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#1 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Rules

  • · Team chemistry comes into play.
  • · Knowledge is only on actual Knowledge of character has on other.
  • · Random Battles every time.
  • · Moral On. In Character.
  • · All Cannon Feats apply, unless stated all Feat Applies
  • · Will be Special Scenarios and at Times Obejectives. No need to even defeat your enemy.
  • · All Throwing Weapons, Arrows, and Ammo Weapons have a 100 cap unless Specified.

Battlefield

Teams

@higorm

11) Venom Flash (Dual Machine Guns, Dual Pistols, 5 Grenades)

6) Winter Soldier (Bionic Arm, Sniper Rifle, Machine Gun, 5 Grenades)

3) Dare Devil (Billy Clubs)

2) Only the Main Team gain the Super Grenade Pack includes 5 Grenades, 5 Flashbangs, 5 Tear Gas, 5 WPs, and 5 Claymores.

1) 1 Weapon type (or Pair if they are Dual) Cancels Healing Factors of any kind for 1 Minuet. (Winter Soldier)

4) Whole Team Gains Ribbons, this allows total Immunity to ANY Status Effects. (Includes Illusions, TP, Poison, Burning, Freezing, and Chemical Weapons)

3) 1 Member Gains the Red Eye Drug, Venom Drug, and Banshee Drug. This allows added 2 Ton Strength, Bullet Time Reaction time on top of their own Reaction Time, and Wolverine Healing Factor. (Daredevil)

1) 1 Member Gains Halo Mjolnir Armour with Shields and Radar. No Stat Enhancers added. (Winter Soldier)

1) Com Gear with Headsets for Whole Team.

2) No more Bad Blood, this will removes Rivalries.

1) 1 Member is Morals off. (Venom)

@boschepg

9) Wolverine (Adamantium)

9) Deadpool (Teleporter, Blades, Dual SMGs, 5 Grenades)

6) Hawkeye (Bow and Arrows, 5 of any Trick Arrows, Nun Chucks, Dual Swords)

1) 1 Range Weapon other than a Explosive Round kind has Infinite Ammo.

1) 1 Weapon type (or Pair if they are Dual) Cancels Healing Factors of any kind for 1 Minuet.

2) TP link for whole team.

1) 1 Member Gains a Ribbon, this allows total Immunity to ANY Status Effects. (Includes Illusions, TP, Poison, Burning, Freezing, and Chemical Weapons)

1) 1 Member Gains a Ribbon, this allows total Immunity to ANY Status Effects. (Includes Illusions, TP, Poison, Burning, Freezing, and Chemical Weapons)

1) 1 Member Gains a Ribbon, this allows total Immunity to ANY Status Effects. (Includes Illusions, TP, Poison, Burning, Freezing, and Chemical Weapons)

4) Gain Prep to study full Dossiers on your enemy as well as Team work.

Mission

You walk in the empty base, there is a table with a holo cube there. One of your team presses the play. A dark silhouette of a man appears.

"Welcome to the final push of our war. With the the enemy main bases wiped out, our little war is near over, we have the ultimate weapon thanks to your previous missions, and now only one thing stand in our way, you! Your team is hired out to the highest bidder, and add to that you proved far more potent than our ultimate weapon. Sorry, but your going have to die. As I speak a large under and over barrier is being placed around this empty base. The Ultimate Weapon is being deployed in 10 minuets from now. Also what you may have notice is the other team who completed the same missions you have on the other side of the world, hahaha, now both teams of the deadliest is locked together to die. Well have fun, say your prayers, or kill each other, escape is not a option. Good working with ya."

It clicks out, nothing but static is seen, until another figure appears.

"Are we patched in? Can they hear me? Good. Listen up, Im the guy who you been paid to make life miserable. I expect by now for you guys be set up for termination at this spot as my spies suggest. Look, your impressive, you killed my hired merc teams with ease. Now with the Ultimate Weapon in their hands, well I am predicting you would not pass a chance at pay, survival, and a little revenge. I have a special ship en-rout to your position in under 10 minuets. It can phase through the shields, pick you up, and the enemy would be none the wiser. However there is one catch..... it can only seat 4. I know that other impressive team is there across from you in the next base, work it out yourselves."

I dont think the directions are needed here. Its your team, or theirs. You have 9 minuets. Get to work.

Perks

There is none. Your on your own merit here. Have fun.

#2 Posted by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: does my full dossier perk still apply?

@higorm let me get my scans together. Going to drop some new ones, never seen before. I should start around Sunday or Monday...more likely Sunday

#3 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg: Was it a perk, or was it a point you spend. If Perk then no, if point then yes.

#4 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow, this is gonna be very interesting..

@boschepg: take your time bro, let´s make this a epic battle CV never seen before!!

@cadencev2: nice set up by the way, as always..

#5 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio
#6 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: @higorm: Im ready as promised now

If I get it right, this is a straight out battle that has to be completed in under 10 minutes?

since Cadence said I still have my full dossier and prep, Im going to know who you are and what to equip.

Now to take out your strongest player, Venom. He is a symbiote. Scan of Avengers knowledge of symbiote.

I know you may argue the fire point, or lack of knowledge per writer on subject, but you cant deny Venom's weakness to sonic attacks. From the scan Quicksilver acheives supersonic speed to effect the symbiote. Hawkeye's two most popular trick arrows are his explosive arrow and sonic arrow. The scans provided show that the sonic arrow doesnt have to hit a target to unleash the sonic attack, the arrow is actually emitting sonic frequency when Hawkeye pulls it out of his holster and prepares to fire and continues its sonic attack for awhile

Now Im claiming that Hawkeye has the ability to separate the Venom from Flash Thompson and take him out

The next person on your team is Daredevil. Now he too is greatly effected by loud sonic attacks. Whats also more impressive is that Daredevil is highly disoriented by Deadpool's talking. DD has to deal with the overload of senses from sonic attack or Deadpool's talking

Im showing that both Hawkeye and Deadpool are capable of of effecting DD and Venom leaving Winter Guard vs Wolverine, Deadpool, and Hawkeye.

your turn

#7 Edited by dondave (34416 posts) - - Show Bio

This should be good

#8 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg

Prep Time

If you look well, all characters from your team doesn´t need full dossiers about my team members since they already know each other here, also considering this part o rules:

Rules

  • · Knowledge is only on actual Knowledge of character has on other.

Now as for the time for preparation, I don´t believe that will be a considerable advantage for you since none of your team members are prep masters. At best you have Wolverine who possess great experience in some fields, and Hawkeye that worked with Steve before but that´s pretty much it. Also, knowing who the enemy is and having time to prepare for the fight doesn´t lead to an automatic win if you don´t have what it takes to do it, and that´s what I´m going to prove here.

Venom vs sonic attacks

Is the Venom symbiote susceptible to sonic attacks? Yes, but only to specific frequencies.

It´s not any kind of sonic attack that will be able to unbond the symbiote from Flash Thompson body. The Venom has shown resistance to sonic attacks before, and my team knows who is Hawkeye and his tricky arrows, so I hardly believe that Clint will be able to tag him him with ease. Also, he can´t reproduce the exactly same effect of Quicksilver supersonic speed. Not to mention this is a morals off Venom so you´ll have to do better then that..

