#1 Edited by Esquire (3742 posts) - - Show Bio

Team @sovereign91001

Wolverine-10 (Adamantium)

Spider-Man-11 (Web shooters, Cryo Pellets)

Add-Ons

Team Bloodlusted-3

Team Full Knowledge-3

Team Immunity to Poison Gas, Pheromones and Tear Gas-1

Team TP Link-2

Team @name12345

Mister X (10) (Telepathy, Twin Katanas)

Agent X (5) (Assault Rifle, Pistol, Combat Knife)

X-23 (6) (Adamantium)

Add-Ons:

1 - One Bladed Weapon is changed to Carbonadium. (Mister X)

1 - One Gun-Wielding Character gets Explosive Rounds. (Agent X)

1 - Each of your Unarmored Characters receives a Kevlar Vest.

1 - Tear Gas Grenades (3) (one to each member)

1 - Electroshock Grenades (3) (one to each member)

2 - Your team has 45 minutes to plan / strategize and is told the names and only basic powers of who they are facing. During this time they cannot access additional information on their foes or bring additional equipment.

1 - Thermal/X-Ray/Night Vision Goggles for each member of the team.

1 - Your team is immune to pheromones, tear gas, and poison gas.

Rules:

    • In character unless otherwise specified
    • Win by Death, KO, BFR, or Incapacitation
    • Team Chemistry does come into play
    • No Prep unless otherwise specified
    • All DC Characters are Pre-52
    • All Marvel Characters are Current unless otherwise specified
    • You may enter the tower. Tower is empty of furniture, top floor is surrounded with windows.
    • Location is unpopulated
    • Contestants start in the forest 0.5 miles from the tower on opposite sides.
#2 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345 Alright would you like to start us off?

#3 Posted by name12345 (560 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345 Alright would you like to start us off?

Well... actually i would like you to begin!! (i started my last 2 battles..)

#4 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345:

No problem, let me get my stuff together and I'll post something up soon.

#5 Edited by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345: Now while it's true my team is outnumbered they are by no means out gunned in fact despite the number disadvantage I'd say my team has the advantage overall.

  • Wolverine has beaten both X-23 and Mister X before, he knows how to take them both down and he can provide that info to Peter via their T.P link
  • The enviorment heavily favors Wolverine he spent years hunting and tracking in the Canadian wilderness, a forest is like a second home for him,
  • I think in terms of sheer speed my team has an advantage here; Logan and Laura's speed is roughly equal as is Mister X. Spider-Man outpaces them all by a large margin (especially considering his bloodlusted state).
  • In terms of team dynamics I think I have the advantage here; knowing what I do I doubt that Laura would be willing to work with either of your other characters. Wolverine and Spider-Man can be a cohessive team and have teamed up together numerous times in the past.
  • In terms of Strength I have a clear advantage here.

This is my opener. I'm working on a battle plan, in the meantime feel free to post.

#6 Edited by Vaeternus (8286 posts) - - Show Bio

Damn...I had a paragraph's worth written up and then my avast went on and cleared my thing argghh lol now I must think again lol

#7 Edited by name12345 (560 posts) - - Show Bio
@sovereign91001 said:
  • Wolverine has beaten both X-23 and Mister X before, he knows how to take them both down and he can provide that info to Peter via their T.P link

- This is true... however i could say the same thing about X-23 and Mister X, they both defeated Wolverine before!! (and in a 1vs1, imagine if the would team up against him...) Also, when Wolverine is bloodlusted he enter that "berserk rage" state, that should render the TP link completely useless...

@sovereign91001 said:
  • The enviorment heavily favors Wolverine he spent years hunting and tracking in the Canadian wilderness, a forest is like a second home for him

- Nothing to say, Wolverine is more familiar with this kind of environment... but there are really just trees here, i wonder how this could be an advantage for him, infact i can't think of anything that could possibly favor Wolverine.

