If this is any Batgirl accept Cain then Team 2 takes an L.I don't really think it's fair either way.I think there is one Batgirl that is more than a match for a Elektra and two others that are nowhere near her.And neither Elektra and especially not Shang Chi can't handle Lady Shiva.
" Shang Chi could beat Lady Shiva and Batgirl could beat Elektra, I think it would come down Shang Chi Vs. Lady Shiva and I'm guessing stalemate. "
What makes you think Shang could beat Shiva? "
It's the classic Shang Chi is better than everyone defense.He has like no fighting skill feats yet people thinks he's either the best fighter in Marvel or not far from it.
" Shang Chi could beat Lady Shiva and Batgirl could beat Elektra, I think it would come down Shang Chi Vs. Lady Shiva and I'm guessing stalemate. "
What makes you think Shang could beat Shiva? "
It's the classic Shang Chi is better than everyone defense.He has like no fighting skill feats yet people thinks he's either the best fighter in Marvel or not far from it. "
Technically Panther never outright said that he was better then Iron Fist anyway, he said "But Shang Chi is a Master" master of what? Kung Fu? Yeah maybe he's better then Danny in that specific discipline but nothing about him being an overall better fighter.
I have to give the vote to team 2. If powers were allowed, then Elektra could just silent scream the DC girls and win. However, because the battle is only pure H2H, DC takes the cake.
" I have to give the vote to team 2. If powers were allowed, then Elektra could just silent scream the DC girls and win. However, because the battle is only pure H2H, DC takes the cake. "
" @spidey 15: Wouldn't he still have a hard time with Shiva or Cassie, both who could read bodies? "
I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic
@saiyan_earthling said:
" I have to give the vote to team 2. If powers were allowed, then Elektra could just silent scream the DC girls and win. However, because the battle is only pure H2H, DC takes the cake. "
No powers in this fight, after doing research if she could use her powers then Team 1 may be able to win but only because of Elektra's silent scream, Shang would probably get his ass beaten regardless of chi abilities or not .
Since there are no powers team 2 takes it pretty easily since either of team 2 could beat either of team 1 without too much difficulty, Shiva would probably beat Elektra without much trouble and Cass would probably kick Shang's head off his shoulders.
" I have to give the vote to team 2. If powers were allowed, then Elektra could just silent scream the DC girls and win. However, because the battle is only pure H2H, DC takes the cake. "
"
The Silent scream isn't a power..it's technique.Shang Chi can also do it and it appears he's better at it.
" I have to give the vote to team 2. If powers were allowed, then Elektra could just silent scream the DC girls and win. However, because the battle is only pure H2H, DC takes the cake. "
No powers in this fight, after doing research if she could use her powers then Team 1 may be able to win but only because of Elektra's silent scream, Shang would probably get his ass beaten regardless of chi abilities or not . Since there are no powers team 2 takes it pretty easily since either of team 2 could beat either of team 1 without too much difficulty, Shiva would probably beat Elektra without much trouble and Cass would probably kick Shang's head off his shoulders. "
Elektra has only used this technique once that I know of and it was on someone that was not as skilled or as physically dominant as Cass and Shiva.So whether she can use it in combat with someone who is actually a match for her remains to be seen. Shiva beating Elektra without too much trouble is nonsense.Unlike the heroes she slapped around...Elektra doesn't play by the rules.Her physical abilities also appear to be slightly superhuman.
Elektra would take either Cass or Shiva for the majority, with or without her powers. She is faster, stronger and more skilled. Even her default punches back as much power as Shiva's ultimate technique the leopards blow. She punches through people like tissue paper and can move too fast for a camera capture. She is a cut above.
