#201 Posted by Pokergeist (22299 posts) - - Show Bio

@illuminatus: I will let this one slide, but only because my brain broke trying to understand.

#202 Posted by the creator (8559 posts) - - Show Bio

@buckshot: I agree. Forever should be inducted irrespective of this vote. I know he damn well earned his place.

#203 Edited by Buckshot (18865 posts) - - Show Bio

@buckshot: I agree. Forever should be inducted irrespective of this vote. I know he damn well earned his place.

I was thinking about doing it actually. I was debating if it would undermine the community voting aspect of the whole thing, but then, most of the community that knew him is gone (which is why he'll likely never make it in any of these threads) and anyone who isn't would want him there. The other issue though is that there isn't a place where this list is kept for me to change it. Or if there is, I don't know where it is because I've not cared enough to find out.

Moderator
#204 Edited by Chaos Prime (10581 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_creator @buckshot regarding forever imo u should either include him in the original list as a 6th member of the Hof or do the whole thing again for the first HoF awards.

As the majority have already stated many dont know zero about him & to sully this years HoF with remarks like unjustified is not on imo.

#205 Posted by Buckshot (18865 posts) - - Show Bio

@chaos_prime: That's how I'd do it, put him in right at the top with the rest of the original Hall of Fame.

Moderator
#206 Posted by Illuminatus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio
#207 Edited by Chaos Prime (10581 posts) - - Show Bio

@buckshot said:

@chaos_prime: That's how I'd do it, put him in right at the top with the rest of the original Hall of Fame.

I agree 100%

#208 Posted by TheTrueBarryAllen (2713 posts) - - Show Bio

I was never around for this 'Forever' guy but the way people speak about him here I feel as if he NEEDS to be in the HOF.

I read some of his posts and they were fantastic. So even though I may not have ever had a conversation with him, I'm in agreement that he deserves a spot.

#209 Posted by Pokergeist (22299 posts) - - Show Bio
#210 Edited by Illuminatus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio
#211 Posted by Lvenger (15969 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@illuminatus: Whilst I would say more than one scan can come in handy when trying to support or strengthen a point, I get where you're coming from. People do over-rely on scans nowadays to make their cases.

Waaaagh. In a way I know this is directed at me, being that guy described to the T. However I am a firm believer in seeing proof than taking some shmucks word for it. I been in too many debates where someone tells me one thing, think its true, only to see later it was out of context or complete BS how they described it.

That is not how I debate, we all have styles and I own every comic my scans come from. I spent countless hours scanning my own crap as well.

Im tired of hearing people cry over one style over another. I never give my wins to CaV for people who never show proof of claims. But I do not bash on people styles either.

It's not wholly aimed at you at all Cadence. I'm noting a trend that has arisen in the battle forums and whilst I don't fully agree with Illuminatus that scans should completely be ignored in favour of logical arguments, the latter should be prioritised before the former IMO. I try and mix both styles of debating in my own arguments.

#212 Posted by Lvenger (15969 posts) - - Show Bio

I was never around for this 'Forever' guy but the way people speak about him here I feel as if he NEEDS to be in the HOF.

I read some of his posts and they were fantastic. So even though I may not have ever had a conversation with him, I'm in agreement that he deserves a spot.

QFT but I disagree with @buckshot and @the_creator's posts that he should be inducted regardless of votes. Respectfully, I feel that undermines the community participation in choosing the candidates for the HOF. If I were in Forever's position, I'd want to get into the HOF fair and square with getting votes rather than being put in regardless of what other people's thoughts are. And it isn't fair on the other nominees who are also deserving of a place in the HOF.

I concede that a lot of the votes came down to which debaters people knew and that's probably why I nearly got into the HOF myself because people knew of my recent debates. But the fairest way to get into the HOF is to post debates you've been in and let people judge for themselves. That's why I voted for Forever and that's the democratic way things should be done IMO.

#213 Posted by Pokergeist (22299 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@cadencev2 said:

Waaaagh. In a way I know this is directed at me, being that guy described to the T. However I am a firm believer in seeing proof than taking some shmucks word for it. I been in too many debates where someone tells me one thing, think its true, only to see later it was out of context or complete BS how they described it.

That is not how I debate, we all have styles and I own every comic my scans come from. I spent countless hours scanning my own crap as well.

Im tired of hearing people cry over one style over another. I never give my wins to CaV for people who never show proof of claims. But I do not bash on people styles either.

It's not wholly aimed at you at all Cadence. I'm noting a trend that has arisen in the battle forums and whilst I don't fully agree with Illuminatus that scans should completely be ignored in favour of logical arguments, the latter should be prioritised before the former IMO. I try and mix both styles of debating in my own arguments.

Im kinda butt hurt at you and God_Spawn for this right now. I feel I do make great use of scans with Counter arguments, but lately all I hear from Veteran debaters is how I make nothing more than Respect Threads.

#214 Posted by Floopay (7700 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@cadencev2 said:

Waaaagh. In a way I know this is directed at me, being that guy described to the T. However I am a firm believer in seeing proof than taking some shmucks word for it. I been in too many debates where someone tells me one thing, think its true, only to see later it was out of context or complete BS how they described it.

That is not how I debate, we all have styles and I own every comic my scans come from. I spent countless hours scanning my own crap as well.

Im tired of hearing people cry over one style over another. I never give my wins to CaV for people who never show proof of claims. But I do not bash on people styles either.

It's not wholly aimed at you at all Cadence. I'm noting a trend that has arisen in the battle forums and whilst I don't fully agree with Illuminatus that scans should completely be ignored in favour of logical arguments, the latter should be prioritised before the former IMO. I try and mix both styles of debating in my own arguments.

