#51 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Doom wins...we have already explained why."
The explanation wasn't good enough....and people are making up stuff.
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#52 Posted by Hellraiser of Despair (71 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"Lunacyde said:
"Doom wins...we have already explained why."
The explanation wasn't good enough....and people are making up stuff."

Doom isnt in the same league as Apoc, they are both smart, but Apoc is a millenia old and far more intelligent then Doom, and a lot stronger in every aspect. Doom is a great villain but there are a lot of characters that he cant beat,  Death Metal killed 9939's Doom, for example, and I doubt Doom could beat Onslaught or Charnel, and Apoc takes this fight too, sorry just the way it is.
#53 Posted by HalJordan1986x (4760 posts) - - Show Bio

Normally I would give it to Doom if he gets prep time
But Apocalypse also has a genius level intellect

I gotta give it to En Sabah Nur

#54 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio
HalJordan1986x said:
"Normally I would give it to Doom if he gets prep time
But Apocalypse also has a genius level intellect

I gotta give it to En Sabah Nur"

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#55 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Apocalyspe has never accomplished anything that has been on Doom's level of accomplishment....Im willing to be swayed though....prove me wrong.

#56 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Apocalyspe has never accomplished anything that has been on Doom's level of accomplishment....Im willing to be swayed though....prove me wrong."
Most of Doom's accomplishments came with prep....
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#57 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

you know there re two parts to this fight...one with prep and one without....

#58 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"

you know there re two parts to this fight...one with prep and one without....

"
Without prep..Doom loses.
With...He wins.
Moderator
#59 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"Lunacyde said:
"

you know there re two parts to this fight...one with prep and one without....

"
Without prep..Doom loses.
With...He wins.
"
I can buy that....
#60 Posted by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio

I want to know who Apocalypse has beat without prep. Doom blitzed Molecule Man and killed him. He also took out Magus and Warlock in the same ship at the same time. So with Apocalypse usual equipment, who has he beat?

Doom could always just get a cheap win since he can go back in time and kill Apocalypse. And yes, time travel is a standard equipment in his armor.

#61 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Doom has prep time, nuff said.

#62 Posted by Shadow_KingOf Killers (524 posts) - - Show Bio
with preptime doom defeats apocalypse  without preptime apocalypse wins.
#63 Posted by Green Patron (498 posts) - - Show Bio

Doom

#64 Posted by ulitmateninjagaidenx (2064 posts) - - Show Bio

apocalypse would win.

#65 Posted by kaino12 (3151 posts) - - Show Bio

lookmwith 1 day prep dr doom stands a chance if not apocalipse murders him well upon reflection there both really smart. i think apocalips can win simply cus he's better at killing dr doom is really smart and i thought with a days prep he coud launch an attack but apoc gets the day also so he can prepare for the attack then its just doom vs one of the most powerful nutants ever!!

#66 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Doom has defeated far more powerful foes...

#67 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio
#68 Posted by kaino12 (3151 posts) - - Show Bio

sry dude...

#69 Edited by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
#70 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Exactly my point

#71 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio

Apoc.

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#72 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Apoc wins both matches? NAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

#73 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Apocalypse is the biggest underachiever in comics...as ive already pointed out

#74 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio

He's beaten Loki, gone toe to toe with the High Evolutionary, and blocked blasts from Galactus. He's a villain so of course he under achieves. Doom is impressive but  he doesn't compare to Apoc.

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#75 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio
#76 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio

What exactly could Doom do to Apoc? If the High Evolutionary can't beat Apoc how would Doom? The blogs cool but its nothing that cant be seen on the KMC forum. And it doesn't trump anything Apoc has done.

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#77 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

I am sorry Gambler but I must disagree here...and you cannot use the villain logic against Doom here they are both villains.

#78 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"I am sorry Gambler but I must disagree here...and you cannot use the villain logic against Doom here they are both villains."
Doom loses to heroes also. He's got so much power yet cant beat the FF4? Villain logic applies to ALL villains. That's why they aint runnin sh!t lol. And you dont need to apologize for disagreeing. Just show me why Apoc loses. I might even change my mind.

Moderator
#79 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio
Gambler said:
"What exactly could Doom do to Apoc? If the High Evolutionary can't beat Apoc how would Doom? The blogs cool but its nothing that cant be seen on the KMC forum. And it doesn't trump anything Apoc has done."


Captain Britain hits harder than Apocalypse and Doom didnt even feel it, now , tell me how Apocalypse will even try and beat that?
#80 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Well as we have stated already Gambler against common opponents Doom has a much better record. Also Doom has taken on and defeated more impressive opponents than Apocalypse.

Gambler said:

"Lunacyde said:
"I am sorry Gambler but I must disagree here...and you cannot use the villain logic against Doom here they are both villains."
Doom loses to heroes also. He's got so much power yet cant beat the FF4? Villain logic applies to ALL villains. That's why they aint runnin sh!t lol. And you dont need to apologize for disagreeing. Just show me why Apoc loses. I might even change my mind.

