Flash vs. Quasar
@No_Trolling: with a day prep he can prepare for flash,hes not joker quasar and his quatum powers can protect him pretty good.
@Spartan101: How does his quantum powers protect him from his kinetic energy being stolen before he can react?
@Bo88gdan said:
@YoungJustice said:
Quasar
@NerdsFTW: Clearly ignoring the battle rules it's a stomp.
After reading the rules. New 52 flash can't do anything to hurt Quasar with shields up.
I don't see any flash speedstealing someone who draws all his speed from his Quantum Bands, which draw energy from the Quantum Zone....So where Flash can speed steal, Quasar can BFR, shield, trap, or drag him into the Quantum Zone where he's doomed.
Close fight because of the Flash's speed, but I gotta go with Quasar.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@Floopay said:
I don't see any flash speedstealing someone who draws all his speed from his Quantum Bands, which draw energy from the Quantum Zone....So where Flash can speed steal, Quasar can BFR, shield, trap, or drag him into the Quantum Zone where he's doomed.
Close fight because of the Flash's speed, but I gotta go with Quasar.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Quasar could do all those things, if he had enough time to act before Flash turned him into a statue.
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
I don't see any flash speedstealing someone who draws all his speed from his Quantum Bands, which draw energy from the Quantum Zone....So where Flash can speed steal, Quasar can BFR, shield, trap, or drag him into the Quantum Zone where he's doomed.
Close fight because of the Flash's speed, but I gotta go with Quasar.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Quasar could do all those things, if he had enough time to act before Flash turned him into a statue.
Yes speed stealing someone who has an unlimited supply of speed. Is this like dividing by 0?
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
I don't see any flash speedstealing someone who draws all his speed from his Quantum Bands, which draw energy from the Quantum Zone....So where Flash can speed steal, Quasar can BFR, shield, trap, or drag him into the Quantum Zone where he's doomed.
Close fight because of the Flash's speed, but I gotta go with Quasar.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Quasar could do all those things, if he had enough time to act before Flash turned him into a statue.
If you can provide me scans of Flash drawing almost an infinite amount of energy out of someone, then I might concede. But he's not speed stealing from Quasar, he's speed stealing from an entire universe of energy....Plus Quasar is about as fast as the Silver Surfer, and probably at least on par or faster than Superman and Wonder Woman. People always seem to think Flash is untouchable, but he has been defeated by people before, and even by people who are Green Lantern level of speed/reflexes...It just takes a powerful opponent to do so, and I think Quasar has what it takes.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@stonerthps said:
Yes speed stealing someone who has an unlimited supply of speed. Is this like dividing by 0?
@Floopay said:
If you can provide me scans of Flash drawing almost an infinite amount of energy out of someone, then I might concede. But he's not speed stealing from Quasar, he's speed stealing from an entire universe of energy....Plus Quasar is about as fast as the Silver Surfer, and probably at least on par or faster than Superman and Wonder Woman. People always seem to think Flash is untouchable, but he has been defeated by people before, and even by people who are Green Lantern level of speed/reflexes...It just takes a powerful opponent to do so, and I think Quasar has what it takes.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Speed-stealing AFAIK isnt about sucking energy from the target, it has to do with the speed force.
@WillPayton said:
@stonerthps said:
Yes speed stealing someone who has an unlimited supply of speed. Is this like dividing by 0?
@Floopay said:
If you can provide me scans of Flash drawing almost an infinite amount of energy out of someone, then I might concede. But he's not speed stealing from Quasar, he's speed stealing from an entire universe of energy....Plus Quasar is about as fast as the Silver Surfer, and probably at least on par or faster than Superman and Wonder Woman. People always seem to think Flash is untouchable, but he has been defeated by people before, and even by people who are Green Lantern level of speed/reflexes...It just takes a powerful opponent to do so, and I think Quasar has what it takes.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Speed-stealing AFAIK isnt about sucking energy from the target, it has to do with the speed force.
I understand that, but Quasar draws his speed and power from the Quantum Zone, something completely outside of the DCU. We have two forces going against each other.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@WillPayton said:
@stonerthps said:
Yes speed stealing someone who has an unlimited supply of speed. Is this like dividing by 0?