Daredevil

Yes, he is also susceptible to sonic attacks, but he also possess enhanced reaction time on top of his own, also knowing who is Clint Barton and Deadpool, which he fought before whitout having major problems. Also, he´s not dumb, and he can easily get rid of this situation, and it´s not like he will be there standing still waiting for the sonic arrow hit his head.

Winter Soldier

Going by your line of reasoning, it looks like Bucky will also be there standing on the ground waiting for his team mates fall so he can take all 3 enemies by himself. This is a guy who knows very well Wolverine (put him down 3 times) and Clint Barton, being able to take the upper hand on both at the same time. In top of his skill and weapons he is using the halo mjolnir armor the grants him incredible durability, that only one arrow from Hawkeye tricky arrows may be able to work, so there are too many variables for your team to deal with here.

#9 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm: Hmm, I didnt get a notice that you replied

@higorm said:

Prep Time

If you look well, all characters from your team doesn´t need full dossiers about my team members since they already know each other here, also considering this part o rules:

.

it just sounds better to the voters, lol.

@higorm said:

Venom vs sonic attacks

Is the Venom symbiote susceptible to sonic attacks? Yes, but only to specific frequencies.

It´s not any kind of sonic attack that will be able to unbond the symbiote from Flash Thompson body. The Venom has shown resistance to sonic attacks before, and my team knows who is Hawkeye and his tricky arrows, so I hardly believe that Clint will be able to tag him him with ease. Also, he can´t reproduce the exactly same effect of Quicksilver supersonic speed. Not to mention this is a morals off Venom so you´ll have to do better then that..

You know Hawkeye threw a symbiote laced Scorpion by himself off a building.

As stated, Hawkeyes sonic arrow doesnt have to tag the enemy. All my scans of the sonic arrow didnt tag the target yet it still effected the Hulk, Songbird and Shroud's Darkforce. I may also say that my prep perk gives me the ability to adjust frequencies I suppose. Here are some other scans of the symbiote being hurt by sonic attacks. Anything above the speed of sound is sonic.

Is that a fog horn Flash is using on the symbiote?
@higorm said:

@boschepg


Daredevil

Yes, he is also susceptible to sonic attacks, but he also possess enhanced reaction time on top of his own, also knowing who is Clint Barton and Deadpool, which he fought before whitout having major problems. Also, he´s not dumb, and he can easily get rid of this situation, and it´s not like he will be there standing still waiting for the sonic arrow hit his head.

As stated with Venom, the sonic arrow doesnt need to hit the target. The arrow is activated once Hawkeye pulls it from holster. With Deadpool, DD was still being thrown off and confused.

Ill get back to Bucky later. Im tired

#10 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3982 posts) - - Show Bio
#11 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg:

1. you're underestimating the interpretative capacity of our valued voters from this great community :P

2. I know that, I was just using irony to describe my statement, since Venom is way more agile then any of those characters you presented, and he won´t be standing waiting for a sonic arrow or whatever other arrow comming next to him. Bucky can also shoot them mid air like he did before..

Those scans shows exactly what I said before, especifically the last one where Venom (Brock) is attack by a sonic attack from the fanstastic car, which was build and created by Reed with the help of Spider-Man, that´s what I meant when I talked about specific sound frequencies. Unless Clint Barton had a genius level intelect upgrade, I highly doubt he can reproduce that kind of attack, that was one of the few capable of effectively hur the Venom symbiote.

I´ll have to read that issue to remember if the fog horn was specific made or not, because I remember Spider-Man using a megaphone against Venom before and he just laughed at Peter´s face. Even then that was close range so that is highly unlikely to work against a Morals off Venom..

*I´ll provide scans of all that later..*

#12 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg:

@higorm:

Giving to Friday and then the Ultimate Weapon Drops, Votes will open Friday till Monday.

#13 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio
#14 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm said:

Those scans shows exactly what I said before, especifically the last one where Venom (Brock) is attack by a sonic attack from the fanstastic car, which was build and created by Reed with the help of Spider-Man, that´s what I meant when I talked about specific sound frequencies. Unless Clint Barton had a genius level intelect upgrade, I highly doubt he can reproduce that kind of attack, that was one of the few capable of effectively hur the Venom symbiote.

you do know that most of Hawkeye's trick arrows are made from either Tony Stark, TChalla or Hank Pym, right? Mainly Stark but just wanted to point out the genius level intellect on who makes the arrows. I knew that, that is why I always place the prep with full dossiers perk with Hawkeye.

Ill await the scans

#15 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg said:

you do know that most of Hawkeye's trick arrows are made from either Tony Stark, TChalla or Hank Pym, right? Mainly Stark but just wanted to point out the genius level intellect on who makes the arrows. I knew that, that is why I always place the prep with full dossiers perk with Hawkeye.

Ill await the scans

Having arrows made from genius like Tony Stark, T'Challa and Hank Pym doesn´t make Clint Barton a genius, capable of changing the frequency of the sonic arrow, unless you can provide a scan to backup that statement. His arrows weren´t made specific to work against Venom, but to work in most of threats and specially heavy hitters like Abomination and Hulk who possess limited agility. It´s not the same against someone with far superior agility such as Venom.

I´ll make a worthy and complete strategy post with all the scans..

#16 Posted by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm said:


Having arrows made from genius like Tony Stark, T'Challa and Hank Pym doesn´t make Clint Barton a genius, capable of changing the frequency of the sonic arrow, unless you can provide a scan to backup that statement. His arrows weren´t made specific to work against Venom, but to work in most of threats and specially heavy hitters like Abomination and Hulk who possess limited agility. It´s not the same against someone with far superior agility such as Venom.

I will never ever claim Hawkeye is on genius level. Im claiming that being a long standing Avenger when genius minds make your weapons. I will also state that Hulk may be even more resilient to sonic weaponry than Venom and that agility means nothing when Flash Thompson is getting hit.

Let me explain

1- it cant be denied Venom symbiote is effected by sonic frequency

2- Now Im also going to state, since you brought it up to, that Hawkeye has previous knowledge of attacking the Venom symbiote

Here is Hawkeye invading Avengers Tower and throwing the Scorpion Venom possessed symbiote out the window. It was his first guy to attack. This scan makes me think that Hawkeye has confidence that he can take out the symbiote

This is Hawkeye stunning the Scorpion Venom possessed symbiote under interrogation with no arrows

All Im doing here is establishing past experience with Hawkeye and the symbiote

3- Now I want to resubmit this scan of Quicksilver effecting the symbiote. Notice Pietro hits the sonic wall three times in his short run by evidence of the boom, Boom, BOOM. Mach3 speed all the way

Now let me submit a scan of Hulk tagging Quicksilver

Pietro gets straight backhanded by Hulk. Now let me show Hulk unleashing his own sonic attack from his hand clap. READ ALL SCANS PROVIDED

Now I will provide two scans of Hulk canceling out a sonic attack which is effecting him by his own sonic clap attack. Now to cancel out an attack, it has to be hit with enough force of the original attack. To rebel an attack, you need an even greater force to rebel back the sonic attack (as provided in these two scans, please read scans)

Now you are probably asking yourself, what does the Hulk have to do with the Venom symbiote. Let me explain. Clearly Venom is effected by sonic attacks as I have provided two scans of such an attack. I even sort of defined the the frequency of sonic attack used by Quicksilver. It effects the symbiote but doesnt the Hulk. Now Hulk is able to also show weakness to sonic attack and yet have enough wits to counter it with a greater force

Which leads me to this pic

Now Hulk is unable to deflect Hawkeye's sonic attack. Its too strong for him that it reverts him back to Banner.

