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#1 Posted by Nightwing_1234 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Morals off, fight takes place on a planet identical to earth but devoid of life.

#2 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

Barry Allen. Massive precog.

#3 Posted by Cybrilious4 (1766 posts) - - Show Bio

SHAZAM!

#4 Posted by Nightwing_1234 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Can you guys back up your responses more?

im confused as to what the Flash's "massive precog" is, im not fully up to date on his comics, sorry :P

#5 Edited by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@nightwing_1234: basically Barry has the ability to envision every possible outcome instantaneously, allowing him instant prep for all probable possibilities.

#6 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash Stomps

#7 Posted by Nightwing_1234 (122 posts) - - Show Bio
#8 Posted by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Posted by joeagentofhand1 (4362 posts) - - Show Bio

Barry should win, WW3 BA was just a bloodlusted BA. During the JSA Jay Garrick was beating him and only stopped when civilians were in danger:

#10 Posted by pooty (11362 posts) - - Show Bio

@nightwing_1234: basically Barry has the ability to envision every possible outcome instantaneously, allowing him instant prep for all probable possibilities.

In New 52, why isn't Wally West the Flash?

#11 Edited by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty: Geoff doesn't want him. Despite pleas for his return, he's remained adamant on Barry remaining the Flash. There's no place for Wally in his new 52. Wally's my favorite DC character so it sucks for me. Johns basically stated that if he brought back West then everyone would expect him to become the flash or wait for him to return to form. That isn't going to happen. So Wally is sort of retired as the most powerful Flash. Barry has the precog ability but Wally had the Speed steal and just outright faster feats. I think once Wally consistently began stealing kinetic energy from electrons then he had become a little impossibly powerful. A Character that could outreact any other character in comics, render them brain dead and motionless while barely tapping into his full potential... Too powerful. Rather thn retconning some of that Johns just wante to stick with Barry, Hal and the silver age dynamos.

#12 Posted by TheAmazingImmortalMan (3331 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty: Geoff doesn't want him. Despite pleas for his return, he's remained adamant on Barry remaining the Flash. There's no place for Wally in his new 52. Wally's my favorite DC character so it sucks for me. Johns basically stated that if he brought back West then everyone would expect him to become the flash or wait for him to return to form. That isn't going to happen. So Wally is sort of retired as the most powerful Flash. Barry has the precog ability but Wally had the Speed steal and just outright faster feats. I think once Wally consistently began stealing kinetic energy from electrons then he had become a little impossibly powerful. A Character that could outreact any other character in comics, render them brain dead and motionless while barely tapping into his full potential... Too powerful. Rather thn retconning some of that Johns just wante to stick with Barry, Hal and the silver age dynamos.

lol I actually prefer Barry

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#13 Posted by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@theamazingimmortalman: Barry's a great character. I prefer Wally myself but I also like Kyle more than Hal.

#14 Posted by pooty (11362 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanwithatan01: Thanks. Wally was getting out of hand with all the powers. but Barry's precog is pretty potent also

#15 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio
#16 Edited by nickthedevil (13207 posts) - - Show Bio

the Flash

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#17 Posted by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

LOL@ Flash stomps. DCnU Barry had troubles taking down Gorilla Grodd physically. How the hell is he going to drop Black Adam? I'm all ears.

#18 Posted by TheAmazingImmortalMan (3331 posts) - - Show Bio

@theamazingimmortalman: Barry's a great character. I prefer Wally myself but I also like Kyle more than Hal.

As far as GL's go I prefer John

to answer the thread if it is Morals off I say Barry but it will not be easy.

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#19 Posted by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: yes it was his excuse. There's an article on it. http://speedforce.org/2012/04/wally-west-story/

But iirc Dredeuced told me that Didio made the plea to Johns who was just not hearing it. I'm not sure which writer it was now. In any event, West is gone. Johns has publicly expressed favoritism of Barry and that's that.