@Floopay said:
If you can provide me scans of Flash drawing almost an infinite amount of energy out of someone, then I might concede. But he's not speed stealing from Quasar, he's speed stealing from an entire universe of energy....Plus Quasar is about as fast as the Silver Surfer, and probably at least on par or faster than Superman and Wonder Woman. People always seem to think Flash is untouchable, but he has been defeated by people before, and even by people who are Green Lantern level of speed/reflexes...It just takes a powerful opponent to do so, and I think Quasar has what it takes.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Speed-stealing AFAIK isnt about sucking energy from the target, it has to do with the speed force.
Since that doesn't exist in MU does it contend here? I could also understand if he had ever tried it on someone who's speed was linked to something unlimited.
@Floopay said:
I understand that, but Quasar draws his speed and power from the Quantum Zone, something completely outside of the DCU. We have two forces going against each other.
Is Quasar infinitely fast? If not, then he gets speed-stolen to 0.
@stonerthps said:
Since that doesn't exist in MU does it contend here? I could also understand if he had ever tried it on someone who's speed was linked to something unlimited.
Why would the speed force not exist for this battle? Who said this battle takes place in the Marvel universe? And if so, what's the point of having a battle with Flash when Flash has no powers?
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
I understand that, but Quasar draws his speed and power from the Quantum Zone, something completely outside of the DCU. We have two forces going against each other.
Is Quasar infinitely fast? If not, then he gets speed-stolen to 0.
@stonerthps said:
Since that doesn't exist in MU does it contend here? I could also understand if he had ever tried it on someone who's speed was linked to something unlimited.
Why would the speed force not exist for this battle? Who said this battle takes place in the Marvel universe? And if so, what's the point of having a battle with Flash when Flash has no powers?
I'm saying he (Quasar) doesn't draw his speed from the Speed Force, and the Flash has zero feats showing the Speed Force capable of stealing powers from another force as strong as itself.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
I understand that, but Quasar draws his speed and power from the Quantum Zone, something completely outside of the DCU. We have two forces going against each other.
Is Quasar infinitely fast? If not, then he gets speed-stolen to 0.
@stonerthps said:
Since that doesn't exist in MU does it contend here? I could also understand if he had ever tried it on someone who's speed was linked to something unlimited.
Why would the speed force not exist for this battle? Who said this battle takes place in the Marvel universe? And if so, what's the point of having a battle with Flash when Flash has no powers?
Why would it reach 0? It can't there is an infinite amount of energy. He isn't speed stealing him to 0 from ∞
@stonerthps said:
@WillPayton said:
Why would the speed force not exist for this battle? Who said this battle takes place in the Marvel universe? And if so, what's the point of having a battle with Flash when Flash has no powers?
Why would it reach 0? It can't there is an infinite amount of energy. He isn't speed stealing him to 0 from ∞
My point is that speed-stealing doesnt work like that, he doesnt absorb or drain "energy" from people, just uses the speed force to slow them down. I could see it not working on someone who was infinitely fast, or was invulnerable to speed force manipulation, or had speed force powers himself, but if not then why wouldnt Flash just slow him down like he can anyone else?
@Floopay said:
I'm saying he (Quasar) doesn't draw his speed from the Speed Force, and the Flash has zero feats showing the Speed Force capable of stealing powers from another force as strong as itself.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
I dont really know how "strong" the source of Quasars power is compared to the speed force, or even what that means. All I know is that absorbing "speed" from people is what Flash can do. If Quasars speed is finite, then it seems reasonable to infer that speed stealing would work on him.
with prep quasar ... shield up ... energy drain ... game over. Quasar probably doesn't even have to move.
@WillPayton said:
@stonerthps said:
@WillPayton said:
Why would the speed force not exist for this battle? Who said this battle takes place in the Marvel universe? And if so, what's the point of having a battle with Flash when Flash has no powers?
Why would it reach 0? It can't there is an infinite amount of energy. He isn't speed stealing him to 0 from ∞
My point is that speed-stealing doesnt work like that, he doesnt absorb or drain "energy" from people, just uses the speed force to slow them down. I could see it not working on someone who was infinitely fast, or was invulnerable to speed force manipulation, or had speed force powers himself, but if not then why wouldnt Flash just slow him down like he can anyone else?
