Flash vs Monica Rambeau

Fight takes place on Earth. Wally West is the Flash in this battle. Fighting for a K.O., Who wins?

Morals are on.

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Monica can win this actually.

@jeanroygrant said:

Monica can win this actually.

Good thing morals are on. If not....

Here we go...predicting this is gonna end up in a speed vs intangibility battle.

Monica FTW

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

@YourNeighborhoodComicGeeksaid:

@jeanroygrant said:

Monica can win this actually.

Good thing morals are on. If not....

Lol. That's why i said that.

@jeanroygrant said:

@YourNeighborhoodComicGeeksaid:

@jeanroygrant said:

Monica can win this actually.

Good thing morals are on. If not....

Lol. That's why i said that.

I know XD

@YourNeighborhoodComicGeeksaid:

@jeanroygrant said:

@YourNeighborhoodComicGeek said:

@jeanroygrant said:

Monica can win this actually.

Good thing morals are on. If not....

Lol. That's why i said that.

I know XD

Lol, who do you think wins?

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

@YoungJusticesaid:

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

So you've got nothing huh? Good to know.

But since your attempt to refute me with no facts, and your inability to provide any rationality while trying to only accept the ultimate in sourcing is silly; having some links with scans already in them. The second link has tons of scans covering the mass speed speed stealing, speed giving, vibrating, energy pulling, time travel, etc. And they're all Wally scans.

http://www.comicvine.com/wally-west/29-23879/wally-wests-top-speed-best-feats/92-598821/?page=2

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatmanvsWolverine/news/?a=48404

Wally West.

@rpottage said:

@YoungJusticesaid:

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

So you've got nothing huh? Good to know.

But since your attempt to refute me with no facts, and your inability to provide any rationality while trying to only accept the ultimate in sourcing is silly; having some links with scans already in them. The second link has tons of scans covering the mass speed speed stealing, speed giving, vibrating, energy pulling, time travel, etc. And they're all Wally scans.

http://www.comicvine.com/wally-west/29-23879/wally-wests-top-speed-best-feats/92-598821/?page=2

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatmanvsWolverine/news/?a=48404

Animated series arent cannon. We do not use Wikipedia as a source as info as it tends to be incorrect.

You dont need to school me on Flash because I know him well.

But the fact you think Flash stomps amazes me.

Pulsar goes from the moon and back in seconds.

Catches bullets easily.

Can speedblitz Quicksilver.

She can manipulate her size.

Can control the electromagnetic spectrum

Can phase

Goes llight speed.

Can become light.

Need I go on?

Wally West wins.

@rpottage said:

Animated series arent cannon. We do not use Wikipedia as a source as info as it tends to be incorrect.

@YoungJusticesaid:

So you've got nothing huh? Good to know.

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

Flash stomps.He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy formeven if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

@rpottage said:

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

But since your attempt to refute me with no facts, and your inability to provide any rationality while trying to only accept the ultimate in sourcing is silly; having some links with scans already in them. The second link has tons of scans covering the mass speed speed stealing, speed giving, vibrating, energy pulling, time travel, etc. And they're all Wally scans.

http://www.comicvine.com/wally-west/29-23879/wally-wests-top-speed-best-feats/92-598821/?page=2

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatmanvsWolverine/news/?a=48404

You dont need to school me on Flash because I know him well.

But the fact you think Flash stomps amazes me.

Pulsar goes from the moon and back in seconds.

Catches bullets easily.

Can speedblitz Quicksilver.

She can manipulate her size.

Can control the electromagnetic spectrum

Can phase

Goes llight speed.

Can become light.

Need I go on?

@YoungJustice said:

Yes, you do. Especially since I already pointed out her top speed was light speed and that the Flash is way faster (if you know about the Flash then you know Wally and Barry are said to be the only two people capable of outrunning death; and that Wally is said to be the fastest of the Flash's), as well as the fact I pointed out he can vibrate through things and disrupt them, as well as vibrate his molecules to create an unstable resonance (that's also simply science), etc. Meanwhile she's moving ten times slower than him.

So yeah, you do need to go on. You need a detailed rationale of how exactly you think she could beat him, bearing him mind everything I've pointed out as well as everything I haven't (like the infinite mass punch). Otherwise you've got nothing. You provided no case, and been unable to refute my points.

Photon goes invisible and kills wally.

Hmm can Wally speed steal light?

Because since Photon can go invisible and is energy I am not sure what Wally is going to do to her even if he is 10 times faster then light.

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

@YoungJusticesaid:

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

@rpottage said:

Flash stomps. He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy form even if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

So you've got nothing huh? Good to know.

But since your attempt to refute me with no facts, and your inability to provide any rationality while trying to only accept the ultimate in sourcing is silly; having some links with scans already in them. The second link has tons of scans covering the mass speed speed stealing, speed giving, vibrating, energy pulling, time travel, etc. And they're all Wally scans.

http://www.comicvine.com/wally-west/29-23879/wally-wests-top-speed-best-feats/92-598821/?page=2

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatmanvsWolverine/news/?a=48404

Animated series arent cannon. We do not use Wikipedia as a source as info as it tends to be incorrect.