@pooty: I agree. And the precog thing is a nice move that makes Barry a threat to anyone now.

#20 Posted by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

Barry can win with prep somehow, but not physically. Adam is vastly more durable than Grodd, someone Barry had troubles taking down physically.

#21 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio

LOL@ Flash stomps. DCnU Barry had troubles taking down Gorilla Grodd physically. How the hell is he going to drop Black Adam? I'm all ears.

Quite easily. He has femtoseocnd reaction time. Black Adam could never touch him. Speed Mind could tell him how to beat Adam. He can run at the speed of light so techinically, the IMP should still work and not to mention when he phases through things he can make them blow up, including Black Adam. Or he could Speed Force dump, where Barry Allen is King.

#22 Posted by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@needlebay said:

LOL@ Flash stomps. DCnU Barry had troubles taking down Gorilla Grodd physically. How the hell is he going to drop Black Adam? I'm all ears.

Quite easily. He has femtoseocnd reaction time. Black Adam could never touch him. Speed Mind could tell him how to beat Adam. He can run at the speed of light so techinically, the IMP should still work and not to mention when he phases through things he can make them blow up, including Black Adam. Or he could Speed Force dump, where Barry Allen is King.

What issue did it say he can run at the speed of light? Having the Speed Mind doesn't guarantee you a victory. In terms of phyically means, Barry doesn't have what it takes and has shown this repeatedly in his comics. I've read all of Barry's books, but I might have missed something good. Other than that, Adam only needs one punch which he will likely connect sooner or later.

#23 Posted by ConvenientLie (644 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@needlebay said:

LOL@ Flash stomps. DCnU Barry had troubles taking down Gorilla Grodd physically. How the hell is he going to drop Black Adam? I'm all ears.

Quite easily. He has femtoseocnd reaction time. Black Adam could never touch him. Speed Mind could tell him how to beat Adam. He can run at the speed of light so techinically, the IMP should still work and not to mention when he phases through things he can make them blow up, including Black Adam. Or he could Speed Force dump, where Barry Allen is King.

What issue did it say he can run at the speed of light? Having the Speed Mind doesn't guarantee you a victory. In terms of phyically means, Barry doesn't have what it takes and has shown this repeatedly in his comics. I've read all of Barry's books, but I might have missed something good. Other than that, Adam only needs one punch which he will likely connect sooner or later.

he's time traveled which means he's gone faster than light. the morals are off and he has precog. he's going to IMP him or speed dump him. either way adam doesnt land a hit even as fast as he is.

#24 Posted by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay: Grodd was feeding off of the speed force which was affecting Barry. Barry literally beat Grodd using his Brain to control the speed force.

#25 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay: He's at the sped of light consistently throughout his series. Him running at the speed was one of the main focuses for an arc in it. Whenever he ran at the speed of light he created portals that sent things back in time

#26 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@nightwing_1234: Battle Computer on steroids.

Guess what?

Morals off, he can time travel.

Femtosecond reaction times (one millionth of one billionth of a second, thousands of millions of times faster than a human)

He can also become invisible for a limited amount of time and has Magneto-esque powers.

Of course, the thing with new 52 is that it's changing constantly, so next week his powers could be drastically different.

#27 Edited by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio
#28 Edited by joeagentofhand1 (4362 posts) - - Show Bio
#29 Edited by Supermanwithatan01 (3786 posts) - - Show Bio

@joeagentofhand1: no just justice league to my knowledge. But he would have to okay that particular move.

#30 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@needlebay said:

LOL@ Flash stomps. DCnU Barry had troubles taking down Gorilla Grodd physically. How the hell is he going to drop Black Adam? I'm all ears.

Quite easily. He has femtoseocnd reaction time. Black Adam could never touch him. Speed Mind could tell him how to beat Adam. He can run at the speed of light so techinically, the IMP should still work and not to mention when he phases through things he can make them blow up, including Black Adam. Or he could Speed Force dump, where Barry Allen is King.

