Emiya Kiritsugu vs Spike Spiegel

Vs.

The Rules

They are in an endless grassy field

Standard gear (No Avalon for Emiya.)

Winner via KO or death.

No prep.

They start 50 yards from each other.

lol that spike pic

Kiritsugu for sure due to Time Alter.

Hahaha, yeah.

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Emiya can go up to 4 times his normal speed but normal speed Spike is much faster and his list of feats in the Pierrot Le Fou episode include some ridiculous speed feats. Plus Emiya would be utterly helpless at close range.

@gunswordfist_: It's true that Spike is faster at normal speed but "much faster" is debatable.

I also disagree that he would be helpless at close range. He was holding his own against Kotomine Kirei in close combat, who would probably stomp Spike with Command Spell Reinforcement.

Overall his sheer speed would be tough for Spike to deal with. At Square Accel he was well beyond Kotomine Kirei's speed. Keep in mind Kirei was fast enough to karate chop a bullet from the Contender which has a muzzle velocity in the Mach 2-3 range. Spike can't block a bullet and it's unlikely he can dodge someone so much faster.

That's not to say it's a stomp, just that Kiritsugu has the definitive edge with Time Alter to pull off a killing shot with a very high chance of success.

EDIT: Forgot that he has no Avalon here which means he can't really go above Double Accel. I still give Kiritsugu the edge, but Spike definitely has a chance under these conditions.

@shenkuei:

I didn't know Emiya couldn't go above Double Accel without Avalon. I'm guessing you're referring to the strain it puts on his body without it.

Anyway, I think Spike is much faster than normal speed Kiritsugu. In the first video, Spike outruns most of a explosion and then all of a missile and its explosion. In the second video he dodges multiple high speed rides (and KOs a robot)

In episode 1, he beats up a guy that dodges futuristic bullets, including automatically fire, while running straight after the gunmen and then killing them. During his last bullet dodge, he watches the bullet go inches in front of his head and then moves out of the way. Spike easily whooped his butt. Asimov is likely faster and has better reaction time then Time Alter Kiritsugu and even then, Asimov is considered a joke compared to Spike.

Before I dug all of this up, I was on the fence on who would win but now I am leaning towards Spike.

@gunswordfist_: He can go above Double Accel but he never did without Avalon due to the fact that it would cause massive damage to his body. In effect, he is limited to Double Accel at most without Avalon. Maybe Triangle or Square Accel for a short time if he is willing to destroy his body to win the fight.

Spike didn't really outrun that missile he put a significant distance between himself and Lefou before it was launched and managed to scrape by mostly on that. As far as outrunning explosions...every action hero has done that at some point. Not a real feat. No way is Asimov faster than Time Alter Kiritsugu (at full power). Even at Double Accel, the lowest level, Kiritsugu's movement was said to be just a blur to all of his opponents at most. If they could see him at all. Kotomine is a bullet timer even without Reinforcement IIRC and at Square Accel Kiritsugu was faster than even a maxed out Kotomine. Max-speed Kotomine was as fast the bullets from Kiritsugu's custom Thomspon Contender which had a muzzle velocity several times higher than a normal gun.

The "future" weapons in Cowboy Bebop are mostly all real guns. For example, Spike Spiegel carries a Jericho 941. That's a real gun that exists in the modern world. Same as most guns in Cowboy Bebop. Most characters in Cowboy Bebop use real, modern guns that presumably aren't any faster than they would normally be.

Kiritsugu is at least as fast as Asimov with Double Accel. And much more skilled. And Spike didn't beat Asimov through superior speed anyway, it was mainly due to superior hand to hand skill. If this was hand to hand only Spike would probably win but Kiritsugu has a variety of weapons on his person including the Contender, machine guns, knives, explosives etc. Kiritsugu, who has the better tactical mind for sure, wouldn't engage Spike in hand to hand but just try to shoot him and neither is significantly better as a marksman so it comes down to speed, firepower and tactics. Not to mention Kiritsugu's other tricks such as hypnosis (which Spike has no defense for as a muggle).

@shenkuei: Spike CLEARLY outrunning an explosion in both the video and the gif I posted is clearly a real feat. Anime tends to have it's characters do more ridiculous feats than even heroes in action movies. And you can't dispute how fast he dodged those rides. Spike is clearly faster than normal speed Kiritsugu.

I've seen nothing from Kiritsugu to suggest that he's clearly faster than Asimov, even at Square Accel. Yeah, the weapons in Bebop are all probably just like modern weapons but Asimov dodged automatic fire easily by slipping side to side of each round. Kotomine NEVER moves faster than a Contender bullet. Both times Kiritsugu fired it, Kotomine had to block. You can see it in the video below:

I never said Spike was faster than Asimov. I meant he was fast enough to tag a bullet timer with ease. Kiritsugu would never ever touch Spike with a knife. Spike's JKD is better than Emiya's knife skills and Spike has dodged knife attacks without even looking at his opponent and would just beat Emiya's ass if he's that close. Plus I haven't seen anything that suggests Emiya's good at dodging bullets. Spike has done it against Le Fou, Vincent Volaju, etc., etc.

