Dovahkiin runs the Gauntlet of Mordor

We have barred the gates but cannot hold them for long. The orcs have taken the lower levels. Our stores of food are running low. We cannot get out. We cannot get out. We hear drums, drums in the deep.

Dum….DUM….DUM…

They are coming.

Dum…..DUM….DUM…

We cannot get out. They have taken the bridge and second hall. We cannot get out.

Dum….DUM….skyrim….

We have barred the gates but cannot hold them for long. The ground shakes, drums…..drums in the deep

Dum…DUM…SKYRIM….

Hoo….HOOOAAHH….SKYRIM!!!

This…..wasnt what we were expecting.

Level 80 Dovahkiin.

Can pick 5 skills to be maxed out for each round (all other skills are capped at level 25 with no perks spent). These 5 skills can be changed for the start of each round.

Starts off with one shout (of your choice) but gains one extra shout after each completed round. (meaning 5 shouts by round 5). Can only use each shout once per fight.

Has access to all special daedric artifacts (weapons and armour) smithed to maximum capacity, plus daedric boots, and daedric gauntlets with enchantments of your choosing (two enchantments if you chose enchanting as one of the skills for that round). Also carries a daedric bow with 250 arrows as standard.

Can pick one of these three to be your follower throughout the gauntlet:

Ulfric Stormcloak

General Tulius + 10 armed bodyguards

Arngeir

(if your follower dies, he will come back fresh as a daisy for the following round should you make it through. Autosave FTW)

Round 1

Moria: Defend the bridge of Khazud dum.

Dovahkiin and his follower start on the right hand side of the bridge, and must stop the following army from crossing:

300 Goblins, 50 Goblin archers, 10 Cave trolls.

Round 2

Helms Deep: Stop the siege.

Dovahkiin is inside Helms deep. The walls have just been breached. Stop the following army from destroying this ancient stronghold:

1000 Uruk Hai, 25 'battle' trolls

Round 3

Isengard: Defeat Saruman.

Dovahkiin must fight through 500 Uruk Hai in an open battlefield, then enter Orthanc Tower (the door has been left open) and fight Saruman and Wormtongue on the roof (where Saruman held Gandalf).

Round 4

Minas Tirith: Defeat the 9.

Dovahkiin starts at the top of the city, on the bit that looks like the front end of a ship. The witch King of Angmar and the other 8 nazgul are circling the city and must be destroyed. The lower level gates have been breached. Outside the city are 1000 Uruk hai, 25 battle trolls and 4 Oliphaunts with full crew. They have just started entering the city, and are hell bent on taking out the Dragonborn.

Final Round

Defeat Sauron, or take the ring and destroy it in the fires of mt doom (ultimately destroying Sauron).

Sauron stands at the entrance to Mt Doom. Dovahkiin must either beat him in combat, or chop off his ring finger, escape, enter mount doom, destroy the 5 Balrog guardian sentries and cast the ring into the fire. (if you defeat Sauron, the balrogs die too).

Can Dovahkiin bring peace to Middle Earth? Or was this just a massive waste of time? :D

No I say he/she gets beat on round 4 because each Nazgul has a dragon of thier own. An you can only summon one Dragon an only for a time with a shoat. An slowing time will not work long enough for.him to take down each Nazgul even.with the other.2 shouts an magic.

@magnificentstorm: Dont forget about all shouts from the dlcs. And its not like we cant take a dragon out from the ground....and the nazgul cannot breathe fire, so what would they have to do to take out dovahkiin...?

@optimuspalm: Oh what do the dlc ones do?

An.its not like the Dovahkin.cant be killed by physical means. Those dragons could easily rip him apart.

Though maybe if the Dovahkin were to have one of your maxed out spells to be a light spell/ illuminate then he.could keep the nazguls at bay an fire spells an the other two shouts from a distance

@magnificentstorm: I havent explored the dlcs a lot (so cant remember the names of the shouts) but one makes a dragon land, and let you ride it. If you use this alongside dragonrend, call dragon(cant remember the dragons name) and call allie, I think its possible to defeat the nine...... as long as you can get a dragon to defeat the witch king (who cant be slayed by a man).

Its up to you to pick the shouts. They can different for each round. You start with 1, but by round 4 will have the choice of taking any four shouts into the fight.

IMHO i think a skyrim dragon would beat one of the Nazgul, and i can take out an ancient dragon in 5-6 swings of my daedric warhammer (if i use dragonrend to make him land). yes they can cause me damage, just like the nazgul would, but if you fight wise and use your speed its not too difficult. And i'm only level 55.

Follower - Arngeir

Round 1 - Max out Smithing, Enchanting and Alchemy to make fortify destruction magic gear. Destruction magic costs 0% to cast. Hold down Master Level thunder spell permanently. Max out heavy armor for good measure and pop potions when appropriate. Shout - Unrelenting force ;) Arngeir shouts stragglers to pieces and helps with trolls.

