Well in terms of an accomplished telepath and manipulator, Emma Frost has it before she joined the X-Men. She was the White Queen after all. Her ability to maximized her use of her mind is indeed notable. She can even do psychic implants that people will not even know until the deed has been done.
BUT
Jean Grey is something else, she is the complete opposite of Emma in terms of her use of power. All that Emma can do, Jean Grey can do better and more but she rarely uses it to its fullest extent because she knows how it can take over her and be more of a problem to her friends. As I have been saying to my other posts, Jean Grey/Phoenix weakness is her strong sense of humanity and morality. It is not a hidden secret that if there is a mutant that will be called a god level Jean Grey and even her bloodline comes into mind, notable are Cable, X-Man and Rachel Grey. One interesting note also in alternate universes, Jean Grey also is noted for this kind of ability.In the tradepaperback of AOA 10th anniversary issue Jean Grey manifested her being the Alpha Mutant that saved the AoA universe. So if its the battle of the mind, even without her telekinetic powers, Jean Grey can kill Emma Frost.
Lastly, there was a fight between Emma and Jean over Scott and Jean out of her anger overtook all the psychic barriers of Emma to know what has been transpiring. It is already a clue how Jean can outdo Emma in the psychic realm.
Jean Grey is an atomic bomb while Emma Frost is just a small gun.
"Well in terms of an accomplished telepath and manipulator, Emma Frost has it before she joined the X-Men. She was the White Queen after all. Her ability to maximized her use of her mind is indeed notable. She can even do psychic implants that people will not even know until the deed has been done.BUTJean Grey is something else, she is the complete opposite of Emma in terms of her use of power. All that Emma can do, Jean Grey can do better and more but she rarely uses it to its fullest extent because she knows how it can take over her and be more of a problem to her friends. As I have been saying to my other posts, Jean Grey/Phoenix weakness is her strong sense of humanity and morality. It is not a hidden secret that if there is a mutant that will be called a god level Jean Grey and even her bloodline comes into mind, notable are Cable, X-Man and Rachel Grey. One interesting note also in alternate universes, Jean Grey also is noted for this kind of ability.In the tradepaperback of AOA 10th anniversary issue Jean Grey manifested her being the Alpha Mutant that saved the AoA universe. So if its the battle of the mind, even without her telekinetic powers, Jean Grey can kill Emma Frost.Lastly, there was a fight between Emma and Jean over Scott and Jean out of her anger overtook all the psychic barriers of Emma to know what has been transpiring. It is already a clue how Jean can outdo Emma in the psychic realm.Jean Grey is an atomic bomb while Emma Frost is just a small gun."
Nice post. Although I'd say Jean is the Big Boy (A-Bomb) and Emma is closer to the Little Boy (smaller A-Bomb)
If you're NOT talking about Phoenix (as using the Phoenix Force), then White Queen would win. Granted that normal Jean is a more powerful using TK, but everything else is just about equal.
What really puts White Queen in advantage are several things:
She's a better fighter...
She's smarter in tactical and prep-time stratagy...
She can turn her hole body into diamond and while in this form increases her strength & durability...
This is just The White Queen VS Jean Grey.
Now If Jean has the Phoenix Force... Then now it's a whole different battle, becuase it's basically a Mutant VS a Cosmic Being.
Whether it's Phoenix or the Dark Phoenix, Jean would be 100 to 1000 times more powerful than Emma. Period.
"If you're NOT talking about Phoenix (as using the Phoenix Force), then White Queen would win. Granted that normal Jean is a more powerful using TK, but everything else is just about equal. What really puts White Queen in advantage are several things: She's a better fighter... She's smarter in tactical and prep-time stratagy... She can turn her hole body into diamond and while in this form increases her strength & durability... This is just The White Queen VS Jean Grey. Now If Jean has the Phoenix Force... Then now it's a whole different battle, becuase it's basically a Mutant VS a Cosmic Being. Whether it's Phoenix or the Dark Phoenix, Jean would be 100 to 1000 times more powerful than Emma. Period. "
So you think emma can defeat professor x?
Jean grey is as powerful as professor x.
And using TK, jean can easily destory emma's diamond.