"

I know that was my point...they both are subject to the same rules of being villains, however Doom has had much more success than Apocalypse. He has taken over the world 3 different times, controlled his own planet, and maintained his own country just to name a few feats. He has done this all within a normal human lifespan and is still going strong. Apocalypse on the other hand has not had nearly the amount of sucess, even though he had millenia to accomplish it.
#81 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio

Who said Captain Britain hits harder then Apoc? What proof do you have to this claim? Apoc was strong enough to restrain the Hulk, and hold She-Hulk in a choke hold with one hand.

Takes a shot from Ikaris, an Eternal, and appears to have suffered no effects.
















































Laughs at the Phoenix. Phoenix > Captain Britain











Moderator
#82 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Well as we have stated already Gambler against common opponents Doom has a much better record. Also Doom has taken on and defeated more impressive opponents than Apocalypse.

Gambler said:
"Lunacyde said:
"I am sorry Gambler but I must disagree here...and you cannot use the villain logic against Doom here they are both villains."
Doom loses to heroes also. He's got so much power yet cant beat the FF4? Villain logic applies to ALL villains. That's why they aint runnin sh!t lol. And you dont need to apologize for disagreeing. Just show me why Apoc loses. I might even change my mind.

"

I know that was my point...they both are subject to the same rules of being villains, however Doom has had much more success than Apocalypse. He has taken over the world 3 different times, controlled his own planet, and maintained his own country just to name a few feats. He has done this all within a normal human lifespan and is still going strong. Apocalypse on the other hand has not had nearly the amount of sucess, even though he had millenia to accomplish it."
He has? I've never heard that. For you to prove that you'd have to compile both their fight histories.

Apoc is always a villain. Doom is a bit more complicated. He cares for Latavia and its people. He's not you're conventional villain. As for ruling the World, pretty sure Apoc's been there and done that. But it doesnt prove who would beat who. Iron Man's ruled the World before doesn't mean he beats Doom or Apoc because of it.
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#83 Edited by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
Gambler said:
"What exactly could Doom do to Apoc? If the High Evolutionary can't beat Apoc how would Doom? The blogs cool but its nothing that cant be seen on the KMC forum. And it doesn't trump anything Apoc has done."
  1. High Evolutionary wasn't even trying to fight Apocalypse. He just wanted him to go away. How do you think that "fight" would go if High Evolutionary is bloodlusted?
  2. Doom's blasts quickly took out Magus, Warlock, and Molecule Man. Thats better than anything Apocalypse has ever done.
  3. It doesn't trump anything Apoc has done? What has Apoc done in 616 Earth? Practically nothing. Doom has done what Apocalypse has wanted to do 3 times, effortlessly.
#84 Posted by kaino12 (3151 posts) - - Show Bio

apoclips wins because:
1 more expireance he has had 100 lifetims to pefect his mutant abilities and fighting abilitys
2 he has one of the best mutant abilities and is the best at useing it. (aka doom wouldent shoot his mom and apoc can shapeshift.)

#85 Posted by The_MVPs (84693 posts) - - Show Bio
Kimikirai said:
"Gambler said:
"What exactly could Doom do to Apoc? If the High Evolutionary can't beat Apoc how would Doom? The blogs cool but its nothing that cant be seen on the KMC forum. And it doesn't trump anything Apoc has done."
  1. High Evolutionary wasn't even trying to fight Apocalypse. He just wanted him to go away. How do you think that "fight" would go if High Evolutionary is bloodlusted?
  2. Doom's blasts quickly took out Magus, Warlock, and Molecule Man. Thats better than anything Apocalypse has ever done.
  3. It doesn't trump anything Apoc has done? What has Apoc done in 616 Earth? Practically nothing. Doom has done what Apocalypse has wanted to do 3 times, effortlessly.
"
1. Wasn't trying to fight him? He blasted him at point blank range and Apoc took it

2. All three of those characters don't compare to the Phoenix if you put em together.

3. Everything I've posted (scans included). Have been from the 616. Again, how does that prove he would defeat Apoc in a fight? Doom and Apoc's plans are two completely different things. When Apoc owned Loki, the God of mischief had already gathered some of the most well known villains. (magneto, doom, skull, kingpin, etc etc).  Loki took em out pretty easily. Then got his ass handed to him by Apoc. I'm sure Doom has great feats. But no one is telling me how he beats Apoc. Doom ruled the World, yaaaay, its called plot.
Moderator
#86 Posted by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
kaino12 said:
"

apoclips wins because:
1 more expireance he has had 100 lifetims to pefect his mutant abilities and fighting abilitys
2 he has one of the best mutant abilities and is the best at useing it. (aka doom wouldent shoot his mom and apoc can shapeshift.)