Round 2 - Max out Block, Smithing, Heavy Armor, Enchanting, One Handed. Use shout slow time. Shield bash through every single Urak Hai until I'm out in the open and right in the middle of them. Use lightning storm shout. While the Urak Hai die by the hundreds during the next few minutes fight my way back to the doors using the.. hmm. Whatever the best one handed Daedric Artifact is, and whatever the best Daedric shield is. Arngeir will also send the Urak Hai flying around the battlefield with his Unrelenting force shout. Once I'm back at the door I'll wait for any stragglers and use my unrelenting force shout to deal with them if they begin to overwhelm (which they shouldn't).

Round 3 - Maxing out Alteration, Restoration, Heavy Armor, Block, Destruction. To deal with the Urak Hai I'll cast a combination of turn undead spells to send them away in fear, and mass paralysis spells to paralyse them and force them to trip on each other. I'll use fireballs, chain lightning and blizzards to deal with the Urak Hai in large numbers. As for Saruman.. when I meet him in combat I'll have all the magic resistance/absorbtion spells from the Alteration tree and ward spells from the restoration tree, making me already a very formidible foe for Saruman. Then, when the opportunity presents itself, I'll bombard Saruman with a combination of my unrelenting force shout and a shield charge from spell breaker. I'll knock him off the tower at his weakest and spellbreaker casts a ward which will help defend against any magical attacks. The shout I'm choosing from this round is bend will.

Round 4 - Maxing out Destrcution, Enchanting, Heavy Armor, Block, One Handed. Okay, this is a tough one. Arngeir is going to hold off any attackers that get close enough to me. When the Nazgul approach I'll begin using my bend will shout on their dragons. Their dragons will land and be under my control. I'll then begin commanding the Nazgul's dragons to attack each other, forcing them to lower their own ranks. The Nazgul will fall from the sky or be forced to land and engage me on ground. From there, they will be pelted with fire destruction magic, which they are weak to. This will be reinforced by my enchanted armor. If they get close enough I'll cast a fire cloak to ward them off and begin attacking with Dawnbreaker, which is enchanted by fire magic, with Ysgramors shield in the other hand. After I've taken down the Nazgul. at least 4 or 5 of their dragons will still be left roughly. I'll command them to attack the Oliphantous and to attack the battle trolls. When I engage the army, I'll use my lightning storm shout to cut down their ranks. Aside from that I'll then bottle neck the army and attack them with my master level thunder magic. When I run out of magic, which will take a while since I've fortified my destruction magic, I'll wade through the enemies hand-to-hand using Dawnbreaker and Mehrunes Razor. Because of the perks in the One Handed tree, my dual wielding speed will be unmatched and I should tear through enemies with ease, seeing only minor difficulty with battle trolls. Arngeir will be backing me up the whole way. Now, the only part that remains is when the Nazguls dragons are no longer under my command. They may want to take revenge on me, but let's not forget, they are now without a pilot, and up against the greatest dragonslayer in history. The Dovahkiins now replenished magic reserves will allow him to put ranged attacks on the dragons, and if they get close it's just a matter of time before the Dovahkiins cuts them down. The shout I'll take from this round is

Round 5 - Hmm.. how does one defeat Sauron in single combat? I'll again edit this post later when I'm done.

@i_like_swords: I'm liking it so far mate :) (although in round one you'd probably want to choose destruction as one of your skills, so you don't waste the enchantments too quickly).

And as far as i know, the shield of ysgramar is the best special shield, then you've got a few one handed weapons to choose from - mehrunes razor (1.25% chance of instant kill) is the one i use most of the time.

I'm not gonna use Call Dragon just for fun, but this shout could win rounds 2-4 and probably 5 as well.

Round one: Restoration, Alteration, Destruction, Heavy Armor, Two Handed. Shout-Unrelenting Force. Follower-Arngeir.

I'd use the best armor I can find and this huge Orcish Daedric hammer of Malacath (forgot its name), and maybe my bow and arrows in the beginning to take out as many enemies as I can from a distance. The Paralysis and Mass Paralisis alteration spells would help. A lot. Also the adept-level destruction spells, which are AoE, like Ice Storm and Fireball would be of great help. When they get in too close, I'd pull out my hammer (lolz) and bash them out. I'd use my restoration spells for healing, and he equibirium alteration spell would come in very handy to restore my magicka. When getting tight, me and my fellow Greybeard would shout the enemies down to their horrible, horrible deaths. On top of all, WABBAJACK, B!TCHEZZZZZ!!!!!!!! Oh, and Sanguine Rose too.

Round two: Archery, Destruction, Alteration, Restoration, Conjuration. New shout-Call Storm.