"If you're NOT talking about Phoenix (as using the Phoenix Force), then White Queen would win. Granted that normal Jean is a more powerful using TK, but everything else is just about equal.What really puts White Queen in advantage are several things:She's a better fighter...She's smarter in tactical and prep-time stratagy...She can turn her hole body into diamond and while in this form increases her strength & durability...This is just The White Queen VS Jean Grey.Now If Jean has the Phoenix Force... Then now it's a whole different battle, becuase it's basically a Mutant VS a Cosmic Being.Whether it's Phoenix or the Dark Phoenix, Jean would be 100 to 1000 times more powerful than Emma. Period."
Jean Grey will still top Emma even without the Phoenix Force, she also is trained in the danger room thus have strategy making knowledge. She has battled aliens and even gods which Emma has not, so in terms of fighting Jean Grey can still give Emma a punch.
The telepathic ability of Jean Grey should not be taken lightly, she can mind swap without being aided which Emma can not do if not aided by a machine, Emma did it with Storm or Iceman. She can also manifest psychic blades, two in both hands when she and Psylocke had a brief training in the Danger room before the Legion Quest series. Also in terms of leveling, Jean Grey is actually stronger than Professor X though the professor has the years of advantage compared to Jean. As I said earlier, in a fight over Scott, Emma lost even with her immense mental blocks against Jean Grey. Jean Grey is made to be on top of the line in terms of mutant evolution that is how her character has developed throughout the years. Emma will just be at the background, maybe she got Jean's man but Jean holds the future of it all.
Also very important to note, is that certain people keep on talking about Jean's powers as if Phoenix is the reason why she's so powerful. That's nowhere near the case. Jean is one of few mutants who has been declared Omega, AND utilized the powers associated with the title, thus, infinite possibilities. Perfect Cell brought up that Jean WITHOUT Phoenix, is not as powerful as Jean WITH Phoenix. However, from what I remember, Jean's unlimited powers are the reason why she's a perfect host for Phoenix, that and her emotions. And while Phoenix possesses powers on it's own, I think it's important to note that it is using what JEAN has to offer. Again, people bring up Phoenix as if she gave Jean this incredible powerset, when in fact, most of the feats that Jean/Phoenix performs are feats that she can perform ON HER OWN, yet doesn't/hasn't, because she actually cares about life. Phoenix sorta doesn't. So, let's make a short list, shall we?
You have a telepathic/telekinetic Omega-class mutant (UNLIMITED potential)
You have an entity who sensed not only her powers, but her emotions, and became addicted to both.
The same Omega-class mutant that Phoenix possesses, never stood a chance in hell of truly being able to fight her off, because her own powers were blocked off at a young age, thus, she never had to really deal with them, and was overwhelmed when some strange deity started doing things that she (the host) never even thought possible.
Again, I MUST emphasize this. Jean had BARELY a fraction of her powers after Xavier did what he thought would protect her. No, wait, scratch that. You can't have a "Fraction" of "Infinity", so Xavier (In a better description in my opinion) pretty much forced her to believe that she had limits, while merely a thought away, she had powers that could perform anything, and everything.
So, with all of this taken into account, how can people STILL say that White Queen is better than Jean at ANYTHING? White Queen never has been, and never will be as powerful as Jean. Maybe if she had Omega-level powers, I would take people's arguements a bit more seriously. But she's Alpha. Powerful, but limited. Emma knows her limits, and powers to the T. She's virtually mastered her powers. Thus, the reason why she's so skilled. Jean however, always struggled to really master her powers. And so, when Phoenix attacked her, she "fought back" with the same same average powers that Xavier made her think she had. AGAIN:
Unlimited power + weak minded vessel + A deity who sensed both = Easy prey for Phoenix.
I wouldn't say that Jean is weak minded. Rachel certainly wasn't and the Phoenix took up residence with her as well.
Phoenix may have intended Jean to be a body but the little red head fought her tooth and nail for every inch she got and let's face it there is but one reason the X-men lived to remember the Phoenix. it's because Jean held her in check she may not have been in full control all the time but she is the only reason Phoenix didn't simply slaughter the entire X-men group with a mere thought.
