@Lance Uppercut: Doom had lost all of his intelligence thanks to the Leader and was capable of nothing more than the simplest of spells at best and didn't even know who his enemies were. Is Doom back to his normal levels nowadays? Or did you not read those issues?
" Dr. Doom. For anyone who hasn't been keeping track of Fall of the Hulks, he demonstrated the ability to absorb the energy of a Hulk robot that was being fueled by the power cosmic, as well as to shrug off hits from it. He also showed that he could drain the power of Skaar. Regardless, he demonstrated the durability to take hits at least close to the level of the normal Hulk. Add that to the tech he has in his armor, and his magical abilities and I see him taking this with very little trouble. "
Don't forget Dr. Voodoo 1-5, more specifically the issues with him fighting alongside Drumm against Nightmare. Demonstrated the ability to transform matter in to energy and absorb someone as powerful as a fear lord again his will. Reversed the penance stare, killed essentially every other magic using character in Marvel during the battle against Nightmares army, etc. "
See, this is the kind of thing you need to tell me about!
@Galactusischere said:
" Isn't current Doom kinda retarded? Or has that changed? "
... There is not face palm big enough to cover this.
@lordofthebrocean: That's not actually an argument, just so you know.
@Galactusischere: I know what you're talking about. It's called the brain drain. They did it to pym, Beast, pretty much all the smartest guys. It's a plot device to remove the eight smartest men in marvel, because they're the only threats to the plan. It was the only way they had to stop Doom.
" @Galactusischere: I know what you're talking about. It's called the brain drain. They did it to pym, Beast, pretty much all the smartest guys. It's a plot device to remove the eight smartest men in marvel, because they're the only threats to the plan. It was the only way they had to stop Doom. "
One thing I don´t understand is, if Doom can so easily defeat Apoc., then why does he lose to the Fantastic Four? Is it because of Reed and his intelligence or because the good guys always have to win? I don´t think that Apoc. would have as much trouble with the Fantastic Four. "
When Loki decieved the major villains of earth. Apocalypse was the only one that wasn't tricked by the god of mischief.
For as old and wise as Apocalypse is, he just isn't smarter than Doom, very few in any realm are. Apocalypse with all of his celestial augmentation and cybernetic enhancements would need to unleash it all to overwhelm Doom. Doom, in very little time, created a device that could absorb Onslaught's energy given off (no doubt for some big scheme later) until it was nailed by Hawkeye and he was dragged to his own demise by Iron Man. If this were face to face with no prep time, I would have to give this to Apocalypse, but with any prep time, Doom would destroy Apocalypse.
@Edamame: It's because the Fantastic Four are really smart and also have really good tech. I think they could beat Apocalypse, heck Galactus first showed up in a Fantastic Four comic.
" @Galactusischere: I know what you're talking about. It's called the brain drain. They did it to pym, Beast, pretty much all the smartest guys. It's a plot device to remove the eight smartest men in marvel, because they're the only threats to the plan. It was the only way they had to stop Doom. "
One thing I don´t understand is, if Doom can so easily defeat Apoc., then why does he lose to the Fantastic Four? Is it because of Reed and his intelligence or because the good guys always have to win? I don´t think that Apoc. would have as much trouble with the Fantastic Four. "
Hubris and ego. Look at all the amazing things Dooms dne. Then look at how he always screws himself because he specifically goes in to contest to one up Reed Richards. The man built a machine to drain the power of the most powerful character written in comics, outsmarted the Marquis of Death, built machines and captured cosmic cubes. But it's all ego and hubris. He's had numerous opportunities to kill Richards. But he hasn't. Just like Apoc has had plenty of opportunity to kill the X-Men. But he hasn't.
" Now, how strong is Dr. Doom's telepathic resistance? Why couldn't Apocalypse (at the end) transfer his psychic essence into Dr. Doom's body? How is Dr. Doom going to affect Apocalypse? "
I think he kept Emma Frost out of his mind pretty effortlessly during the Cabal meetings.
" Now, how strong is Dr. Doom's telepathic resistance? Why couldn't Apocalypse (at the end) transfer his psychic essence into Dr. Doom's body? How is Dr. Doom going to affect Apocalypse? "
I think he kept Emma Frost out of his mind pretty effortlessly during the Cabal meetings. "
That was the name of the story arc? Was this 616? How exactly is Doom going to hurt Magneto here? "
It was during the start of Dark Reign. The cabal one-shot. Yes, it's 616. Dooms already beaten Magneto by reversing his power. I think you mean Apocalypse. I'll post scans if you'd like, though I'm rather tired at the moment.
@Edamame: Technological, and through sheer force of will. He has circuitry in his helmet built to defend against psychic intrusion. But in Emperor Doom, he withstood Purple Mans powers while being not feet from him.
" @Edamame: Technological, and through sheer force of will. He has circuitry in his helmet built to defend against psychic intrusion. But in Emperor Doom, he withstood Purple Mans powers while being not feet from him. "
So sort of like Magneto or Storm then. Could he resist psychic essence transferal? "
Yes, though I'd guess to a much higher degree then Storm. I think Magneto's actually matched wills with him though. But yeah, that's why Apocalypse couldn't inhabit his body through any sort of psychic means.
" @Edamame: Technological, and through sheer force of will. He has circuitry in his helmet built to defend against psychic intrusion. But in Emperor Doom, he withstood Purple Mans powers while being not feet from him. "
So sort of like Magneto or Storm then. Could he resist psychic essence transferal? "
Yes, though I'd guess to a much higher degree then Storm. I think Magneto's actually matched wills with him though. But yeah, that's why Apocalypse couldn't inhabit his body through any sort of psychic means. "
Well, Storm simultaneously resisted the combined telepathic efforts of Xavier, Oracle and Psylocke. I haven't seen Magneto resisting that much. Anyway, it is important to remember that telepathic resistance does not = telepathic immunity. So I think that Apocalypse could eventually break through Doom's telepathic defenses and use him as a host body. Unless there is something else that I don't know. "
Yes. The same Xavier that mentally dueled with Dark Phoenix on numerous different planes, and has read the mind of nearly everyone on earth at once... but couldn't push thoughts in to the mind of Storm (a member of the X-men, and IIRC, he supposedly put mental blocks in all of them. Apparently not working well.)
No no. His will power makes him resistant. The circuitry in his armor makes him immune. Completely. Forever. And based on his willpower feats, no chance.
@Edamame: For one, he's negated mutant abilities numerous times. He's even fooled the mind of Rachel Grey by analyzing her brains wavelengths and inserting her in to a hologram. This, while she had the Phoenix force. Mystically, he could subdue Apocalypse with the endless, send him to whatever time line he wished, and who knows, possibly utilize tech to find a way to turn Apocalypse's celestial devices against him. He's smart enough to work with watcher tech, has used Beyonder's tech to great effect... he has many options.
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