactus.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

that's why i said he's above galactus.......

when someone is above galactus we could only assume that their reaction time should be superb

Franklin Richards is just a human, right? He has normal human speed and durability, he just has hax reality warping powers.

#19 Edited by Dredeuced (5724 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: I think his ability to react to the Mad Celestials trying to blast him, at bare minimum, gives him near light speed operational ability.

#20 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

correct, however he is a very powerful reality warper, and he has very good control of his powers unlike the kid version.

#21 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

correct, however he is a very powerful reality warper, and he has very good control of his powers unlike the kid version.

Well, then DS wins via speed blitz.

@uberhikari: I think his ability to react to the Mad Celestials trying to blast him, at bare minimum, gives him near light speed operational ability.

DS is at least several thousand times FTL, with the ability to exchange millions of FTL blows per second.

#22 Posted by X_insignia1 (1394 posts) - - Show Bio

@rolldestroyer said:

@dredeuced said:

@rolldestroyer said:

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

He's actually quite a bit more powerful than Galactus.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

that's why i said he's above galactus.......

when someone is above galactus we could only assume that their reaction time should be superb

Franklin Richards is just a human, right? He has normal human speed and durability, he just has hax reality warping powers.

He has more than just reality warping, I don't see durability nor reaction time being anything to him. The fact that he was capable of tanking multiple blast from the mad Celestials is that he wills his durability to whatever he wishes. Not familiar with Dark Schneider, however Franklin has a lot going for him. And there may be something more to him, it was stated that he is eventually to become a Cosmic force/abstract and usher in the new Universe after this one perishes, so you can add immortality too.

#23 Edited by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

no he won't because FR can amp his speed, strength, etc...

#24 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

@dredeuced said:

@rolldestroyer said:

@uberhikari said:

@rolldestroyer said:

Adult FR wins

Franklin Richards gets speed blitzed and dies.

hardly, adult FR is above cosmic entities as powerful as galactus.

He's actually quite a bit more powerful than Galactus.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

that's why i said he's above galactus.......

when someone is above galactus we could only assume that their reaction time should be superb

Franklin Richards is just a human, right? He has normal human speed and durability, he just has hax reality warping powers.

He has more than just reality warping, I don't see durability nor reaction time being anything to him. The fact that he was capable of tanking multiple blast from the mad Celestials is that he wills his durability to whatever he wishes. Not familiar with Dark Schneider, however Franklin has a lot going for him. And there may be something more to him, it was stated that he is eventually to become a Cosmic force/abstract and usher in the new Universe after this one perishes, so you can add immortality too.

yeah i just posted that he can amp his stats, he has also shown that he can instantly amp his strength destroying a mad celestial.

#25 Edited by jashro44 (22911 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway.

No. The battle forum rules state CIS is on. They fight within the limits of there personality unless stated otherwise.

PIS and CIS

Determining what is done for the plot and what is done because of the characters involved can be hard for some people. Superman is a prime case. In comics, Superman rarely uses his speed offensively. This is done for plot, to prolong the story and make it interesting (though it can also be said that it's a part of his character and not done solely because it benefits the story). In comics, Superman doesn’t kill. He does not spare his enemies because of the plot, he spares them because it’s part of his character not to kill thanks to how he was raised. In battles on the forum we include CIS, but not PIS, so Superman uses his speed but generally doesn’t kill unless otherwise stated. (“Bloodlust”)

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/battle-forum-rules-please-read-for-more-informatio-675391/?page=1#1

#26 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@x_insignia1: @rolldestroyer:

Alright, the only way this is going to be resolved is if you guys start posting scans. You people keep saying that reaction time means nothing to him and he can amp his durability. But unless Franklin Richards has confirmed feats of being able to react at massively FTL speeds during combat, then he gets speed blitzed by DS. It's really that simple. In the first micro-second of the fight DS speeds blitzes at massively FTL speeds and kills Franklin Richards before he can think or react, and there are lots of spells DS can use to get the job done. We're talking about spells that erase a person's soul, spirit, and physical body from existence.

#27 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

@uberhikari:

Plus, PIS and CIS are turned off anyway.

No. The battle forum rules state CIS is on. They fight within the limits of there personality unless stated otherwise.