"
  1. All that proves is how superior Doom is to Apocalypse. Apoc had a millennium to achieve his goals and failed. Doom did what Apoc wanted to do 3 times within a normal human life span.
  2. Doom wouldn't be fooled by a childish trick like that. Dr. Doom is the 2nd smartest man on Earth (I think 1st) and the second most powerful sorcerer.
#87 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Apoc used his body weight and leverage to his advantage in the fight with hulk, the fight with Ikaris doesn't prove anything, Ikaris is a ton ?? class and Britain a 90 tonner

the fight with phoenix, how exactly did the fight end? ;)

Plus here some things Doom could do to apoc



(Magic ftw)


He could conjur mindless ones whoc ould aid him in the fight against apoc



Or hypnotize him



Blast him




Plus, there is NOTHING apocalypse can do to get ANYWHERE near this



End of Story

#88 Posted by Erik (32787 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Apocalypse is the biggest underachiever in comics...as ive already pointed out"
Lol. So true. Doom with prep time could take just about anybody. A lot of people on this thread underestimate the power of Doom. In a random encounter Doom may not be able to beat Apocalypse for certain, but I am confident that his mix of tech and magic could prevent him from getting killed or even losing. I think at worst Apocalypse stalemates Doom in a random encounter.
Online
#89 Posted by kaino12 (3151 posts) - - Show Bio
Kimikirai said:
"kaino12 said:
"

apoclips wins because:
1 more expireance he has had 100 lifetims to pefect his mutant abilities and fighting abilitys
2 he has one of the best mutant abilities and is the best at useing it. (aka doom wouldent shoot his mom and apoc can shapeshift.)

"
  1. All that proves is how superior Doom is to Apocalypse. Apoc had a millennium to achieve his goals and failed. Doom did what Apoc wanted to do 3 times within a normal human life span.
  2. Doom wouldn't be fooled by a childish trick like that. Dr. Doom is the 2nd smartest man on Earth (I think 1st) and the second most powerful sorcerer.
"
1 dr doom has had any but a normal life span he's been killed like three times (not includeing doombots). and apocalypse has an infinate lifespan and knows it dr doom knows his mortality u cant compare them. apoc can wait as long as he wants he'll never age. he doesnt move with the reckless hast that others do cus he can afford to and 616 he succeded and i read what u said and he dident do much cus he dident want to.
2 i admit doom is really smart thats the reason i say he wins in alot of other threads but everything doom knows apoc knows. if not he has a way of finding out the only reason he isent as smart as doom is cus he thinks he's smart enough and we all know doom has the same vainity weakness apoc has.
#90 Posted by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
kaino12 said:
dr doom has had any but a normal life span he's been killed like three times (not includeing doombots). and apocalypse has an infinate lifespan and knows it dr doom knows his mortality u cant compare them. apoc can wait as long as he wants he'll never age. he doesnt move with the reckless hast that others do cus he can afford to and 616 he succeded and i read what u said and he dident do much cus he dident want to.
Doom was never killed in 616. He has been presumed dead before, but it was never the case. The rest of what you say is BS. Apocalypse didn't do much because he didn't want to? Um.. why do you think the X-men have thwarted him so many times? Because he was trying (keyword) to conquer Earth. And when did Apocalypse conquer 616 Earth? He never did. He ruled in AoA. An alternate version of AoA. AndEarth Askani. Never 616.

i admit doom is really smart thats the reason i say he wins in alot of other threads but everything doom knows apoc knows. if not he has a way of finding out the only reason he isent as smart as doom is cus he thinks he's smart enough and we all know doom has the same vainity weakness apoc has.
BS. Dr. Doom has much better knowledge in technology and sorcery than Apocalypse. Apocalypse can't even time travel, a regular function in Doom's armor. Oh, and in case you didn't know, Kang the Conqueror (a villain Dr. Doom defeated along with Magus and Warlock at the same time) could have killed Apoc in the past if he wanted to. Think of what Doom can do.

#91 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Molecule Man doesnt compare to Phoenix?

#92 Edited by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Molecule Man doesnt compare to Phoenix?
"
Do not forget Magus with the Infinite Gauntlet.


#93 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Grrr... i was gonna post that but one of my fav's got owned...

#94 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Here is one way that concretely explains how Doom can beat Apocalypse. He goes back in time to when Apocalypse was abandoned as a baby and slays the child. There done.

#95 Posted by King Saturn (224189 posts) - - Show Bio
Kimikirai said:
"Lunacyde said:
"Molecule Man doesnt compare to Phoenix?
"
Do not forget Magus with the Infinite Gauntlet.


"
Oooh Cool
#96 Edited by Kimikirai (954 posts) - - Show Bio
King Saturn said:
"Kimikirai said:
"Lunacyde said:
"Molecule Man doesnt compare to Phoenix?
"
Do not forget Magus with the Infinite Gauntlet.
Oooh Cool"
Dr. Doom also beat Kang the Conqueror seconds before this event.
#97 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

yup

#98 Posted by King Saturn (224189 posts) - - Show Bio
Kimikirai said:
"King Saturn said:
"Kimikirai said:
"Lunacyde said:
"Molecule Man doesnt compare to Phoenix?
"
Do not forget Magus with the Infinite Gauntlet.
Oooh Cool"
Dr. Doom also beat Kang the Conqueror seconds before this event."
Oh Wow... Doom was on a hell of a rampage then...
#99 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

Precisely why i dont see Apocalypse winning no matter what

#100 Posted by Lunacyde (19084 posts) - - Show Bio

Me either....but that fight with the Phoenix intrigues me...