You dont need to school me on Flash because I know him well.

But the fact you think Flash stomps amazes me.

Pulsar goes from the moon and back in seconds.

Catches bullets easily.

Can speedblitz Quicksilver.

She can manipulate her size.

Can control the electromagnetic spectrum

Can phase

Goes llight speed.

Can become light.

Need I go on?

Great scans. to add to it Monica is invisible and can fly. she can attack Wally at her leisure. He

will never know she's there until it's too late.Not to mention she can create "mini monica" by the

thousands who all have her powers.

Flash is not dodging thousands of INVISIBLE lightspeed energy beings at once.

never knew she was so powerful monica wins

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

@Phylos said:

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

A-MOTHERF**G- MAN

@Phylos said:

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

She is a powerful minority female. Why would they not sleep on her?

@Skaddix said:

@Phylos said:

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

She is a powerful minority female. Why would they not sleep on her?

Sad, but true. but also how do you use her? Name 4 marvel villains that are a match for her? She is either too powerful by far or not powerful enough to make a difference.

@Skaddix said:

@Phylos said:

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

She is a powerful minority female. Why would they not sleep on her?

@pooty said:

@Skaddix said:

@Phylos said:

Christ, why does Marvel sleep on Monica?

She is a powerful minority female. Why would they not sleep on her?

Sad, but true. but also how do you use her? Name 4 marvel villains that are a match for her? She is either too powerful by far or not powerful enough to make a difference.

Well other factors include

2. a dead cosmic sector (which might change)

3. marvel sucking at using energy manipulators correctly (see thor not using half his powers, strange nerfed, storm being lightning lass)

But I think I covered the 3 major issues but yeah aversion to powerful minorities and/or females tops the list.

@Skaddix: i can't disagree with one point you made. so for fun:

2. Assemble a "cosmic" team she would be good with

3. if Thor used all his powers then he couldn't be an avenger. he would be too powerful and since he is a major character they want to keep in on earth. it's time for Thor to go crazy again. that would be fun. I hate, hate , hate what they did to Strange. Storm, I couldn't care less about.

I always knew the Flashes were uber powerful, but those scans on monica blew my mind.

@pooty said:

@Skaddix: i can't disagree with one point you made. so for fun:

2. Assemble a "cosmic" team she would be good with

3. if Thor used all his powers then he couldn't be an avenger. he would be too powerful and since he is a major character they want to keep in on earth. it's time for Thor to go crazy again. that would be fun. I hate, hate , hate what they did to Strange. Storm, I couldn't care less about.

2. Well that is an option. And certainly Marvel Cosmic could use more females and minorities. The only one they have is Mantis (and she does not look Asian anymore) and they killed all their LGBTs as well. I mean come on they got more talking animals and walking trees then they do minorities. That is utter bs.

3. Well I understand Thor has to be limited but they could at least provide in story reason. I mean really just have all the Godheads sign some deal that says Powers will be limited for all gods in mortal territory except in cases of fighting other gods or in near death situations. Easy but still even when he is fighting something higher end like say the Serpent in Fear Itself. They don't have him do anything creative at all and that is a time when he should be able to cut loose. Storm was really just to illustrate a point although Thor does much the same. They fire a lightning bolt which fails and then forget all their other moves inexplicably because marvel writers cannot right anything that does not involve punching.

@rpottage said:

@rpottage said:

Animated series arent cannon. We do not use Wikipedia as a source as info as it tends to be incorrect.

@YoungJusticesaid:

So you've got nothing huh? Good to know.

@rpottage said:

@YoungJustice said:

Flash stomps.He's way faster, can think/react way faster, and can vibrate his hands to create an unstable resonance to disupt her energy formeven if he can't think of anything else (can also hit her with a whirlwind to disrupt her form, etc.). No contest.

@rpottage said:

Yes, great counter; love the argument...

-.-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQSay7qulpY

Forward to 2:00

For speed see Flash 150 where Barry ran 10 times faster than the speed of light (which is ten times faster than Monica's fastest).

Here he disrupted the entire area with his speed/vibrations; pulling energy in (you can also see how he charges with electricity at such high speeds):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53OyPYa7SEI

He has complete self-molecular control and can vibrate through solid objects; and if done improperly can cause objects to explode (Wally) or Melt (Bart). He can vibrate though dimensions, time travel, steal the speed from others, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_Force

What exactly are you confused about?

You do know every single on of those links is invalid right..............

But since your attempt to refute me with no facts, and your inability to provide any rationality while trying to only accept the ultimate in sourcing is silly; having some links with scans already in them. The second link has tons of scans covering the mass speed speed stealing, speed giving, vibrating, energy pulling, time travel, etc. And they're all Wally scans.

http://www.comicvine.com/wally-west/29-23879/wally-wests-top-speed-best-feats/92-598821/?page=2

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatmanvsWolverine/news/?a=48404

You dont need to school me on Flash because I know him well.

But the fact you think Flash stomps amazes me.

Pulsar goes from the moon and back in seconds.

Catches bullets easily.

Can speedblitz Quicksilver.

She can manipulate her size.

