Despero, Superman, Cap Marvel Vs Thanos, Silver Surfer, Thor

This is a stomp. Silver Surfer stomps Superman, Thor beats Cap Marvel (again) and Thanos beats Desparo.

@dondave: You have not proved why not, and have shown no reason; why he would TP Thanos, even though it has been proven, he would resist it.

If you want to keep resorting to one word answers, with no evidence; saying Despero solo's, when actually Thanos has a much higher chance of solo'ing, then go ahead.

The fact is Thanos has a very high TP resistance, and will resist someone, even if Despero's level.

Thanos might solo. Cap is non factor because he lacks feats.

I would say something why it is pointless to put Cap against thunder-wielders, but it is not needed here.

People... Really. Surfer has two planet level TP feats on his own. One with calming down Galadorians and secodn winning TP battle with Dire Wraiths queen consuming power from minds of other Dire Wraiths.

Thanos resited to Moondragon, Cosmo and Mantis together. He controlled Hulk with one move and mind-r@ped Maker and Fallen One. It may not be his first choice, but if someone would try it against him - he will use it as well.

Thor resisted to sooo many telepaths, that suggesting that he will be easily taken down shouldn't even be considered. Phoenix Emma Frost, MG Moondragon (twice), Rachel Summers, Tana Nile - ALL failed to put him down with TP. He isn't immune, but he is highly resistant. And it is not like Despero would get a chance to attack with TP without being attacked by team 2.

Captain Marvel is Superman's equal.

Moreover, he is above other notable Kryptonians.

@frozen: Yes he is, but a lot Dc fans do like to think that.

@czarny_samael666: Well put.

Thor has been TP'd before, Thanos has not to my knowledge though; and has consistently shown to be fine a giants that way of attacking him, is useless.

@kingant27:

Yes he is

I agree in regards to this point.

@frozen: The same with Black Adam as well, IMO.

Which Superman exactly? And in what? Because from what I know, he actually matched long-hair Superman in strength, later when Supe called him his equal, these were only his words and in very specific situation.

Long-hair Superman was getting boost to moment when he changed into Blue one. Last version, one that destroyed Dark Moon is more powerfull than one that matched with Cap. More than that - Superman (as Thor, WW nor Hercules - even adding to this that they are gods/god-types) is just a character who can't know how to measure it.

Cap - as Herc in comparision to Thor - may have equal strength to ealier versions of Supe, but there is nothing shown here or in similar threads, proving his speed (flying/reaction), durability (to brute strength, sharp objects, energy projection), resistance to telepathy, possesion etc.

Here are proves that Superman felt growing up in power and that we had on-panel evidence of that:

Gallery

While I am not sure if this is post-crisis:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111125237/4005098-1745778140-capta.jpg

this is for sure:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-LcnEd65xsTI/TdgeO7FyN4I/AAAAAAAAAEw/Fa2WfhqGxLw/s1600/babbbbba+001.jpg

Team 2.

Despero solos. No one on the other team has adequate TP resistance to handle him.

Thor is an extra here. Thanos and Surfer wins it without any problem.

@czarny_samael666: Not a single one of your examples would stop Despero from controlling everyone here. They all have inferior TP shields compared to Martian Manhunter and Despero regularly overpowers him with his TP.

Surfer > Martian (Martian's searching the planet vs Surfer's claming it down and beating someone who was powered up by all Dire Wraiths)

MG Moondragon > Martian (taking control over the planet vs searching the planet)

All these three resisted to MG Moondragon. Surfer and Thanos has their own powerfull TP, Thanos blocked MD, Cocmo and Mantis at the same time and couldn't be reached at all by them.

Thor resisted powerfull telepaths more than once.

Despero may be above Martian, but it doesn't mean that he would win here, because Martian would lose here exactly the same.

And You're also forgotting - even while I am still syaing that Thanos solos - that Despero would need to fight with two powerfull telepaths.

As much as that Surfer can't be defeated in Astral Plane. Before Despero would even have time to learn all of this, he already would be destroyed, because he barely have any energy-resistance feats.

@czarny_samael666: He fought Superman in Public Enemies (2004) and Superman said Marvel is a match for him because of his magic.

