• 103 results
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
#1 Edited by antiwhipped (202 posts) - - Show Bio

Mutants: Iceman Darwin Magneto Exodus Hope Vulcan Apocalypse Cable (without technovirus) Legion Quinten Quire Namor

JL: Superman Wonder Woman Flash Hal Jordan Bat man Aqua man Martian manhunter

Setting: Island, No prep, random encounter. Morals on (but mutants will work together). 1: Pre 52 2: Post 52

#2 Posted by WW3 (14 posts) - - Show Bio

JL wins

#3 Posted by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

@WW3: Ok why, i hate when people dont state way

Cable( in Messiah mode here) Who can stop that

Hope ( hmm so on top of her teams power, she now has Supes WW Flash Aquaman's and MM) whos stoping that

Every one of them can hang with JL, and they outnumber them, I hate the lack of respect Iceman Gets, Lets not forget one of Exodus' powers included AMPING his team

Morals on, So aside from Flash No speed Blitz, Hope will have his speed, and Darwin will evolve to counter them GL is boned against Vulcan

#4 Posted by Gritterr (489 posts) - - Show Bio

If Legion is mentally stable for the fight he would solo. He is far above anybody on the JL. and Cable free of restraints is overkill

#5 Posted by Killemall (18287 posts) - - Show Bio

@Gritterr said:

If Legion is mentally stable for the fight he would solo. He is far above anybody on the JL. and Cable free of restraints is overkill

With morals on unlikely, because Legion doesnt bring out the big guns with morals on. Yeah he has the ability to stop time and all but his main personalities , i.e. Moira and True Legion would probably lie dormant, also there is the whole thing against his durability. Much like Franklin Richards he is packing a holy hell lot of fire power within him but is slow and had little durability to stand up to guys like Flash, Superman or Wonder Woman.

#6 Posted by Dextersinister (5795 posts) - - Show Bio

The problem with the elite team is so many of them have massive flaws to prevent them from overshadowing their team mates. Iceman untapped potential until the end of time, Hope can access some other mutant powers for about a minute before she falls over, Legion is a fruit loop and cannot control his powers or he would win all the battles, Cable is burnt out.

The rest are up against the typical power houses of the JL and post 52 Manhunter is a badass and would solo.

#7 Posted by Bo88gdan (4393 posts) - - Show Bio

Mutants FTW

#8 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Magneto can solo half of the JL Team.

Spite.

#9 Posted by SHAZAM117 (2659 posts) - - Show Bio

Too much for the New52 Justice League....PreNew52 Justice League I would say wins, but with difficulty

#10 Posted by greenteaforme (1826 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

Magneto can solo half of the JL Team.

Spite.

Batman hardly counts as half of the Justice League.

#11 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@greenteaforme: Yeah I guess MM can mind rape... oh wait no he cant.... how about Super speed and strength break his shield .... no Phoenix had a hard time breaking that.... ummm..... Maybe they can BFR him... before Mags makes a Black Hole and BFR the whole team.....

Wow that just one mutant. We still have Legion, Apoc, Iceman, and Cable here.

#12 Posted by greenteaforme (1826 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme: Yeah I guess MM can mind rape... oh wait no he cant.... how about Super speed and strength break his shield .... no Phoenix had a hard time breaking that.... ummm..... Maybe they can BFR him... before Mags makes a Black Hole and BFR the whole team.....

Wow that just one mutant. We still have Legion, Apoc, Iceman, and Cable here.

Even with that logic, which is that he's untouchable, he isn't going to be able to do...anything...to them.

Magneto isn't making a black hole with morals on in a random encounter working with a team. As far as I know, when Magneto made the worm hole (not a black hole, as far as I know) he was boosted, anyway.

Superman, Wonder Woman and Manhunter have withstood the gravitational pull of a black hole past the point of no return before, anyway, so. Nope. Try again.

At best, he's a distraction. At worst, he's ignorable. He is powerful, but he's just outclassed here.

#13 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@greenteaforme: So your counter is simply the Worm Hole I pointed out. his Ability to Pull Iron from Blood, cause Nervous System Attacks, and manipulate a Celestials Body with his power alone cant touch Supes..

Nope. Try Again.

#14 Posted by greenteaforme (1826 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme: So your counter is simply the Worm Hole I pointed out. his Ability to Pull Iron from Blood, cause Nervous System Attacks, and manipulate a Celestials Body with his power alone cant touch Supes..

Nope. Try Again.

My...counter? You only gave him one point, and that was BFRing through a black hole (which wasn't even a black hole, so...), so I had nothing else to really argue against.

To be honest, we don't even know if at least four of the Justice Leaguers have iron in their blood (Aquaman may very respirate through hemocyanins ala copper, which is not magnetic) as they are either aliens, or otherwise non-humans.

He also doesn't go for such attacks (such as his brain aneurysm move) with morals on. He's had trouble manipulating super strength/durable people in the past, as well, in such a manner.

You're welcome to try again, but you're arguing a losing point: Magneto soloing.

#15 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@greenteaforme said:

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme: So your counter is simply the Worm Hole I pointed out. his Ability to Pull Iron from Blood, cause Nervous System Attacks, and manipulate a Celestials Body with his power alone cant touch Supes..

Nope. Try Again.

My...counter? You only gave him one point, and that was BFRing through a black hole (which wasn't even a black hole, so...), so I had nothing else to really argue against.

To be honest, we don't even know if at least four of the Justice Leaguers have iron in their blood (Aquaman may very respirate through hemocyanins ala copper, which is not magnetic) as they are either aliens, or otherwise non-humans.

He also doesn't go for such attacks (such as his brain aneurysm move) with morals on. He's had trouble manipulating super strength/durable people in the past, as well, in such a manner.

You're welcome to try again, but you're arguing a losing point: Magneto soloing.

Actually your the one grabbing straws on the in character deal. He has done it before and can do so again. He has killed many times, that is in character.

Nope. Try Again. :)

Add to this is Iceman Molecule freezing (Guess Supes is above Molecule freezing?) and cant be physicaly KO. Then we have Apoc whole is Immortal and cant be Mind rape Either and be strong enough (and big enough) to Wreck Cities. We have Reality Warper and Time Stopper Legion..... that alone ends this fight. Hope who can copy all this.....