While I do believe that Jean takes Emma in which ever way be it with or without her Phoenix powers.
When it comes to looks, plastic or not, Emma wins. Seriously she could have done plastic and ended up looking hideous. Natural beauty is great and all but so is plastic, when done right.
As for the character it's a toss up. Sure Jean was all heart on her sleeve and what not but to say Emma doesn't care or love implies that your ignorant and take things too much on face value only. Emma cares deeply for her charges and each loss hits her harder than it does Jean. She has had it way rougher than the popular redhead from the get go and she got to where she is by using all she had to do so.
She was blatant in her wanting to get X-23 away from the school but it wasn't just because she felt like it or a whim of such. She is fully aware that she can't help Laura over come her trigger sent which has been ingrained into her psyche making her a possible danger to anyone and everyone someone else might target. That is why she didn't want X-23 amongst them. She punished X-23 handler viciously for the treatment of her charge. and she really does love Scott and is committed to him even thou herself preservation she has depended on from her early years is screeching to get the hell away from him.
Jean loved Scott that much is true but that ever lasting triangle with Logan thus make the unwavering love questionable.
"Also very important to note, is that certain people keep on talking about Jean's powers as if Phoenix is the reason why she's so powerful. That's nowhere near the case. Jean is one of few mutants who has been declared Omega, AND utilized the powers associated with the title, thus, infinite possibilities. Perfect Cell brought up that Jean WITHOUT Phoenix, is not as powerful as Jean WITH Phoenix. However, from what I remember, Jean's unlimited powers are the reason why she's a perfect host for Phoenix, that and her emotions. And while Phoenix possesses powers on it's own, I think it's important to note that it is using what JEAN has to offer. Again, people bring up Phoenix as if she gave Jean this incredible powerset, when in fact, most of the feats that Jean/Phoenix performs are feats that she can perform ON HER OWN, yet doesn't/hasn't, because she actually cares about life. Phoenix sorta doesn't. So, let's make a short list, shall we? 1. You have a telepathic/telekinetic Omega-class mutant (UNLIMITED potential) 2. You have an entity who sensed not only her powers, but her emotions, and became addicted to both. 3. The same Omega-class mutant that Phoenix possesses, never stood a chance in hell of truly being able to fight her off, because her own powers were blocked off at a young age, thus, she never had to really deal with them, and was overwhelmed when some strange deity started doing things that she (the host) never even thought possible. 4. Again, I MUST emphasize this. Jean had BARELY a fraction of her powers after Xavier did what he thought would protect her. No, wait, scratch that. You can't have a "Fraction" of "Infinity", so Xavier (In a better description in my opinion) pretty much forced her to believe that she had limits, while merely a thought away, she had powers that could perform anything, and everything. So, with all of this taken into account, how can people STILL say that White Queen is better than Jean at ANYTHING? White Queen never has been, and never will be as powerful as Jean. Maybe if she had Omega-level powers, I would take people's arguements a bit more seriously. But she's Alpha. Powerful, but limited. Emma knows her limits, and powers to the T. She's virtually mastered her powers. Thus, the reason why she's so skilled. Jean however, always struggled to really master her powers. And so, when Phoenix attacked her, she "fought back" with the same same average powers that Xavier made her think she had. AGAIN: Unlimited power + weak minded vessel + A deity who sensed both = Easy prey for Phoenix."
So you said omega level's mutant power can destory entire universe by one blast?
I think you can't see the phoenix ensong.
It state phoenix and jean grey is same entity.
yes, you are rigt. But limited jean grey can match emma frost.
Limited jean has power and experience as professor x.
"Phoenix didn't simply slaughter the entire X-men group with a mere thought. "
Because she love x-men and her lover. That's why she didn't defeat the x-men with a mere thought. Marvel didn't employe stupid man. They wanted to show their friendship.