Now to tie it all in, Hulk is effected by Hawkeye's sonic arrow. Hulk has a higher threshhold of sonic attacks then to Venom. Now Im saying if Hawkeye's (stark based sonic arrows) are able to take out the Hulk, even with all his showings of weakness to sonics, Im claiming that Hawkeye's sonic arrow is strong enough to take out Venom if it can take out Hulk

#17 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg:

That´s why I´m claiming he doesn´t have sonic arrows to work specific against a Venom symbiote, and his regular arrows won´t be enough to put him down for good, specially when you´re facing a morals OFF Venom. Also, I don´t see how your how this comparison to Hulk is relevant since both are affected in different ways, Hulk feels the attack because of his hearing, while the symbiote possess an inherent weakness to sonics. I also don´t see how Hawkeye will be able to hit Venom so easily as you claim, considering he is far more agile then Hulk, have ways to disguise himself and have the backup of the Winter Soldier.

- Venom vs Spider-Man and Fantastic Four with specially build (Reed+Peter) sonic weapons:

Venom is attacked by Peter with a sonic smasher gun and then engulfed with flames by Human-Torch, still he resists all the and uses the tendril to drown Johnny while keep comming after Spider-Man, and even manage to bring him down using camouflage, then he rises a tank to finish the spidey when is hit by the second sonic attack (sonic beam) from the Fantasticar.

Now, how a sonic arrow will be able to completely unbond Flash from the Venom symbiote if it was already able to resist a more powerfull sonic attack made specificlly to work against him?

Even if Hawkeye manage to tag the Venom (which I doubt) the arrow doesn´t have enough power to do the job, since that´s not the only instance Venom resisted to a sonic attack.

- Here the next scans shows the Venom symbiote killing several guards armed with sonic guns and flame throwers:

1 - Yes, I´ve already said that at my first post, but only to specific frequencies Hawkeye doesn´t have.

2 - All you´ve shown is Hawkeye sneaking up to a guy that was sleeping. I don´t think he can do the same here in a battle situation against Flash Thompson. About the scans, He attacked the guy with a sonic arrow? I can´t see your´re trying to point out, showing another scan with a guy arrested in custody for interrogation.

3 - Yes he hit the sonic wall three times because he possess superhuman speed able to reach the speed of sound. Your point exactly?

Again, what a scan of Hulk tagging Pietro have anything to do with this? Here´s a scan of Spider-Man tagging Pietro:

Venom is more agile then Spider-Man, your point?

Hawkeye´s sonic arrow doesn´t have the same power of a thunderclap or sonicboom so I don´t see your point again.

You presented 2 scans showing Hulk resisting and then canceling a sonic attack, then you show me a scan from the last century (back in the time Hulk was too dumb) showing Hulk falling to a sonic arrow? A little conflicting don´t you think?

#18 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm said:

You presented 2 scans showing Hulk resisting and then canceling a sonic attack, then you show me a scan from the last century (back in the time Hulk was too dumb) showing Hulk falling to a sonic arrow? A little conflicting don´t you think?

and yet you too also keep showing Venom scans of Eddie Brock from before the 21st Century. I have shown that the Venim symbiote still is weak to sonic decibels. You have too.

With the Hulk, I am showing that the old "dumb" Hulk and a more modern Hulk were both able to do sonic clap. When old dumb Hulk reflected the sonic attack he was old dumb Hulk. When he got effected by the sonic arrow, he was old dumb Hulk.

@higorm said:

That´s why I´m claiming he doesn´t have sonic arrows to work specific against a Venom symbiote, and his regular arrows won´t be enough to put him down for good, specially when you´re facing a morals OFF Venom. Also, I don´t see how your how this comparison to Hulk is relevant since both are affected in different ways, Hulk feels the attack because of his hearing, while the symbiote possess an inherent weakness to sonics.

I also don´t see how Hawkeye will be able to hit Venom so easily as you claim, considering he is far more agile then Hulk, have ways to disguise himself and have the backup of the Winter Soldier.


1 and 2-If Hulk it takes more sonic output to put down Hulk, why wouldnt I believe that a higher frequency would effect the Venom hos has less resistance to sonic attacks. If a sonic attack of say level 4 can hurt Venom and I hurt Hulk with a level 7 attack, why wouldnt the level 7 effect Venom. Not only is it hitting the frequency, its coming with more force to effect Hulk. Its how decibels work.

3- No one has really laid out an attack plan, we are both just showing how we can attack each other. Im calling since this is a timed event, that I can seriously disorient both DD and Venom to then attack. AGility has nothing to do with it. As shown in scans, the sonic arrow doesnt need contact. Its emitting the decibel level upon flight.

Did your scan hit the symbiote? Does it have to hit DD? ...answer is no

but if you want to show agility, then explain this

@higorm said:

- Venom vs Spider-Man and Fantastic Four with specially build (Reed+Peter) sonic weapons:

Venom is attacked by Peter with a sonic smasher gun and then engulfed with flames by Human-Torch, still he resists all the and uses the tendril to drown Johnny while keep comming after Spider-Man, and even manage to bring him down using camouflage, then he rises a tank to finish the spidey when is hit by the second sonic attack (sonic beam) from the Fantasticar.

Now, how a sonic arrow will be able to completely unbond Flash from the Venom symbiote if it was already able to resist a more powerfull sonic attack made specificlly to work against him?

Even if Hawkeye manage to tag the Venom (which I doubt) the arrow doesn´t have enough power to do the job, since that´s not the only instance Venom resisted to a sonic attack.

- Here the next scans shows the Venom symbiote killing several guards armed with sonic guns and flame throwers:


1- are you saying that sonic fog horn attack you showed was made by Reed Richards? Once again, you are showing Brock. I know the symbiote is similar, but I keep showing more modern scans of the symbiote getting hurt post 2001. I will rely on my Avenger tech arrows from Stark, Pym or TChalla and say they are strong enough

2-Thats Brock again. Im also need clarity cuz I doubt those Guards have higher tech then Stark made items. Even so: we all know Stark > Avenger tech from Stark > every other tech like Guardsmen from Stark

DAREDEVIL

to cover more of your team, I think Ive shown that sonic attacks mess up DDs radar sense as does Deadpools talking creating confusion or white noise against DD. DD is no longer capable in this fight and thus, Im relying on Deadpool to do more damage when disoriented

Now Im claiming numbers after I can take down DD and Venom. 3 vs 1 for me

#19 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

So you can show scans in black and white and I can´t show scans from Venom ? Interesting..

I´m not going to argue explaining for the 3rd or 4th time about weakness to specific sonic frequencies..

I´m just gonna post some scans:

- the Venom symbiote resisting a sonic scream:

- Since you brought the Stark technology to the table, let´s see how the symbiote reacts to an ultrasound attack:

- Now since you also claimed Hulk´s sonic boom and all that let´s see the Venom symbiote against Hulk who needed to use 2 thunderclaps to put Venom down, still not enough to unbond him:

1. and 2. I´ve already said that the sonic attacks works in a different against the Hulk and the Venom. Furthermore, I´ve also presented enough scans to prove that the symbiote can resist more powerfull attacks then a sonic arrow. The only presented one B&W scan back in the time of dumb Hulk to base your argument while I´ve presented far more recent scans of Venom resisting 2 Thunderclaps that you already agreed to be more powerfull then the sonic arrow.