Your kinda on a sinking ship yes?

#16 Edited by greenteaforme (1826 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme said:

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme: So your counter is simply the Worm Hole I pointed out. his Ability to Pull Iron from Blood, cause Nervous System Attacks, and manipulate a Celestials Body with his power alone cant touch Supes..

Nope. Try Again.

My...counter? You only gave him one point, and that was BFRing through a black hole (which wasn't even a black hole, so...), so I had nothing else to really argue against.

To be honest, we don't even know if at least four of the Justice Leaguers have iron in their blood (Aquaman may very respirate through hemocyanins ala copper, which is not magnetic) as they are either aliens, or otherwise non-humans.

He also doesn't go for such attacks (such as his brain aneurysm move) with morals on. He's had trouble manipulating super strength/durable people in the past, as well, in such a manner.

You're welcome to try again, but you're arguing a losing point: Magneto soloing.

Actually your the one grabbing straws on the in character deal. He has done it before and can do so again. He has killed many times, that is in character.

Nope. Try Again. :)

Add to this is Iceman Molecule freezing (Guess Supes is above Molecule freezing?) and cant be physicaly KO. Then we have Apoc whole is Immortal and cant be Mind rape Either and be strong enough (and big enough) to Wreck Cities. We have Reality Warper and Time Stopper Legion..... that alone ends this fight. Hope who can copy all this.....

Your kinda on a sinking ship yes?

Well none of that is either here nor there, since I only commented on your "Magneto solos half of the JL" comment. I never said the JL wins or loses either way, otherwise.

Why bring up the other characters, suddenly?

Grasping at straws, indeed. I'll take that as an admittance that you take back Magneto soloing.

And, no, Magneto does not go around giving people aneurysms, affecting the iron in their blood or attacking their nervous systems in random encounters with morals on. I didn't say he wouldn't kill, but he's never been one to needlessly slaughter everyone or go for the quick kill when he's not pressed or has no reason to.

#17 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@greenteaforme: LOL Aquaman TP and Powers fail against Mags.

WW cant take Stabs or Bullets and has Metal braclets. Fail.

Batman.... Fail.

GL uses Energy Ring. A Metal Ring that has been Magneticly removed before against a Guy who manipulate all forms of Energy really and has Magnetic Powers at the front... Fail.

Yeah he solos half the JL.

#18 Posted by greenteaforme (1826 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@greenteaforme: LOL Aquaman TP and Powers fail against Mags.

WW cant take Stabs or Bullets and has Metal braclets. Fail.

Batman.... Fail.

GL uses Energy Ring. A Metal Ring that has been Magneticly removed before against a Guy who manipulate all forms of Energy really and has Magnetic Powers at the front... Fail.

Yeah he solos half the JL.

If Aquaman has the Trident of Neptune, he's nowhere near fail. And before you go on about metal blah-blah, I'm going to need evidence of it being affected by magnetism.

Give me evidence of the Bracelets of Victory being affected by magnetism. Same as the trident, they're god-forged and not necessarily made out of a metal that is affected by magnetism in such a way that Magneto can just do his thing.

Wonder Woman being vulnerable to piercing damage doesn't mean anything. She'd have to get pierced. How is he going to do this?

I don't know about the GL thing, so I can't comment on it.

Your argument from the start was that they can't hurt him, but that's not soloing. That's simply existing.

Also, you seem to be overlooking something: You're bringing up Wonder Woman getting stabbed and shot. Yes, the fight is morals on, but if Diana dies (unlikely), the JL is going to completely enrage. Especially Clark.

#19 Edited by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

Ok Magneto owns, now i also have scans of him taking on Herc, as well as the avengers, and one of thos scans shows him Not only redirecting a TP attack but screwing with gravity at the same time

#20 Posted by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

You put 6 Omega Level Mutants against the JLA?

I am sorry JLA, you just got whipped by some Muties!!!...lol

p.s. Omega Mutants- Iceman, Hope, Cable, Vulcan, Legion, and Quinten Quire.

#21 Posted by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsoto74 said:

You put 6 Omega Level Mutants against the JLA?

I am sorry JLA, you just got whipped by some Muties!!!...lol

p.s. Omega Mutants- Iceman, Hope, Cable, Vulcan, Legion, and Quinten Quire.

lets not forget aside from namor, the rest are near omega level, and Exodus has been beastly in the past. Over the years marvel has dumbed down namor

#22 Edited by Pwok21 (2249 posts) - - Show Bio

Regardless of whether Legion is sane, if Hope knows how to use his powers (to their full potential) then she solos.

#23 Posted by YoungJustice (6683 posts) - - Show Bio

Legion and Magneto solo without much trouble.......

Online
#24 Posted by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

P.S Cable isn't considered Omega, never was and i doubt he ever will

secondly who ever state Hope would be able to copy JL's powers, they're not mutants(no x-gene)..so i don't see how that would be possible

also from what i recall magneto had assistance in creating the black holes, he doesn't do this casually. if someone could post the scans that would be much appreciated, hope tends to burn out after accessing multiple mutants power, so teh only real threats imo are Legion Vulcan and Cable, however to combat cable i could see MM taking him on, i doubt magneto would be able to manipulate MM or Clarks blood because honestly they have different properties, i'm somewhat leaning towards the JL, also being Omega doesn't necessarily mean "the most powerful" it measures potential/possible immortality. far as iceman flash freezing, not sure how exactly that would work against others with high durability due to their more dense molecular structures.

Apoc would get slapped around by supes, in regards to pure strength, supes outclasses him in durability and strength likewise Diana

#25 Edited by Yai_Inn (352 posts) - - Show Bio
@greenteaforme: Actually Magneto has controlled Mjolnir so I don't see any reason to why he wouldn't be able to control Diana's bracelets.   
He could theoretically steal GL's ring and the Trident of Neptune and take out Batman rather easily. So half the JL is possible.   
The rest of the battle... 
Martian's TP isn't going to over power the combined minds of Cable, Exodus, Apocalypse, and Quinten Quire. He'd go down.   
Flash has crazy offensive power, but not a lot of durability, similar to Legion... they can blow each other away.  
Vulcan drains Sups.  
That leaves Aquaman to fight Iceman, Hope, Namor and Darwin (who currently is Hell Lord level).  
Muties win due to numbers. How is this not spite?   
#26 Edited by antiwhipped (202 posts) - - Show Bio

Darwin is base level to start.