PIS and CIS

Determining what is done for the plot and what is done because of the characters involved can be hard for some people. Superman is a prime case. In comics, Superman rarely uses his speed offensively. This is done for plot, to prolong the story and make it interesting (though it can also be said that it's a part of his character and not done solely because it benefits the story). In comics, Superman doesn’t kill. He does not spare his enemies because of the plot, he spares them because it’s part of his character not to kill thanks to how he was raised. In battles on the forum we include CIS, but not PIS, so Superman uses his speed but generally doesn’t kill unless otherwise stated. (“Bloodlust”)

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/battle-forum-rules-please-read-for-more-informatio-675391/?page=1#1

Thanks. Now tell me where in the battle forums "within the limits of personality" is explicitly defined. I'll wait with baited breath... I've read that guide and it doesn't even define precisely what CIS is. Here's what the first paragraph under PIS and CIS actually says:

These are terms commonly used on battle forums on other sites and most of us know what they mean. For those who don’t, PIS is “plot induced stupidity” and CIS is “character induced stupidity”. PIS/”jobbing” is when a character loses for the sake of plot despite the fact that they should be able to win. CIS is when a character loses because an aspect of the character (usually a lack of intelligence) gets in his own way. Superman losing to Batman would be PIS is most cases since Superman is perfectly capable of beating Batman in a number of ways before he can react. Sandman losing to Spider-Man is CIS because Sandman isn’t all that smart so Spider-Man, who is less powerful and should be easy to beat, can outsmart him and find victory.

See the problem? First, if a character is not intelligent, i.e, they're not an adept battle strategist or tactician then that's not CIS, it just means the character is inherently stupid. Not being smart is a character limitation solely dependent upon the qualities that the writer gives the character. Hence, it's not CIS because it's not character induced, it's a limitation created by the writer. CIS is supposed to be stuff like a character forgetting that they have a power or not using the powers they have to there fullest extent or refusing to adopt a battle strategy even if it's more efficient.

Like I stated before, you can't abuse CIS by claiming that a character will stand around making gag comedy speeches. The outcome of versus matches can't be predicated on things that have nothing to do with a character's fighting abilities otherwise the "match" becomes a farce because you can make certain characters win or lose by fiat when it's clear that they would win if they use the full extent of their abilities.

#28 Posted by comic_book_fan (5716 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

it might stop franklyn from using his power on ds but he could use it on himself to give him self any power he needs to win he could become faster and stronger than ds or just make himself immune to anything ds can do if you want to remove charicter than feats and everything are thrown out and we just judge there powers and franklin's powers are he can do anything so by that there is no way he can lose.

#29 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

it might stop franklyn from using his power on ds but he could use it on himself to give him self any power he needs to win he could become faster and stronger than ds or just make himself immune to anything ds can do if you want to remove charicter than feats and everything are thrown out and we just judge there powers and franklin's powers are he can do anything so by that there is no way he can lose.

It doesn't matter if Franklin can amp his speed or power. He first has to start with his normal, human reaction speed and normal, human strength and normal, human durability. Dark Schneider doesn't have these limitations. Thus, Dark Schneider wins via speed blitz.

#30 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (18816 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari:

it might stop franklyn from using his power on ds but he could use it on himself to give him self any power he needs to win he could become faster and stronger than ds or just make himself immune to anything ds can do if you want to remove charicter than feats and everything are thrown out and we just judge there powers and franklin's powers are he can do anything so by that there is no way he can lose.

So, assuming ds will give him a chance, how will he make himself immune to spells that destroy your body, soul, etc?

#31 Edited by Hyper_God (933 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

But it's clear that you need at least galaxy busting level power.

Which is well-below the scale of power that Mister Franklin operates upon . Not to mention that he's defeated beings that have demonstrated resistance to reality warping themselves(the Mad Celestials) . So your entire argument fails .

Franklin wins easily , 1000000/10 .

Edit : I am not even sure that why you're claiming that Mister Franklin starts of with human level durability , when the on-panel evidence available at hand clearly tells us that his durability is very much superhuman .

#32 Posted by jashro44 (22911 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: I wasn't actually saying gag comedy speeches should be taken into account just that CIS is on in battle forums. I am not quite sure what you mean by gag comedy speeches and I haven't read Bastard!! so I wont comment on what is in character for Dark scheider but if you mean he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account.

#33 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

But it's clear that you need at least galaxy busting level power.