@czarny_samael666 Neither Thor or Surfer resisted MG Moondragon. She didn't even use telepathy against them. She used a mind blast.

Standard Moondragon, Cosmo and Mantis don't compare to MMH.

Thor has also been affected by telepathy numerous times. The disparity between the times he resisted and has been affected by it isn't going to allow him to resist someone as powerful as Despero.

Why do you always take the Astral Plane feat out of context? The feats itself had nothing to do with telepathy. His energy was being drained and he went to a place where he had too much energy to be significantly drained. It had nothing to do with his TP defence.

But this would actually contradict Your point, since it would mean, that without the weakness, he wouldn't be a match for him.

If weaker Superman was his equal in strength and this is their last that clear strength-contest, then Post-Blue has to be stronger.

BTW, what is Superman's best feat when it comes to normal (no flying-speed) punch? What do we even compare? The same about Pre-DoS one.

Other thing is that You're talking about a fight (it was one when each of them thought that fights a villain, right?) without clear winner and other is clear strength-contest. Thor also won with Hercules before, but it doesn't mean that they aren't equal in strength.

Fight=/= strength contest.

@czarny_samael666: It doesn't contradict my point. Superman has no weakness to magic - his resistance just isn't that ample against the Shazam family. Captain Marvel's magic has been used on other people besides Superman.

Superman also stated in 2001 that Marvel was his equal in strength.

Black Adam fought Superman in 2005 and while he held back against Superman, more or less matched him.

Thanos solos

Thanos solos

This battle could go either way. Is Thanos magic or Telepathy resistant? if not then DC wins. Despero's telepathy could take a few guys down. Silver Surfer will be a tough match up for either Superman or Captain Marvel, But I see Captain Marvel matching up better against him since Silver Surfer can be overcome by magic. Superman most certainly would take down Thor..Thor will use his hammer and powers that come with it to keep him in the fight but Superman is a veteran at fighting beings with carious powers. In the End; Despero's Telepathy will play the biggest role in who wins and who loses.Plus; we must all remember that Despero is a heavyweight that even w/o Telepathy would probably be able to take out Silver Surfer, and most definitely Thor. Maybe not Thanos; That's where he would really need his Telepathy. So I will go with DC FTW..

1.Breaking control of Godess and Moondragon from both (I would also remind You, that MD couldn't reach Thor, when he was angry)

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/78977/1687016-thormentaldefense06infinitywatch21.jpg

Gallery

2.To my knowledge Moondragon didn't have Mind Gem, when she enslaved the planet she ruled. And she went on Thor through persuasion there, when Thor understood what is going on, he broke her control. Despero isn't Moondragon and he can't use the same tactic on Odinson.

3.Affected by telepathy =/= being taken out from battle. When he will try it on him, he can summon a lightning on him. And Thor has good enough lightnings to even instantly KO Despero. Not that he will use them from the start, but they will surely stun him and stop Despero's attack.

I also belive You're mixing spells and normal telepathy. Thor was controlled before, mostly by Loki and his magic which is different to telepathy.

I have gived You six situation when Thor resisted different types of telepathy: PF Emma, Rachel Summers, Tana Nile, MD-Goddess, MD with MG, MD without MG. I can try to look for more TP-resistance feats from Blood and Thunder, when he is angry. Thor was KOd during his other fights, by overpowered Cable, who couldn't control his power and actually before Xavier used TP, since Namor took him down before that (closed eyes):

http://i.imgur.com/vyDnP.jpg

In what other situations he was taken down by pure telepathy?

4.IT has all with his TP-resistance. If his power comes from Astral Plane, which was pretty much confirmed during the Annihilation by Thanos, then normal TP at least isn't as usefull against him, as against other beings.

You also forgot to answer on Galadorian's and Dire Wraiths' points as well as about Thanos.

5.You seem to think that it will be easy, like with Thanos and Hulk. Even IF Despero would be able to break Thor (he wouldn't do so to SS or Thanos) with TP, it would be a process. And he won't have enough time for that.

6.I don't see any Despero's energy resistance feats either.

All 3 from team 2 are highly resistant to TP and 2 of them has their own telepathy. Surfer shown planet level of it. Thanos manipulated herald and Cosmic Cube being through it and in 1st form beat Moondragon.