Cable is not burnt out.

Legion is current self.

I think it'll come down to can MM hold off the psychics long enough for flash/ww/superman to take them out. Not sure how well their TK is going to slow superman/ww immense speed/strength.

Feel free to suggest a subset of the mutants that makes the most even match.

#27 Posted by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

@antiwhipped: MM is not going to be able to fight the Psychics, Hell Exodus would be a problem, and yes i got scans of him wrecking people, who MM's tp is on Par with, I also have scans of him Taking on the Avengers, Xmen and a few Inhumans, all at once, So Exodus Ties up MM. also have scans of him mimicking Mags power,

I also have scans of Magneto Taking on hercules, and shrugging him off, so Cyborg will become cannon fodder, as will Bats. He controls teh entire EM spectrum, can screw with gravity( which will screw with supermans Flight, as he moves gravity around him in order to fly.) Can also redirect TP attacks, placed in Scan above. Also have scans of him screwing with the earth,

Cable is in Messiah mode, to TO virus, during burnt offering, he fought the surfer, while fully powering providence, and keeping it floating, So yeah he would classified as omega, here, as he now equal to Nate grey, but with a ton more training.

Darwin will adapt, so if flash blitzes, high chance of Darwin auto stopping him.

See what i hate about hope, is writers tend forget that she was trained her whole life by Cable, even if she cant take powers from teh JL, look at her team

Oh and this just somethign Iceman has been doing on the fly as of late, Couple that with the fact Exodus power boosts his team. I dont see a single person they need to add to win

#28 Posted by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@Yai_Inn said:

@greenteaforme: Actually Magneto has controlled Mjolnir so I don't see any reason to why he wouldn't be able to control Diana's bracelets. He could theoretically steal GL's ring and the Trident of Neptune and take out Batman rather easily. So half the JL is possible. The rest of the battle... Martian's TP isn't going to over power the combined minds of Cable, Exodus, Apocalypse, and Quinten Quire. He'd go down. Flash has crazy offensive power, but not a lot of durability, similar to Darwin... they can blow each other away. Vulcan drains Sups. That leaves Aquaman to fight Iceman, Hope, Namor and Darwin (who currently is Hell Lord level). Muties win due to numbers. How is this not spite?

from what i recall that was the ultimate universe, not 616 therefore not canon, if you could produce a scan of 616 manipulating Thors hammer, then i'll consider the possibility, until then, I doubt he could manipulate magically enchanted weapons/items, secondly i doubt Vulcan would be able to drain supes, his reaction isn't sufficient enough to contend, with Clark, he'd get ko'd, most likely to an ever greater degree than what Gladiator did, Flash can accelerate his brain waves to become immune to telepathy, i see no intangible characters, hate to say this but wall could simply speed steal? namor could most def get affected by aquamans TP, i don't see how this IS spite...

#29 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1: Can Wally Fly? Almost the whole X-team can..... Can wally prevent Time stopping? Legion does Time stop...... Can Wally break thru Mags Force Field that Phoenix had trouble doing? Doubt it. can Wally Speed Steal Darwin who would just adapt to that........

#30 Posted by Yai_Inn (352 posts) - - Show Bio
@X_insignia1:  
 
The spite I was referring to was that this is basically an 11 vs. 6 battle. When I read the OP it looked like it was created to prove that mutants could beat the JL.
#31 Posted by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@crackerjack82 said:

@antiwhipped: MM is not going to be able to fight the Psychics, Hell Exodus would be a problem, and yes i got scans of him wrecking people, who MM's tp is on Par with, I also have scans of him Taking on the Avengers, Xmen and a few Inhumans, all at once, So Exodus Ties up MM. also have scans of him mimicking Mags power,

I also have scans of Magneto Taking on hercules, and shrugging him off, so Cyborg will become cannon fodder, as will Bats. He controls teh entire EM spectrum, can screw with gravity( which will screw with supermans Flight, as he moves gravity around him in order to fly.) Can also redirect TP attacks, placed in Scan above. Also have scans of him screwing with the earth,

Cable is in Messiah mode, to TO virus, during burnt offering, he fought the surfer, while fully powering providence, and keeping it floating, So yeah he would classified as omega, here, as he now equal to Nate grey, but with a ton more training.

Darwin will adapt, so if flash blitzes, high chance of Darwin auto stopping him.

See what i hate about hope, is writers tend forget that she was trained her whole life by Cable, even if she cant take powers from teh JL, look at her team

Oh and this just somethign Iceman has been doing on the fly as of late, Couple that with the fact Exodus power boosts his team. I dont see a single person they need to add to win

no, he still wasn't considered omega, he was considered a high end alpha, if it hasn't been stated on panel or the handbooks then it can't be accounted for. Nate surpassed him in power even in his messiah mode, in the older cable volumes cable himself stated that Nate possessed HIS full potential and THEN some(more)...also Nate has more impressive feats under his belt as shaman than cable( he's reality warped, stopped time, and entered planck length) and to add nate was capable of transcending the physical world to a higher plane of existence( pure psionic energy) which is why he was considered omega, NOT cable...

#32 Posted by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1 said:

P.S Cable isn't considered Omega, never was and i doubt he ever will

secondly who ever state Hope would be able to copy JL's powers, they're not mutants(no x-gene)..so i don't see how that would be possible

also from what i recall magneto had assistance in creating the black holes, he doesn't do this casually. if someone could post the scans that would be much appreciated, hope tends to burn out after accessing multiple mutants power, so teh only real threats imo are Legion Vulcan and Cable, however to combat cable i could see MM taking him on, i doubt magneto would be able to manipulate MM or Clarks blood because honestly they have different properties, i'm somewhat leaning towards the JL, also being Omega doesn't necessarily mean "the most powerful" it measures potential/possible immortality. far as iceman flash freezing, not sure how exactly that would work against others with high durability due to their more dense molecular structures.