@Floopay said:
I'm saying he (Quasar) doesn't draw his speed from the Speed Force, and the Flash has zero feats showing the Speed Force capable of stealing powers from another force as strong as itself.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
I dont really know how "strong" the source of Quasars power is compared to the speed force, or even what that means. All I know is that absorbing "speed" from people is what Flash can do. If Quasars speed is finite, then it seems reasonable to infer that speed stealing would work on him.
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
However, Quasar can still beat Flash with any of the number of ways I've listed already.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Can i get some scans of Quasar's reaction time. People keep suggesting he's near Wally's level of speed.
@No_Trolling said:
Can i get some scans of Quasar's reaction time. People keep suggesting he's near Wally's level of speed.
Second I would also like to see scans I've seen someone say Quasar could put up shields before Flash could react.
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
That's like stating Quasar won't have any powers in this battle because the Quantom Zone doesn't exist there.
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Like you said, we don't know that, correct? Quasar's bands can be like Superboy Prime's resistance to magic. HIS resistance is because Magic didn't originate in his original Universe. but this is the battle boards, so assumptions like that are tossed away. Assumptions by which are the only arguement you have for Quasar.
@_Black said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
That's like stating Quasar won't have any powers in this battle because the Quantom Zone doesn't exist there.
Well it's not like saying that because I in no way indicated that Flash couldn't use any one of his other myriad of abilities, just stated that the Speed Force is not the thing that governs time in either of the two Universes he is up against.
However if we assume both are usable against one another then nobody has answered my question on how the Speed Force, which is time itself as nick stated, counteracts the Quantum Zone, which is all the potential energy in the Universe...Nobody has yet to answer that question. They have simply stated "The Speed Force would work" with no reasonings why. Has the Flash ever used this against another opponent with access to a source of power that was unlimited? Yes, he has used it on other speed force users, but has he done it to anyone who could obtain there powers through another unlimited source.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Like you said, we don't know that, correct? Quasar's bands can be like Superboy Prime's resistance to magic. HIS resistance is because Magic didn't originate in his original Universe. but this is the battle boards, so assumptions like that are tossed away. Assumptions by which are the only arguement you have for Quasar.
I've made a myriad of arguments in Quasar's defense. People assume the Flash can speed steal Quasar but the Flash has no feats proving that he can. Speedsters in the DC Universe draw their source of power from the Speed Source, do they not? Those who don't still are given their speed by their own merit.
Quasar falls under neither of these categories. He does NOT gain his speed through the speed force. And he is NOT that fast under his own strength. He is granted his speed and all his other powers through his Quantum Bands which draw their power from the Quantum Zone, a source of unlimited energy. That means Quasar's powers are driven by an energy source. Can you provide to me one scan or instance of the Flash affecting someone who was granted immense super human speed from a device which granted it's users these powers by drawing power from an unlimited power source that was completely unassociated with the speed force?
Still I have yet to see any argument as to how the Flash can get out of one of Quasar's shields, or get through one of Quasar's shields that he will use to defend himself. He can also teleport, and etc.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
@Floopay: There's a lot of assumptions in your posts. Flash hasn't stole speed from someone wearing something like the Quantum Bands yet Quasar has never defending against such a thing either. What if Flash turns him into a statue? Quasar couldn't think to even regain his speed since speedstealing is instantaneous.
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Like you said, we don't know that, correct? Quasar's bands can be like Superboy Prime's resistance to magic. HIS resistance is because Magic didn't originate in his original Universe. but this is the battle boards, so assumptions like that are tossed away. Assumptions by which are the only arguement you have for Quasar.
I've made a myriad of arguments in Quasar's defense. People assume the Flash can speed steal Quasar but the Flash has no feats proving that he can. Speedsters in the DC Universe draw their source of power from the Speed Source, do they not? Those who don't still are given their speed by their own merit.
Quasar falls under neither of these categories. He does NOT gain his speed through the speed force. And he is NOT that fast under his own strength. He is granted his speed and all his other powers through his Quantum Bands which draw their power from the Quantum Zone, a source of unlimited energy. That means Quasar's powers are driven by an energy source. Can you provide to me one scan or instance of the Flash affecting someone who was granted immense super human speed from a device which granted it's users these powers by drawing power from an unlimited power source that was completely unassociated with the speed force?