3. Yeah I agree none of us presented a decent strategy, that´s why I would like to ask @cadencev2 one day more before the votes so we can do it properly. I know that the sonic arrow doesn´t need direct contact, the thing is that it doesn´t have enough power to successfully put a morals Off Venom down for good, not when he knows that the enemy possess such weapon and have others to back him up. It´s not like Flash and Matt will stand still together waiting for the attack.

Another prove of how the symbiote can resist to sonics is here:

Venom is fighting Spider-Man and the cops to save his wife, Peter tries to affect him with a megaphone but the Venom only laughs at him, he even claims that "it takes a sonic blast of major proportions to stop our clock these days", then a girl helps Peter switching on an air raid siren to stop the Venom who manage to get away from the "cone" of the sound wave.

After all that he is ready for another fight:

If i´m not mistaken that was Klaw a being composed by pure sonic energy. Daredevil was able to defeat him before:

About the Kraven scan, that was Flash´s first mission as Agent Venom dealing with a guy like Kraven in his environment. Also, Flash was drugged out of his mind by an auditory hallucinogen, still he was able to dodge from this attack from the Hunter:

1 - The sonic gun Spider-Man used and the sonic beam from the fantasticar were made by Reed Richards, yes. The fog he used on Toxin was a sonic charge espeacilly made by Peter Parker to work specificlly against symbiotes, which was in possession of Betty Brant (Flash´s ex-girlfriend).

The Venom Symbiote is the same. The difference between Brock and Flash is that with the first one the symbiote was stronger and more ruthless but less disciplined, which leds us to the morals Off state Agent Venom is here.

So can I rely on Reed Richards tech which is far superior then all those 3 together?

2 - Still the same symbiote. Doesn´t matter if their tech is below stark or not, Stark didn´t made Clint Barton sonic arrow to work specific against the morals off Agent Venom!

DAREDEVIL

Well the teams start separated without seeing each other, DD is more then capable to track all his 3 oponents before they manage to do anything. I hardly believe DD will fall to such tactic in this scenario. Thus, he possess enhanced strength, reaction time and a healing factor that should be enough to take care of any of those 3 threats, since he already manage to beat Wolverine and can more then dodge Hawkeye´s arrows.

#20 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm:

you didnt tag me

1- still Brock scans. did the symbiote grow more attached to Brock? cuz the modern scans I post the symbiote is effected by sonics still. Flash is effected by sonics

2- I have that issue of DD. You really want me to bring out the flaws in that issue.

Im just saying I can get a chance before battle closes

#21 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg: sorry, the thing is that I erase the post while I´m responding it, then I forgot to tag you.. won´t happen again.

1 - You´re entering into another contradiction, because why is only valid for you to show the Venom symbiote (not bonded with Flash) suffering, but for me isn´t valid to show the same symbiote resisting to most powerfull sonic attacks?

2 - You can bring all the flaws you want we are here to debate anyway :)

#22 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio
#23 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio
#24 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg

Enought of this nonsense!!

It´s time to present a real decent strategy here!!

Okay so my team have 9 minutes to get rid of those 3 enemies, sounds like a mission to me, so given mission is mission accomplished!

TEAM

Venom Flash (Dual Machine Guns, Dual Pistols, 5 Grenades)

1 Member is Morals off.

Winter Soldier (Bionic Arm, Sniper Rifle, Machine Gun, 5 Grenades)

1 Weapon type (or Pair if they are Dual) Cancels Healing Factors of any kind for 1 Minuet.

1 Member Gains Halo Mjolnir Armour with Shields and Radar. No Stat Enhancers added.

DareDevil (Billy Clubs)

1 Member Gains the Red Eye Drug, Venom Drug, and Banshee Drug. This allows added 2 Ton Strength, Bullet Time Reaction time on top of their own Reaction Time, and Wolverine Healing Factor.erks) Stealth Field, you gain the 1 minuet stealth Power Up. Activates when you need it.

Team:

1) Com Gear with Headsets for Whole Team.

2) Only the Main Team gain the Super Grenade Pack includes 5 Grenades, 5 Flashbangs, 5 Tear Gas, 5 WPs, and 5 Claymores.

2) No more Bad Blood, this will removes Rivalries.

4) Whole Team Gains Ribbons, this allows total Immunity to ANY Status Effects. (Includes Illusions, TP, Poison, Burning, Freezing, and Chemical Weapons)

Initial Considerations

My team (through Bucky and Matt) knows very well who they´re facing here, since:

  • Knowledge is only on actual Knowledge of character has on other.

So there´s no surprises here. Your team may have time for preparation but without a prep master that time will be useless when you already know who the enemy is, so this is about who got what it takes to defeat the other team, and of course my team got it.

Also, the Venom symbiote possess knowledge from the previous hosts, and Flash already knows Deadpool, so even him is well aware of who the enemy is.

The Game Plan!

Daredevil will start scanning the map with his mental radar. He is more then capable to track the enemies in a matter of seconds, after that he will inform his team member about their location. The team will split, Venom will use his camouflage abilities to disguise himself to difficult the enemy tracking. Bucky will plant claymores in the ground and then assume a sniper position using his radar and thermal vision given by the halo mjolnir armor to scan the enemies, to aim and shoot at sight. Teams will clash sooner or later, so Venom will enter a Morals OFF state to take on more then one threat at the same time while Matt keep any of those 3 that may be left busy. Bucky will be there to shoot the ones who may be vulnerable using weapon that cancels healing factors, so no scape for Wolverine or Deadpool. Also, Bucky will provide backup for his team from distance shotting Hawkeye´s arrows mid air if necessary.

Flash as well as the rest of the team will carry (hiding) flash bangs to use them if necessary to temporarily blind the enemy, and grenades to throw at their base forcing them to reveal their position.

Now let´s talk about my team members:

Daredevil

Radar-Sense:

Fighting

He was able to defeat Logan 2x before, with standard levels, now imagine now he got 2 ton strength, healing factor and enhanced reaction time (on top of his own).

vs Wolverine:

vs Wolverine + Ninjas:

Dodging

Now let´s that Matt is more then capable of dealing with gunfire, even from to marksmanship characters such as the Punisher, so Deadpool will just waste his time and bullets trying to tag Daredevil here:

* I´ll post the scans of Daredevil vs Hawkeye later..*

Winter Soldier

Top marksmanship, expert in H2H combat, bionic arm, sniper rifle, machine gun, halo mjolnir armor.

vs Wolverine:

vs Clint Barton:

Bucky shows his superiority over Clint Barton at H2H combat. He is also able to catch arrows mid air while performing gymnastics with his bionic arm.

vs Wolverine and Hawkeye:

Bucky is able to put Wolverine down for the 3rd time after overcoming his senses again, then he manage to cut Hawkeye´s arrows in half, and then shoot 3 of those arrows all in mid air..

Venom

Far superior in strength, more agile, can fight against the enemy at any distance, being more dangerous at close combat, can´t be stopped when Vulking-out, can easily take more then one enemy at the same time here.