Apoc would get slapped around by supes, in regards to pure strength, supes outclasses him in durability and strength likewise Diana

Nate Grey is Cable without the Techno Virus and he is an Omega Level Mutant. It has been implied that the constant strain of suppressing Techno Virus is what prevented Cable from reaching Omega Level. Now he does not have the virus, so what is stopping him.On the other hand Stryfe is a clone of Cable and he is not considered a Omega level Mutant, so I guess we can take him off the list for now... :)

With the exception of Martian Manhunter does anyone on the JLA have resistance to Psi Powers?

#33 Edited by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

P.S Cable isn't considered Omega, never was and i doubt he ever will

secondly who ever state Hope would be able to copy JL's powers, they're not mutants(no x-gene)..so i don't see how that would be possible

also from what i recall magneto had assistance in creating the black holes, he doesn't do this casually. if someone could post the scans that would be much appreciated, hope tends to burn out after accessing multiple mutants power, so teh only real threats imo are Legion Vulcan and Cable, however to combat cable i could see MM taking him on, i doubt magneto would be able to manipulate MM or Clarks blood because honestly they have different properties, i'm somewhat leaning towards the JL, also being Omega doesn't necessarily mean "the most powerful" it measures potential/possible immortality. far as iceman flash freezing, not sure how exactly that would work against others with high durability due to their more dense molecular structures.

Apoc would get slapped around by supes, in regards to pure strength, supes outclasses him in durability and strength likewise Diana

Nate Grey is Cable without the Techno Virus and he is an Omega Level Mutant. It has been implied that the constant strain of suppressing Techno Virus is what prevented Cable from reaching Omega Level. Now he does not have the virus, so what is stopping him.On the other hand Stryfe is a clone of Cable and he is not considered a Omega level Mutant, so I guess we can take him off the list for now... :)

With the exception of Martian Manhunter does anyone on the JLA have resistance to Psi Powers?

no, not necessarily, they're more akin to being brothers rather than genetic copies. They're similar genetically, NOT identical. One came from a clone, Madelyn Pryor(his genes being the random assortment) while the other came from Jean grey who was also the phoenix at that time ( using the best arrangements of genes possible)Nate even has his own alternate reality counter parts... and yes the virus suppresses Cable's power, however he stated himself that Nate Grey exceeds his powers, even it they weren't hampered by the T-O virus , Cable says "From what I've seen already, Grey exhibits all my psionic, and telekinetic potential, and then some. Unchecked by the techno-virus I carry" (X-Man #14) therefore Shaman X-man man > Jesus Cable, Nate was born with the omega potential, NOT cable. Cable maxes out at high-end alpha.

#34 Posted by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

They are 6 people on the mutant team that have mental powers Exodus, Hope, Apocalypse, Cable, Legion, and Quinten Quire. Superman is vulnerable to psionics, especially mind control. By exploiting this weakness, a superhero does not need to kill Superman, only control him. Maxwell Lord, the Insect Queen, Martian Manhunter, Eclipso, and others have exploited this weakness. Martian Manhunter has very strong Psionic abilities; however I do not think he could overpower all 6 of them. The OP stated the mutants will be working together so more than likely they will all have a mental link. Superman is the most powerful one of the bunch so he will be controlled to take out MM first. Then Batman will try to stop Superman and he will pull out his Kryptonite that he has stored in his utility belt. So now MM and Supes are done. Flash will try to blitz and Legion will just stop the time and he will be finished off by a well placed blast from Vulcan. Since no prep is allowed, Batman did not prepare for Magneto and will quickly be encased in a metal sphere prison. He will use his bat torch to try to get out, but by that time it will all be over. Hal Jordan will make a Helmet like Magneto's to protect from the mental attacks and he take down Ice Man by encaseing him in a force Bubble. He will be a good fight, but all the telekinesis and magnetic control, he will be attacked from all sides and Namor will swoop in for the knock out blow. Wonder Woman will deliver a KO punch of her own and send Namor to the ground. Aquaman will try to reach Superman to removed the Kryptonite to get him back into the fight. Darwin will be waiting with Vulcan and Darwin will once again convert to pure energy and merge with Vulcan to increase his power. The heat emitted from Vulcan and his blast will be enough to weaken and slow him down until the rest of the team arrive and finish him off with great quickness. Amazingly Wonder Woman will be the last one standing and Magneto will just wait for the right moment and make her Bracelets Super Magnetic and they will attract metal from all angles she will be trying to fight the Mutants while trying to avoid the metal coming to her (car, trucks, boats, light poles, etc...) She will be encased in a prison as well, but she would bust out, but be surrounded. Legion with one of his abilities will put Wonder Woman down for the count.

#35 Posted by _Black (2302 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsoto74: Lost all credibility when you said Batman would take out Superman.

#36 Posted by Blacharrt1 (751 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1 said:

P.S Cable isn't considered Omega, never was and i doubt he ever will

secondly who ever state Hope would be able to copy JL's powers, they're not mutants(no x-gene)..so i don't see how that would be possible

also from what i recall magneto had assistance in creating the black holes, he doesn't do this casually. if someone could post the scans that would be much appreciated, hope tends to burn out after accessing multiple mutants power, so teh only real threats imo are Legion Vulcan and Cable, however to combat cable i could see MM taking him on, i doubt magneto would be able to manipulate MM or Clarks blood because honestly they have different properties, i'm somewhat leaning towards the JL, also being Omega doesn't necessarily mean "the most powerful" it measures potential/possible immortality. far as iceman flash freezing, not sure how exactly that would work against others with high durability due to their more dense molecular structures.

Apoc would get slapped around by supes, in regards to pure strength, supes outclasses him in durability and strength likewise Diana

It's very apparent from this statement you don't read Marvel.

Cable, the only reason cable isn't an omega level mutant is because he uses the majority of his powers to hold back the techno-organic virus, Which would kill him if he didn't. However in this fight that is gone. Cable without the techno-organic virus in everyway would be equated to x-man in ability, making him an omega level telepathy and telekinetic.