What issue did it say he can run at the speed of light? Having the Speed Mind doesn't guarantee you a victory. In terms of phyically means, Barry doesn't have what it takes and has shown this repeatedly in his comics. I've read all of Barry's books, but I might have missed something good. Other than that, Adam only needs one punch which he will likely connect sooner or later.

He's not connecting against something that has Femtosecond reaction time, Black Adam isn't touching him. If Barry keeps on increasing his speed, he can one-shot Black Adam, Mass x Accelration = Force

#31 Posted by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

A thunderclap will work just as good. Barry doesn't have the physical means to put him down.

#32 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7670 posts) - - Show Bio

A thunderclap will work just as good. Barry doesn't have the physical means to put him down.

BFR

#33 Posted by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay said:

A thunderclap will work just as good. Barry doesn't have the physical means to put him down.

BFR

That's the only way Barry can win, TBH.

#34 Posted by dondave (38464 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay: There really is no way for Black Adam to win though

#35 Edited by logy5000 (5923 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash wins, almost in a stomp.

#36 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7670 posts) - - Show Bio

@mr_ingenuity said:

@needlebay said:

A thunderclap will work just as good. Barry doesn't have the physical means to put him down.

BFR

That's the only way Barry can win, TBH.

Well he's not touching Barry sooo.....¯\(°_o)/¯

#37 Edited by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay said:

@mr_ingenuity said:

@needlebay said:

A thunderclap will work just as good. Barry doesn't have the physical means to put him down.

BFR

That's the only way Barry can win, TBH.

Well he's not touching Barry sooo.....¯\(°_o)/¯

He's been tagged before by lesser beings than Adam. Barry is good, but not that good. If Grodd can easily survive a speed blitz, what makes you think Adam can't?

#38 Edited by Mr_Ingenuity (7670 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay: Not speedblitz....Speed force dump, no Adam doesn't have the reaction time, & the only thing Grodd has anything to do with this is a speedforce dump....◔_◔

#39 Edited by Needlebay (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

@needlebay: Not speedblitz....Speed force dump, no Adam doesn't have the reaction time, & the only thing Grodd has anything to do with this is a speedforce dump....◔_◔

I already said that's the only way he can win, although, I think Adam can get out by entering the Rock of Eternity. If Flash tries to use punches and whatnot (like he USUALLY does), he will lose.

#40 Posted by Cybrilious4 (1766 posts) - - Show Bio

@logy5000: Flash looses, almost in a stomp.

Fixed ;)

#41 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@cybrilious4: Care to elaborate?

How is Black Adam supposed to beat someone who, morals off, can TIME TRAVEL, is hundreds of times faster than BA, and basically has a pumped-up Battle Computer?

#42 Posted by Batman242 (4862 posts) - - Show Bio
#43 Posted by Cybrilious4 (1766 posts) - - Show Bio

Sure will, Black Adam is basically a Superman lvl character with magic. He has absolute almost no weaknesses that Barry Alen can exploit. All BA had to do his fly in the air and spat "Shazam" at the hopeless Flashling and hope to not get hit by magic. Only the speed force is saving Flash if anything.

#44 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@cybrilious4:

...

*facepalm*

'superman lvl character with magic'

Good job, Barry Allen morals off is hopelessly beyond supes. He will know exactly what BA can do.

He's invisible, AND he can fly, AND BA is Mach 500 MAX, thousands of times slower than Flash. How is BA going to fly up before Flash gets to him and rips his head off/

#45 Posted by spiderbuck (2454 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash wins.

#46 Posted by son_of_tomorrow (493 posts) - - Show Bio

@cybrilious4:

...

*facepalm*

'superman lvl character with magic'

Good job, Barry Allen morals off is hopelessly beyond supes. He will know exactly what BA can do.