"Also very important to note, is that certain people keep on talking about Jean's powers as if Phoenix is the reason why she's so powerful. That's nowhere near the case. Jean is one of few mutants who has been declared Omega, AND utilized the powers associated with the title, thus, infinite possibilities. Perfect Cell brought up that Jean WITHOUT Phoenix, is not as powerful as Jean WITH Phoenix. However, from what I remember, Jean's unlimited powers are the reason why she's a perfect host for Phoenix, that and her emotions. And while Phoenix possesses powers on it's own, I think it's important to note that it is using what JEAN has to offer. Again, people bring up Phoenix as if she gave Jean this incredible powerset, when in fact, most of the feats that Jean/Phoenix performs are feats that she can perform ON HER OWN, yet doesn't/hasn't, because she actually cares about life. Phoenix sorta doesn't. So, let's make a short list, shall we? 1. You have a telepathic/telekinetic Omega-class mutant (UNLIMITED potential) 2. You have an entity who sensed not only her powers, but her emotions, and became addicted to both. 3. The same Omega-class mutant that Phoenix possesses, never stood a chance in hell of truly being able to fight her off, because her own powers were blocked off at a young age, thus, she never had to really deal with them, and was overwhelmed when some strange deity started doing things that she (the host) never even thought possible. 4. Again, I MUST emphasize this. Jean had BARELY a fraction of her powers after Xavier did what he thought w ould protect her. No, wait, scratch that. You can't have a "Fraction" of "Infinity", so Xavier (In a better description in my opinion) pretty much forced her to believe that she had limits, while merely a thought away, she had powers that could perform anything, and everything. So, with all of this taken into account, how can people STILL say that White Queen is better than Jean at ANYTHING? White Queen never has been, and never will be as powerful as Jean. Maybe if she had Omega-level powers, I would take people's arguements a bit more seriously. But she's Alpha. Powerful, but limited. Emma knows her limits, and powers to the T. She's virtually mastered her powers. Thus, the reason why she's so skilled. Jean however, always struggled to really master her powers. And so, when Phoenix attacked her, she "fought back" with the same same average powers that Xavier made her think she had. AGAIN: Unlimited power + weak minded vessel + A deity who sensed both = Easy prey for Phoenix."
So you said omega level's mutant power can destory entire universe by one blast? I think you can't see the phoenix ensong. It state phoenix and jean grey is same entity. yes, you are rigt. But limited jean grey can match emma frost. Limited jean has power and experience as professor x. "
No, I didn't say, nor do I think that Jean could destroy the universe with one blast. I DID however, say that Phoenix has powers of its own.
I HAVE read Phoenix Endsong (LOVE the way Storm looks BTW), but that still doesn't change the fact that Jean still can perform several of the maneuvers she has with Phoenix on her own. However, it's still more than obvious that PHOENIX is the one who performed the "Almighty Deity" stunts. Like eating stars, and wiping out future generations.
This part is still slightly debatable. I haven't seen too much that would confirm this, but I'm also not going to rule this out. And just to be clear, Jean WITH MENTAL BLOCKS is what I am referring to when I say "limited".
Yes, Professor X trained her. But, with how she was portrayed, it's still a little debatable as to whether or not she was actually BETTER than Professor X.
no. emma is a plastic surgery whore. pre plastic surgery emma is a dog"
LMFAO! I'm gonna go with Ms. Grey for the win. Emma would catch a broke neck in this fight...literally, she would get turned upside down and dropped on her neck hard and shattered into tiny little pieces..lol
It would depend on which version of Emma or Jean you are talking about. In some instances Jean was powerful but had little understanding or control of her powers and therefore would get her butt kicked. Plus Emma has been able to hold up against Xavier in certain instances and helped the Hellfire Club control Jean for a while. Plus the three Cuckoo's had to split the Phoenix because they all share one mind. I think it depends on tactic, they are both strong telepathically it just depends on which one has the better moves.