As far as Hope you are wrong in AvX it was shown that Hope can actually mimic cosmic powers (Phoenix), Magical Powers (scarlet Witch), and Chi (Iron Fist) all at the same time in a combined force. So again you are wrong. They don't have to be mutants.

As far as magneto you are right that he had help with creating the wormhole, Not a black hole. Hope doesn't really burn out as you put it, I'm not even sure what you mean by that, But lately she hasn't shown any side effects of mimicking powers this was shown in the Uncanny X-men and AvX.

Majority of the People on that Team are a threat, Magneto being one of those people. Very few people can manipulate energy the way he can. Discounting the times he was amped in some way, he still has very impressive Energy Manipulation feats, and In character I don't know if you read Magneto No a Hero series, but Magneto will clearly Kill, IN CHARACTER, without hesitation. Same for Vulcan, Cable, Exodus, Apocalypse, and even Hope (as she was taught by Cable in Second Coming would kill)

The whole iron in the blood thing, Clark actually doe have iron in his blood it's what makes it red. As to whether Magneto would use this, not really. If he's p*ed off, or annoyed by the fight he might. Not right off. He could also use their blood to prevent them from consciously use their powers, as he did with X-men, during Illyana's funeral.

This fight would be over very quickly if Magneto, Vulcan, Darwin Apocalypse or Hope tapped into the speed force. All of the people listed have the potential to do so. Vulcan and Hope being the most likely, Apocalypse ability to master different energy makes him a possibility and Darwin could conscious or adapt to Flash's speed to counter his power. Hope due to proximity could gain access to it.

Apocalypse, Cable, Exodus, Quinten Quire, Legion either have high level use of telepathic power. It's no way MM, or Aquaman would be able to beat them. Being that Superman, Aquaman, MM, Batman, flash, even Hal with his very High resistance can be mind-controlled. That leave WW (who is the only one immuned) fighting off her own team. So a telepathic fight would be a very bad thing.

Then you have Iceman...

#37 Edited by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@Blacharrt1 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

P.S Cable isn't considered Omega, never was and i doubt he ever will

secondly who ever state Hope would be able to copy JL's powers, they're not mutants(no x-gene)..so i don't see how that would be possible

also from what i recall magneto had assistance in creating the black holes, he doesn't do this casually. if someone could post the scans that would be much appreciated, hope tends to burn out after accessing multiple mutants power, so teh only real threats imo are Legion Vulcan and Cable, however to combat cable i could see MM taking him on, i doubt magneto would be able to manipulate MM or Clarks blood because honestly they have different properties, i'm somewhat leaning towards the JL, also being Omega doesn't necessarily mean "the most powerful" it measures potential/possible immortality. far as iceman flash freezing, not sure how exactly that would work against others with high durability due to their more dense molecular structures.

Apoc would get slapped around by supes, in regards to pure strength, supes outclasses him in durability and strength likewise Diana

It's very apparent from this statement you don't read Marvel.

Cable, the only reason cable isn't an omega level mutant is because he uses the majority of his powers to hold back the techno-organic virus, Which would kill him if he didn't. However in this fight that is gone. Cable without the techno-organic virus in everyway would be equated to x-man in ability, making him an omega level telepathy and telekinetic.

As far as Hope you are wrong in AvX it was shown that Hope can actually mimic cosmic powers (Phoenix), Magical Powers (scarlet Witch), and Chi (Iron Fist) all at the same time in a combined force. So again you are wrong. They don't have to be mutants.

As far as magneto you are right that he had help with creating the wormhole, Not a black hole. Hope doesn't really burn out as you put it, I'm not even sure what you mean by that, But lately she hasn't shown any side effects of mimicking powers this was shown in the Uncanny X-men and AvX.

Majority of the People on that Team are a threat, Magneto being one of those people. Very few people can manipulate energy the way he can. Discounting the times he was amped in some way, he still has very impressive Energy Manipulation feats, and In character I don't know if you read Magneto No a Hero series, but Magneto will clearly Kill, IN CHARACTER, without hesitation. Same for Vulcan, Cable, Exodus, Apocalypse, and even Hope (as she was taught by Cable in Second Coming would kill)

The whole iron in the blood thing, Clark actually doe have iron in his blood it's what makes it red. As to whether Magneto would use this, not really. If he's p*ed off, or annoyed by the fight he might. Not right off. He could also use their blood to prevent them from consciously use their powers, as he did with X-men, during Illyana's funeral.

This fight would be over very quickly if Magneto, Vulcan, Darwin Apocalypse or Hope tapped into the speed force. All of the people listed have the potential to do so. Vulcan and Hope being the most likely, Apocalypse ability to master different energy makes him a possibility and Darwin could conscious or adapt to Flash's speed to counter his power. Hope due to proximity could gain access to it.

Apocalypse, Cable, Exodus, Quinten Quire, Legion either have high level use of telepathic power. It's no way MM, or Aquaman would be able to beat them. Being that Superman, Aquaman, MM, Batman, flash, even Hal with his very High resistance can be mind-controlled. That leave WW (who is the only one immuned) fighting off her own team. So a telepathic fight would be a very bad thing.

Then you have Iceman...

you're not understanding my statements guy... as i said prior

-self quote

no, not necessarily, they're more akin to being brothers rather than genetic copies. They're similar genetically, NOT identical. One came from a clone, Madelyn Pryor(his genes being the random assortment) while the other came from Jean grey who was also the phoenix at that time ( using the best arrangements of genes possible)Nate even has his own alternate reality counter parts... and yes the virus suppresses Cable's power, however he stated himself that Nate Grey exceeds his powers, even it they weren't hampered by the T-O virus , Cable says "From what I've seen already, Grey exhibits all my psionic, and telekinetic potential, and then some. Unchecked by the techno-virus I carry" (X-Man #14) therefore Shaman X-man man > Jesus Cable, Nate was born with the omega potential, NOT cable. Cable maxes out at high-end alpha.

and to add, hope is able to mimic the phoenix force due to her connection to it, likewise iron fist (fonji) which has yet to be explained because in the past if she were able to mimic other cosmic forces, she would of then mimicked he dreaming Celestials during the whole Sinister fiasco and she has fainted from channeling multiple abilities at once in the past, and again we're not sure how Magneto's abilities would react to someone of Superman's or wonder woman's durability, and again far as wally being mind controlled that is highly unlikely, i don't see iceman causing too many problems for Diana or Supes

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

#38 Edited by Dextersinister (5795 posts) - - Show Bio

Cable is borderline powerless and they will never allow him to have any degree of power on a permanent basis as it would ruin his character.