Can control the electromagnetic spectrum

Can phase

Goes llight speed.

Can become light.

Need I go on?

@YoungJustice said:

Yes, you do. Especially since I already pointed out her top speed was light speed and that the Flash is way faster (if you know about the Flash then you know Wally and Barry are said to be the only two people capable of outrunning death; and that Wally is said to be the fastest of the Flash's), as well as the fact I pointed out he can vibrate through things and disrupt them, as well as vibrate his molecules to create an unstable resonance (that's also simply science), etc. Meanwhile she's moving ten times slower than him.

So yeah, you do need to go on. You need a detailed rationale of how exactly you think she could beat him, bearing him mind everything I've pointed out as well as everything I haven't (like the infinite mass punch). Otherwise you've got nothing. You provided no case, and been unable to refute my points.

I never even said she would beat him.

I was just saying it isnt the stomp you make it out to be.

@pooty: @Skaddix: Do you think she'll ever get a solo title?

@Phylos: I think she had a limited series.........it sold about 8 copies. They should have her face Storm or Sue Richards and BEAT THEM. but then you would piss off Storm fans and nobody wants to do that. lol

@pooty said:

@Phylos: I think she had a limited series.........it sold about 8 copies. They should have her face Storm or Sue Richards and BEAT THEM. but then you would piss off Storm fans and nobody wants to do that. lol

You know, as much as Storm can be an egh character [due to fans of course], Marvel has definitely nerfed her. Like you mentioned in another comment here, Lightning Lass. But coming back to Monica, I believe they should try again. Plus, there are other females who are deserving of a 'necromancing' return.

@Phylos said:

@pooty: @Skaddix: Do you think she'll ever get a solo title?

No not unless the economy really turns around for comics. Or cosmic or Captain Marvel really take off.

Honestly, Photon beating Storm makes sense. Now Valkyrie beating Storm in the air that is bs.

Monica just becomes invisible and intangible and kills him. There's nothing he can do to her while there are a lot of ways she can kill him.

Where are the scans for Flash? I didn't mean for this to be a curbstomp in Monica's favor. I thought it would be a good fight.

Wally West wins here.

@PlasticBag said:

Wally West wins here.

How?

@Mr Creesy said:

@PlasticBag said:

Wally West wins here.

How?

He steals her speed then Infinite Mass punches her.

@PlasticBag: Can he speed steal from someone who he can't see, hear or touch? and how do you IMP light?

Agreed you cannot punch out light.

@pooty said:

@Skaddix: i can't disagree with one point you made. so for fun:

2. Assemble a "cosmic" team she would be good with

3. if Thor used all his powers then he couldn't be an avenger. he would be too powerful and since he is a major character they want to keep in on earth. it's time for Thor to go crazy again. that would be fun. I hate, hate , hate what they did to Strange. Storm, I couldn't care less about.

2. Well that is an option. And certainly Marvel Cosmic could use more females and minorities. The only one they have is Mantis (and she does not look Asian anymore) and they killed all their LGBTs as well. I mean come on they got more talking animals and walking trees then they do minorities. That is utter bs.

3. Well I understand Thor has to be limited but they could at least provide in story reason. I mean really just have all the Godheads sign some deal that says Powers will be limited for all gods in mortal territory except in cases of fighting other gods or in near death situations. Easy but still even when he is fighting something higher end like say the Serpent in Fear Itself. They don't have him do anything creative at all and that is a time when he should be able to cut loose. Storm was really just to illustrate a point although Thor does much the same. They fire a lightning bolt which fails and then forget all their other moves inexplicably because marvel writers cannot right anything that does not involve punching.

@PlasticBag said:

@Mr Creesy said:

@PlasticBag said:

Wally West wins here.

How?

He steals her speed then Infinite Mass punches her.

I hate when people say that.

Imp's take time to build up.

Also, how can you steal speed from light.

@YoungJustice said:

Also, how can you steal speed from light.

So Monica wins this battle. Thank you you all for debating.

Flash will win, all those scans are from an era when most cosmic based characters where written inconsistently and writers had them perform feats that would be god like today, look at a green lantern issue he was an absolute beast, back then she would have beaten the Flash of that era. Current Monica is not as powerful.

The Flash is one of the few mainstream superheroes where the trend was in reverse he became a truly frightening monster of a character towards the end of his run, writers even admitted that they had to use pis to put him in danger most of the time. It's one of the reasons he became so popular on the vine battle forums.

@Dextersinister: Current Monica is not as powerful.

In what ways has she been depowered? In "Nextwave" she was still doing everything she could do before. During Civil War she was the same. When did she get weaker?

Mmmm......not so sure on that. Wally can vibrate fast enough to rematerialize characters that can dematerialize. I'm not very familiar with Monica, only what I've read on wiki and what not. I'm guessing that while she has light speed feats, she may not have enough to put her up there with the elite speedsters like Surfer or Flash (??).

Unless someone can show scans indicating otherwise...

@Malevolent1: she isn't as fast as flash but she doesn't need to be. Wally can't see her or track her. Also, Photon's body is put into another dimension when she becomes energy so Wally can't re materialize her. Nearly any contact with Photon would hurt wally.