#101 Posted by Nefarious (22896 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine.

Adamantium > Diamond.

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#102 Edited by 18hunt (2948 posts) - - Show Bio

Well I guess they can do whatever they want with him...

#103 Edited by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash: I think DH has the power to put Wolverine down.

- Like I said before, he can easily manipulate almost infinite amount of crystals from his body and ground, and can create crystals inside of objects instantly.

- He may have the reaction time as he overpowered Vilgax.

-What can Wolverine do to DH to even hurt him? He can simply regenerate and he has shown no pain when his body parts were broken.

#104 Posted by 18hunt (2948 posts) - - Show Bio

Also it isn't diamond, much harder, the hardest in the Ben 10 universe i think. (Although DH has had some jobbing moments that remind me of hulk lifting Thor's hammer) A.k.a. unrealistic

#105 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2986 posts) - - Show Bio

@18hunt: Still doubt it's harder than adamantium. It has broken.

#106 Posted by 18hunt (2948 posts) - - Show Bio

Like I said it has some jobbing moments where a punch can break it whereas sometimes it destroys a giant drill when it is between the drill and a very hard metal without a scratch (NRG episode). But I doubt it is harder than adamantium.

#107 Posted by Inconvenient_Truth (2362 posts) - - Show Bio

wolverine

#108 Posted by 18hunt (2948 posts) - - Show Bio

How is wolverine gonna deal with sharp diamonds through every square inch of his body, even if he lives, he won't be able to move

#109 Edited by Sideslash (5918 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadovvlite: First of all, he has to hit Wolverine, which is easier said than done, since Spider-Man has said he can't keep up with Wolverine in CQC.

Wolverine has the speed to dodge Diamondhead's projectiles, since he has ghosted an entire room full of enemies firing automatic weapons at him.

Wolverine's gonna keep slicing bits off until Diamondhead stays down. Diamondhead, on the other hand, won't be able to put Wolverine down.

@18hunt said:

How is wolverine gonna deal with sharp diamonds through every square inch of his body, even if he lives, he won't be able to move

First, those diamonds have to hit him. That's going to be incredibly hard. In terms of speed, Wolverine could be the single most dangerous street leveler in the Marvel universe.

#110 Edited by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash

First of all, he has to hit Wolverine, which is easier said than done, since Spider-Man has said he can't keep up with Wolverine in CQC.

So Spiderman has never hit Wolverine with his web? Because it'll be easier for DH to hit Logan since his attack range is way more and quicker than bullets.

since he has ghosted an entire room full of enemies firing automatic weapons at him.

Problem with automatic guns is that they fire bullets. Bullets if misses their target by even an inch won't do you any damage. What DH fires, explodes. Try harder. How many times Logan has completely dodged more than 50 assault rifle grenades being fired at him simultaneously? None!

@sideslash said:

Wolverine's gonna keep slicing bits off until Diamondhead stays down. Diamondhead, on the other hand, won't be able to put Wolverine down.

That's the problem. Diamondhead will NEVER stay down. He can regenerate much faster than Logan can hit. He regenrated his whole palm and fingers in 1 second. Diamondhead is at least twice or thrice more powerful than Logan. Believe me, he very well can put him down.

#111 Edited by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt By dodging the diamond machine gun and not standing there like a pole while Ben hovers giant diamonds over his head. I honestly don't believe Diamondhead is fast enough to tag Wolverine.

Oh believe me, Diamond head is not gonna pause for effect as well.

#112 Edited by 18hunt (2948 posts) - - Show Bio

But at the speed DH controls his diamonds, he is definitely fast enough

#113 Posted by Sideslash (5918 posts) - - Show Bio
@rbt said:

@sideslash

First of all, he has to hit Wolverine, which is easier said than done, since Spider-Man has said he can't keep up with Wolverine in CQC.

So Spiderman has never hit Wolverine with his web? Because it'll be easier for DH to hit Logan since his attack range is way more and quicker than bullets.

I didn't say that. I said Wolverine can overwhelm Spider-Man, a verified bullet timer, with his speed. That alone shows he can dominate Diamondhead up close.

Diamondhead has no feats to suggest his diamonds are FTB.

since he has ghosted an entire room full of enemies firing automatic weapons at him.

Problem with automatic guns is that they fire bullets. Bullets if misses their target by even an inch won't do you any damage. What DH fires, explodes. Try harder. How many times Logan has completely dodged more than 50 assault rifle grenades being fired at him simultaneously? None!