Legion is still suffering and cannot be depended on.

Magneto is a lot weaker in story and would be unable to do a fraction of the things the people on this thread think he can do, not to mention most of those scans are probably older than them.

The rest are mish mash of characters that are powerful but have never worked together and have no answer to the heavy duty speed blitzing this team can deliver.

#39 Posted by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlastCore9: So i take it that you Never Read the Bloodties storyline, the one where Exodus (alone) take out the avengers, Xmen, Inhuman, and Crushes an island. also during this storyline, Fights Holocaust, while beating Jene grey in TP battle, and kicks the crap out of Prof X on the astal plane at the same time. In another Storyline he tore apart a shield helicarrier( mimicking magnetos power) just to build a version of Cerbro, that he stole from Cables mind( 2007) Oh yes lets not forget that he can bring people back to life, Himself included, as well as actively shut down a persons power( as he did to Storm)

If you want proof Go here,

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=418961&pagenumber=1

ive been warned about posting full scans Twice by mods

#40 Posted by TheGraySon (457 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlastCore9 said:

@bigsoto74:You're forgetting that almost every one of the telepaths on the mutant team can get one shotted. They'll have 6 telepaths to start, 4 of them will get one shotted off the bat. Hope, Cable, Exodus and Apocalypse will go down like a sac of bricks. I can't comment on Legion or Quinten but if they're vunerable to physical force they'll go down as well.

Even if they managed to control Superman, Martian would wreck him in a fight. Flash is immune to telepathy, and unless Legion can stop time before getting blitzed he'll be out of the fight as well.

So you have Supes, Martian, Hal, Diana, Aquaman and Bruce vs Iceman, Darwin, Namor, Magneto, Vulcan, ei ei. Vulcan, Namor and Magneto will get destroyed by Superman, Martian and Wonder Woman. Aquaman will mind rape Namor, Hal would contain Bobby. I really can't comment on how Darwin would play into this fight but if unless he can withstand telepathy and physical force along with speed stealing, the mutants get stomped.

Yeah pretty much this. I dont see how half the team would survive a speed blitz from Supes,WW, or Flash.

#41 Edited by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

@_Black: Doesnt Batman keep Kryptonite in his utility belt? If Supes is controlled by someone else and there is no other way to stop him, you dont think Batman would have no other choice but to incapacitate him by using his only means?

#42 Posted by kktheman1 (43 posts) - - Show Bio

Your arguments are complete bull Magneto does not Solo in fact if u actually get down to it i can say flash solos

#43 Posted by kktheman1 (43 posts) - - Show Bio

Also The Flash can take them all out before they even Blink IMP FTW

#44 Posted by spawn_123 (1693 posts) - - Show Bio

Dont know but i think that Iceman Magneto Apocalypse are too much

#45 Posted by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

#46 Posted by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

understandable for Vulcan, can you provide scans/instances of other DC energy manipulators manipulating the speed force? if not, then he may be a$$'d out,, (other than speedsters) and in regards to magneto, i highly doubt so, he's only limited to energies within the electromagnetic spectrum, seeing that the speed force is extradimensional,i don't see how he would be able to do so.

#47 Edited by Blacharrt1 (751 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1 said:

@X_insignia1 said:


-self quote

no, not necessarily, they're more akin to being brothers rather than genetic copies. They're similar genetically, NOT identical. One came from a clone, Madelyn Pryor(his genes being the random assortment) while the other came from Jean grey who was also the phoenix at that time ( using the best arrangements of genes possible)Nate even has his own alternate reality counter parts... and yes the virus suppresses Cable's power, however he stated himself that Nate Grey exceeds his powers, even it they weren't hampered by the T-O virus , Cable says "From what I've seen already, Grey exhibits all my psionic, and telekinetic potential, and then some. Unchecked by the techno-virus I carry" (X-Man #14) therefore Shaman X-man man > Jesus Cable, Nate was born with the omega potential, NOT cable. Cable maxes out at high-end alpha.

and to add, hope is able to mimic the phoenix force due to her connection to it, likewise iron fist (fonji) which has yet to be explained because in the past if she were able to mimic other cosmic forces, she would of then mimicked he dreaming Celestials during the whole Sinister fiasco and she has fainted from channeling multiple abilities at once in the past, and again we're not sure how Magneto's abilities would react to someone of Superman's or wonder woman's durability, and again far as wally being mind controlled that is highly unlikely, i don't see iceman causing too many problems for Diana or Supes

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Both Cable and Nate were a by product of Sinister manipulating the Summers and Grey DNA. both are by products of cloning. So i don't get your point in stating that. the only real difference is that Sinister in AOA, accelerated Nate's growth with initially was suppose to shorten his life, and he was only meant to kill Apocalypse in AoA.

Cables potential as i stated before has been Omega level, X-man at his prime had comparable power to the Phoenix with shear output, which is well beyond Omega Level mutant. Even Rachel with the Phoenix echo wasn't nearly has powerful as X-man. But for you to make it seem like Cable is some low level telepath or telekinetic is ridiculous.