Which is well-below the scale of power that Mister Franklin operates upon . Not to mention that he's defeated beings that have demonstrated resistance to reality warping themselves(the Mad Celestials) . So your entire argument fails .

Franklin wins easily , 1000000/10 .

Edit : I am not even sure that why you're claiming that Mister Franklin starts of with human level durability , when the on-panel evidence available at hand clearly tells us that his durability is very much superhuman .

Listen, I understand that people in this thread think Franklin Richards is very strong and people want to wank for him very badly. I keep asking for scans and no one will provide them. People keep claiming that he starts the fight with "superhuman" durability or "superhuman" speed but no one will precisely specify what this means or provide scans to give me context. Dark Schneider is several thousand times FTL and he will speed blitz. And he has an arsenal of hax abilities: like erasing a person's soul, spirit, and physical body from existence. Show scans that Franklin Richards has defense against attacks designed to erase a person's spirit and soul from existence and this can be resolved.

Also, even if Franklin Richards can break DS's Dispel Bound, which I agree he can, if he can actually hit DS, I don't think it matters because: speed blitz for the win.

#34 Posted by Superbot400 (420 posts) - - Show Bio

@comic_book_fan said:

@uberhikari:

it might stop franklyn from using his power on ds but he could use it on himself to give him self any power he needs to win he could become faster and stronger than ds or just make himself immune to anything ds can do if you want to remove charicter than feats and everything are thrown out and we just judge there powers and franklin's powers are he can do anything so by that there is no way he can lose.

It doesn't matter if Franklin can amp his speed or power. He first has to start with his normal, human reaction speed and normal, human strength and normal, human durability. Dark Schneider doesn't have these limitations. Thus, Dark Schneider wins via speed blitz.

What exactly implies that Adult Franklin is just a human body? Even a Teen Franklin has shown to power to tank blasts from Galactus, Thing,etc.

#35 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

@uberhikari: I wasn't actually saying gag comedy speeches should be taken into account just that CIS is on in battle forums. I am not quite sure what you mean by gag comedy speeches and I haven't read Bastard!! so I wont comment on what is in character for Dark scheider but if you mean he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account.

Now you're just being inconsistent. First you say that CIS is on and that a character's personality should be taken into account but now you say if a character gives gag comedy speeches, which DS sometimes does, then that should not be taken into account. So, which one is it? Do you see the problem? You can quote the forum rules that say CIS is on, but there are two problems: CIS is not properly defined and precisely what constitutes CIS is very vaguely defined in the forum rules. You claim that "if he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account," but because CIS is not clearly defined in the rules and my definition of CIS is different, then I disagree.

#36 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@comic_book_fan said:

@uberhikari:

it might stop franklyn from using his power on ds but he could use it on himself to give him self any power he needs to win he could become faster and stronger than ds or just make himself immune to anything ds can do if you want to remove charicter than feats and everything are thrown out and we just judge there powers and franklin's powers are he can do anything so by that there is no way he can lose.

It doesn't matter if Franklin can amp his speed or power. He first has to start with his normal, human reaction speed and normal, human strength and normal, human durability. Dark Schneider doesn't have these limitations. Thus, Dark Schneider wins via speed blitz.

What exactly implies that Adult Franklin is just a human body? Even a Teen Franklin has shown to power to tank blasts from Galactus, Thing,etc.

Even if this is true, so what? Dark Schneider is still massively FTL, he will speed blitz, and Judas Priest bypasses physical durability.

#37 Posted by reikai (4352 posts) - - Show Bio

Blitz. So fast Raphael couldn't even see it.

Total and absolute removal of existence. Everything has one Eternal Atom, linking them to three realms of Mind (Astral), Body (Physical) and Soul (spiritual). Most things that die still exist in some form. But not if they are destroyed in all forms. That's what Judas Priest or Jude the Priest does.

#38 Posted by jashro44 (22911 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

@uberhikari: I wasn't actually saying gag comedy speeches should be taken into account just that CIS is on in battle forums. I am not quite sure what you mean by gag comedy speeches and I haven't read Bastard!! so I wont comment on what is in character for Dark scheider but if you mean he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account.

Now you're just being inconsistent. First you say that CIS is on and that a character's personality should be taken into account but now you say if a character gives gag comedy speeches, which DS sometimes does, then that should not be taken into account. So, which one is it? Do you see the problem? You can quote the forum rules that say CIS is on, but there are two problems: CIS is not properly defined and precisely what constitutes CIS is very vaguely defined in the forum rules. You claim that "if he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account," but because CIS is not clearly defined in the rules and my definition of CIS is different, then I disagree.