Despero also doesn't have energy-resistance feats, so nothing proves he can take powerfull energy blasts from Thanos/Surfer or lightning from Thor.

1.You didn't answer on my scans.

2.Superman's words aren't a prove of anything. I told You that already - we can't take seriously character's claims. At least not ones, who can be described in similar way as Watcher or who uses machines to prove their point like Richards.

3.Black Adam's fight would rather prove my point. Superman had to hold back there.

4.Then what do You mean by "Cap's magic"? Cap always have magic, if Superman was mentioning that, it would mean that he belives that it affects his weakness, like Cap's said when he KOd him near Phantom Stranger.

@czarny_samael666

1.Moondragon isn't using telepathy against Surfer. It's a mind blast; concussive force. Neither did she use it against Thor. She ordered him to come back but didn't actually use telepathy against him.

2. Thor was her sex slave. It was only after she controlled him into fighting the Avengers and they convinced him how stupid he was that he broke free. Not exactly Thor's finest hour in TP resistance.

3. He been affected by pure telepathy a number of times. Charles Xavier, Madcap, Red Skull, Sentry, Moondragon, Sandu and Rachel Geist are all examples.

Nothing indicated Namor knocked him out.

4. It has nothing to do with TP resistance. All it tells us is that Surfer can't have his energy drained in the Astral Plane.

5. If he was able to instantly drop Martian Manhunter, no one here is going to give him any more resistance.

1.She was talking in their minds, commanding them to do something. It is hard to show telepathy resistance in more clear way...

2.Thor wanted to come to her, he is a god of thunder after all. It proves that she can't just take control over him at will.

3.Again: affecting =/= KO/being controlled. Xavier didn't put him to sleep - Namor defeated him, my scan proves that Thor was already KOd. Red Skull didn't use him, his servant was a whisperer. Thanos' one proved that even Strange can't see him. This is not telepathy. Madcap also isn't using telepathy, in the same way Fear gods doesn't use it. They use emotions for their own purpose. Sentry is above Void, who is above most existing telepaths - I didn't claim that Thor is immune to TP, but remember: Thor wasn't defeated by TP there. Sandu was boosted by Loki's magic - You can't measure Thor's resistant to TP, if You're putting magic-TP there, since I already said that Thor was controlled by Loki before.

Rachel Geist was created by Scrier, among many others who were later summoned to fight The Other and Thor felt all this energy coming back, hardly something that could be repeated even by her, it is more a context thing.

You're putting way too many things in box "telepathy". It is like saying that Ghost Rider and Adam Warlock use telepathy, becuase they aren't attacking body with PS and Karmic blast.

Even hypnosis isn't a telepathy, what was proved by Legion in his fight with Magic.

You have to admitt that I didn't use any Thor's showing with resistance to spells/illusions/other types of attacking soul/mind/emotions.

4.It means that he can't be defeated there.

5.Martian - as most known telepaths - have problem with instant changes in psionic situation on the world. That is why he couldn't stand Adam's madness, that is why we always could see Jean/Emma/Xavier being stunned by dramatic change on the world. And it is not like Despero is always instantly taking out Martian - he is better, but not on whole different level.

Again:

6.I don't see any Despero's energy resistance feats either.

I honestly believe DC has a chance.

Despero vs Thanos, it goes either way. I think Thanos is immortal, so I guess EVENTUALLY, Despero would lose, but neither are going to speed blitz the other. There's no prep, so there goes Thanos' main advantage, and then Despero himself has outmuscled several top tier JL'ers. His mind games wouldn't work, but this is a toss up until someone helps out IMO.

Surfer vs Supes. Now where I'm typically inclined to give it Norrin, Clark isn't a push over. The ONLY thing I think that Norrin could potentially have over Clark is his cosmic awareness. But Supes has brute force that I don't believe Surfer has. Not saying he's a street leveler, but if Supes flexed a bit, I think he'd outmuscle him. I don't believe any of Clark's other powers matter, whereas cosmic blasts of some some sort COULD harm Supes, but I still think he's a better fighter. The awareness could lead to some sort of drain though, not sure.