Hope's connection to the Phoenix hasn't really been explain in any real detail what so ever, However Unit stated that the Phoenix picks a champions on a planet then destroys it. There was no mentioning of the person having connection to the phoenix before the phoenix reached the planet. Also the Phoenix isn't a mutant and she was able to tap into this power while the phoenix was in the white hot room after Jean called all the phoenix energy back to her is quite impressive in itself. And it's highly likely she could tap into that cosmic power from anywhere. But that doesn't explain how she was able to tap into Scarlet Witch's power which is Magical, and the Life Force (which is another cosmic power). An as far as the connection of Hope to the Iron fist, it stated in that little history that a red headed woman who had a connection to the phoenix when there well before Hope was born and was trained to harness chi to conquer the phoenix. The problem with that is iron fist never got to train Hope to do that, he even says it when Cyclop shows up to come and take her. So, and she wasn't tired due to her combining all those power, or at least the comic didn't show that. As far as uncanny with the Sleeping Celestial, the Sleeping Celestial was already being manipulated by Sinister. And as far as i could tell she couldn't or didn't mimic Sinister in any way, so it states to reason she wouldn't be able to tap into the Sleeping Celestials power since it had already been tampered with and controlled by another Entity.

As far as Diana and Superman durability, it has nothing to do with their internal bodies. It's like saying people couldn't mess with Superman's brain because he has a high durability... nope sorry that's not the case, he very highly susceptible to telepathy and mind control (which inturn would affect the usage of his entire body). The only reason WW is immune to it is that she was given magical immunity not because she has a strong mind. But for some unknown reason sharp objects hurt her. WW's durability is high for Kinetic impact only. A character like wolverine could literally kill her easily if he could hit her. So your theory about somehow their bodies be highly resistant due to their durability doesn't really hold water. The fact that blood has iron in it, and Magneto can manipulate that doesn't change the fact that both WW and Superman have Human physiology. they both bleed red blood which is a sign of iron in blood. Now would Magneto be able to rip them apart from the inside out... hmm that's doubtful, this is where durability would be a factor. But can he forcibly remove the blood from their bodies, yeah. Could he prevent them from consciously using their powers, yeah, could he paralyze them from moving, yeah. could he detect them with his sense of magnetism yeah. Also flash would be the worst for this because his accelerated metabolism he should have more iron in his blood than anyone else there, so he would likely be the most susceptible.

@bigsoto74: Thank you for breaking that down for him.

@X_insignia1 said:

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

understandable for Vulcan, can you provide scans/instances of other DC energy manipulators manipulating the speed force? if not, then he may be a$$'d out,, (other than speedsters) and in regards to magneto, i highly doubt so, he's only limited to energies within the electromagnetic spectrum, seeing that the speed force is extradimensional,i don't see how he would be able to do so.

Why would we have to prove anything for DC, what you need to prove is that it couldn't be done by the marvel characters.. As far as magneto, he has manipulated energies outside of the Electromagnetic spectrum including magical in property, and unknown energies that was similar to ones he was familiar with. Like when he disburse Proteus. It's as he explained harder to do, but he can infact do it. Darwin is self- explanatory His body can willfully and automatically get any powerset he wants. And Hope could mimic it.

#48 Posted by bigsoto74 (216 posts) - - Show Bio

@X_insignia1 said:

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

understandable for Vulcan, can you provide scans/instances of other DC energy manipulators manipulating the speed force? if not, then he may be a$$'d out,, (other than speedsters) and in regards to magneto, i highly doubt so, he's only limited to energies within the electromagnetic spectrum, seeing that the speed force is extradimensional,i don't see how he would be able to do so.

I am not much of a DC fan but I am pretty sure that Amazo has absorbed Flash's Speed. I am not sure about Parasite, but I did read that he can absorb any form of energy (even Superman's energy).

#49 Edited by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@Blacharrt1 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

@X_insignia1 said:


-self quote

no, not necessarily, they're more akin to being brothers rather than genetic copies. They're similar genetically, NOT identical. One came from a clone, Madelyn Pryor(his genes being the random assortment) while the other came from Jean grey who was also the phoenix at that time ( using the best arrangements of genes possible)Nate even has his own alternate reality counter parts... and yes the virus suppresses Cable's power, however he stated himself that Nate Grey exceeds his powers, even it they weren't hampered by the T-O virus , Cable says "From what I've seen already, Grey exhibits all my psionic, and telekinetic potential, and then some. Unchecked by the techno-virus I carry" (X-Man #14) therefore Shaman X-man man > Jesus Cable, Nate was born with the omega potential, NOT cable. Cable maxes out at high-end alpha.

and to add, hope is able to mimic the phoenix force due to her connection to it, likewise iron fist (fonji) which has yet to be explained because in the past if she were able to mimic other cosmic forces, she would of then mimicked he dreaming Celestials during the whole Sinister fiasco and she has fainted from channeling multiple abilities at once in the past, and again we're not sure how Magneto's abilities would react to someone of Superman's or wonder woman's durability, and again far as wally being mind controlled that is highly unlikely, i don't see iceman causing too many problems for Diana or Supes

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Both Cable and Nate were a by product of Sinister manipulating the Summers and Grey DNA. both are by products of cloning. So i don't get your point in stating that. the only real difference is that Sinister in AOA, accelerated Nate's growth with initially was suppose to shorten his life, and he was only meant to kill Apocalypse in AoA.

Cables potential as i stated before has been Omega level, X-man at his prime had comparable power to the Phoenix with shear output, which is well beyond Omega Level mutant. Even Rachel with the Phoenix echo wasn't nearly has powerful as X-man. But for you to make it seem like Cable is some low level telepath or telekinetic is ridiculous.

Hope's connection to the Phoenix hasn't really been explain in any real detail what so ever, However Unit stated that the Phoenix picks a champions on a planet then destroys it. There was no mentioning of the person having connection to the phoenix before the phoenix reached the planet. Also the Phoenix isn't a mutant and she was able to tap into this power while the phoenix was in the white hot room after Jean called all the phoenix energy back to her is quite impressive in itself. And it's highly likely she could tap into that cosmic power from anywhere. But that doesn't explain how she was able to tap into Scarlet Witch's power which is Magical, and the Life Force (which is another cosmic power). An as far as the connection of Hope to the Iron fist, it stated in that little history that a red headed woman who had a connection to the phoenix when there well before Hope was born and was trained to harness chi to conquer the phoenix. The problem with that is iron fist never got to train Hope to do that, he even says it when Cyclop shows up to come and take her. So, and she wasn't tired due to her combining all those power, or at least the comic didn't show that. As far as uncanny with the Sleeping Celestial, the Sleeping Celestial was already being manipulated by Sinister. And as far as i could tell she couldn't or didn't mimic Sinister in any way, so it states to reason she wouldn't be able to tap into the Sleeping Celestials power since it had already been tampered with and controlled by another Entity.