I'd rely mostly on ranged attacks. A maxed Archery skill with a Daedric Bow+250 arrows would be devastating in such a fight. Once again, the AoE Destruction spells would be used to great effect, so would be the Paralysis spells, the healing spells and equibirium. Call Storm would cause heavy damage among the ranks of Uruk-Hai and trolls, and, well, Unrelenting Force is always fun. I'd use high-level Conjuration spells to resurrect dead enemies to help me and Arngeir, and maybe get some Dremora Lords/Storm Elementals. And again, Wabbajack. I could also use Soul Trap on my Black Star, and refill my Wabbajack.

Round three: Heavy Armor, Restoration, Two Handed, Sneak, Illusion. New shout-Marked for Death.

I'd shout the MFD as soon as I can, trying to affect as many enemies as I can. This shout is rediculously powerful, and can make those sorts of fight much easier. As much as I'd love Mass Paralysis in here, it'd be kinda useless due to its long casting time. I'd use mostly melee, the big-ass Orcish hammer would star here too. Heavy armor too, of course. The restoration spells would be used to great effect, as well as my Wabbajack/Sanguine Rose, and of course I can use Call Storm to huge effect. When I'm finally done with those annoying Uruk-Hai, with the dedicated help of my partner, I'd sneak up the tower (the Ebony Mail has a muffling effect, and I'd use my Illusion skill to cast Invisibility), and Fus-Ro-Dah the hell out of Saruman and Wormtongue (falling off towers has proven to be most effective against Saruman, obviously the more dangerous of the two). If that doesn't work for some reason, I'd deal with them the old fashioned way. My wards would be of great help when fighting Saruman.

Round Four: Archery, Restoration, Alchemy, Destruction, Alteration. New shout-Animal Alliance.

The Animal Alliance is a no-brainer. The poor sods won't know what hit them when four bloodthirsty Oliphaunts start rampaging in their ranks. Although I thought of maybe taking Dragonrend, but I didn't know if it'd work on the Nazgul, so better (somewhat) safe than sorry. Anywho, why Alchemy, do you ask? I'll tell you why Alchemy: POISONS, MADAFAKA, POISONS!!! Level 100 Alchemy is one helluva thing and can be used to make extremely useful poisons and potions, like slow poisons and frenzy poisons, and of course healing potions. With my bow and arrow, those poisons definently would come in handy. My most powerful weapon, however, would be fireballs. I'd rain death on my enemies from above and boy would that be fun... the biggest problem would be the Nazgul and their riders. I guess I'm going to have to rely on brute force for them, and I'm confident my archery and spells would provide me with all the force I need. About the Witch King, well... I guess I'm gonna have to be a woman for this fight. Of course, as always, my loyal partner would also cause some heavy damage to he enemy with his shouts. Call Storm would definently come in handy here, as well as equibirium and healing spells. Alteration would come in handy especially against the Nazgul. And of course, Fus Ro friggen Dah. Oh, and never forget the Wabbajack!

Round Five: One Handed, Block, Heavy Armor, Illusion, Sneak. New shout: Become Ethereal.

That is an interesting one. The first think I'm gonna do would be Call Storm. Then, I'm gonna sneak up on Sauron using my Sneak skill, the Invisibility spell and the muffle effect I have with my Ebony Mail, and cut off his ring finger, while he's busy trying to take on Arngeir. I'm gonna use Mehrune's Razor for this task, as there is always the small chance of insta-killing him with it. If that doesn't work, and my cover is blown, I'd use the Unrelenting Force shout to knock him off his feet, then, when he's all grounded, I'd cut off his finger and run to Mt. Doom. When I get to the Balrogs, I'd use Become Ethereal so they can't hurt me. I'd simply dash to the edge of the cliff and throw the ring in the fire. Game over, I win. Or I could just fight him, big deal...

Great thread BTW :)

@the_red_viper: Haha! Awesome!

Dont forget the wabbajack doesn't always do what you want it too, but I'm glad you mentioned it!

For round 4 i'm saying that dragonrend WILL work on the nazgul. And great thinking about being a woman to defeat the Witch King, i hadnt thought of that lol

Also great strategy for round 5 to get passed the balrogs, but i'm unconvinced you could deal with Sauron that quickly. I cant see anybody sneaking up on him. I also dont think he'd be moved by unrelenting force....but....i guess it could work...

@optimuspalm: Oh yeah in round 1 destruction is my 5th maxed out skill, forgot to key that in. Nice thread btw! It inspired me to make a Dragonborn related one if you wish to check it out.

I have complete faith in the Wabbajack ever since I beat the Mage's College questline by turning the Dragonpriest-boss into a sweetroll.

About round 4, Dragonrend or not, they have no ranged attacks that I'm aware of and I'm pretty damn good with a bow, so I think I can pass the Dragonrend on this one.