I should probably rephrase myself (apologies I am tired right now so my thoughts aren't 100% clear). What I meant to say with the first sentence is that I am not going to say these gag speeches are in character as I don't know what you mean by gag speeches. Are you talking about comic relief moments or is this trash talk? If its the latter its CIS.

As for CIS being defined is specifically says limits of the personality under the be specific about fights section. Anything that is apart of ones personality is CIS (morals, stupidity, arrogance, etc). If he isn't serious in his fights in the manga he wont be serious here.

When these things are left out it’s generally assumed that characters are fighting to the best of their ability but still within the limits of their personality, using their standard gear, have no prep time, and are their current mainstream versions. Their starting distance is close and the setting is most often a city. Without any specifications to a battle, those are what we go by. It’s always best to give as much information about the fight in the first post

#39 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

@uberhikari said:

@jashro44 said:

@uberhikari: I wasn't actually saying gag comedy speeches should be taken into account just that CIS is on in battle forums. I am not quite sure what you mean by gag comedy speeches and I haven't read Bastard!! so I wont comment on what is in character for Dark scheider but if you mean he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account.

Now you're just being inconsistent. First you say that CIS is on and that a character's personality should be taken into account but now you say if a character gives gag comedy speeches, which DS sometimes does, then that should not be taken into account. So, which one is it? Do you see the problem? You can quote the forum rules that say CIS is on, but there are two problems: CIS is not properly defined and precisely what constitutes CIS is very vaguely defined in the forum rules. You claim that "if he jokes around in a fight or messes around with a enemy then that is taken into account," but because CIS is not clearly defined in the rules and my definition of CIS is different, then I disagree.

I should probably rephrase myself (apologies I am tired right now so my thoughts aren't 100% clear). What I meant to say with the first sentence is that I am not going to say these gag speeches are in character as I don't know what you mean by gag speeches. Are you talking about comic relief moments or is this trash talk? If its the latter its CIS.

As for CIS being defined is specifically says limits of the personality under the be specific about fights section. Anything that is apart of ones personality is CIS (morals, stupidity, arrogance, etc). If he isn't serious in his fights in the manga he wont be serious here.

When these things are left out it’s generally assumed that characters are fighting to the best of their ability but still within the limits of their personality, using their standard gear, have no prep time, and are their current mainstream versions. Their starting distance is close and the setting is most often a city. Without any specifications to a battle, those are what we go by. It’s always best to give as much information about the fight in the first post

The problem isn't that you're being unclear: the reason why I find you confusing is that we have a fundamental disagreement over what constitutes CIS, what precisely CIS means, and what "within the limits of their personality" means. Like I've stated before, these things are NOT clearly defined in the forum rules, and as a result they're extremely ambiguous.

For example, on what grounds can you say that comic relief moments aren't CIS but trash talk is CIS? What definition of CIS are you using that allows you to say that? (Dark Schneider's gag comedy speeches are for comic relief, but they're also designed to be a reflection of his personality.) And, more importantly, whatever definition you're using is clearly NOT articulated in the battle forum rules themselves. Moreover, and most importantly, if you argue that a character would lose because they trash talk then the "battle" becomes a farce because it's being decided by something that has nothing to do with the fighting ability of the characters. I've had people argue against me that Thor would be unprepared for a fight because he would stand around giving speeches like he does in the comic books. See what I'm saying?

Furthermore, the only thing that's precisely stated to be CIS in the forum rules, i.e., stupidity, is something that is clearly NOT CIS from my standpoint. Stupidity is not CIS because it's something inherent to a character. Intelligence in terms of battle tactics and strategy is a component of a character's battle ability. If a character isn't good at developing effective strategies or tactics during battle, you can't claim CIS. You can only say that the character doesn't have a very high battle intelligence. Now, if characters forget that they have abilities or don't use them to their fullest extent, that's CIS. Stupidity isn't character induced, it's a specific quality a writer gives a character; forgetting abilities or not using them to their fullest extent is character induced forgetfulness for plot purposes.

Finally, the very paragraph you quote from the forum rules is inconsistent. The forum rules state:

It's generally assumed that characters are fighting to the best of their abilities but still within the limits of their personality.