Im kinda butt hurt at you and God_Spawn for this right now. I feel I do make great use of scans with Counter arguments, but lately all I hear from Veteran debaters is how I make nothing more than Respect Threads.

In all fairness, you do tend to put feats first and foremost, and tend to make real arguments secondary, and even tertiary. I do love that you've brought feats to become more prominent in debates, and that's one of the primary reasons I voted for you, so take the rest of what I'm stating as constructive criticism.. That being said, you are easily one of the most aggressive debaters on comicvine, and as threads go on I have observed on multiple occasions that you have been known to get more than a little insulting when people don't agree with your opinion. Personally, I think that you are at your best in your first few posts in any debate. However, as debates go on you seem to attack other people's posting, understate the points they've been trying to make, start skimming over the message their trying to make, and sometimes just flat out dismiss an argument entirely and claim superiority. You are not always to blame for this, though, as I've observed more than a few threads where others seem to attack you first, your scans reliability, or seem to just be trolling you. At the same time, I feel you would do much better and gain a lot more respect if you kept a much more level head in debates, and tried a little hard to respect other arguments while making your own.

Again, I voted for you for a reason, and I really do believe you do an excellent job on this site, and I do like debating with you. I also think you played a major role in teaching people on this site that not all wild claims can be taken for face value, and that sometimes a statement needs to backed up; which some people dislike, but I personally think it's a push forward in debating (as part of any great debate should be providing evidence to support your conclusions).

@god_spawn I'm gonna tag you in here, because you were mentioned by name in the post I'm quoting, and think you should at least see that this response is here in case you'd like to comment further.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#215 Posted by Pokergeist (22299 posts) - - Show Bio

@floopay said:

In all fairness, you do tend to put feats first and foremost, and tend to make real arguments secondary, and even tertiary. I do love that you've brought feats to become more prominent in debates, and that's one of the primary reasons I voted for you, so take the rest of what I'm stating as constructive criticism.. That being said, you are easily one of the most aggressive debaters on comicvine, and as threads go on I have observed on multiple occasions that you have been known to get more than a little insulting when people don't agree with your opinion. Personally, I think that you are at your best in your first few posts in any debate. However, as debates go on you seem to attack other people's posting, understate the points they've been trying to make, start skimming over the message their trying to make, and sometimes just flat out dismiss an argument entirely and claim superiority. You are not always to blame for this, though, as I've observed more than a few threads where others seem to attack you first, your scans reliability, or seem to just be trolling you. At the same time, I feel you would do much better and gain a lot more respect if you kept a much more level head in debates, and tried a little hard to respect other arguments while making your own.

Again, I voted for you for a reason, and I really do believe you do an excellent job on this site, and I do like debating with you. I also think you played a major role in teaching people on this site that not all wild claims can be taken for face value, and that sometimes a statement needs to backed up; which some people dislike, but I personally think it's a push forward in debating (as part of any great debate should be providing evidence to support your conclusions).

@god_spawn I'm gonna tag you in here, because you were mentioned by name in the post I'm quoting, and think you should at least see that this response is here in case you'd like to comment further.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

I do have a hot head and others remind me of that. I hear ya what your saying.

Check out my recent 2 debates vs Kidman650 and GhostRavage. Im am ignoring my current style for what I use to do when I first joined. See if that keeps from overwhelming people with the scan bombs.

#216 Posted by Floopay (7700 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: K. I try to vote on those threads, but I have a very limited time on Comicvine, and always keep them open in tabs on my browser, but I usually only get about halfway through before I get distracted. If I were being honest, I only vote in about 1 out of every 5 threads I'm asked to vote in, so I'm working on that.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#217 Posted by Pokergeist (22299 posts) - - Show Bio

@floopay said:

@cadencev2: K. I try to vote on those threads, but I have a very limited time on Comicvine, and always keep them open in tabs on my browser, but I usually only get about halfway through before I get distracted. If I were being honest, I only vote in about 1 out of every 5 threads I'm asked to vote in, so I'm working on that.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

I hate voting on threads with more than 5 posts of back and forth.

#218 Edited by Wolverine08 (26225 posts) - - Show Bio

@floopay said:

In all fairness, you do tend to put feats first and foremost, and tend to make real arguments secondary, and even tertiary. I do love that you've brought feats to become more prominent in debates, and that's one of the primary reasons I voted for you, so take the rest of what I'm stating as constructive criticism.. That being said, you are easily one of the most aggressive debaters on comicvine, and as threads go on I have observed on multiple occasions that you have been known to get more than a little insulting when people don't agree with your opinion. Personally, I think that you are at your best in your first few posts in any debate. However, as debates go on you seem to attack other people's posting, understate the points they've been trying to make, start skimming over the message their trying to make, and sometimes just flat out dismiss an argument entirely and claim superiority. You are not always to blame for this, though, as I've observed more than a few threads where others seem to attack you first, your scans reliability, or seem to just be trolling you. At the same time, I feel you would do much better and gain a lot more respect if you kept a much more level head in debates, and tried a little hard to respect other arguments while making your own.

Again, I voted for you for a reason, and I really do believe you do an excellent job on this site, and I do like debating with you. I also think you played a major role in teaching people on this site that not all wild claims can be taken for face value, and that sometimes a statement needs to backed up; which some people dislike, but I personally think it's a push forward in debating (as part of any great debate should be providing evidence to support your conclusions).

@god_spawn I'm gonna tag you in here, because you were mentioned by name in the post I'm quoting, and think you should at least see that this response is here in case you'd like to comment further.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

I do have a hot head and others remind me of that. I hear ya what your saying.

Check out my recent 2 debates vs Kidman650 and GhostRavage. Im am ignoring my current style for what I use to do when I first joined. See if that keeps from overwhelming people with the scan bombs.

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