About Sauron, well, He's goona have Arngeir and his shouts to deal with, and a storm raging around him, while I sneak around him with a muffle effect, invisibility AND level 100 Sneak. Mehrune's Razor can cut just about anything I believe, including this mofo's finger. Then all I have to do is run like there's no tomorrow, use the Become Ethereal, toss the ring down the volcano and do my happy-dance :D Even if he goes after me, and even if he's already killed Arngeir, I can always use Unrelenting Force. Even if it doesn't send him flying (and I see no reason why it wouldn't, it works great on giants and grizzly bears), the least it would do is stagger him, which would leave me free to run away and win dat sh!t. :D I can always fight him, me+Arngeir+Call Storm+Marked for Death=we probably win :D

That's absolutely brilliant.

@the_red_viper:

Fair enough for round 4. But arrows against 9 dragons with riders swooping down from all sides? Also, i'm not sure you could hit the oliphaunts with the animal alliance shout from that far away.

And Saurons finger will be moving. But your mage = sweetroll move is enough of a feat for me to believe you can win this!

lol agreed, and i just posted on your thread.

Lol yup, indeed it was.

@the_red_viper:

Your Round 5 is kinda flawed. !) I don't think anyone is sneaking up on Sauron (LOTR is a lot deeper than people know I don't really know how deep but it gets deep because the books go further into his powers an what he was though I never read them LoL)

An just because the Balrogs cant hurt you they more than definitely can grap an catch you until the shouts power no longer takes affect. They have great control with a whip just as Gandalf lol

Round 1: Ice Form (Shout). Anything that comes on the bridge will be a frozen statue and will slide and fall off. Max Alteration, throw on Dragonhide, Gob-Archers won't even be able to hurt me, and I can max Archery and snipe them with ease.

Round 2: If it's just me and my companion there, and I don't gotta worry about civs, I just use Storm Call (Shout). I can just stand there and watch as the entire army gets blasted apart by lightning from the sky. Anything that gets too close I can still freeze and snipe at will.

Round 3: Can just use Storm Call again, watch them all fall to the lightning, maybe finally take max Destruction and maybe use Lightning Storm to Kamehameha the stragglers.

By the time I get to the top of the tower, Saruman will already have jumped over the side and killed himself. If he hasn't, I can use Staff of Magnus to rip his power from him and just punt his elderly arse over the edge. And if I wanted to pick my 3rd shout now, it'd be Soul Tear.

Round 4: Storm Call once again picks apart the army. Archery I can pick apart the dragons and riders at my leisure. They have to get in close to attack. I can slow time while targeting to pick my shots. And for my 4th Shout, well, gotta go with the classic Unrelenting Force. Anything that actually gets up the stairs to come after me, gets blown off the entire edifice to their doom.

Round 5: At this point, after seeing all I just did, Sauron dives head first into the lava to save himself the embarrassment.

Middle-Earth gets a new conqueror.

@magnificentstorm: Sauron would be distracted by Arngeir AND the storm, and I'm with maxed Sneak, invisibility and muffle. Even if I can't sneak up on him, I believe I can overpower him with Marked for Death, powerful melee, Storm Call and Arngeir (who has unlimited, extremely powerful shouts). As for the Balrogs, even if I can't get past them, I can pull off the same invisibility-muffle-xneaking trick here. But if I kill Sauron, it wouldn't even be necessary.

@reikai: You can use each sout only once per round. And no, you can't get away with round 5 :D

Level 80 Dovahkiin rapes.

@the_red_viper: Well Storm Call lasts for several minutes. Wall of Frost spell takes the place of Ice Form, cept slows an hurts instead of freezes. Either way, they ain't gettin across bridges. Pretty silly to limit the souts when the Spells end up being more destructive.

But really you only need 3 things to win here; Smithing, Enchanting and Archery. Can one-shot kill most of the enemies on the table with just that. Anything else is just gravy.. Sauron might take 3 or 4 arrows, but that's about it. Could do the same to Alduin and Miraak. I can clock the dmg on an Ebony Bow at over 300 from smithing perks and enchanting stuff to increase the smithing skill.

One could just as easily take Block and One-handed, and just use Auriel's Shield and Mehrune's Razor. By lore standard, a shield that makes you nigh-invincible, and a dagger that insta-kills the victim. There are so many combinations of ultimate doom to inflict upon Middle-Earth...I'd have so much fun steamrolling over them all.

Hell with Max Destructions, just use chain lightning, end up with multiple guys dead and/or turned to ash. And thing is, people could use mods and things to make most of the fights in Skyrim itself. Heck they made an Iron-Man fanmovie using it.

@reikai: Lol, yeah. It's all about using your imagination now isn't it? haha

True. But level 80 dovahkiin with ONLY 5 skills maxed out, and the rest on level 25 (with no perks added) and a limitation of a maximum 5 dragon shouts, does not.

Read the OP!

EDIT: @reikai Unless you pick destruction, alteration, conjuration etc etc as a skill, your spells wont last that long, or be very powerful, or be able to be use more than once until you have to wait for your magicka to fill back up. The same goes for any enchanted weapons. Unless you pick the right skills, the enchantment will be used up within just a few hits.