Ok so I read some of the comment people have made, don't get me wrong I do like Emma Frost, and I think she a cool character in the Marvel Universie. You have to look at facts. 1. In all the comic cards I have, if u look at energy blast, Mental Powers, fighting and so on Jean is so ahead. 2. It has been stated time-after- time, that Jean is a level 5 mutant, meaning she is the most powerful mutant in the Marvel Universe ' hello how many time has she died like 7 or 8 times.. That take power people.. haha 3. In x-men Book 3 men & x-men it is stated the jean is the first omega and alpha Mutant, the spark of life and creation, 4. jean was not only the host to the phoenix force, but Phoenix force and her bonded on a gentic level, meaning Phoenix and her became one. Geneticly she is the Phoenix now, it in her blood people... That why she keep saying. " I am Phoenix and Phoenix is me" Hello read the comics people... 5.PROFESSOR -X had to put psychic barriors, because he feard jean could not handle her psychic powers. 6.Jean Children" Rachel, Cable, and Nathan x-man" have been stated to be as powerful telepaths and all have been consider omega Mutants. So that kind of cut Emma as being the second most powerful telepathy. But she did beat Rachel in a battle, however Emma Stated Rachel had the power but lack the experience. 7.Also was Emma ever apart of the tapesty of creation hello I remember reading and i didn't remember seeing her apart of the group and it was jean who was leading it. If u want to know read x-men Book 3 men & x-men 8. Yes Emma has been the host to the phoenix force too and we don't know what affect it still has on her, but Jean is now the White Phoenix of the Crown and she's apart, dwell, who know in the white hot room. She has cut and heal a universe... 9. Go to marvel. com and read the bios people and look at the power levels Jean is ahead again. So my BET is on JEAN GREY/ Phoenix...
OMG PEOPLE YOU SAID PRE PHOENIX NOT JEAN GREY( PHOENIX) AND + Emma Could punch her once in the face with her SUPER STRENGTH in her diamond form and * thump* K.O. And another thing in the 2nd movie Jean Grey gets Killed by WATER. ? AND Jean is not stronger than Prof. X
My monies on Jean for the win. Emma and Jean are both very powerful telepaths, and I would wager equally skilled, but I think Jean is still the more powerful of the 2. I assume they can use all of their powers in this battle, and with Jean's TK, she could shatter Emma in her diamond form, and would likely beat Emma, with difficulty, telepathically. Let alone destroy her human form as well with TK.
I've always assumed that Jean was more powerful than both Emma and Prof X, at least overall. I don't know why, as I've never followed X-Men comics with her in it, but I just have always thought that.
Even as a child Jean has been a powerful telepath...She was able to communicate with her dead friend in the after life....It put her in a coma but she still did it...I have yet to see Emma do such a feat....Jean ftw
"Even as a child Jean has been a powerful telepath...She was able to communicate with her dead friend in the after life....It put her in a coma but she still did it...I have yet to see Emma do such a feat....Jean ftw "
Why would emma do that.
I think that emma is probably a better telepath, but jean wins this one easy, telekenisis, is a brilliant power to have. Jean coul hold her own against emma but I think that on a pure telepathic battle with no phoenix, emma is better, but hey that is why jean is an omega mutant, two powers, they are both good, most things that start with "tele" are cool, telepathic, telekenetic, and teleportation.
"Even as a child Jean has been a powerful telepath...She was able to communicate with her dead friend in the after life....It put her in a coma but she still did it...I have yet to see Emma do such a feat....Jean ftw "
Why would emma do that. I think that emma is probably a better telepath, but jean wins this one easy, telekenisis, is a brilliant power to have. Jean coul hold her own against emma but I think that on a pure telepathic battle with no phoenix, emma is better, but hey that is why jean is an omega mutant, two powers, they are both good, most things that start with "tele" are cool, telepathic, telekenetic, and teleportation. "
Having two powers has nothing to do with her being Omega, it is because those powers have no limits and she can transcend the mortal coil. Prof. X was the most powerful telepath, Jean was second most while Shadow King, Emma and Psylocke were around, when X was depowered, Shadow King was still around so were Emma and Psylocke and Jean took the mantle of Most powerful telepath. Jean could more than hold her own against Emma telepathically she would wreck her. A psi blast from Jean took down Emma while the Phoenix was in possession of Emmas body, and then it was ripped from her with ease. Emma entered a psychic coma to protect herself from the attack that killed the Hellions, Jean was mortally wounded during the attack and kicked Emma out of her body causing Emma to have to seek a new body (Iceman) until hers became available again, only by Jean leaving did her body become available, because apparently she could not keep Jean from taking it. Jean like her daughter has way more raw telepathic power than Emma, Jean > Rachel, Emma only beat Rachel because of skill, she will not be so lucky with Jean. Emma has no defense against Jean telepathically, even her diamond form immunity is useless. "
Ok take it down a notch..we all know that Jean would murder Emma..