" Elektra would take either Cass or Shiva for the majority, with or without her powers. She is faster, stronger and more skilled. Even her default punches back as much power as Shiva's ultimate technique the leopards blow. She punches through people like tissue paper and can move too fast for a camera capture. She is a cut above. "
I disagree with this.Elektra may be appear stronger than Cass and Shiva but she's definitely not faster or more skilled.Both characters have a better track record in combat than Elektra.They are also both masters of over 100 styles.Not knowledgeable but MASTERS.Elektra's training as a ninja wasn't even complete and after being resurrected by the Hand the Chaste rejected her altogether.Being to fast for a camera to capture doesn't make Elektra too fast for them because not only does Cassandra have the same feat she's moved fast enough that people that were in the same room with her didn't know where she went.
" @Vance Astro: So, do you believe that Cas or Shiva could beat Elektra after a tough battle? =] "
Yes..I believe they are both superior to her skill wise but beating her will be no walk in the park.Cass and Shiva's skills have been way overblown on Comicvine.
" Elektra would take either Cass or Shiva for the majority, with or without her powers. She is faster, stronger and more skilled. Even her default punches back as much power as Shiva's ultimate technique the leopards blow. She punches through people like tissue paper and can move too fast for a camera capture. She is a cut above. "
I disagree with this.Elektra may be appear stronger than Cass and Shiva but she's definitely not faster or more skilled.Both characters have a better track record in combat than Elektra.They are also both masters of over 100 styles.Not knowledgeable but MASTERS.Elektra's training as a ninja wasn't even complete and after being resurrected by the Hand the Chaste rejected her altogether.Being to fast for a camera to capture doesn't make Elektra too fast for them because not only does Cassandra have the same feat she's moved fast enough that people that were in the same room with her didn't know where she went. "
@Vance Astro said:
" @spidey 15 said:
" @Vance Astro: So, do you believe that Cas or Shiva could beat Elektra after a tough battle? =] "
Yes..I believe they are both superior to her skill wise but beating her will be no walk in the park.Cass and Shiva's skills have been way overblown on Comicvine. "
" Elektra would take either Cass or Shiva for the majority, with or without her powers. She is faster, stronger and more skilled. Even her default punches back as much power as Shiva's ultimate technique the leopards blow. She punches through people like tissue paper and can move too fast for a camera capture. She is a cut above. "
I disagree with this.Elektra may be appear stronger than Cass and Shiva but she's definitely not faster or more skilled.Both characters have a better track record in combat than Elektra.They are also both masters of over 100 styles.Not knowledgeable but MASTERS.Elektra's training as a ninja wasn't even complete and after being resurrected by the Hand the Chaste rejected her altogether.Being to fast for a camera to capture doesn't make Elektra too fast for them because not only does Cassandra have the same feat she's moved fast enough that people that were in the same room with her didn't know where she went. "
There are conflicting accounts of her training, when she started with the Chaste, when and why she left and a few other discrepancies. We know she studied under a different sensei every year after her 9th birthday until the Chaste started training her and she was close to completing her training with the Chaste when she was kicked out and joined the Hand for the first time. She recieved additional training from the Hand, and eventually rejoined Stick on the mountain to resume her training. She also had additional training from Drake. It's unclear how many styles she has mastered.
Do you have a scan or issue number of Cass moving too fast to be recorded on camera? I know she has avoid being record on 30 some odd servalence cameras before... but that isn't nearly the same as moving to fast for a camera to record your movements. The other example of moving to fast for people in the sam room to know where she went isn't a big deal, that is run of the mile street level ninja stuff. Elektra as moved too fast for Agent Garret a Shield Cyborg's eyes to fallow... underwater, and ran straight through a well guarded merc camp without anyone seeing her. She is faster than Cass or Shiva.
I also disagree with the notion that they have a better track record than Elektra. Other than Bullseye killing her before she was rez'ed and upgraded to badass she has scarcely been beaten.
Elektra has pretty much one shotted Taskmaster. Shiva got stomped by Prometheus. >:D
LOL comparing Taskmaster to Prometheus, Prom would stomp the hell out of Tasky and Elektra at the same time.