2nd EDIT: i'll be posting a few feats about Sauron in a bit, clearly some of you dont know just what hes capable of. Round 5 isnt as easy as you think. 4 arrows certainly isnt putting him down LMAO

@the_red_viper: Imagination is what makes the Modding Community for TES so awesome.

@optimuspalm: I did say max Destruction, which reduces cost of all rank spells by half, and max enchanting, which in itself can be used to reduce the cost of spells further in that school to virtually nothing, and increase magica regen. Even stuff in game without enchants that can do that. Diadem of the Savant from "Shalidor's Maze" next to "Labyrinthian" reduces cost of spells from all magic schools.

It's so easy to reduce the magica cost. Perks already drop it by half. Enchants in just two items can drop the remaining cost by another half easily. Can get to where Master Level destruction spells cost next to nothing to cast and barely make a blip in your magica bar.

As for arrows, well with the smithing skill, I can knock the Daedric Bow to over 300dmg, and double enchant it with the Enchanting Perk, and I usually for for Frost and Shock dmg enchants. Frost does an extra 41 points of dmg per hit, and half as much to magica. Shock does the same, except half as much to stamina. Two together on the bow easily clocks over 400dmg per hit, and it eats away at the targets magic and stamina. If they're not dead in the first two shots, they ain't gonna be able to move much anyway.

Anyway, as for what Sauron is capable of, if we wanted to go by Lore an such, Dovahkiin's Thu'um is so powerful it could wipe a continent, and he has several objects on his person that make him virtually indestructible, plus he's carrying around tools and objects granted power by Divines and Daedric Princes (essentially Gods). Which includes Auriel's Bow an tack on some Sunhallowed Arrows.

Another part of the lore being the Dragonborn became more powerful with every dragon soul consumed. You need more than 60 to unlock all shouts, but for this to get a max of 5 that's still fifteen dragon souls, plus all those Miraak had ever consumed as the Last Dragonborn receives all of those upon defeating Miraak.

Ah, mods... there is literally nothing more awesome than a mudcrab wearing a top-hat and a monocle...

Except maybe turning the Dragonpriest at the end of the Mage's College questline into a sweetroll...

About Sauron, I really don't think that a max-sneak, muffled, invisible Divahkiin can't get around him. Plus, since I have max Illusion, I can calm him down or make him run away. If I max out Alchemy as well, I can create a potion that'd boost my Illusion even further.

@reikai: Thats nothing i didnt already know :)

Has the thu'um ever wiped a continent?

We know what the weapons do, who made them has no relevance here. Why are you talking Lore? I never mentioned it. I just read how you would clear rounds 4 and 5 and thought you needed some help with knowledge about Sauron. Also how will you take out the Witch King? I'll give you Saruman, but thats a bit sketchy too lol

And dont forget that in Skyrim you dont face 100's of enemies at the same time. And none that would run at you all at once and surround you like in Round 3. Certain magic will not effect them all, and you cant shoot arrows whilst casting spells.

Yes the first two rounds are easy, and they'd be no point in making a gauntlet that was impossible to clear, but i think it wont be as easy in the last three rounds as you make out ;)

Just saw this comment^^ (took me long enough, lol)

Anywho, about the Nazgul-I also have maxed out destruction. And I can easily regenerate tons of magicka with my max-alchemy potions, or a heal+equibirium combo.

As for the elephants, I can just wait for them to get closer. I can also take them out with arrows/magic and skip the shout.

AWESOME!!!!!

Great plan for round 3. As for Round 4, these are no normal riders. I'm thinking you'd probably have to take the riders out before bend will would work on the dragons, who are under the will of the rider to begin with. But obviously this would be 'making things up' a bit lol

Round 5: Technically Sauron cant die. When Huan the hound of Valinor killed his body, Sauron turned into a spirit vampire and fled.

So for this fight the easiest way would be to stand against him and come up with a way of chopping his finger off (Isildur dealt a lucky blow, which isnt going to work here!) then getting past the balrogs and destroying the ring. The harder way would be to stand against him and win the fight, killing his body and making him flee in spirit form.

I dont think magic, or dragon shouts would be very effective against him. He is far beyond any other opponent here. Its difficult to judge how magic works in the Tolkien world, but the fight between Sauron and King Felegund (one of the most powerful of the noldor elves) was a battle of magic words and song

'For Felegund strove with Sauron in songs of power, and the power of the King was very great; but Sauron had the mastery,...'

Thats the closest thing that i can relate to dragonshouts lol

This is a section from 'Of the ruin of Beleriand' from The Silmarillion:

'Sauron was become now a sorceror of dreadful power, master of shadows and of phantoms, foul in wisdom, cruel in strength, misshaping what he touched, twisting what he ruled, lord of werewolves; his dominion was torment.'