"Even as a child Jean has been a powerful telepath...She was able to communicate with her dead friend in the after life....It put her in a coma but she still did it...I have yet to see Emma do such a feat....Jean ftw "
Why would emma do that. I think that emma is probably a better telepath, but jean wins this one easy, telekenisis, is a brilliant power to have. Jean coul hold her own against emma but I think that on a pure telepathic battle with no phoenix, emma is better, but hey that is why jean is an omega mutant, two powers, they are both good, most things that start with "tele" are cool, telepathic, telekenetic, and teleportation. "
Having two powers has nothing to do with her being Omega, it is because those powers have no limits and she can transcend the mortal coil. Prof. X was the most powerful telepath, Jean was second most while Shadow King, Emma and Psylocke were around, when X was depowered, Shadow King was still around so were Emma and Psylocke and Jean took the mantle of Most powerful telepath. Jean could more than hold her own against Emma telepathically she would wreck her. A psi blast from Jean took down Emma while the Phoenix was in possession of Emmas body, and then it was ripped from her with ease. Emma entered a psychic coma to protect herself from the attack that killed the Hellions, Jean was mortally wounded during the attack and kicked Emma out of her body causing Emma to have to seek a new body (Iceman) until hers became available again, only by Jean leaving did her body become available, because apparently she could not keep Jean from taking it. Jean like her daughter has way more raw telepathic power than Emma, Jean > Rachel, Emma only beat Rachel because of skill, she will not be so lucky with Jean. Emma has no defense against Jean telepathically, even her diamond form immunity is useless. "
Ok take it down a notch..we all know that Jean would murder Emma.. I still dont Y this thread stayed open 4 so long. "
Apparently we all don't know that or people wouldn't think that the only edge Jean has is tk or the Phoenix. I don't come in Storm threads telling you to calm down so I'd appreciate the same respect. "
1.Well this whole thread is pointless Jean NO=Emma dead Jean with PF=Emma erased from evertimeline
2.They obviliouly dont know about Jean or her power. Either with only TK or TP she is Omega..but together she is Phoenix.
3.U never come into Storm threads. And u also need 2 chill...I was just joking...I really dont C Y u even waste UR time on this..I mean really Emma VS Jean..they ALL know how thats gonna turn out..and I love Emma but she isnt a match 4 Jean.
"I like Emma a lot more...so i have to side with her "
SoS this is why I even bother, this is why this thread is still going on not because of feats or even a well thought argument only I like her more so she wins WTF?!? Had no Idea you were Joking...my bad... an lol would have been nice. "
I learned allong time ago to not even give them the pleasure of an argument..and I look @ this scan and laugh. and I get over it REAL quick.
besides from what u post I take u as a reasonable person like White Mage. u dont let ur feelings take U over.
Given that Jean could actually handle the phoenix force and emma could NOT it stands that jean has the stronger mental abilities and fortitude against such powers.
" @Ego: Given that Jean could actually handle the phoenix force and emma could NOT it stands that jean has the stronger mental abilities and fortitude against such powers. "
Well not so much..Her daughters handled the Phoenix and they were weaker than Emma. I always though It was because of Emma 2nd mutation that makes her emotionless is what drove the Phoenix away. As we all know The PF loves Emotion.
@Phoenix of the Black Throne said:
" @Son Of Storm said:
" @Phoenix of the Black Throne said:
" @The Hottness said:
"I like Emma a lot more...so i have to side with her "
SoS this is why I even bother, this is why this thread is still going on not because of feats or even a well thought argument only I like her more so she wins WTF?!? Had no Idea you were Joking...my bad... an lol would have been nice. "
I learned allong time ago to not even give them the pleasure of an argument..and I look @ this scan and laugh. and I get over it REAL quick. besides from what u post I take u as a reasonable person like White Mage. u dont let ur feelings take U over. "
agreed, thanks for the perspective. "
No problem. I would hate 2 see u get banned because of some idiot who cant take the loss of their character like an actual human being but instead going all fanboi.
Log in to comment