First question: What exactly does this mean? What exactly does "but still within the limits of their personality" mean? And what if fighting "within the limits of their personality" actually hinders a character from fighting to the best of their ability? For example, if a character loses fights because of arrogance are we to assume that the character is fighting to the best of their ability but in a way that doesn't allow them to fight to the best of their ability? That's a flat out contradiction. This is why when I argue in versus matches I assume that characters are fighting to the best of their ability but "in character," i.e., with their morals, using battle strategies they would realistically use, etc. I don't take things like Thor giving speeches or arrogance into account because then it would saddle some characters with disadvantages by fiat, and that seems ridiculous especially when saddling characters with disadvantages have absolutely nothing to do with their fighting ability. It seems silly to determine the outcome of a hypothetical fight using CIS because by definition CIS is something writers use for specific plot purposes and versus matches aren't part of a plot.

#40 Edited by Superbot400 (420 posts) - - Show Bio

[quote] Listen, I understand that people in this thread think Franklin Richards is very strong and people want to wank for him very badly. [/quote]

Wankery. It's more like you don't read or understand the character at all.

Franklin Richard has shown to be more powerful than Mephisto in his own realm. Mephisto battle with Galactus destroyed mutiple galaxies through the universal, Galactus, and he is capable of fighting Celesitals. He is so powerful that he was capable of creating a baby universe, and destroying timelines, among other things. He was said to have enough power to destroy a universe. On top of that, he is capable of manipulating

Mephisto, Galactus, Celestials are galaxy busters at their mininium. They have damaged the universe when he got to batttle. The fact that Franklin Richard is said to be more powerful suggests you are underrating signficantly.

[quote] People keep claiming that he starts the fight with "superhuman" durability or "superhuman" speed but no one will precisely specify what this means or provide scans to give me context.[/quote]

Why do just read the comics themselves, instead of making crap up?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/118428/2243860-fantasticfour_604_thegroup_010.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/118428/2243861-fantasticfour_604_thegroup_011.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11/118428/2243862-fantasticfour_604_thegroup_012.jpg

Does that look like Franklin Richard doesn't have superhuman durability. Why would a being capable to Celestials, beings that are more powerful than the cosmic cube not having superhuman durability. It doesn't make sense at all.

Even then there was time when Franklin Richard suivived being in a coma, Survived overpowered attack that defeated Inhumans and The Avengers at the same time.

[quote]

Dark Schneider is several thousand times FTL and he will speed blitz.[/quote]

How is that going to kill Franklin Richard those? He is existentially god. He is on par with a Celestial, and essentially more.. Which is a uber-cosmic cube with powers that are infinte.

[quote] And he has an arsenal of hax abilities: like erasing a person's soul, spirit, and physical body from existence.[/quote]

How is that going to work on somebody like Franklin Richard? He is capable of creating a universe, destroying one, and even ressurecting a cosmic enitity like Galactus. Or somebody can defeat Mephisto, who can also warp realty, steals, erases people from existance?

Franklin Richard has existentially survived going to hell mutiple times. The devil cannot take his soul.

[quote]

Also, even if Franklin Richards can break DS's Dispel Bound, which I agree he can, if he can actually hit DS, I don't think it matters because: speed blitz for the win.[/quote]

What suggests Franklin Richard will die from from speed blitz. Why would that work on somebody who tank blasts characters that devastate time, space, galaxies, or the universe?

[quote] Even if this is true, so what? Dark Schneider is still massively FTL, he will speed blitz, and Judas Priest bypasses physical durability.[/quote]

Why would that work on a character that fight cosmic beings, who not have ridiculous durabiilty. Especially since that he is a rivial to Celestial. Which

I don't see why Franklin Richard couldn't be either given that he can do anything he wants. . Franklin Richard creates a entire universe, and is nearly powerful enough to destroy one.

#41 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@superbot400:

Franklin Richards is very powerful...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards has infinite power...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards is stronger than Celestials...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards can do whatever he wants...blah, blah, blah. *sniffle, sniffle*

Thank you for all these wonderful no limit fallacies. Are you done? I still haven't seen any scans that show Franklin Richards has either combat or reaction speed that puts him anywhere near several thousand times FTL. DS doesn't even need to use incantations to cast his spells; he casts them telepathically. Franklin Richards is a human. He has a spirit, right? He has a soul, right? Then Judas Priest can erase him from existence. I'm still waiting for those scans showing that Franklin Richards can't be soul or spirit f*cked.