From 'Of Beren and Luthien':

(having already shapeshifted into the most dreadful werewolf) 'Then Sauron sprang upon Luthien and she swooned before the menace in his eyes, and the foul vapour of his breath'

Even with bad breath he can make beautiful women swoon......

I just feel Sauron's capabilities arent fully understood, as its actually quite hard to understand them.

@the_red_viper: Yeah, i think destruction magic would probably be the best bet against the Nazgul too. So would you deal with the Nazgul first, or head down in the city and go for the ground troops and then use the shout on the Oliphaunts?

Well, the Nazgul seem like a bigger, more immediate threat. I think I'd deal with one or two of them while Arngeir sends some offensive shouts down at the ground troops. Afterwards, the Oliphaunts would probably be pretty close, so I could go down swiftly and use the AA shout while Arngeir deals with some of the other Nazgul. I'd probably need to use a mass paralysis or something before getting to the Oliphaunts but that's ok I guess (max alchemy magicka potions ftw). Then I can either stay down and slaughter some ground troops, or go back up and help Arngeir with the Nazgul (I'd probably choose the latter). I can use arrows coated with Frenzy poisons to huge advantage as well, as they would cause the targets to turn on their friends. I see how this would be great against the 25 trolls especially.

Dovahkiin and friends win.

It's not the 'if', it's the 'how' :)

Or riding Rainbow Dash across the frost-covered fields and killing people with a flute.

@optimuspalm: Well I already know about Sauron, but you can't really compare him in Lore to Dovahkiin under Game Mechanics. With Lore, the Thu'um has shattered castles, made quakes, and other nasty things. The three first Nordic heroes to use the Voice, taught to them by Parthurnaax, were said to be the strongest in history, but could not defeat Alduin.

However, the Last Dragonborn proved that his Voice was greater than even Alduin's, the very dragon and son of Akatosh who was ordained to bring about the end of the world. Alduin is essentially a god in his own right, and the Dovahkiin took him down. Even sparring with Shor to be allowed into the great hall in Sovngarde.

As far as sheer number of enemies, that actually works against their army. They can't all attack at once. Physically impossible. They'd be running each other through just trying to get to the Dovahkiin. They'd just keep getting in each others way. They'll cluster together while the Dovahkiin can move more freely. Saruman's orcs aren't very smart and they're trained for phalanx maneuvers like Spartans. They're all about brute force and numbers, something the Dovahkiin has dealt with.

Dovahkiin has been surrounded by enemies before in game, from skeletons and draugr, to bandits and soldiers (stormcloaks and/or Imperial). Also wolf packs and spider nests. Positioning and AoE spells do help with that. With Storm Call, aiming is not even required. It will hit every enemy on the field, several at a time, until the storm ends. The more orcs there are, the more that'll be killed Dovahkiin doesn't need to do anything to keep the storm going. Can just sit back and watch them die, and any that get close will suffer a worse fate.

Lolwut? Does that exist? =\

Reminds me of another mod btw, a flying broomstick. It's basically a horse designed to look like a broomstick and fly. The funny thing is, when you climb off the broomstick and start a fight, it would run away. God, it was one of the best laughs I've ever had...

@reikai: I think you kind of missed my point. You were using the damage output of weapons (comparing game mechanics to Lore like you just said we couldnt), and treating magic like it would have the same effect on Sauron like it does on basic enemies in Skyrim. All i tried to show was an idea of how tough Sauron would be compared to those characters, and that's he is capable of dealing with powerful spells and magic, and overcoming it.

I'm not saying he would overcome the dragonborn, i'm just saying that its in no way a walkover for Dovahkiin, and would require tactics to beat Sauron, not just......what was it....hoping he'd dive headfirst into the lava lol

And i wasnt suggesting they would ALL attack at once...but if you're claiming that 'They're all about brute force and numbers, something the Dovahkiin has dealt with', then i'm not going to argue, because thats simply not true, not on the scale of this fight.

@optimuspalm Dude, you DO know you can edit the thread's headline... right? I think Dovarkiin would be most grateful.

@optimuspalm: Thing with LotR is, magic users are so scarce as to be non-existent. And they never really showed anything impressive of themselves.

But with TES, they're all over the place, and do lots of ridiculous things. And given the Dovahkiin can affect and kill Legendary Dragons, Vampire Lords, Dremora and Alduin with his magic, I would have to say that Sauron's physical form isn't going to hold up well to such onslaughts.

We also know, thanks to ESO, that magic users can pretty much reduce people to ashes with single shots pretty easily.

The three shown in that vid is essentially like a Nordic Warrior, a Battlemage and a Ranger/Assassin. The Dovahkiin is like all three of these rolled into one.

@reikai: Just because there wasn't a lot of magic during the time of LOTR, doesn't mean the magic that happened during the thousands of years before that time is any less powerful than it already is. Why are you comparing Sauron to Dragons, Vampire Lords, dremora etc. He's beyond that.