- can fight with multiple weapons using the tendrils:

- Vulking-out:

- Multi-tendril impalement:

- Hinding guns inside the symbiote + webbing:

#25 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm: I guess these are closings. I will post two parts as I just got back and couldnt reply properly to the last scans this morning

I will prove that Hawkeye's sonic arrow is more stronger then Venom can take with large scans cuz I think you or the voters are missing or might miss the points

Ill title this VENOM GETS HAWKEYEd

@higorm said:

1. and 2. I´ve already said that the sonic attacks works in a different against the Hulk and the Venom. Furthermore, I´ve also presented enough scans to prove that the symbiote can resist more powerfull attacks then a sonic arrow. The only presented one B&W scan back in the time of dumb Hulk to base your argument while I´ve presented far more recent scans of Venom resisting 2 Thunderclaps that you already agreed to be more powerfull then the sonic arrow.

3. Yeah I agree none of us presented a decent strategy, that´s why I would like to ask @cadencev2 one day more before the votes so we can do it properly. I know that the sonic arrow doesn´t need direct contact, the thing is that it doesn´t have enough power to successfully put a morals Off Venom down for good, not when he knows that the enemy possess such weapon and have others to back him up. It´s not like Flash and Matt will stand still together waiting for the attack.


the below pic states that Hawkeye's sonic arrow is hypersonic. Hypersonic is Mach 5 or above. Here are a few links to credit the statement

definition of hypersonic link

chart in middle showing power of hypersonic

Mockingbird clearly refers to the arrow as hypersonic which is Mach 5 or greater in decibel force. Also see how Mockingbird tells Hawkeye to turn it off, as Ive stated all along that its a constant sonic energy (remember this later)

As stated previously by me, Quicksilver achieves Mach 3 by the Boom, boom, BOOM.

So if Mach 3 sonic energy is able to effect the Venom symbiote, why isnt a more powerful Mach 5 or greater sonic energy not going to effect Venom? It will cuz the Mach 3 (supersonic) energy is still built into the Mach 5 (hypersonic) energy

Now to discredit your scans of Venom resistant to sonic energy

flaw 1- Iron man. Stark doesnt use a sonic attack in this scan. He uses ultrasound which is like subsonic (like x-ray or radar level), but it isnt even an attack. Its for Stark's vision to see once he gets webbed in the face, yet the lower subsonic frequency annoys Venom. Once again, Stark didnt use a sonic attack. He pretty much was giving Venom a CT scan.

Once again, read your scan. "Ultrasonic imaging" which is now way as powerful as supersonic or hypersonic

Now your sonic scream scan and Hulk scan. If you click the spoiler, the sonic scream and Hulks sonic clap still disperses the Venom symbiote from Brock. Venom did resist nothing. He got hurt, the only flaw in the attack is that the sonic attack wasnt continuous.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063404-sound1.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063405-sound2.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063406-sound3.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063465-venomvshulk6.jpg

I think Ive shown via scan that Hawkeye's sonic arrow is hypersonic energy which is even more powerful then supersonic. Remember when I said Mockingbird told Hawkeye to turn off the hypersonic arrow? So its a continuous attack unless stopped. You remember the scan I posted of a continuous sonic attack on Venom? If not, here it is again. He isnt so effective anymore

If the arrow emits a constant stream of hypersonic energy, Venom isnt going to reform. How is he? He cant

Venom is out of this fight

I would also like to debunk a couple of other scans you posted though.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063485-8575064507-PQAAA.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107456/3063487-2674202877-PQAAA.jpg

You want to know why Venom is laughing at a megaphone attack? Cuz its WIS.

And then he is effected by 5 megaphones. Im still laughing. And there is no way five megaphones is supersonic in decibel (the measurement of sound) or even hypersonic, which as stated is what Hawkeye's arrow is made of, which is why it took out the Hulk and would take out Venom

Closing Venom Statement:

1- Hawkeye's arrow produces hypersonic energy(Mach 5 or greater), more powerful then Quicksilver's supersonic attack (Mach 3)

2- the hypersonic energy is constant and doesnt give Venom to reform cuz the one scan it is constant he is captured and useless while Venom only reforming when the sonic attacks are stopped

#26 Posted by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm said:

Daredevil

Fighting

He was able to defeat Logan 2x before, with standard levels, now imagine now he got 2 ton strength, healing factor and enhanced reaction time (on top of his own).

vs Wolverine:

vs Wolverine + Ninjas:

Dodging

Now let´s that Matt is more then capable of dealing with gunfire, even from to marksmanship characters such as the Punisher, so Deadpool will just waste his time and bullets trying to tag Daredevil here:


1- Ok, you know your Enemy of the State scan your provided that Wolverine wasnt completely focused cuz he was fighting the Hand mental control. He didnt want to fight DD but couldnt stop himself. Just read your narratives.

2- the Klaw DD fight. Yeah...do you have that issue cuz if you do, you know DD was running away from the Klaw the entire fight and just happened to stumble across a device the emits sonic energy during the plot. You know what we call that in battle world here on comicvine??? Plot device. Is DD bringing some noise dampening headphones to this fight? Cuz if he isnt, another hypersonic arrow is going to rattle his radar.

3- Punisher doesnt create white noise to to distort DDs radar sense. Deadpool does. Plus the hypersonic arrow, DD isnt at full strength and he still was able to get the jump on DD. Remember I got healing factor canceling weapons too

Gun to the head...BANG

My wifey is calling me but Ill try to get to Winter Soldier tonight cuz I know votes open tomorrow.

But Im taking out your team still

#27 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

bump

#28 Edited by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio
@higorm said:

Winter Soldier

Top marksmanship, expert in H2H combat, bionic arm, sniper rifle, machine gun, halo mjolnir armor.

vs Wolverine:

vs Clint Barton:

Bucky shows his superiority over Clint Barton at H2H combat. He is also able to catch arrows mid air while performing gymnastics with his bionic arm.

vs Wolverine and Hawkeye:

Bucky is able to put Wolverine down for the 3rd time after overcoming his senses again, then he manage to cut Hawkeye´s arrows in half, and then shoot 3 of those arrows all in mid air..


1- Bucky vs Wolverine: scan one Wolverine doesnt know Bucky was a threat. he just appears and surprises. Scan two, Wolverine has his hands tied. What do you want him to do?

2- Im never claimed Hawkeye was better than Bucky in H2H. He's alot better then he was at H2H but I wont ever claim Clintin the upper echelon in H2H...but Im relying on the bow. Also, what makes Bucky think he wasnt slicing an explosive arrow? Bucky has no way of sensing the arrows sent. He was taking a risk from my POV

@higorm said:

Enought of this nonsense!!

It´s time to present a real decent strategy here!!

Okay so my team have 9 minutes to get rid of those 3 enemies, sounds like a mission to me, so given mission is mission accomplished!


Initial Considerations

My team (through Bucky and Matt) knows very well who they´re facing here, since:

  • Knowledge is only on actual Knowledge of character has on other.

So there´s no surprises here. Your team may have time for preparation but without a prep master that time will be useless when you already know who the enemy is, so this is about who got what it takes to defeat the other team, and of course my team got it.

Also, the Venom symbiote possess knowledge from the previous hosts, and Flash already knows Deadpool, so even him is well aware of who the enemy is.

The Game Plan!