Still I have yet to see any argument as to how the Flash can get out of one of Quasar's shields, or get through one of Quasar's shields that he will use to defend himself. He can also teleport, and etc.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Uh... yes? He's absorbed the speed of the entire Earth before, and you're arguing that Flash can't steal speed from Quasar because it's "unlimited energy" :I
He wouldn't have to. provide a feat of his, where his shields activate faster than light speed, please? and Flash can go intangible, just so you know. though I do understand that his constructs have some inangability-proof, thing. Can that be explained?
@_Black said:
@Floopay: There's a lot of assumptions in your posts. Flash hasn't stole speed from someone wearing something like the Quantum Bands yet Quasar has never defending against such a thing either. What if Flash turns him into a statue? Quasar couldn't think to even regain his speed since speedstealing is instantaneous.
There is more assumption in yours. You think that flash can steal his speed when the reason he's able to do the things he does are connected to a limitless force. You can't subtract from infinity.
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Like you said, we don't know that, correct? Quasar's bands can be like Superboy Prime's resistance to magic. HIS resistance is because Magic didn't originate in his original Universe. but this is the battle boards, so assumptions like that are tossed away. Assumptions by which are the only arguement you have for Quasar.
I've made a myriad of arguments in Quasar's defense. People assume the Flash can speed steal Quasar but the Flash has no feats proving that he can. Speedsters in the DC Universe draw their source of power from the Speed Source, do they not? Those who don't still are given their speed by their own merit.
Quasar falls under neither of these categories. He does NOT gain his speed through the speed force. And he is NOT that fast under his own strength. He is granted his speed and all his other powers through his Quantum Bands which draw their power from the Quantum Zone, a source of unlimited energy. That means Quasar's powers are driven by an energy source. Can you provide to me one scan or instance of the Flash affecting someone who was granted immense super human speed from a device which granted it's users these powers by drawing power from an unlimited power source that was completely unassociated with the speed force?
Still I have yet to see any argument as to how the Flash can get out of one of Quasar's shields, or get through one of Quasar's shields that he will use to defend himself. He can also teleport, and etc.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Uh... yes? He's absorbed the speed of the entire Earth before, and you're arguing that Flash can't steal speed from Quasar because it's "unlimited energy" :I
He wouldn't have to. provide a feat of his, where his shields activate faster than light speed, please? and Flash can go intangible, just so you know. though I do understand that his constructs have some inangability-proof, thing. Can that be explained?
He can speed steal the entire Earth it doesn't change the fact that none of those characters were connected to something aside from the speed force that gives them their speed/kinetic momentum. Quasar is connected to the Quantam zone which gives him a limitless supply of speed constantly. Unless he loses the bands he isn't losing his speed. You can't subtract from infinity.
@stonerthps said:
@_Black said:
@Floopay: There's a lot of assumptions in your posts. Flash hasn't stole speed from someone wearing something like the Quantum Bands yet Quasar has never defending against such a thing either. What if Flash turns him into a statue? Quasar couldn't think to even regain his speed since speedstealing is instantaneous.
There is more assumption in yours. You think that flash can steal his speed when the reason he's able to do the things he does are connected to a limitless force. You can't subtract from infinity.
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@nickthedevil said:
@Floopay said:
@WillPayton said:
@Floopay said:
The Quantum Zone is filled with all the potential energy in the universe and it is limitless. Quasar draws all his powers and strengths from the Quantum Zone. Flash can try and speed steal Quasar, but the fact is his speed might not be unlimited, but the source he draws on to obtain that speed is. So he should have no problem maintaining his speed regardless of how much Flash is trying to "steal" it from him, because his speed will be drained and instantly replenished from it's source.
I'd be tempted to agree with you in principle, if the physics aligned in such a way that channeling unlimited energy into increasing speed could counter the speed force slowdown. But, if his power is contingent on him thinking about it, or performing some other action to do it, then also in theory Flash just slows him down to 0 and he cant even think to use his power. In reality, before he could think about it, he'd already be slowed down and be taking IMPs till he's dead.