He takes round one and two, but stops at round 3, due to saruman, I guess. They get zapped or burned to a crisp.

@optimuspalm: Unless they can actually demonstrate that their magic is up there, can't say it's the same as it was millennia earlier, or even comparable. From what I saw used by Gandalf and Saruman, they weren't that tough or even impressive.

And I'm not comparing Sauron to these other things, but you can't honestly claim that he is more resilient to magic than dragons whose very way of speech is a form of magic. And can't say he's beyond them. At least not in his mortal form, which is the one being used. Sure, as a Valar he was pretty much a god. But he wasn't allowed to do anything like that. He had to take a vulnerable form on Middle-Earth to get what he wanted without direct interference from the other Valar and Maiar.

I don't see how Saruman can do anything to stop him. He didn't do anything fancy, and the Dovahkiin became the Archmage of the College of Winterhold, and put a stop to an object that could alter the reality of the world itself. From what I can see, the Dovahkiin has more power in the stuff he keeps on his person than Saruman has ever displayed.

Dovahkiin has also dealt with numerous magic users, from necromancers to mages, as well as Atronachs. Stood against and defeated the spirit of Potema the Wolf Queen, who is stated was being one of the most powerful and dangerous necromancers in history.

@reikai: Dude, now you're comparing him to Saruman and Gandalf LOL Lets just stop. Its clear you know nothing about Sauron, and aren't prepared to learn.

EDIT: I'll try one last time to show you why you are wrong, and why you're on the totally wrong track about Sauron, and about what i'm saying. Look at the picture of Sauron, and look at the description of Round 5. Sauron has the ring on his finger.

So why you're bringing up his power levels during the LOTR i've no idea. And why you think that power levels drop, just because lesser being didnt use a lot of power at a much later date has any relevance i really dont know.

Do you even know what i'm talking about, or are you just ignoring it all on purpose?

You still havent come up with any sort of explanation of how you could beat Sauron, which tells me all i need to know.

You don't know how to beat him.

@optimuspalm: The One Ring gave him power over all those bearing the other rings he forged and contains his essence which allows him to keep his form on Middle-Earth. A half-@$$ed stroke from a guy with an elvish sword of unstated magical properties lopped off his hand and stopped him. That doesn't exactly take much effort.

You keep saying I don't understand how powerful guys in LotR, but I do. And they're not that strong. We have "The Infernal City", Umbriel, which is a landmass used to literally crush people and then raise them as undead. All thanks to an ancient Lich who really doesn't like people.

And this was four decades after the Oblivion Crisis where Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedric Princes of Destruction, entered onto the world and flooded it with Daedra, and it took the sacrifice of Martin Septim and the Amulet of Kings to call forth Akatosh, Lord of the Aedra and head of the Divines, to battle with Mehrunes Dagon and force him from Nirn and close the Oblivion Gates forever.

And then, we have Alduin. The Firstborn of Akatosh, the Dragon God. Alduin the World-Eater who took Domination as his birthright, who consumes the souls of the mortal dead to feed his power and commanded all of Dragon kind in the Mythic Era before recorded history began.

Miraak was the First Dragonborn and he turned against the dragons, consuming their souls, not to save the world but to bend it to his will. But even he couldn't win and hid himself within the realm of Hermaeus Mora, the Daedric Prince of Knowledge and Secrets. Both Alduin and Miraak were some of the most powerful figures to ever appear on Tamriel, and the Last Dragonborn defeats both of them.

You have also dismissed the origin of some of the Dovahkiin's equipment. Daedric Artifacts are not something to just sweep under the rug. These guys're gods, same with the Aedra. Their bodies when they 'died', became planets and stars that dot the skies over Nirn. Even the Sun is a hole in the realms created by Magnus when he escaped from Aetherius to Nirn because he didn't agree with some of the things the others were doing. The Sun, to which, became a conduit for Akatosh' power and where Auriel's Bow draws its strength from.

So, let's just make a quick list of all the Aedra/Daedra related things the Dragonborn carries around;

Volendrung: Forged by the ancient Dwemer (Dwarves) and empowered by Malacath, god of the Orcs and Daedric Prince of strength.

Ebony Mail: Armor of ebony created and empowered by Boethiah, the Daedric Prince of treachery and deceit, the devourer of Trinimac.

Sanguine Rose: A staff formed by the Sanguine, the Daedric Prince of debauchery and possesses the power to summon Dremora Lords at the wielders behest.

Dawnbreaker: A weapon forged in the light of creation that scatters the darkness and shadows and burns the cursed undead. Created by Meridia, the Daedric Prince of Life and Energy

Mehrunes Razor: A dagger formed by Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedric Princes of Destruction, chaos and change, with the power to instantly kill all who're struck by its blade.

Mace of Molag Bal: A jagged and edged mace bearing the likeness of Molag Bal himself, the Daedric Prince of Domination and Corruption, the lord and creator of all vampires and undead.