@sovereign91001 said:
  • I think in terms of sheer speed my team has an advantage here; Logan and Laura's speed is roughly equal as is Mister X. Spider-Man outpaces them all by a large margin (especially considering his bloodlusted state).

- In terms of speed yes, Spiderman is better... BUT X-23 is definitively faster than Logan, mainly because she doesn't have an adamantium exoskeleton(which make her healing factor superior to Logan's), and also because of her fighting style. On top of that, she was even able to catch Spiderman during a fight!

@sovereign91001 said:
  • In terms of team dynamics I think I have the advantage here; knowing what I do I doubt that Laura would be willing to work with either of your other characters. Wolverine and Spider-Man can be a cohessive team and have teamed up together numerous times in the past.

- I think you are wrong for 3 reasons, and you have committed a BIG MISTAKE:

1) You have to consider that X-23 and Logan already fighted each others...

2) We have 40 minutes prep!! My team would formulate a plan, they would know who they are going to face, and they would be psychologically prepared.

3) The big mistake... your team had a better chemestry than mine without being bloodlusted!!! Now all they want is to kill, and they would not collaborate or even take advantage of their TP link or their prep!!! a bloodlusted Wolverine is just a ferocious beast...

My team on the other hand, would've 40 minutes to process what is going on, who they are going to face, how to collaborate the best etc. I think i have the better chemestry here!

@sovereign91001 said:
  • In terms of Strength I have a clear advantage here.

This is my opener. I'm working on a battle plan, in the meantime feel free to post.

- Yeah, i can't argue with that... Spiderman is the strongest, but is not like there's going be a car to throw at us right?? the battleground is practically empty... so, the only advantage you should get is the striking power... i believe that having more physical strength will not be very important in this battle, since we all use lethal weapons already, and none of my team's member is a grappler...

Thanks for opening the debate, i will post my strategy after you @sovereign91001

#8 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

- This is true... however i could say the same thing about X-23 and Mister X, they both defeated Wolverine before!! (and in a 1vs1, imagine if the would team up against him...) Also, when Wolverine is bloodlusted he enter that "berserk rage" state, that should render the TP link completely useless...

From Esquire's O.P: 3 - All your characters are Bloodlusted; their intelligence and emotional state is unaffected, but they will kill without hesitation or remorse.

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/esquires-build-a-team-tournament-sign-ups-750316/ (Link so you can verify) Now as to the reason why I chose bloodlust; Spider-Man will not be holding back in his abilities (as is his norm) and whenever Spidey doesn't hold back he is a pure beast. The unaffected emotional state means Logan won't go into berserk rage unless I need him too; but at the start of the battle he's in his normal frame of mind.

3) The big mistake... your team had a better chemestry than mine without being bloodlusted!!! Now all they want is to kill, and they would not collaborate or even take advantage of their TP link or their prep!!! a bloodlusted Wolverine is just a ferocious beast...

Already addressed it.

My team on the other hand, would've 40 minutes to process what is going on, who they are going to face, how to collaborate the best etc. I think i have the better chemestry here!

Prep is nice but on your team you have a hero/anti-hero (X-23), a Mercenary (Agent X) & a villain (Mister X) and seeing as they are all in character there is really no reason X-23 and Mister X wouldn't attack each other (as to which one wins, I have no idea). Hell Mister X a guy who lives for the thrill of killing would probably go after Agent X also. Given that I'm surprised you didn't take advantage of the teamwork add-on.

Battle Plan

Since I believe my team holds a speed advantage overall, they are going to set out to the tower first. Your most dangerous link imo is Mister X, I'm going to have Spider-Man take him on. Spider-Man between his speed and ways to nuetralize Mister X's main way of doing damage (he can web up his katanas) and his experience fighting psychic opponents before. He can web or cryo cube Mister X or KO or kill him, I don't think Mister X has the durability to stand up to Peter if he's going all out.