He doesn't need to, since there isn't any 'assault rifle grenades' being fired at him.

Also, DH's diamonds don't explode. They never have. Ultimate Humungosaur's projectiles explode. And anyway, like I said, Wolverine won't be anywhere near them.

@sideslash said:

Wolverine's gonna keep slicing bits off until Diamondhead stays down. Diamondhead, on the other hand, won't be able to put Wolverine down.

That's the problem. Diamondhead will NEVER stay down. He can regenerate much faster than Logan can hit. He regenrated his whole palm and fingers in 1 second. Diamondhead is at least twice or thrice more powerful than Logan. Believe me, he very well can put him down.

Twice or thrice more powerful isn't enough. Diamondhead doesn't have the strength, or the durability to put Logan down. 100 tonners have a hard time putting Wolverine down. This will be a war of attrition, and Wolverine is incredibly hard to even KO. And if he gets into danger, he'll go all savage, which makes him like, three times more dangerous. And Diamondhead simply doesn't have the damage output to even pose a challenge to Wolverine's healing factor. What James doesn't dodge, he can tank.

#114 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sideslash Watch the video I posted in the last page. DH was able to fool Vilgax three times with his speed. Vilgax, who can easily catch XLR8 running at him mid-run. So, DH definitely has speed.

Again watch the video. His projectiles does explode. DH can fire 100s of those in second. Even if he does manage to dodge all of them(which Spidey will have trouble doing), the explosion will throw him off his feet.

DH's strength is not his only power.Once Logan is on ground,he's many options how to keep him down.

#115 Edited by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash:

He doesn't need to, since there isn't any 'assault rifle grenades' being fired at him.

Also, DH's diamonds don't explode. They never have. Ultimate Humungosaur's projectiles explode. And anyway, like I said, Wolverine won't be anywhere near them.

They do explode, but they explode on impact. But then again these guys have gone from just assault rifle fire, to being faster than machine gunfire, to now every single piece will explode (which is true), to Ben having pinpoint accuracy (which is false).

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#116 Edited by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_sapwn Ben doesn't have Deathstroke's accuracy. But his wide range of attack will actually help him here. He can easily fire an area more than 1m wide. His explosions easily shattered Vilgax's shield, which Jetray's beam couldn't and niether could Ultimos' punch(who can easily lift a huge steel block).So,his explosion is as powerful as assault rifle greneade if not more.

DH can simply cover him in a suit of Diamonds.Logan won't be able to move his limbs and he's definitely not strong enough to break it.

#117 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (20253 posts) - - Show Bio

How does someone even put a living diamond down permanently?

#118 Posted by Sideslash (5918 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt said:

@Sideslash Watch the video I posted in the last page. DH was able to fool Vilgax three times with his speed. Vilgax, who can easily catch XLR8 running at him mid-run. So, DH definitely has speed.

Travel speed isn't the same as reaction speed. And Wolverine's dealt with speedsters too.

Also, just because he surprised Vilgax, doesn't mean he's anywhere close to being able to overpower Wolverine's speed.

Again watch the video. His projectiles does explode. DH can fire 100s of those in second. Even if he does manage to dodge all of them(which Spidey will have trouble doing), the explosion will throw him off his feet.

The fact remains, Wolverine can dodge multiple full automatic rifles effortlessly. And as GS said, they explode on impact. They still need to impact near him, which they won't, because he's fast enough to dodge them.

DH's strength is not his only power.Once Logan is on ground,he's many options how to keep him down.

Even if DH gets Logan down, which is very unlikely, Logan will be back up before Ben's even processed that he's on the floor.

--

Another point I want to make is that Ben's not really that good in terms of varying his attacks. His go-to move is to charge in windmilling, which is the single worst tactic you can use against Wolverine. Diamondhead will be in pieces before he even realises Logan's hit him.

--

@sideslash:

He doesn't need to, since there isn't any 'assault rifle grenades' being fired at him.

Also, DH's diamonds don't explode. They never have. Ultimate Humungosaur's projectiles explode. And anyway, like I said, Wolverine won't be anywhere near them.

They do explode, but they explode on impact. But then again these guys have gone from just assault rifle fire, to being faster than machine gunfire, to now every single piece will explode (which is true), to Ben having pinpoint accuracy (which is false).

I'm intrigued, do you think Wolverine will win?

#119 Edited by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@sideslash:

He doesn't need to, since there isn't any 'assault rifle grenades' being fired at him.