Daredevil will start scanning the map with his mental radar. He is more then capable to track the enemies in a matter of seconds, after that he will inform his team member about their location. The team will split, Venom will use his camouflage abilities to disguise himself to difficult the enemy tracking. Bucky will plant claymores in the ground and then assume a sniper position using his radar and thermal vision given by the halo mjolnir armor to scan the enemies, to aim and shoot at sight. Teams will clash sooner or later, so Venom will enter a Morals OFF state to take on more then one threat at the same time while Matt keep any of those 3 that may be left busy. Bucky will be there to shoot the ones who may be vulnerable using weapon that cancels healing factors, so no scape for Wolverine or Deadpool. Also, Bucky will provide backup for his team from distance shotting Hawkeye´s arrows mid air if necessary.

Flash as well as the rest of the team will carry (hiding) flash bangs to use them if necessary to temporarily blind the enemy, and grenades to throw at their base forcing them to reveal their position.


I will agree that we both know each other

1- Wont argue DD will do this but I think the radar gets shut down. Remember, my team is linked by TP. Get the sonic arrow near your guys Deadpool knows to teleport and get the drop on people. Wolverines smell will tell us where your people are at.

2- Venom...does he get sniffed out? Wolverine can smell invisible opponents. Then comes the sonic arrow

3-Bucky plants claymores and then takes sniping position? You know we are timed, right? Also, your shooting angles are all messed up to get a real good shot. There is the elevated stone bridge and the top of your buildings entrance. Everything else the shot is clouded. Also, if I needed a last resort, what makes me not send Deadpool to take out a claymore and knockout the mjolnir armor? What makes me not using my EMP arrow to knock out mjolnir armor? What makes me not send Pym arrows of thousand of death to your location? You dont have infinity clips to shoot them all down

4- If you are sending Venom and Daredevil in and leaving Winter Guard behind then Im claiming Wolverine picks up their scent, gets communicated by TP, then they get knocked out by Hawkeye or Deadpool. Any fire on your team gives away Bucky's shooting position. He isnt a teleporter. Whoever notices the shot, the info will be quickly relayed via TP

5- And since Wolverine knows that Bucky is here trying to us, Wolverine has shown ability to sense a shot coming

Also, due to prior knowledge and prep, Wolverine knows the exact scents of all

6- So Bucky is waiting to get a shot on my team while also shooting Hawkeye's arrows? When did Bucky get Flash speed, lol

Also, since Wolverine actually knows Bucky is coming Wolverine know can rely on bullet dodging with his reaction speed

reaction time .038 seconds (credit goes to @jashro44 for the above scan)

7- for the same reason you will claim Bucky can shoot down arrows, I will claim that Hawkeye can shoot down thrown flashbangs...which will do more damage to DD then anything else...if Venom and DD get this far

#29 Edited by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg

Hypersonic arrow:

Hawkeye´s sonic arrow may be hypersonic but that doesn´t chance the fact that:

  1. He only got 1 arrow of this kind since you have 5 of any Trick Arrows (unless stated otherwise)
  2. He must be able to shoot the arrow first.
  3. Even if he have time to do it, he can´t see the Venom Symbiote.
  4. Let´s say he can shoot the arrow, and got clear vision, still not enough to hit the target since the Venom possess a danger sense and superhuman agility to dodge or neutralize the arrow, like he did before against other sonic attacks..
  5. The arrow emits hypersonic sound. but doesn´t travel at hypersonic speed, it´s quite different from what Pietro did, since he used speed to produce enough sonic to affect the symbiote, while the arrow emits a sound after it´s fired, still considering Mockinbird was holding the arrow without faiting, I highly doubt it possess enough sonic power to put a morals off Venom down. So from all that I can say either Bucky or Venom can destroy the arrow mid air or even resist to it since a character like Mockingbird was able to resist to it..

Venom resisting to sonic attacks:

You didn´t presented any flaws..

The Stark scan was to counter your "stark tech" argument, which proves Venom already manage to deal with it before, even with the armor releasing a sonic attack, doesn´t matter the name you put to it, it was an attack, a counter measure from the armor to affect the Venom. That proves even stark tech isn´t enough to deal with Venom.

The sonic scream works exactly like your sonic arrow, but with more intensity since Venom was tagged at close range, and still Venom manage to resist to it and keep fighting. Hulk used 2 thunderclaps to put the Venom down, and even then not enough to completely unbound the symbiote off the host. How the Venom was not resisting if he got back on his feat after the 1st thunderclap? Forcing the Hulk to use another one?? A sonic arrow doesn´t have the same power of a thunderclap to unbound the symbiote, which is the only way to effectively defeat him.

You´re not going to say that Clint´s sonic arrow is more powerfull then a thunderclap are you? Clint´s arrow is so strong that even Mockinbird was able to resist it..

You have continuous sonic emission but not with enough power, in that scan Venom was trapped and still resisting the sonic attack since he wasn´t completely unbound, which proves he can resist to it and even counter it like he did before, he´s not trapped here so your argument is pointless.

Venom is far from being out of this fight, since Hawkeye doesn´t have a clear shot from the beginning, doesn´t have enough agility to keep up with him, and can have his arrows neutralized mid air, not to mention Venom´s radar sense which helps him not being caught by anyone by surprise.

That´s not WIS, I´ve stabilished the Venom symbiote can resist to sonic attacks, that scan only proves that even a constant stream of sonic energy isn´t enough to put him down if it isn´t powerfull enough. The sonic arrow is even less powerfull then that so I hardly doubt it would work the way you want.

Flash knows about the sonic arrow, have ways to counter it with his guns, tendrils or webbing, possess enough agility to get away from it and a danger sense in top of all that.

Winter Soldier

1. First scan Bucky take all the samurais down then Wolverine comes after him and is put down too. The Second scan show Bucky following Logan for a month without him knowing it, then he nearly beats him to death but that wasn´t Bucky´s mission at the time, and he had his hand tied after getting beating up by Bucky who manage to put him down, for the 2nd time.

Here is Bucky putting Logan down for the 3rd time:

Note that Wolverine was after Bucky trying to track him through scent, still Bucky manage to outsmart him, shooting him from the back by surprise, why Logan didn´t scent the shot comming this time huh?

Because he´s not dealing with a random thug, THIS IS THE WINTER SOLDIER BABY!!

The scans shows how BADASS the guy is, even Wolverine was impressed by him, claiming that the guy was holding back all these years..

2. Because if it was a explosive arrow Logan would be affected since Bucky shoot him 3 times with explosive rounds and was about to put a knife on him. Also, that doesn´t really matter since Bucky is using the halo armor here, a explosive arrow means nothing when the armor can resist atmospheric re-entry:

More Bucky´s marksmanship feats, now against another top fighter such as Daredevil:

Game Plan

1- Daredevil mental radar > Wolverine scent. Matt will track your team faster then Logan, since Matt can use 3 different ways to do it, super smell, hearing and radar. By the time Logan manage to track my team will be already taking positions according to the strategy. Also, Bucky manage to outsmart Wolverine before, hiding his scent to take him by surprise, we can do it again here. So no advantage on this department for you here.

Also, about the teleportation, Daredevil can feel it before it happens using his super senses.

So he will be ready and prepared to Deadpool and will be able to use pressure points to take him down when he appears.

2 - I can´t remember one instance the Venom was tracked via scent..

3 - That´s for anyone who tries to sneak up on him, also he is there to cover his team, which increase my chances of successfully acomplish the mission. That´s why Bucky possess a radar and thermal vision on his helmet, so no one on your team can hide from him. The mjolnir armor can´t be easily knocked by a claymore or grenades. You most get pass through the energy shield and armor durability first.

Hawkeye is not going to do that since we have rules:

  • Moral On. In Character.