Logan should be able to handle X-23 and Agent X, I'm not convinced of her being faster than him

He's not even really trying to fight her here, he's trying to talk and he's staying one step ahead of her. Now she soon thereafter manages to slice his throat open (while he's trying to talk to her) but he promptly bats her away. Anywho I think he can hold Agent X and X-23 off long enough for Spidey to take care of Mister X.

#9 Edited by name12345 (560 posts) - - Show Bio

@sovereign91001:

I'm sorry i forgot about the bloodlusted rules... it's been a while since i checked. So, i'm facing an "evil" Wolverine and Spiderman!! This is probably more of a challenge for my team!!

This would mean that Mister X will be able to read their minds, and this is a huge advantage... He pratically humiliated Wolverine without using weapons!!

Since, i think, that you don't want Wolverine to fight him... you put Spiderman against him. But, Mister X can predict his moves too, and he is fast enough to do so!!

Imagine how long the fight would be, if he had 2 Katanas?? (and one of them made of Carbonadium)

In this scan, we can see that he is able to deflect multiple shots fired from 2 semi-automatic guns!!This feats is more impressive than it looks, because the average semi-automatic gun, can shoot about 5 bullets per second and more(as fast as you can pull the trigger), and he is able to deflect them all x2, apparently this isn't even his limit... This feat doesn't require just an incredible reaction time(his reflexes are better than the average bullet timer), but also incredible speed and precision!!

So, my conclusion is that Spiderman isn't going to hit him with any ranged attack.

- About my chemestry:

Agent X =A mercenary is not evil or good, and Agent X is not stupid... he would not attack his own team, and he's used to "work" and collaborate with different people, it's part of his job.

Mister X = Again not stupid... you said yourself that he lives for the thrill of killing, so why would he ever want to attack his own team, when an evil Wolverine is trying to kill him?? In the prep time they get some knowledge of who they are going to face, so he know exactly who's the enemy, he would probably want a revenge on Wolverine!! since he couldn't do it with Spiderman in the way, he also needs his team to fight Spiderman.

X-23 = Why would she ever want to attack Mister X? She doesn't even know him, the only thing she knows is that she must defeat Wolverine and Spiderman... and that his team is going to do the same.

- My strategy

Ok, like i already said Mister X would probably want to attack Logan, since i don't think X-23 would like to face him... she and Agent X would take on Spiderman. If the turret would already be occupied by the enemy team, Agent X would use his explosing grounds to make it fall and destroy it. Of course they would be using their grenades as well to help during the fight.

Mister X vs Wolverine

Agent X & X-23 vs Spiderman

Also, there's a slight chance of Agent X using his psionic powers, he always use them without thinking... for example, one time he was seeing this mutant, Mary Zero, who's power is to make people forget she's there, no one couldn't notice her but he was immune. So my point is that he could use his powers to bypass Spiderman's spider sense.

So, Mister X would easily defeat Wolverine as he already defeated him without weapons, and X-23 and Agent X will team up against Spiderman... There are good chances they could win thanks to Agent X incredible ability in h2h, guns, HF and with his powers. He is basically like a Deadpool with psionic powers

- Feats for Agent X

- Hand to Hand: Easily defeating Taskmaster h2h, later Task admitted for some reason he couldn't understand his moves (beacuse of his psionic powers i think)

(correct order is 3, 2, 1, 4 sorry i couldn't fix it)

- Guns: Shoots better than deadpool.

- HF/Pain tollerance: They pierce him for fun ^^

That's it for now! But i think i've demostrated that having the number advantage and a counter for Wolverine gives me a clear advantage!! @sovereign91001

#10 Edited by Esquire (3742 posts) - - Show Bio

@sovereign91001 @name12345:

Either of you want to get in any more debate? (Also, did name12345 get banned? I can't @reply him, I had to use the Reply button.)

#11 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@esquire: I think so his profile pic is deleted and everything I couldn't tag him either. And I did have debate left, I'd just got caught up in the other 5 I'm in lol. I'll post some more tomorrow just in case he isn't banned.