Marvel and Thor. Marvel all the way. They're equals in everything from strength to lightning, but Marvel can blitz him, and I'll never accept Thor for being able to take on FTL fighters. He may move fast. He may be more combat savvy, but when I hit you with 50 Superman level punches in a second, before you can retract your arm to swing Mjolnir, I'll eventually win IMO.

Marvel then lends a hand to Supes and Despero to finish off their opponents.

@czarny_samael666: Your scan is out of context. Captain Marvel lost the arm wrestle because his power was split by 1/3. The writer also confirmed this. It's from Power of Shazam and both Superman and Captain Marvel were equal until Billy and Freddy powered up, thus making Marvel weaker.

@czarny_samael666:

2.Superman's words aren't a prove of anything. I told You that already - we can't take seriously character's claims. At least not ones, who can be described in similar way as Watcher or who uses machines to prove their point like Richards.

This is rather contradcitory considering a few weeks ago, you cited the statement of Sentry fighting Galactus as 'evidence' for Sentry beating Superman. Furthermore, Superman made an admission on his own capability in contrast to Captain Marvel's.

3.Black Adam's fight would rather prove my point. Superman had to hold back there.

No it doesn't. Doctor Psycho controlled Adam into throwing the first punch against Superman, it was Adam who did not want to fight either.

4.Then what do You mean by "Cap's magic"? Cap always have magic, if Superman was mentioning that, it would mean that he belives that it affects his weakness, like Cap's said when he KOd him near Phantom Stranger.

Superman mentionde his magic is an advantage. Superman's not the only person who has a vulnerability against magic. Captain Marvel punched Superman with lightning. He's only done that once.

Thanos and Silver Surfer would win this and Thor would just be a backup lol.

Marvel team still wins handily.

1.A)Thanks for that info, I have seen it on few forums and sites as legitimate. As I said - I didn't even know if this was post-crisis.

B)What about scan with long-haired Superman?

We're still talking only about strenght

2.Wait... What??? Me?? Are You sure about it? I never took that as a proof of anything. But I recall myself almost always correcting people, that Shaman X-Man confirmed that this fight happened which contradicts Spider's words even more because it means that these were not only words from character (not narrator), not only that it happened off-panel, but also that Sentry wasn't alone, which also implicates that it was team vs Galan and Sentry was just the most important part. No feat for Sentry from that. 100%.

3.But it was shown that Adam turned away his back and that it was Superman who could do much more damage. This fight doesn't prove anything for BA.

4.Remember about what we are talking about - if Superman mention that it gives him advantage over him, it means that he feel weakned in his presence (something like that already happened to Supergirl IIRC, mere presence of magic was enough to drastically reduce her durability).

5.We're still talking only about strength. Cap needs much more feats in different areas to be placed here.

And I repeat my question: What is Superman's (best for normal and pre-death) best punching feat? I would ask the same about Despero, but more appropriate question would be: which DC character that KOd Superman has the best striking feat and what it is? Is it greater than the best striking feat for character that lost with Superman and if no, then what is that character's best striking feat? (((That is how we can measure his durability and thus - Despero's strength)))

Really, I view Thanos vs Despero as a toss up. Their battle would take quite a while.

But Silver Surfer and Thor > Supes and Cap.

So I'm handing this to Marvel.

Thor gets taken down first pitting Superman, Captain Marvel, and Despero against Silver Surfer, and Thanos..I do believe Despero's TP is strong enough to give Thanos hell and at least weaken him for a short time..Captain Marvel is actually a better matchup against Silver Surfer than Superman Due to Silver Surfer's power of being able to absorb and discharge cosmic matter..This doesn't necessarily mean Superman can't battle characters wth this power because he has before..Captain Marvel however, is smart enough not to take a chance when he knows it may take all three of them to eventually take down Thanos..In the end,I see DC winning a rough and rugged battle..

Thanos solos

@apex_pretador: And you had to bump this exactly because?

@thekinfing:

I was looking for SS vs despro thread.

How is despero beating thanos? is my question.

Thanos beats despero

Surfer beats superman

Thor loses to CM

Despero is a cosmic level telepath, he should be easily capable of making Thor and Silver Surfer fight against eachother, making the fight a stomp for team 1.