Also being a Cyborg doesn't necessarily increase your perception, Vic Stone is a Cyborg and humans have blitzed him before. When Nick Fury and his Howling Commandos put all of their skills and knowledge into Shield Cyborgs, Cable solo'd them all without powers :D Based off of feats both Cass and Shiva are faster then Elektra, definitely more skilled.
" LOL comparing Taskmaster to Prometheus, Prom would stomp the hell out of Tasky and Elektra at the same time. Also being a Cyborg doesn't necessarily increase your perception, Vic Stone is a Cyborg and humans have blitzed him before. When Nick Fury and his Howling Commandos put all of their skills and knowledge into Shield Cyborgs, Cable solo'd them all without powers :D Based off of feats both Cass and Shiva are faster then Elektra, definitely more skilled. "
Agreed as far as Taskmaster and Prometheus.When it comes to execution Prometheus has proven to have a far better track record of getting the job done.Also Elektra didn't one shot Taskmaster.She hit him twice already before hitting him with the kick that KO'd him.Also Taskmaster is one of the weakest street level villains physically and according to Daredevil and what she has shown Elektra hits hard as hell.I don't know if on feats Cass and Shiva are faster than Elektra.On par would be more accurate IMO.
I also disagree with the notion that they have a better track record than Elektra. Other than Bullseye killing her before she was rez'ed and upgraded to badass she has scarcely been beaten. Elektra has pretty much one shotted Taskmaster. Shiva got stomped by Prometheus. >:D "
Just because Elektra hasn't been beaten very much does mean that she is as skilled as Shiva or Cass as far as showings.Characters who are masters of several styles and have years and years of feats of their own call them superior.For Elektra to match Shiva in Cass in combat as far as feats she would have to beat Iron Fist or Mantis or someone who is highly skilled or be labeled more skilled then them and she's not.What Elektra showed against Taskmaster is nothing to brag about against them because unlike Shiva and Cass they actually mastered their fighting styles through training.Taskmaster is a copycat and it's as much of a flaw in his character as it is an asset as proven by his fight with Elektra.
I also disagree with the notion that they have a better track record than Elektra. Other than Bullseye killing her before she was rez'ed and upgraded to badass she has scarcely been beaten. Elektra has pretty much one shotted Taskmaster. Shiva got stomped by Prometheus. >:D "
Just because Elektra hasn't been beaten very much does mean that she is as skilled as Shiva or Cass as far as showings.Characters who are masters of several styles and have years and years of feats of their own call them superior.For Elektra to match Shiva in Cass in combat as far as feats she would have to beat Iron Fist or Mantis or someone who is highly skilled or be labeled more skilled then them and she's not.What Elektra showed against Taskmaster is nothing to brag about against them because unlike Shiva and Cass they actually mastered their fighting styles through training.Taskmaster is a copycat and it's as much of a flaw in his character as it is an asset as proven by his fight with Elektra. "
So in your mind Elektra needs to beat Iron Fist or Mantis to be on the same level as Shiva? Um... can I ask why? What has Shiva done that would place her on the same level as Mantis or Iron Fist? Other than killing Batgirl (who was holding back and wanted to die) the most skilled person Shiva has beaten in current DC contiunity is Connar Hawke... and that was by no means a landslide victory. Richard Dragon Kung-fu fighter is Pre-Crisis, and Chuck Dixon's Richard Dragon solo title isn't canon based on Fifty-two and all Dragon's subsequent appearances, so nothing that happened in either of those titles is relevant. So what has she done? Elektra has soundly beaten Daredevil (and Matt has stalemated Iron Fist three or four times himself which seems to be of importance to you), which is more than we can say about Shiva and Batman. Shiva's skill his largely heresay and theortical... but Shiva gets the benifit of the doubt and Elektra needs to beat Mantis? Why?