#12 Edited by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345: Okay as to why Mister X would attack X-23, he's omnicidal. He's incabale of working on a team and has threatned (and fought with) his teammates on the thunderbolts.

How could he resist the chance to not only stick it to the demon (Wolverine) who's won 2 of their three fights by taking out his protege but the chance to show up Wolverine and Spidey at the same time. Seems to me he'd be salivating at the chance.

As I've demonstrated telepathy has no bearing on Peter's Spider-Sense. the only times it's been bypassed are with drugs and other spider-powered oponents (Ezekiel, Venom etc.) none of which Mr X has avaliable. He's also been unable to land a single hit on Quicksilver; an opponent Spidey has been able to tag. While deflecting bullets is impressive. Catching them is even more so and Peter has done that before.

In terms of reflexes Spider-Man is far above anyone Mister X has faced with the exception of Quicksilver an opponent he wasn't able to tag.

#13 Posted by Name55555 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@name12345: Okay as to why Mister X would attack X-23, he's omnicidal. He's incabale of working on a team and has threatned (and fought with) his teammates on the thunderbolts.

How could he resist the chance to not only stick it to the demon (Wolverine) who's won 2 of their three fights by taking out his protege but the chance to show up Wolverine and Spidey at the same time. Seems to me he'd be salivating at the chance.

As I've demonstrated telepathy has no bearing on Peter's Spider-Sense. the only times it's been bypassed are with drugs and other spider-powered oponents (Ezekiel, Venom etc.) none of which Mr X has avaliable. He's also been unable to land a single hit on Quicksilver; an opponent Spidey has been able to tag. While deflecting bullets is impressive. Catching them is even more so and Peter has done that before.

In terms of reflexes Spider-Man is far above anyone Mister X has faced with the exception of Quicksilver an opponent he wasn't able to tag.

As i already stated, Mister X can't fight with Wolverine AND Spiderman at the same time, he NEEDS his teammates to take care of Spidey... That's why he would never touch them, remember that they are given basic info about the enemy so he would knows that Spiderman is really dangerous... Plus i think he's idea of revenge would be a 1 vs 1, so... he's not going to get rid of X-23 and Agent X.

anyway, we can open the vote if you agree

@esquire: yes... i got banned for calling someone stupid, i hope i can continue with this tourney

#14 Posted by Esquire (3742 posts) - - Show Bio

@name55555 I don't mind letting you continue, just be on your best behavior. :P

@sovereign91001 Do you mind opening this for votes? Cadence and Fetts have already finished, so I'd like this one open since it turns out we do need votes.

#15 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

@esquire: @name55555:

Scans Peter catching a bullet while sick, dodging feats, freeze pellets, him going all out and explanations of his Spider-Sense.

I'll close this out as I don't want to hold anyone up. Okay so I believe Spidey is faster than Mister X, he's lost his biggest advantage his T.P as it's negated by Spidey's Spider sense, not to mention Peter with no morals is far too much for Mister X. I think under normal circumstances he's to fast but with moral off even more so. He could one shout Mister X, his freeze pellets and W.O.T.S also more than equal the playing field in addition his webbing is also an option.

Should Mr. X engage Logan the same result as what happened in 2 of their three scuffles will happen; Logan should win.

X-23 is slower than Logan (she couldn't keep up with him when he wasn't trying to fight), who's slower than Spidey and I don't think with the morals off she can handle either, Logan is far more skilled than her and she can't match Spidey's speed and has no practical answer to his Spider-Sense. A cryo pellet or webbing can keep her out the game (especially if he webs her hands to her head like he's done to Logan in the past)

Logan skill showing

Agent X is the wildcard but Logan could take his head off, I feel comfortable saying he's less skilled than Logan. I also believe Spidey's Speed is far to much for him to match, he can be K.O'd decapitated or webbed up or frozen.