So he won´t start sending pym arrows or anything like that from start, he doesn´t even know where Bucky is positioned to shoot the arrows at him.

Halo Radar:

Thermal Vision:

Halo armor energy shield:

Durability:

  • Titanium Alloy Outer Shell: The outer shell of the MJOLNIR armor is comprised of a fairly thick titanium alloy. This plating covers the chest, arms, hip, legs, calves, feet and hands. This alloy is very resilient, can take significant punishment, and is nearly impervious to small arms fire. While enough shots from armor piercing rounds will breach the outer shell, the suit can take a few glancing blows from them without compromising the armor. The outer shell of the all MJOLNIR suits is covered with a refractive coating to help disperse the heat experienced from Covenant energy weapons. However one or two direct hits from any Plasma weapon will compromise the armor plating.
  • Titanium Nanocomposite Bodysuit: Sandwiched between the external armor and the internal padding is a thick black armored bodysuit. This suit has numerous functions, small but vital to the safety and survival of the wearer. The bodysuit is made of a titanium-based material, making it very strong and yet very flexible. It also serves as another layer of protection against ballistics attacks and is coated with a heat resistant material to disperse heat from Plasma weapons.

4 - By the time Logan manage to pick their scent (Bucky already outsmart wolverine in that department), my team will be jumping on your guys, specially Venom who is at a morals off state. How are they going to knock a morals off venom out? Or Daredevil who is stronger then both Wolverine and Deadpool, is more agile, possess enhanced reaction time and a healing factor to complete. Not to mention previous record defeating Logan. Also, Bucky can defend himself against anyone here.

5 - I´ll have to post it again..

Possessing the scent doesn´t mean anything when you can react faster then the enemy.

6- Bucky is a top marksmanship he can do that without much effort.

Logan´s reaction time didn´t save him from this:

Here´s the outstanding ability of Logan scent a shot comming:

Also, about seeing a shot comming, Daredevil can do it better:

7 - Bucky already did that against Hawkeye. Also, Venom can hide the grenade and use it at close distance if necessary:

This is what is gonna happen if anyone try to fight Venom here:

#30 Posted by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm: hmm....something must be wrong with the site cuz Im still not getting notices from you

anyways...

@higorm said:

5 - I´ll have to post it again..

Possessing the scent doesn´t mean anything when you can react faster then the enemy.


Possessing the scent combined with TP link is faster then your radar sense and having to communicate it over your comms...if you can hear yourself over a hypersonic frequency.

@higorm said:

Also, about seeing a shot comming, Daredevil can do it better:


and what happens if you are distracted by Deadpools white noise or by the hypersonic arrow effecting you radar sense that moment could cost you your life.

@higorm said:

Venom resisting to sonic attacks:

You didn´t presented any flaws..

The Stark scan was to counter your "stark tech" argument, which proves Venom already manage to deal with it before, even with the armor releasing a sonic attack, doesn´t matter the name you put to it, it was an attack, a counter measure from the armor to affect the Venom. That proves even stark tech isn´t enough to deal with Venom.

The sonic scream works exactly like your sonic arrow, but with more intensity since Venom was tagged at close range, and still Venom manage to resist to it and keep fighting. Hulk used 2 thunderclaps to put the Venom down, and even then not enough to completely unbound the symbiote off the host. How the Venom was not resisting if he got back on his feat after the 1st thunderclap? Forcing the Hulk to use another one?? A sonic arrow doesn´t have the same power of a thunderclap to unbound the symbiote, which is the only way to effectively defeat him.

You´re not going to say that Clint´s sonic arrow is more powerfull then a thunderclap are you? Clint´s arrow is so strong that even Mockinbird was able to resist it..

You have continuous sonic emission but not with enough power, in that scan Venom was trapped and still resisting the sonic attack since he wasn´t completely unbound, which proves he can resist to it and even counter it like he did before, he´s not trapped here so your argument is pointless.

Venom is far from being out of this fight, since Hawkeye doesn´t have a clear shot from the beginning, doesn´t have enough agility to keep up with him, and can have his arrows neutralized mid air, not to mention Venom´s radar sense which helps him not being caught by anyone by surprise.

That´s not WIS, I´ve stabilished the Venom symbiote can resist to sonic attacks, that scan only proves that even a constant stream of sonic energy isn´t enough to put him down if it isn´t powerfull enough. The sonic arrow is even less powerfull then that so I hardly doubt it would work the way you want.

Flash knows about the sonic arrow, have ways to counter it with his guns, tendrils or webbing, possess enough agility to get away from it and a danger sense in top of all that.


1- it wasnt an attack. Iron Man was changing his visuals cuz his eyes were blocked. Venom was hurt by the subsonic frequency the ultrasonic frequency created. If Iron Man made a armor from kyrptonite and just walked next to Superman, did IronMan's tech kill Superman or was it the kryptonite?

2- Sonic works the same but like I said, the sonic screamed stopped then Venom attacked. it wasnt a constant frequency...and how do you know that scream was more powerful then my hypersonic arrow? If a ultrasonic (subsonic frequency from IronMan) radar view effected Venom, a supersonic frequency (Mach 3 from Quicksilver) , 5 megaphones effected the Venom (from your scan) (which isnt supersonic cuz people wouldnt be able to listen to it) then why isnt a hypersonic arrow going to work...or how is it not more powerful? By definition, it is.

Hypersonic more powerful the supersonic of thunderclap. The scan clearly states sonic boom, which is Mach 1. Hypersonic is Mach 5 or greater

3- I am saying that. It was effecting Mockingbird , she told Hawkeye to turn it off. Mockingbird is Hawkeye's wife , an Avenger, and a SHIELD agent so her knowing Hawkeye's arrows is highly likely

4- and yet you post scans of Bucky beating WOlverine when Logan's hands are tied behind his back?

5- Morals off doesnt mean you get a power boost unless otherwise shown. Morals off with Hulk and Wolverine is different then say Batman. Morals off simply means that you will kill if you have to if in character. You dont get a magical super saiyan level to attack.

Also, how do you define resist? In every scan we have both shown, any sonic (subsonic to supersonic) the Venom symbiote clearly ripples. I dont need to kill Venom in this scenario either. Just keep it busy to not attack or open enough opening of human flesh to kill the host

6- if you are keeping your eyes on Venom then you are leaving DD open to get attacked. If I send normal arrows at your position, you going to shoot it down with your sniper rifle? Cuz then you have to readjust to save Venom? How you going to even know where Venom is if he is cloaked? Bucky cant shoot everything with his sniper rifle cuz he has to lock on target. If you had TP link with DD, I would believe it more but not just on normal human reaction

7- that was WIS. What else would you call it? What fighter would try to bring out a bullhorn to scream in an enemies face. That was the dumbest things I have ever seen. It was a regular bullhorn. Not a special Stark or Reed equipped bullhorn. It was a bullhorn

It was like that DD vs Klaw scan your provided. DD is running away from Klaw the whole issue yet he happens to stumble across a sonic device to you against Klaw....in Hells Kitchen??? Hells Kitchen is like the hood, why is this big scientific device in the hood???

8- the bullhorn screamed in Venom's face is more louder then a hypersonic attack???Seriously, you going to try and run that past me? Seriously???