Other than one instance of Supergirl jobbing to her briefly in Wonder Woman, Elektra has better feats across the board than Shiva. She has better strength feats, better speed feats, better pressure point feats, better stealth feats and more impressive victories.
You could say the samething about Prometheus, he just borrowed his abilities through tech while Taskmaster has an inate ability.
So in your mind Elektra needs to beat Iron Fist or Mantis to be on the same level as Shiva? Um... can I ask why? What has Shiva done that would place her on the same level as Mantis or Iron Fist? Other than killing Batgirl (who was holding back and wanted to die) the most skilled person Shiva has beaten in current DC contiunity is Connar Hawke... and that was by no means a landslide victory. Richard Dragon Kung-fu fighter is Pre-Crisis, and Chuck Dixon's Richard Dragon solo title isn't canon based on Fifty-two and all Dragon's subsequent appearances, so nothing that happened in either of those titles is relevant. So what has she done? Elektra has soundly beaten Daredevil (and Matt has stalemated Iron Fist three or four times himself which seems to be of importance to you), which is more than we can say about Shiva and Batman. Shiva's skill his largely heresay and theortical... but Shiva gets the benifit of the doubt and Elektra needs to beat Mantis? Why? Other than one instance of Supergirl jobbing to her briefly in Wonder Woman, Elektra has better feats across the board than Shiva. She has better strength feats, better speed feats, better pressure point feats, better stealth feats and more impressive victories. You could say the samething about Prometheus, he just borrowed his abilities through tech while Taskmaster has an inate ability. "
For Elektra to beat Shiva she would at least have to be on part with Mantis or Iron Fist.I consider them the top tier in Marvel U.Elektra isn't even on par with characters like Captain America,Wolverine,and Black Panther.They all have much better showings in combat.You say the only skilled fighter Shiva beat was Connor Hawke as if Elektra is on his level.By his own admission Connor is MORE skilled than Batman and Elektra isn't even on par with Wayne.That alone proves she's not on Shiva's level.Elektra has never beaten Daredevil soundly as Daredevil has never gave Elektra his all in combat because he doesn't want to hurt her.Daredevil also has not stalemated Iron Fist 3 times.He stalemated him once.Their other fights were inconclusive.The most skilled fighter Elektra has beaten was Taskmaster and her win had nothing to do with skill.
So in your mind Elektra needs to beat Iron Fist or Mantis to be on the same level as Shiva? Um... can I ask why? What has Shiva done that would place her on the same level as Mantis or Iron Fist? Other than killing Batgirl (who was holding back and wanted to die) the most skilled person Shiva has beaten in current DC contiunity is Connar Hawke... and that was by no means a landslide victory. Richard Dragon Kung-fu fighter is Pre-Crisis, and Chuck Dixon's Richard Dragon solo title isn't canon based on Fifty-two and all Dragon's subsequent appearances, so nothing that happened in either of those titles is relevant. So what has she done? Elektra has soundly beaten Daredevil (and Matt has stalemated Iron Fist three or four times himself which seems to be of importance to you), which is more than we can say about Shiva and Batman. Shiva's skill his largely heresay and theortical... but Shiva gets the benifit of the doubt and Elektra needs to beat Mantis? Why? Other than one instance of Supergirl jobbing to her briefly in Wonder Woman, Elektra has better feats across the board than Shiva. She has better strength feats, better speed feats, better pressure point feats, better stealth feats and more impressive victories. You could say the samething about Prometheus, he just borrowed his abilities through tech while Taskmaster has an inate ability. "
For Elektra to beat Shiva she would at least have to be on part with Mantis or Iron Fist.I consider them the top tier in Marvel U.Elektra isn't even on par with characters like Captain America,Wolverine,and Black Panther.They all have much better showings in combat.You say the only skilled fighter Shiva beat was Connor Hawke as if Elektra is on his level.By his own admission Connor is MORE skilled than Batman and Elektra isn't even on par with Wayne.That alone proves she's not on Shiva's level.Elektra has never beaten Daredevil soundly as Daredevil has never gave Elektra his all in combat because he doesn't want to hurt her.Daredevil also has not stalemated Iron Fist 3 times.He stalemated him once.Their other fights were inconclusive.The most skilled fighter Elektra has beaten was Taskmaster and her win had nothing to do with skill. "
And what makes you think Elektra isn't on par with characters like Captain America (who FYI has falt out said he is more skilled than Iron Fist), Wolverine and Panther? She's beaten Wolverine before (of course there were some circumstances), she is the one who retrained him. Elektra is one, Wolverine has even strongly suggest that he thinks she is more skilled than he is. Daredevil has tried to hurt Elektra before, and she still easily took him down. She has also beaten Silver Samurai who is the greatest living swordsman in Marvel U. Old Masters and Superhumanly skilled fights like Temugin, Mandarin, Po, Ogun ect aside, Elektra is easily in the top three of Marvel U MA's easily on par with Wolverine and Captain America.