Also, DH's diamonds don't explode. They never have. Ultimate Humungosaur's projectiles explode. And anyway, like I said, Wolverine won't be anywhere near them.

They do explode, but they explode on impact. But then again these guys have gone from just assault rifle fire, to being faster than machine gunfire, to now every single piece will explode (which is true), to Ben having pinpoint accuracy (which is false).

I'm intrigued, do you think Wolverine will win?

You couldn't be more wrong bud.

#120 Posted by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash: Go read the first two pages. I debated Wolverine curbstomps Diamondhead and even locked it, but gave it a chance to see what the other mods think and Vance thinks a case could be made for either character so I backed off being true to my word.

@rbt: Yeah, I've already countered those points so no reason for me to repeat myself anymore so you can continue reaching in a thread you made in which you've asked how Wolverine wins this so that you can give the character you want to win the win.

Moderator
#121 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash He doesn't need to counter or block every Logan's attack. He doesn't feel pain at all. Closer Logan gets easier it'll to hit him with his diamond.

Yes, Logan can dodge all of them. But how far will he go? 100s of those projectiles exploding will be like many hand greneade exploding. Logan will easily be thrown off his feet.

You're treating Logan like XLR8 or Flash here. He's been in exloding range of many greneades here. He can't heal that quick.He'll need some seconds and DH wil have clean shot.

#122 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@sideslash And what about DH covering Logan in a suit of Diamonds like he did with Kevin in ep. In Charm's Way? Logan is not powerful enough to break it. He won't be able to move his limbs at all.

@god_spawn So, I can't debate in my own thread? I posted it to see what others think. I am pretty sure DH will win.

#123 Edited by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt: You can but you aren't supposed to have a decisive victor in mind and the way you keep posting about it makes it seem you intentionally want to lose.

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#124 Edited by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn Ok. I had this Logan vs DH debate with my firend who thought Logan will win. That's why I put it here. As long as I don't make Ultimate Way big vs Logan just to make Logan look bad, I'm okay.

#125 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@mirrorwave4 said:

@ god_Spawn

- Oh he'll realized Diamond's punches can K.O him, after he wakes up from the fight...

- Your forgetting their's no prep for this fight, how is Wolverine gonna "realize it" without taking a lick?

Two problems with that : Hulk is vastly stronger than Diamondhead, and Wolverine has tanked those punches. Without a doubt he was injured by them, but he wasn't instantly knocked out. What makes you think Diamondback, who has less feats than Hulk and is generally accepted to be weaker, will hit the daylight out of Logan in one punch?

Heck, Wolverine has even held his own against Savage Gray Hulk before, who is around the 70 + ton range.

If there is no prep and it is a random encounter, what says Diamondback with Ben's persona, won't be brash and reckless, and get sliced up by Wolverine who is over 2x swifter than he is? Adamantium >>>>> Alien Diamond that seldom portrays impressive feats.

I'd be surprised if Diamondhead's attacks can even touch Logan. His reaction feats are insane. The three feats below pretty much depict the gist of Wolverine's abilities.

@god_spawn - You got any good feats on how powerful and lethal Wolverine's adamantium claws are? I'm fairly confident a couple good hits would slice up Diamondhead.

#126 Posted by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio
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#127 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: The fact he's cut into more durable people like Hulk, Thor, Thing, Namor, Thanos.

Yeah he even penetrated Thanos in Infinity Gauntlet. If Logan's claws can still stab into Thanos while he was wearing the Infinity Gauntlet, I'm pretty sure he would slice and dice Diamondhead. Thanks for reminding me of that. I think I have some scans on that.

Wolverine stabbing into (not much so injuring) Thanos while wearing the Infinity Gauntlet. He, of course, gets stomped shortly after, but still a vastly impressive feat.

#128 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@Youneightbourhoodcomicgeek @mirrorwave4 said in his very next post that one puch of DH won't KO logan.

Logan cannot dodge all of em.Heck even Spidey will have hard time dodging 100s of projectiles coming at him with speed of bullet if not more(though he will dodge.) Even if by some miracle,Logan does dodge all of them,he sure as heck won't be able to go out of explosion range in time. DH can keep doing it.Also,Logan will have to come close to hit DH.Closer he's,higher the chances he'll get hit by diamond.

#129 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@YNCG I NEVER said that Logan can't cut through DH. Read my earlier posts. But what good that's gonna do? DH doesn't feel pain, regenerates faster than Logan can ever cut. Also Logan will get at most 1 strike before DH fires his projectile on his chest sending him flying away with a chunk of flesh missing, or just throw him away with his superior strength.