Edit: I understand that you find it incredulous that Franklin Richards can be beaten, but incredulity is not a substitute for a good argument.

#42 Edited by Superbot400 (420 posts) - - Show Bio

Thank you for all these wonderful no limit fallacies.

What limit fallacies? Stop skpping my posts, and read the arguments that I have suggest to you.

1. Celestial have the power to destroy galaxalies, create universes, do anything that cosmic cubes could do.

2. Franklin Richard tanked a blast from Celestials. Which makes superhuman

3. He has super strength by damaging the Celestials.

In addition Franklin Richard likely has a form of hyper space like power due to his powers being similar to Celestials. There is no reason to believe that Franklin Richard wouldn't have godlike regen, and among other things.

I still haven't seen any scans that show Franklin Richards has either combat or reaction speed that puts him anywhere near several thousand times FTL.

You haven't shown a damn thing that would suggest that DS has any 1000x FTL Speed blitz, or is Speedblitz happy. You don't have any scans of that.Even if He could speedblitz, that's not really going to matter to a being that can tanks blasts from Celestials like they are nothing.

DS doesn't even need to use incantations to cast his spells; he casts them telepathically.

Franklin Richard has psionic powers, he can affect DS if he tries to do that. That's not going to work.

Franklin Richards is a human.

He is not a regular human, and he is mutant with godlike power. Reailty Warping mutants are not easy to kill.

He has a spirit, right? He has a soul, right? Then Judas Priest can erase him from existence

. I'm still waiting for those scans showing that Franklin Richards can't be soul or spirit f*cked.

So you going to completely ignore the fact that Franklin Richard that defeated Mephisto, and that Mephisto couldn't destroy his soul? Mephisto is a hell lord that control anybody souls that exist in his dimension. Galactus can control and manipulate souls, he cannot stop Franklin Richard. Cosmic Cube/Celestial can also manipulare reality itself. There is no reason to believe that Franklin Richard couldn't fight back.

Edit: I understand that you find it incredulous that Franklin Richards can be beaten, but incredulity is not a substitute for a good argument.

That's nice, but you haven't done anything, but skim from my arguments why Franklin Richard has a strong chance of winning.

#43 Edited by isaac_clarke (5448 posts) - - Show Bio

Franklin Richards has a lot more to his tool bag than just reality warping. And I somewhat doubt said DP has stopped anyone that makes universes under their bed-sheets.

That doesn't give him reaction time, though.

I'm not sure where you're getting that from. Simply reviving the World Devourer required his younger-part's power (energy stored up over months) and took him out of the fight for the most part.

#44 Edited by Dredeuced (5724 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke: I'd say he put up a better showing against the Celestials than Galactus did. I mean, not to mention making Galactus his herald as stated by the narration. Usually heralds are weaker than who they herald for :P

#45 Posted by Jezer (3129 posts) - - Show Bio

@superbot400:

Franklin Richards is very powerful...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards has infinite power...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards is stronger than Celestials...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards can do whatever he wants...blah, blah, blah. *sniffle, sniffle*

Thank you for all these wonderful no limit fallacies. Are you done? I still haven't seen any scans that show Franklin Richards has either combat or reaction speed that puts him anywhere near several thousand times FTL. DS doesn't even need to use incantations to cast his spells; he casts them telepathically. Franklin Richards is a human. He has a spirit, right? He has a soul, right? Then Judas Priest can erase him from existence. I'm still waiting for those scans showing that Franklin Richards can't be soul or spirit f*cked.

Edit: I understand that you find it incredulous that Franklin Richards can be beaten, but incredulity is not a substitute for a good argument.

It is not often you find a thread where the majority disagrees with someone--who goes on to dominate them all with his arguments. I approve.