Batman never admitted that Conner was more skilled than he was, Nigthwing implied it and Bruce made a grunting noise. Daredevil is easily on par with Batman in fighting skill, and Elektra is better than DD.
If the fights stop with neither party victorious or holding any sort of advantage, then it ended in a stalemate. DD has stalemated Danny, virtually every time they have fought.
And what makes you think Elektra isn't on par with characters like Captain America (who FYI has falt out said he is more skilled than Iron Fist), Wolverine and Panther? She's beaten Wolverine before (of course there were some circumstances), she is the one who retrained him. Elektra is one, Wolverine has even strongly suggest that he thinks she is more skilled than he is. Daredevil has tried to hurt Elektra before, and she still easily took him down. She has also beaten Silver Samurai who is the greatest living swordsman in Marvel U. Old Masters and Superhumanly skilled fights like Temugin, Mandarin, Po, Ogun ect aside, Elektra is easily in the top three of Marvel U MA's easily on par with Wolverine and Captain America. Batman never admitted that Conner was more skilled than he was, Nigthwing implied it and Bruce made a grunting noise. Daredevil is easily on par with Batman in fighting skill, and Elektra is better than DD. If the fights stop with neither party victorious or holding any sort of advantage, then it ended in a stalemate. DD has stalemated Danny, virtually every time they have fought. "
Elektra has never beaten Wolverine. Captain America,Black Panther,and Wolverine all have more impressive showings than Elektra. Wolverine never said Elektra was more skilled than him.He said she was the best ninja in the world.That doesn't mean she's more skilled than him.He also said that someone as skilled as he would make it hard for him.If you are talking about the same fight I am though.Wolverine was brainwashed.Daredevil TECHNICALLY beat him in the same comic.I'm sure Shiva or Batgirl could have executed the same underhanded tactics. Captain America said he was better than Iron Fist years ago.Iron Fist has gotten better since then.Not that he knew what he was talking about to begin with.When Daredevil first fought Captain America, he suggested that HE was better than Cap.Doesn't make it true. Silver Samurai isn't very skilled.He has almost no skill feats.He's also not the greatest living Swordsman in the Marvel U.You made up that title. Elektra is top 3 in Marvel? And I thought people overrate Shiva.... Elektra isn't a better fighter than Daredevil.Aside from their fights with each other she's done nothing she hasn't.He's easily beaten the guy who killed her when not holding back.He's ALSO beaten Taskmaster, while fighting 3 other villains,He's beaten Wolverine and unlike her she didn't have to trick him into turning his head so he could stab him in the neck.Daredevil has also beaten Silver Samurai,Black Widow 3 times (who has stalemated Elektra). DD only stalemated Danny in contest of champions.Other than that no.The fight In Civil War Danny was taking it easy on Daredevil.Most of their other fights are old as hell which completely leaves out Iron Fists's recent upgrades in skill and power.
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