What about DH covering him with diamond like he did to Kevin?

#130 Edited by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

Question, how is Wolverine going to put down DH? He has instant regeneration, no matter how bad he is shattered. His only weakness is high sonic blasts and strong powerful blasts, such as strong explosions. Like I said again, DH can manipulate infinite amounts of crystals from his body, ground or from other objects. Also, DH can just bury Wolverine deep in the ground.

#131 Posted by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: That's what I was referring to. I do believe Thanos kind of shut off the IG at that point, but I'd have to recheck. The fact Wolverine even got his claws half way deep into Thanos was a good showing for Logan.

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#132 Edited by jashro44 (25369 posts) - - Show Bio

I would say wolverine all though I don't think I would say a stomp. Its been a while since I have seen Ben 10 though.

#133 Edited by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: That's what I was referring to. I do believe Thanos kind of shut off the IG at that point, but I'd have to recheck. The fact Wolverine even got his claws half way deep into Thanos was a good showing for Logan.

IIRC, Thanos still had ALL his power, he just turned off his omniscience, hence him being able to be taken off-guard. All the heroes fighting Thanos had a 1% chance of winning or something along those lines. Adam Warlock was commenting that Thanos was true to his word and turned off his omniscience to impress Death.

Thanos ambushed by Drax and Hulk

@rbt said:

@YNCG I NEVER said that Logan can't cut through DH. Read my earlier posts. But what good that's gonna do? DH doesn't feel pain, regenerates faster than Logan can ever cut. Also Logan will get at most 1 strike before DH fires his projectile on his chest sending him flying away with a chunk of flesh missing, or just throw him away with his superior strength.

What about DH covering him with diamond like he did to Kevin?

Logan can cut insanely fast. He's overwhelmed Hulk before, who arguably has a better healing factor than Wolverine himself. Also Wolverine is pretty pain-resistant himself, and his healing factor, plus his own adamantium skeleton that is tougher than Alien Diamond. I don't remember saying that you said Logan's claws wouldn't cut through Diamondhead, I was merely pointing it out.

Also Wolverine is too fast to get covered in diamond. He would just evade it or jump away. He's dodged things point-blank and in tough situations before.

Logan was trapped between two cars in that encounter, and still dodged that, so that is proof that

A) He could evade the trap tactic.

B) Even if he gets caught in the diamond, he cold still dodge projectiles and other attacks, and cut his way out of it.

#134 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt said:

@YNCG I NEVER said that Logan can't cut through DH. Read my earlier posts. But what good that's gonna do? DH doesn't feel pain, regenerates faster than Logan can ever cut. Also Logan will get at most 1 strike before DH fires his projectile on his chest sending him flying away with a chunk of flesh missing, or just throw him away with his superior strength.

What about DH covering him with diamond like he did to Kevin?

Wolverine effortlessly dodging weapon-fire

#135 Edited by jashro44 (25369 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt: May I ask what makes you believe diamondhead fires his crystals at bullet speed?

@shadovvlite said:

Question, how is Wolverine going to put down DH? He has instant regeneration, no matter how bad he is shattered. His only weakness is high sonic blasts and strong powerful blasts, such as strong explosions. Like I said again, DH can manipulate infinite amounts of crystals from his body, ground or from other objects. Also, DH can just bury Wolverine deep in the ground.

Decapitating diamondhead should incapacitate him long enough to count as a win. I don't recall him regenerating his head instantly.

#136 Posted by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek:
-Yes Wolverine has insane cutting speed, but that won't help at all. DH can regenerate even if he was obliterated to tiny pieces and regenerate while being cut.

-I doubt Wolverine can escape traps, when DH creates a huge area of crystals around them.

#137 Edited by God_Spawn (38301 posts) - - Show Bio
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#138 Posted by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: His whole body was broken to pieces and still regenerated.

#139 Posted by jashro44 (25369 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadovvlite: That wasn't because of diamondheads powers. In the episode secret of chormastone it was explained that chromastone is the guardian of diamondhead species and has the power to revive them. When chromastone died he revived Ben and activated diamondhead. It was chromastones abilities.

#140 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: Thx for the refresher.

No problem. I'd expect you to do the same if I forget anything :P

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek:

-Yes Wolverine has insane cutting speed, but that won't help at all. DH can regenerate even if he was obliterated to tiny pieces and regenerate while being cut.

-I doubt Wolverine can escape traps, when DH creates a huge area of crystals around them.