He doesn't have to think about it to perform most of his feats. In fact, they have a series of automatic defenses (not useful against the Flash) that protect him against most forms of energy attacks. So not only do they enhance his abilities automatically, but they have several forms of defense that can occur without him thinking about it. And his shields have tanked hits from the entire Avengers (which included Thor, Hercules, She-Hulk, and like 20 other people). Plus he himself has taken hits from very powerful characters, and he's kept up with the Silver Surfer while they were going Light Speed+ and was able to dodge asteroids (having difficulties doing so) through astroid fields with only a bit of difficulty. So he has good reaction time.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Alright, let's skip right to it.
The Speed Force itself IS time. It IS reality. it's it's own dimension, and it exists in every dimension. it's a limitless concept, not restricted to being called just energy. Now, to what you were saying: there is significant proof that Flash can speed Steal. mostly, because he's stolen speed from not one, or two, but three speedsters, simultaneously.
All connected to his own Universe. He is going against someone outside of his Universe and the person he is going against is also outside of his Universe. The two of them are fighting on equal ground, and Speedforce has never made any showing in the Star Trek Universe which is where they are fighting, so he's not speed stealing Quasar, someone who is in no way, shape, or form connected to the Speed Force. In the Marvel Universe the Speed Force has no control over time, space, or anything along those lines.
Try a new argument.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Like you said, we don't know that, correct? Quasar's bands can be like Superboy Prime's resistance to magic. HIS resistance is because Magic didn't originate in his original Universe. but this is the battle boards, so assumptions like that are tossed away. Assumptions by which are the only arguement you have for Quasar.
I've made a myriad of arguments in Quasar's defense. People assume the Flash can speed steal Quasar but the Flash has no feats proving that he can. Speedsters in the DC Universe draw their source of power from the Speed Source, do they not? Those who don't still are given their speed by their own merit.
Quasar falls under neither of these categories. He does NOT gain his speed through the speed force. And he is NOT that fast under his own strength. He is granted his speed and all his other powers through his Quantum Bands which draw their power from the Quantum Zone, a source of unlimited energy. That means Quasar's powers are driven by an energy source. Can you provide to me one scan or instance of the Flash affecting someone who was granted immense super human speed from a device which granted it's users these powers by drawing power from an unlimited power source that was completely unassociated with the speed force?
Still I have yet to see any argument as to how the Flash can get out of one of Quasar's shields, or get through one of Quasar's shields that he will use to defend himself. He can also teleport, and etc.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
Uh... yes? He's absorbed the speed of the entire Earth before, and you're arguing that Flash can't steal speed from Quasar because it's "unlimited energy" :I
He wouldn't have to. provide a feat of his, where his shields activate faster than light speed, please? and Flash can go intangible, just so you know. though I do understand that his constructs have some inangability-proof, thing. Can that be explained?
He can speed steal the entire Earth it doesn't change the fact that none of those characters were connected to something aside from the speed force that gives them their speed/kinetic momentum. Quasar is connected to the Quantam zone which gives him a limitless supply of speed constantly. Unless he loses the bands he isn't losing his speed. You can't subtract from infinity.
And we go downhill from here....
He stops all molecular movement. you understand that right? Yes, they enhance his movements, but put the damn gauntlets on a stone, they won't enhance it's speed. why? because it isn't moving, that's why. He doesn't have to speed steal from the gauntlets, he speed steals from Quasar.
@nickthedevil:
This is him reacting and thinking at things while traveling at the speed of light. He is having difficulties, but he is most definitely doing it.
He can steal energy from others in order to reinforce the strength of his own shields. Two pages before this it entails how he was able to errect this shield in less than a nanosecond.
Creating Light Constructs capable of hassling Thor, and once he creates a light construct, he doesn't need to focus to keep it going, it just does it on his own.
He can also teleport.
Here's the scan I was talking about of the Avengers blasting his shield. YOu can see Thor's red cape in the top of the page, Colossus, Warforge (pre downgrade), She-Hulk, the Hulk, Wolverine, I think Wonderman (His pants are under Xavier's chair), and a bunch of others.
More constructs for Quasar...
Plain and simply: He can do more than just move fast, you're not taking into consideration any of his other feats. And again, Flash can speed steal him all day, but the Quantum Bands will keep supplying him the energy necessary for him to move and travel at the speeds he does. If you read the scans above it is clear that the bands are providing him all of his powers and allowing him to travel at the speed he does. He can easily create a barrier around himself and summon constructs to fight Flash all day.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
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