As far as Diana and Superman durability, it has nothing to do with their internal bodies. It's like saying people couldn't mess with Superman's brain because he has a high durability... nope sorry that's not the case, he very highly susceptible to telepathy and mind control (which inturn would affect the usage of his entire body). The only reason WW is immune to it is that she was given magical immunity not because she has a strong mind. But for some unknown reason sharp objects hurt her. WW's durability is high for Kinetic impact only. A character like wolverine could literally kill her easily if he could hit her. So your theory about somehow their bodies be highly resistant due to their durability doesn't really hold water. The fact that blood has iron in it, and Magneto can manipulate that doesn't change the fact that both WW and Superman have Human physiology. they both bleed red blood which is a sign of iron in blood. Now would Magneto be able to rip them apart from the inside out... hmm that's doubtful, this is where durability would be a factor. But can he forcibly remove the blood from their bodies, yeah. Could he prevent them from consciously using their powers, yeah, could he paralyze them from moving, yeah. could he detect them with his sense of magnetism yeah. Also flash would be the worst for this because his accelerated metabolism he should have more iron in his blood than anyone else there, so he would likely be the most susceptible.

@bigsoto74: Thank you for breaking that down for him.

@X_insignia1 said:

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

understandable for Vulcan, can you provide scans/instances of other DC energy manipulators manipulating the speed force? if not, then he may be a$$'d out,, (other than speedsters) and in regards to magneto, i highly doubt so, he's only limited to energies within the electromagnetic spectrum, seeing that the speed force is extradimensional,i don't see how he would be able to do so.

Why would we have to prove anything for DC, what you need to prove is that it couldn't be done by the marvel characters.. As far as magneto, he has manipulated energies outside of the Electromagnetic spectrum including magical in property, and unknown energies that was similar to ones he was familiar with. Like when he disburse Proteus. It's as he explained harder to do, but he can infact do it. Darwin is self- explanatory His body can willfully and automatically get any powerset he wants. And Hope could mimic it.

i never stated cable was a low level telepath or telekinetic, you're simple no understanding simple explanations, cable came from a clone, nate came from an original, he was the product of normal reproduction sex, Nate was the product of extreme tampering, he was created to be the ultimate telekinetic, i even supplied the quote from cable where he states Nate's potential exceeds his, it was never stated cable had omega potential, find me the scan or reference or quote THEN make that claim , you can't. you're also disregarding that Nate has his own alternate reality counterparts , he's his own person, and her connection to the phoenix? she's been called it's child, obviously her circumstances are different due to her connection to the lights ect, and yes, it's simple NATE'S POTENTIAL OUTMAXES CABLE'S, can you grasp that simple concept? it's been stated, even the alternate Jean grey ( the red queen) stated every Nate grey she came across was designed to be the ultimate telekinetic?why not "cable" or "nathan summers" of..that's right..they're different people..NOT the same

and yes, Hope never received official training from iron fist, however that still doesn't dismiss the connection between the dragon and the phoenix

you're jumping to conclusion, and wasn't chaos magic retconned into being a aspect of Wanda's power? therefore it's mutant related

her hexbolts are also mutant related

and you're still jumping to conclusions about supermans blood, you have no idea about it's properties, for all you know another element or complex could be the cause of the red blood color, and humans and Kryptonians do not have have human physiology, they have THEIR OWN,

they have their own unique organs, ect.

i would need proof of DC characters as benchmakr because there is no speedforce is marvel obviously, therefore one cannot assume he can manipulate the speed force, it's extradimensional , and when has magneto manipulated magic? show me the instance, if you're referring to thor's hammer he barely able to budge it, because despite being enchanted it obviously has an em field, nonetheless he still couldn't lift it ,and you're

Supeman has resisted telepathy. not to mention his strong will, is he vulnerable? yes, however most of these telepaths can be one shotted

and magneto would never be able to tag flash, the guys not just going to sit around and allow magneto to manipulate him

and in regards to proteus, he only dispersed him because proteus also contained traces of electrons, not to mention proteus had also let his guard down

#50 Posted by X_insignia1 (1373 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

@bigsoto74 said:

@X_insignia1 said:

also you're assuming that Superman's red blood is due to, iron however you don't know that, he isn't human HE'S KRYPTONIAN, unless you can verify that their species indeed carries iron, you can't make that assumption, and how in the world will Magneto, Vulcan or Derwin or Hope tap in the speedforce? they're not speedsters...

Speed Force: The Speed Force is an ENERGY SOURCE in the DC Universe generated by Barry Allen that lets speedsters travel at otherwise impossible speeds and do other nifty tricks without being hindered by physics.

Vulcan: He can manipulate ALL FORMS OF ENERGY and, in one instance with the aid of Darwin, absorbed the essence and powers of his former teammates ( Petra, Darwin, and Sway). Charles Xavier commented that he is the most powerful energy manipulator he has ever come across.

Magneto: Although Magneto's primary power is the control over magnetism, he can also manipulate ANY FORM OF ENERGY from the electromagnetic spectrum. This includes visible light, radio waves, ultraviolet light, gamma rays, and x-rays.

understandable for Vulcan, can you provide scans/instances of other DC energy manipulators manipulating the speed force? if not, then he may be a$$'d out,, (other than speedsters) and in regards to magneto, i highly doubt so, he's only limited to energies within the electromagnetic spectrum, seeing that the speed force is extradimensional,i don't see how he would be able to do so.

I am not much of a DC fan but I am pretty sure that Amazo has absorbed Flash's Speed. I am not sure about Parasite, but I did read that he can absorb any form of energy (even Superman's energy).

Amazo is known for replicating superhuman abilities through unknown means, because he's also absorbed supermans abilities, which are stemmed from his cellular structure, the solar energy is just initialized that process to metabolize the energy. but i've yet to see parasite absorb the speed force