@higorm said:

Game Plan

1- Daredevil mental radar > Wolverine scent. Matt will track your team faster then Logan, since Matt can use 3 different ways to do it, super smell, hearing and radar. By the time Logan manage to track my team will be already taking positions according to the strategy. Also, Bucky manage to outsmart Wolverine before, hiding his scent to take him by surprise, we can do it again here. So no advantage on this department for you here.

Also, about the teleportation, Daredevil can feel it before it happens using his super senses.

So he will be ready and prepared to Deadpool and will be able to use pressure points to take him down when he appears.


Im not claiming Wolverines senses are better then DDs, all Im stating is that both DD and Venom have weakness to sonic frequencies, which I possess and am able to use at a distance

If DD is getting flooded by hypersonic frequency, is he really going to also recognize the teleportation?

#31 Posted by HigorM (3576 posts) - - Show Bio

No. The mental radar is faster then the scent, Logan need some time to stop and use his super senses to track someone through smell. With Matt it´s a whole different story, he only needs to focus and then he get everyone who is around him, a mental radar works faster then scent tracking. So having a TP link doesn´t change the whole procsess since Wolverine must track first and communicates later.

Also, Hawkeye will only be able to shoot the arrow after Logan´s tracking, not before, so Daredevil won´t be affected by no sonic arrow until he completes his own superior tracking. By that time my team will be already be putting the plan into operation.

1. Doesn´t matter if Iron Man only changes his way to see Venom, that doesn´t change the fact that a sonic frequency was released, so even if not specific classified as an attack, that worked like one since Venom felt it forcing him to overcome the pain and jump on him..

About your silly question, both. Stark made it right? It´s the same thing I say that was not the killer who murdered the victim, it was the knife..

2. I´ve already presented Venom getting away from a constant sonic frequency. How can you say it wasn´t? If a regular human without super powers (Classic Mockingbird) was able to resist it? The ultrasound from Iron Man was nothing more than a nuisance since he was able to respond to it. Also the 5 megaphones emitting constant sonic frequency wasn´t able to put him down. A hypersonic arrow is not enough because a non superhuman character was able to resist to it, and also the arrow can be neutralized before or after it starts to work.

Nothing is more powerful then a thunderclap in this scenario, sonic boom it´s just a name, it doesn´t mean that it´s Mach 1, come on!

3. And she was still resisting to it, how powerfull is that sonic arrow? I´m not putting is question her knowledge but her being able to resist to it, quite a feat huh?

4. Did you read the scans? Bucky was following Logan over a month without his notice. Then he decides to put him down, and they fight, Logan wasn´t hundcuffed because Bucky hundcuffed him after BEAT HIM INTO THE GROUND. Please read the scans!

5. Yeah it does when we´re talking about the Venom symbiote. I´ve presented scans where he starts fighting morals on and then as the fight goes he becomes more and more stronger and vicious without morals. Here is the scans:

I define resist when he take the damage and keeps fighting after it. In all my scans the Venom symbiote is shown being able to take the attack and then put himself back to action. The symbiote gives a healing factor to the host so he can instantly recover after every attack. So that´s make him very difficult to deal with.

6. Bucky is backing the whole team, they are connected via com gear with headsets for whole team. Also, bucky have enhanced vision with the radar and thermal vision. So he will know who is needing backup or not. He can either focus on a target or open fire with the machine gun. Bucky can tank heavy damage with the mjolnir armor. Venom doesn´t need to be saved here. As said, he is cloaked but the team possess com gear for communication, so.. He doesn´t have only the sniper but also machine gun and grenades. Bucky also have enhanced reaction due to his bionic arm.

7. It wasn´t WIS, Peter was trying to use everything against the Venom since he was getting a beat down, being smashed and hurled from one side to the other. And I´ve never said that was a special bullhorn, I was refering myself to the 5 megaphones.

8. No, the 5 megaphones that was releasing constant sound frequency at loud decibels since that was a air raid siren for emergency situations. They have the weakness but that doesn´t mean a thing when the enemy can´t use it properly. He´s not getting flooded by hypersonic frequency as already stated so he will recognize the teleportation just fine.

#32 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio
#34 Posted by oceanmaster21 (7742 posts) - - Show Bio

HigorM has my vote but good job to vote

#35 Posted by Veshark (9058 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow, this was a really long and interesting read.

First off, kudos to the both of you for a great debate. Some good arguments being made here, and plenty of interesting back-and-forth.

But I'm going to have to give the vote to @higorm here. His argument regarding Venom's resistance to sonics was more convincing, and I also thought that he had a solid strategy for his team. His use of his team members by playing to their advantages (Bucky as a sniper, DD as an instant tracker, and a morals-off Venom as a MVP) won me over, and he used his scans more effectively.

Regardless of the outcome, nice work to both debaters - this was a great finale.

#36 Posted by dondave (34416 posts) - - Show Bio
#37 Edited by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (19910 posts) - - Show Bio

HigorM pulled it off at the last second. Love the setting by the way :)

#38 Posted by ULTRAstarkiller (5881 posts) - - Show Bio

Too close

#39 Edited by Backflip (2256 posts) - - Show Bio

Very close, but got to back HigorM

#40 Posted by Stronger (4948 posts) - - Show Bio

HigorM ftw

#41 Posted by Stompa (1256 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm: get´s my vote because he overall did a better job presenting a tactic for his team although i think hawkeyes sonic arrows would take down Venom.....vulnerability to sonics is just that and i can´t see were a special frequency is needed when sonic booms and a "superyell" were able to affect him.

#42 Edited by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

Holy.

I really don't know who to vote for here. Both were awesome at proving and debunking the other. I'll vote later after taking some time to think it through more.

Phenomenal job by both. Really.

#43 Posted by laflux (14128 posts) - - Show Bio

@lykopis: Lyko, what are you doing here!!!!!! This is where all the C*ck Stroking goes on D:

#44 Edited by batnorris (679 posts) - - Show Bio

higorm. he's been great all the way through this tournament

#45 Posted by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux said:

@lykopis: Lyko, what are you doing here!!!!!! This is where all the C*ck Stroking goes on D:

omg....O_O

At least these debates are thought out -- respectful and educational, let alone informative. It's you heathens out there on those free-for-all battles that **ahem** particular activity is partaken in.

#46 Posted by laflux (14128 posts) - - Show Bio

@lykopis said:

@laflux said:

@lykopis: Lyko, what are you doing here!!!!!! This is where all the C*ck Stroking goes on D:

omg....O_O

At least these debates are thought out -- respectful and educational, let alone informative. It's you heathens out there on those free-for-all battles that **ahem** particular activity is partaken in.

I don't like to blow my own horn, but look at this

The prowess of Laflux

I did mention I was like ridiculously modest too right.

#47 Posted by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux:

Modesty, thy name is not laflux.

Interesting argument -- reading through it, considering feats etc (plus I am aware of Ultimate Cap's abilities) I would have expected cadence to win except as the debate continued, I can see why you did, based on the presentation of your argument . It shouldn't have been such a slaughter though -- and you keeping track after EACH vote was a bit much, ala godspawn. You are good -- I give you that. I do think the focus on Spiderman didn't do either of you any favours but oh well. Looks like it's how things are done.

Those are the battles worth reading.

#48 Posted by laflux (14128 posts) - - Show Bio
#49 Posted by boschePG (2175 posts) - - Show Bio

6 to 1 for HigorM so far

#50 Posted by laflux (14128 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh and great Battle, I vote a bit later.