And I didn't know Emiya could use hypnosis. Can you confirm this?

Spike. He is like water.

These are just about all his combat feats I think.

@darthaznable: Don't see how Spike's MA is gonna help when he's facing against some1 with time manipulation + guns.

I wasn't being serious. Emiya seems far too powerful honestly. Not fair.

@gunswordfist_: Spike CLEARLY outrunning an explosion in both the video and the gif I posted is clearly a real feat. Anime tends to have it's characters do more ridiculous feats than even heroes in action movies. And you can't dispute how fast he dodged those rides. Spike is clearly faster than normal speed Kiritsugu.

"Anime tends to be more ridiculous" is not valid logic for evaluating a feat. I already acknowledged Spike is faster than base Kiritsugu. And that's giving Spike the benefit of the doubt since we don't have a clear picture of how fast base Kiritsugu is (probably very fast).

II've seen nothing from Kiritsugu to suggest that he's clearly faster than Asimov, even at Square Accel.

I already explained this. At Square Accel he was faster than a maxed-out Kotomine. Kotomine karate-chopped a high-velocity round. That's a far superior feat compared to Asimov's bullet dodging.

Yeah, the weapons in Bebop are all probably just like modern weapons but Asimov dodged automatic fire easily by slipping side to side of each round.

That's a huge assumption. The only round Asimov clearly dodged after firing is the handgun bullet at the beginning of the video. The rest could easily be aim dodging.

Kotomine NEVER moves faster than a Contender bullet. Both times Kiritsugu fired it, Kotomine had to block.

You're mistaken, Kotomine did not block it the second time, he struck it. Big difference. The novels make this quite explicit. That's most definitely Mach 2+ speed.

I never said Spike was faster than Asimov. I meant he was fast enough to tag a bullet timer with ease.

That bullet timer was a no-name thug who had no skill to speak of and only one impressive feat to his name. Kiritsugu is explicitly stated to be, in the estimation of the Magic Association, the greatest assassin in the world. Asimov was also unarmed, while Kiritsugu is armed with the Contender, a machine gun, grenades etc.

Kiritsugu would never ever touch Spike with a knife. Spike's JKD is better than Emiya's knife skills and Spike has dodged knife attacks without even looking at his opponent and would just beat Emiya's ass if he's that close.

"Never" is a strong word but I can agree that Spike will likely win that fight if we are limiting Kiritsugu to Double Accel. Kiritsugu could still use it as a finishing blow or as a surprise attack though.

Plus I haven't seen anything that suggests Emiya's good at dodging bullets. Spike has done it against Le Fou, Vincent Volaju, etc., etc.

That's because none of Kiritsugu's opponents in Fate Zero even use guns. I've never seen anything that suggests Spike's marksmanship is good enough to hit someone as fast as Kiritsugu anyway.

And I didn't know Emiya could use hypnosis. Can you confirm this?

Yes. "Charm Eyes" is a basic magic almost every magus knows. All that's required is making eye contact. Here is an example of Kiritsugu using it:

"Mr. Archibald! Are you here?"

"-- I am here. Do not worry."

A resonant voice came from behind the bellhop, but as the bellhop turned around he became confused. The person speaking to him was a Japanese male wearing an old-styled coat.

This kind of joke is too much. The angry bellhop was about to yell at him-- but he was captivated by the man's eyes.

That man's eyes held an indescribable, mysterious force of attraction; the bellhop was unable to avoid his eyes, and was not able to even speak.

"I am Kayneth El-Melloi Archibald. My wife Sola is with me."

This unknown Japanese male stated in a clear voice. And the bellhop accepted this without any suspicion as if hypnotized.

"...Is that so? Ah, yes. That's it."

After the bellhop checked off a spot on the 'escaped' section of his list, finally confirming that all the customers were safe, he exhaled a long breath. All of his suspicions while speaking to Archibald earlier and his feelings that something was wrong had disappeared without a trace.

Watching the employee continue on to tend to other customers, Emiya Kiritsugu left the chaotic crowd. His earlier hypnotic suggestion, to a commoner with no magic resistance whatsoever, would not be broken in a short period of time.

-From Fate Zero Volume 2, Act 5.

Kiritsugu would not be helpless in close range and he's definitely got this.

I reached here mainly to comment not of the battle which Kiritsugu should win but that they look really alike, especially the unique hairstyle, after watching Cowboy Bebop recently Spike Spiegel really reminded of Kiritsugu Emiya, and they also both use pistol as main tool for combat.