Spellbreaker: A shield formed by the ancient Dwemer and empowered by Peryite, the Daedric Prince Pestilence, Plague and Disease. The shield itself creates a Ward against magic.

Auriel's Bow: The bow formed and used by Auriel (Akatosh) himself, and draws its power from Aetherius, channeled through the sun. And was said that it made its wielder invulnerable to all lesser forms of attack. The power of the bows strikes are magnified when used with enchanted Sunhallowed arrows.

Auriel's Shield: A shield created by Auriel himself and makes its wielder nigh-invulnerable to harm, its defensive prowess unmatched in all of Tamriel. It can absorb the force of every blow against it, magical and physical, and can unleashed this accumulated power against an enemy when striking them with the shield.

Skull of Corruption: A staff that feeds on the dreams and memories of mortals and terrorizes them with unspeakable nightmares. Created by Vaermina the Dreamweaver, the Daedric Prince of Dreams and Nightmares. It can unleash blasts of terrible force and strike at multiple figures, it's power at its peak after consuming the dreams of others, whether they are the dreams of the living or the dead.

Staff of Magnus: A staff created by Magnus himself, the lord of magic, and said to be the only thing capable of adequately containing his power. It was also the only thing that could stop the power of the Eye of Magnus from reshaping the world and closing the rifts in reality caused by its misuse by Ancano.

Ebony Blade: A two-handed sword resembling an Akaviri Dai-Katana (or masamune) and created by Mephala the Webspinner, the lady of whispers, the Daedric Prince of Obfuscation and Secrets, known also as the Spider God. The blade absorbs the life essence of its victims and grows in power when used to slay the goodly folk who had placed their trust in the wielder of this terrible weapon.

@reikai: One does not simply forget the Wabbajack!!!!

Oh, and the Black Star/Azura's Star, pretty useful for this thread.

@optimuspalm: So, are we using a maxed out Dovahkiin? Like 100 in all ares, lvl 50 type?

Dovahkiin clears and earns some fun new armor and potential new rings =P

@reikai: One does not simply forget the Wabbajack!!!!

Oh, and the Black Star/Azura's Star, pretty useful for this thread.

@dratini1331: You know I did find it funny how the op sets him at lv80 and then I am asked why I'm mentioning stats and damage counters with weapons.

We don't, but the Wabbajack is always a gamble And Azura's Star isn't really a combat item, unless potentially hitting Sauron with Soul Trap and, perhaps, trapping his soul within the star for eternity. Or at least until it fades back into Azura's realm in Oblivion and he finds himself stuck there as her boytoy.

Dovahkiin has plenty of other stuff too, even spectral weapons like the Ghostblade. And by lore the Gauldur Amulet would make him immensely powerful.

@reikai: I thought it maxed at lvl 50, cause I maxed out most of mine with 3 lvl 100 skills at level like 43 or something, though I may definitely be crazy off, but yeah. Also, level 100 Sneak + Level 100 Illusion by themselves clear this. Beyond that, the Conjuration and Destruction easily make this spite against anyone who would try to fight you. Double deadra summon, AoE Mind Control, Invisibility, all the AoE damage ever, I mean, nothing in LotR should be able to really deal with that. I mean, There's harder in game quests than most of these...

Never even properly thought of this. And here's me currently sitting on level 37 Illusion/Assassin with 100 in Illusion and Sneak. Yeah Dragonborn clears with too much difficulty.

The Star would be useful for recharging the Wabbajack/Rose.

And the Wabbajack would definently help. In round 4, for example, the Wabbajack can't turn the Nazgul into something more dangerous than they are now. I mean, even if it's a Dremora Lord, it's really not as bad as a huge dragon with a wraith commanding it (not to mention it would have to fall down from the skies first).

@i_like_swords: Oh yeah, you have no idea. I played my first time on H2H the other day, and with 100 Heavy Armor, full Dragon Plate, the 50% shield resist, 30% MR from alteration perks, and about 300 something life and Dragonflesh, and the dragon still one shots me.

On the other hand, my lvl 100 Assassin Khajit (Mr. Fwuffums) Deals like 1000+ damage, can turn invisible, and if I use sneak nothing in the game can see me, not to mention Harmony means nothing can attack mean, and Invisibility means nothing can see me.

Conjuration of course is just infinity Health Daedra because by the time anything kills it you have another Daedra ready to go, and at lvl 100, that's 2 all the time.

Yes, Skyrim is a game where you can become overpowered TOO easily. Still really fun though.

@dratini1331: Was your Smithing legendary? What difficulty? What level? What dragon? But God Damn your guy seems like the ultimate tank.

But yeah, sneaking paired with illusion is the most OP mechanic in the game. When you beef up your weapons and start backstabbing it becomes ridiculous.

Yup, conjuration can carry you a long way too. Especially when you reanimate a reallllly powerful corpse.