However, there is a scan that can be used to refute your speedblitz argument. If I remember correctly, a scan of Franklin's powers naturally protecting him as a child from a Celestial attack, when he had no real control over his powers or was even conscious of them even attacking. The scan in question involves him asking, "why are they shooting flowers at me?" Let me go Google it up

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/5/51088/2874196-franklin_richards_flower_power.jpg

His confusion implies that, at least in terms of protection, he does not always have to make a conscious choice for his powers to work. If we consider this true, and that his powers passively protect him, it can be argued that they will protect him from the speedblitz despite not thinking consciously fast enough to activate his powers. It can also be argued that the speed of the attack wouldn't matter as the protection is not connected to him registering it happening, and there's no reason to believe that his powers working independent(somehow conscious?) of him are limited by the speed of anything since its not a physical entity.

As for your question of whether Franklin's powers could protect more than his physical body, I remember there being a scan of the Beyonder fighting the Celestials and him remarking on the fight happening on so many levels other than the physical and wishing other people could observe. It probably can't be used though. I would also bring up Mephisto fighting Galactus in his hell realm, and bring any evidence that Mephisto attacks in other ways such as spiritually(if there is any) and then make a comparison of Galactus's level of power to Franklins, but I'm not invested enough in this debate and I shouldn't even be posting considering how many tests and projects I have due as Finals on the same day...

#46 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@jezer said:

@uberhikari said:

@superbot400:

Franklin Richards is very powerful...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards has infinite power...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards is stronger than Celestials...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards can do whatever he wants...blah, blah, blah. *sniffle, sniffle*

Thank you for all these wonderful no limit fallacies. Are you done? I still haven't seen any scans that show Franklin Richards has either combat or reaction speed that puts him anywhere near several thousand times FTL. DS doesn't even need to use incantations to cast his spells; he casts them telepathically. Franklin Richards is a human. He has a spirit, right? He has a soul, right? Then Judas Priest can erase him from existence. I'm still waiting for those scans showing that Franklin Richards can't be soul or spirit f*cked.

Edit: I understand that you find it incredulous that Franklin Richards can be beaten, but incredulity is not a substitute for a good argument.

It is not often you find a thread where the majority disagrees with someone--who goes on to dominate them all with his arguments. I approve.

However, there is a scan that can be used to refute your speedblitz argument. If I remember correctly, a scan of Franklin's powers naturally protecting him as a child from a Celestial attack, when he had no real control over his powers or was even conscious of them even attacking. The scan in question involves him asking, "why are they shooting flowers at me?" Let me go Google it up

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/5/51088/2874196-franklin_richards_flower_power.jpg

His confusion implies that, at least in terms of protection, he does not always have to make a conscious choice for his powers to work. If we consider this true, and that his powers passively protect him, it can be argued that they will protect him from the speedblitz despite not thinking consciously fast enough to activate his powers. It can also be argued that the speed of the attack wouldn't matter as the protection is not connected to him registering it happening, and there's no reason to believe that his powers working independent(somehow conscious?) of him are limited by the speed of anything since its not a physical entity.

As for your question of whether Franklin's powers could protect more than his physical body, I remember there being a scan of the Beyonder fighting the Celestials and him remarking on the fight happening on so many levels other than the physical and wishing other people could observe. It probably can't be used though. I would also bring up Mephisto fighting Galactus in his hell realm, and bring any evidence that Mephisto attacks in other ways such as spiritually(if there is any) and then make a comparison of Galactus's level of power to Franklins, but I'm not invested enough in this debate and I shouldn't even be posting considering how many tests and projects I have due as Finals on the same day...

If this is true, then DS gets stomped and we can all go home, lol. The only thing DS has over Franklin is speed and ridiculous hax like Judas Priest or Bloodstone, which creates a cursed space that makes Dark Schneider's opponent also take any damage that he receives from them. But if Franklin's powers protect him subconsciously, then the fight is over before it starts.

Thanks for the info.

#47 Posted by Jezer (3129 posts) - - Show Bio

@jezer said:

@uberhikari said:

@superbot400:

Franklin Richards is very powerful...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards has infinite power...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards is stronger than Celestials...blah, blah, blah...Franklin Richards can do whatever he wants...blah, blah, blah. *sniffle, sniffle*

Thank you for all these wonderful no limit fallacies. Are you done? I still haven't seen any scans that show Franklin Richards has either combat or reaction speed that puts him anywhere near several thousand times FTL. DS doesn't even need to use incantations to cast his spells; he casts them telepathically. Franklin Richards is a human. He has a spirit, right? He has a soul, right? Then Judas Priest can erase him from existence. I'm still waiting for those scans showing that Franklin Richards can't be soul or spirit f*cked.