He's invisible, AND he can fly, AND BA is Mach 500 MAX, thousands of times slower than Flash. How is BA going to fly up before Flash gets to him and rips his head off/

Barry is not hopelessly beyond supes, supes murders Barry. He tagged Barry in justice league, and without morals superman can easily suck the oxygen out of barry's lungs, use heat vision to scorch the area, or just destroy the planet. And Flash can't rip Black Adams heads off under any circumstance.

#47 Posted by Dredeuced (5718 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: yes it was his excuse. There's an article on it. http://speedforce.org/2012/04/wally-west-story/

But iirc Dredeuced told me that Didio made the plea to Johns who was just not hearing it. I'm not sure which writer it was now. In any event, West is gone. Johns has publicly expressed favoritism of Barry and that's that.

@pooty: I agree. And the precog thing is a nice move that makes Barry a threat to anyone now.

It is Didio and Johns. Manapul(artist and co-writer of new-52 Flash) was the one who made the plea to let him put Wally in, even as a cameo as Iris' nephew, in the New 52 and Didio told him that he is absolutely, under no circumstances, even allowed to imply Wally West exists.

#48 Edited by World_Breaker_Elmo (186 posts) - - Show Bio

How did Barry do against the Manhunter when the league skirmished with him? If he is capable of such speed and reaction times wouldn't he have been able to make quick work of the martian himself, instead of J'onn being able to hold is own as he did against not only Flash but the rest of the league as well? Were Barry's skills compromised entering into the battle with J'onn that hindered him in some way? The reason I bring up this fight is that if he is unable to bring down J'onn while being assisted by the rest of the league, then how would he be able to single-handedly defeat Black Adam? I know J'onn has telepathy and phasing, but physically isn't Adam his equal if not his superior? Also, doesn't New52 Adam now have spellcasting?

#49 Posted by Dredeuced (5718 posts) - - Show Bio

How did Barry do against the Manhunter when the league skirmished with him? If he is capable of such speed and reaction times wouldn't he have been able to make quick work of the martian himself, instead of J'onn being able to hold is own as he did against not only Flash but the rest of the league as well? Were Barry's skills compromised entering into the battle with J'onn that hindered him in some way? The reason I bring up this fight is that if he is unable to bring down J'onn while being assisted by the rest of the league, then how would he be able to single-handedly defeat Black Adam? I know J'onn has telepathy and phasing, but physically isn't Adam his equal if not his superior? Also, doesn't New52 Adam now have spellcasting?

Fight was never shown. At the time, Barry did not know his abilities, either. Martian Manhunter joined the league and left sometime between the 5 years past Darkseid event and the current JL run. Barry learned both his Speed Mind and Speed Force Dump in the recent past, as he wasn't around for a couple of JL issues because he was dealing with Grodd's invasion. This is when he learned to use his Speed Mind and Speed Force BFR abilities.

What you're also applying is ABC logic between Black Adam and J'onn. They've vastly different characters with vastly different powersets and limits.

The reason he can beat BA is because BA has no noted abilities that counter intangibility, dimensional BFR, or the ability to make something explode on the molecular level. Nor does he have the ability to defend a blitz by a speedster, as his fight with Jay Garrick demonstrated. Jay was whoopin him for a good bit before he started using endangered civillians, and Barry is morals off so this would hardly matter.

#50 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@son_of_tomorrow: Yes, when Barry still had no idea what the heck he was doing. Barry easily matched Supes holding back and not going anywhere near top speed.

I don't understand how this is debatable.

The reason he can beat BA is because BA has no noted abilities that counter intangibility, dimensional BFR, or the ability to make something explode on the molecular level. Nor does he have the ability to defend a blitz by a speedster, as his fight with Jay Garrick demonstrated. Jay was whoopin him for a good bit before he started using endangered civillians, and Barry is morals off so this would hardly matter.

Also Barry can TIME TRAVEL. And he has basically LIMITLESS PRECOG. He is 1000s of times faster than BA! Literally he could just walk up to him and punch him (Barry's on par with supes) 1000 times before BA noticed! Or use a Speed Force Dump!