In closing I think Spider-Man is the difference maker: he's too fast and with morals off he's too much for your team to deal with. Logan has more skill than anyone here and has bested two of your members in combat before, this shouldn't be different. No one on your team has an answer to his webs, cryo pellets or his spider-sense. I still think team work will be an issue for your team especially the wildcard of Mister X who's shown in the past that he's not a team player and has even tried to kill his teammates in the past.

I think the combined skills and powersets my characters bring to the table coupled with their history and team work should win the day.

@name55555: thanks for the debate (even though it was much shorter than I would have liked) and best of luck in the votes.

I'm ready to vote guys and I'm done with this one.

#16 Posted by Name55555 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@sovereign91001: Thanks! i think it was a little short too, but we started 20 days ago!!

The votes are officially open!!

#17 Posted by boschePG (1966 posts) - - Show Bio

@name55555: @sovereign91001:

winner sovereign91001

with me, you will always get a battle breakdown on why I think the way i voted. This was an even battle. It really was. when it is this close I look at perks and likelihood of execution of plan. in any battle it goes plan and communication, location of target, speed to target and then the battle.

in this battle sovereign has better prep and tp link while name5555 does not. though name5555 has proven mister x can bust wolverines butt, with plan and senses i dont see wolverine targeting mister x as sovereign has stated. name5555 cant communicate with the other team for mister x to locate wolverine IMO.

this was really a good battle for you name55555

#18 Posted by Name55555 (213 posts) - - Show Bio
#19 Posted by Fetts (4081 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm giving this one to Sovereign as well. He just found that he argued his points better than name could overall. Good battle though!

#20 Edited by CalebHara (2329 posts) - - Show Bio

Great job on both sides, however, i would agree with the majority and say that Sovereign edges this

#21 Edited by Pokergeist (22301 posts) - - Show Bio
#22 Posted by DireDrill (2063 posts) - - Show Bio

Sovereign has my vote here. He never really provided a good means of countering the blisteringly fast and vicious Spider-man much less how he plans on taking him down.

#23 Posted by Name55555 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: thank you!

@diredrill: actually i already countered Spiderman... if you see my first post you can see a scan of X-23 taking down Spiderman!! of course i know that he wasn't supposed to be taking it seriously, but still that mean that X-23 can keep up with his speed, if you add Agent-X who's basically like Deadpool, then you have my way of countering Spiderman.

You may agree or not that this would work... but i've provided a valid counter for everything he said, and also a winning strategy.

#24 Posted by Chaos Prime (10581 posts) - - Show Bio

my vote is for name12345

#25 Posted by HigorM (3238 posts) - - Show Bio

I believe that @name55555 possess the right combination of power set, gear, equipment and time to prepare against @sovereign91001 team. He doesn´t need full knowledge considering that his team already know and fought both Spider-Man and Wolverine. The number advantage should be enough to pull out a win, even against a bloodlusted team, which makes it really hard to accomplish, but I think that Mister X can hold Wolverine long enough until the rest of the team take care of Spiderman.

So my votes goes to @name55555

#26 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump for votes.

Sovereign: 4

Name: 3

#27 Posted by DireDrill (2063 posts) - - Show Bio

Spider-man was not fighting anywhere near his best. When he starts out the fight with the phrase, "Wolverine what have they done to you!" You know he is just toying with them like he does every other member of his rogues gallery who is a joke.

Spider-man's speed is easily in excess of everyone here, he could essentially solo.

#28 Edited by Name55555 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@higorm: thanks!

@diredrill: I partially agree, but remember that Spiderman tells jokes all the time that doesn't mean he becomes incapacitated... He was still trying to avoid X-23 and she got him!

#29 Edited by NeonGameWave (7205 posts) - - Show Bio

This debate was really cool and both Name12345 as well as Sovereign91001 did an amazing job! But I`m going to vote for Name12345, I believe his team would have the overall edge.

#30 Edited by Oblivions_Child (59 posts) - - Show Bio
#31 Edited by Esquire (3742 posts) - - Show Bio

Sov is the winner, ladies and gents!

#32 Edited by Sovereign91001 (3327 posts) - - Show Bio