Well it would still be considered a win if Wolverine can temporarily KO Diamondhead, while Diamondhead can't even land a hit on Wolverine.

If he creates a huge area of crystals around him, he'd just have more things to parkour around. He'd just jump on top of the crystal and escape. He's evaded worst before.

#141 Posted by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: Can't DH immobilize Wolverine's feet first then encase him large amounts of crystals, where he wouldn't have any leverage and won't be able to move his hands? He has done this before in later episodes IIRC.

#142 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: Can't DH immobilize Wolverine's feet first then encase him large amounts of crystals, where he wouldn't have any leverage and won't be able to move his hands? He has done this before in later episodes IIRC.

But then Wolverine would just cut the diamond encasing his feet the instant they make contact with him and jump away. Its like trying to catch a Rabbit in a net. It keeps jumping away, and even if you catch it, it bites its way out.

#143 Posted by fanb0y (18 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice match, Diamonhead does have a healing factor like Wolverine but this match can go either way.

5/10

agreed.

#144 Posted by ShadoVvlite (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: True, but I mean as in it goes for his feet working up in large amounts. Like I said before, DH has access to infinite amounts of crystals. Quick question, how good is Wolverines stamina? Because I can also say DH can create endless thick walled crystals for defense and try to tire him out.

#145 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: True, but I mean as in it goes for his feet working up in large amounts. Like I said before, DH has access to infinite amounts of crystals. Quick question, how good is Wolverines stamina? Because I can also say DH can create endless thick walled crystals for defense and try to tire him out.

Easily above average, if not metahuman. His healing factor makes it so that Logan doesn't emit nearly as much fatigue hormones as a normal human would.

#146 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@YNCG He's overwhelmed Huly. And Diamondhead heals at least 10 times as faster as Hulk. Tell me when has Hulk been able to regrow his cut off body part in a second. All he ever does is regenrate some cuts and wounds and even it takes a while. So, Logan can try all, he CANNOT overwhelm DH.

You still didn't answer how Logan will cope if DH played the same trick he played on Kevin in ep In Charm's way? Logan will be out.

DH won't be there standing to get his head chopped off. He can block it with his hand.

#147 Edited by jashro44 (25369 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt said:

@YNCG He's overwhelmed Huly. And Diamondhead heals at least 10 times as faster as Hulk. Tell me when has Hulk been able to regrow his cut off body part in a second. All he ever does is regenrate some cuts and wounds and even it takes a while. So, Logan can try all, he CANNOT overwhelm DH.

You still didn't answer how Logan will cope if DH played the same trick he played on Kevin in ep In Charm's way? Logan will be out.

DH won't be there standing to get his head chopped off. He can block it with his hand.

After his fight with zeus, hulks organs were being torn apart by vultures and he was healing so fast the vultures didn't stop eating IIRC. And this was after Zeus beat him and he supposedly wasn't 100% after his fight with zeus.

Hulks healing factor is very impressive.

#148 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

In that case his hand will be chpped off. We're assuming here that his claws will cut his limbs like a hot knife cuts butter which is not the case.

Being pain resistent is one thing. Not feeling pain at all is another. Logan can resist pain, but it'll definitely slow him down. DH's both feet maybe gone and he'll regenerate in seconds to resume firing while regenerating.

DH's exploding projectiles will be Logan's reason to fail. Or his ability to control diamonds, ot his punch or he'll tire him down.

#149 Posted by RBT (4754 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 I knew that was coming. How fast can vultures eat anyway? It takes packs of them more than a day or two to eat a body. So, no this does not even compare to what DH can do. Again, DH doesn't heal, he regenerates. And that's why he'll never be overwhelmed by Logan.

#150 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20443 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt said:

@YNCG He's overwhelmed Huly. And Diamondhead heals at least 10 times as faster as Hulk. Tell me when has Hulk been able to regrow his cut off body part in a second. All he ever does is regenrate some cuts and wounds and even it takes a while. So, Logan can try all, he CANNOT overwhelm DH.

You still didn't answer how Logan will cope if DH played the same trick he played on Kevin in ep In Charm's way? Logan will be out.

DH won't be there standing to get his head chopped off. He can block it with his hand.

First of all, to even hurt Hulk in the first place is impressive, as his invulnerable skin is something that most opponents can't penetrate. Hulk's healing factor is equal, if not better than Diamondhead's own healing factor. The only person I could imagine has a better healing factor than Logan or Hulk here is Goop (man I loved Goop. Such an underused and underrated Alien).

Regenerates his skin in seconds