Edit: I understand that you find it incredulous that Franklin Richards can be beaten, but incredulity is not a substitute for a good argument.

It is not often you find a thread where the majority disagrees with someone--who goes on to dominate them all with his arguments. I approve.

However, there is a scan that can be used to refute your speedblitz argument. If I remember correctly, a scan of Franklin's powers naturally protecting him as a child from a Celestial attack, when he had no real control over his powers or was even conscious of them even attacking. The scan in question involves him asking, "why are they shooting flowers at me?" Let me go Google it up

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/5/51088/2874196-franklin_richards_flower_power.jpg

His confusion implies that, at least in terms of protection, he does not always have to make a conscious choice for his powers to work. If we consider this true, and that his powers passively protect him, it can be argued that they will protect him from the speedblitz despite not thinking consciously fast enough to activate his powers. It can also be argued that the speed of the attack wouldn't matter as the protection is not connected to him registering it happening, and there's no reason to believe that his powers working independent(somehow conscious?) of him are limited by the speed of anything since its not a physical entity.

As for your question of whether Franklin's powers could protect more than his physical body, I remember there being a scan of the Beyonder fighting the Celestials and him remarking on the fight happening on so many levels other than the physical and wishing other people could observe. It probably can't be used though. I would also bring up Mephisto fighting Galactus in his hell realm, and bring any evidence that Mephisto attacks in other ways such as spiritually(if there is any) and then make a comparison of Galactus's level of power to Franklins, but I'm not invested enough in this debate and I shouldn't even be posting considering how many tests and projects I have due as Finals on the same day...

If this is true, then DS gets stomped and we can all go home, lol. The only thing DS has over Franklin is speed and ridiculous hax like Judas Priest or Bloodstone, which creates a cursed space that makes Dark Schneider's opponent also take any damage that he receives from them. But if Franklin's powers protect him subconsciously, then the fight is over before it starts.

Thanks for the info.

Lol

Np. Thanks for making this thread entertaining to read/worth reading. Usually I step into battle threads and then my palm steps into my face.

#48 Posted by Dredeuced (5724 posts) - - Show Bio

@jezer: Wasn't Franklin specifically prepared for that attack, though? Like with forewarning and prep and knew the celestials were about to fire on him? I mean he's been kidnapped a dozen times, I don't think his powers always passively protect him.

Though maybe Adult Franklin is smart enough to keep his auto shields on.

#49 Posted by Jezer (3129 posts) - - Show Bio

@jezer: Wasn't Franklin specifically prepared for that attack, though? Like with forewarning and prep and knew the celestials were about to fire on him? I mean he's been kidnapped a dozen times, I don't think his powers always passively protect him.

Though maybe Adult Franklin is smart enough to keep his auto shields on.

I don't know, I was going based on my memory of the scan.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/5/51088/2874196-franklin_richards_flower_power.jpg

Was he forewarned/prepped in this situation? Do you have the rest of the panels surrounding it? The scan shows him completely unaware of the fact that his powers are working to protect him. "Why are there flowers growing out of you? Why are you shooting flowers?" Seems like it wasn't a conscious choice. If my interpretation is mistaken, correct me.

True. But there's a difference between being kidnapped and being attacked/in danger at that very moment.

#50 Edited by Dredeuced (5724 posts) - - Show Bio

@jezer said:

@dredeuced said:

@jezer: Wasn't Franklin specifically prepared for that attack, though? Like with forewarning and prep and knew the celestials were about to fire on him? I mean he's been kidnapped a dozen times, I don't think his powers always passively protect him.

Though maybe Adult Franklin is smart enough to keep his auto shields on.

I don't know, I was going based on my memory of the scan.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/5/51088/2874196-franklin_richards_flower_power.jpg

Was he forewarned/prepped in this situation? Do you have the rest of the panels surrounding it? The scan shows him completely unaware of the fact that his powers are working to protect him. "Why are there flowers growing out of you? Why are you shooting flowers?" Seems like it wasn't a conscious choice. If my interpretation is mistaken, correct me.

True. But there's a difference between being kidnapped and being attacked/in danger at that very moment.

Someone posted the entire ordeal on here before -- I think it might've been killemall -- to debunk the "he automatically has reality warping defense up" idea. It was in the Marvel Earth vs DC Earth thread when we were talking about DC Speedsters vs Kid Richards.