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#51 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

Darth Paul says:

"In Vader's own words… "The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force." i.e. no matter how angry or strong Hulk gets with the Force at his side Vader wins. The Force is the ultimate power in the universe and in the right hands of a powerful sith or jedi something that not even a living weapon of mass destruction such as the Hulk can withstand.
Post Edited:2007-04-17 15:25:27"

remember the force yes, yoda no, ankain/vader no. even luke no, none of them have done anything close to that, the force was around before jedi/sith, and will be around....long after

it a power in it universe and it has it limits...and cost!!!!!(DARK SIDE)

how do we even know the force will work on the hulk now that i think about it,

it did not work on invaders from outside the know galaxy of stw, the Yuuzhan Vong, the force did not reall work on them?

vader may just lose his other hand(you know those skywalkers always losing body parts) yup may the force be with you

#52 Posted by Darth Paul (273 posts) - - Show Bio

The only aspect of the Force that might not work on the Hulk is the mind tricks. The Hulk is resistant to mental control due the mutiple personalities within Banner, the smart/professor Hulk, Mr. Fixit, Maestro, and even Bruce himself just name the most common ones. Not even Prof. X the most powerful telepathic mind in the Marvel U can take dow the Hulk with his power since he can't lock on to any one personality or else he would have just made Bruce/Hulk a vegetable long ago and the world would've been a safer place already. Anyway what you're trying to say now is that the Force might not work on him, well that's pretty much only determined by which universe this battle is set in and that's not part of this question. It seems to me that we are all just assuming for the sake of argument that no matter if this battle is taking place in the Marvel U or the Star Wars U that the Force is present and Vader can use it against the Hulk. Even if he cannot use it directly agains the Hulk because it doesn't affect him because he's not of the Star Wars Galaxy/Universe it doesn't really matter because there would be other ways in which Vader could use the Force indirectly such as his martial arts, super-speed, and the ability to lift and lauch other objects at Hulk to keep him at bay. Plus a light saber can cut through anything even the Hulk, and unless he really can do one of those lame ass regeneration things from a single cell like Wolverine can, and even if he could it would take moths or years for him to regenerate his entire self, Vader would have his head before the Hulk even touched him. He wouldn't even have to physically get close to the Hulk to do the decapitation all he has to do is Force guide the saber right through Hulk's skull.

#53 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

whoa whoa whoa, stop the press where does a jedi, besides maybe a comic use ma(martial arts)

now if you mean lightsabers, that all they really use??

once agian, there are heros that hit hurt with energy beams and what not, and it does not phase him?

how does a lightsaber do(explain please, keeping in mind those things)(how does a plasma beam not hurt him, but a plasma blade?)

all i stated was that the force does not always work well....if it did the Yuuzhan Vong, would not have been such a problem...(just wonder would this apply to hulk)

and yes the hulk regens quite fast

i like the keeping force in though.... hulk has fought people faster than vader, who are better fighters, and far stronger and won....what if hulk catches the light saber and break it/eats it lol, not looking good

if this was obi wan vs hulk ill say obi wan, the guy waxed everyone he fought..vader didnot even really kill him poking around like where did he go

#54 Posted by Ms. Invisible (3292 posts) - - Show Bio

Sync says:

"what if hulk catches the light saber and break it/eats it lol, not looking good"

Well that would be an embarrassing death.

#55 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio

Femoceanique says:

"Darth Vader never wins in the end. He only wins some battles but the good guy always wins the war. So of course the Hulk would smash and win."

Since win is the Hulk considered a good guy? AND WERE ARE ALL THESE FREAK'N HULK FANATICS COMING FROM?

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#56 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

Ms. Invisible says:

"Sync says:
" what if hulk catches the light saber and break it/eats it lol, not looking good "
Well that would be an embarrassing death. "

assume the light saber has any affect on him,

and crush a lightsaber is well in his means

even eating it..

now one every said he ate the light end but no one never said he didnt

but for pete sake, will the blade hurt him?

the hulk has been hit by lot of marvel enegry powers and most of them had no effect?

how can a lightsowrd made of plasma do it, if he surives the heat of nuclear blast and such?

#57 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader doesnt need the Lightsaber to kill the Hulk. He could crush his windpipe like that. The Hulk still breaths doesnt he?

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#58 Posted by Nameless one (516 posts) - - Show Bio

Kalesniko says:

"I wish people would stop saying that the Hulk could use the force. I dont know if these people have never seen a Star Wars movie or what. The force comes from mediclorans, since when did the Hulk get those?"

Again good point I guess that means it would be Vaders Victory no matter what

#59 Posted by Darth Paul (273 posts) - - Show Bio

Ms. Invisible says:

"Sync says:
"what if hulk catches the light saber and break it/eats it lol, not looking good"

Well that would be an embarrassing death.

"

The Hulk wouldn't be able to catch the lightsaber, Vader could make the blade spin so fast that it would be a whirling blade of energy that would cut the Hulk to shreds. It would be similiar to what the Emperor did to Yoda in Revenge of the Sith where he spun all the senate chamber seats at him. Bottom line is that the Force is the deciding factor here. Without it Vader isn't anything, he's not even himself, he's Han Solo. Han Solo wouldn't stand a chance since he doesn't have command of the Force and just his puny blaster. Vader has way to many tricks up his sleave with his Force powers. You can't take away the Force powers, it negates the entire battle. As for whether or not Hulk could actually withstand the blade of the lightsaber and comparing it to him surviving other energy attacks and nuclear blasts, etc. Well look at it this way, Hulk can survive nuclear basts because he was created from one. and the lightsaber isn't just a white hot plasma energy blade, it's the ultimate weapon of the Star Wars Universe, it's blade is indestructable and it can cut through anything. It's equivalent to Admantium, but instead of a metal it's energy, but it does the same thing, and Wolverine's adamantium can injure the Hulk and so could Vader's lightsaber. Oh, and Jedi and Sith do use martial arts, look at Darth Maul. It also has a name in the SWU, it's called Teras Kasi and there was even a video game for it. It involves more than just the swordplay and there are various forms of it.

#60 Posted by Broken Arrow (493 posts) - - Show Bio

Its clear to me all your Star War knowledge comes from the movies, did you know theres a whole universe of Star Wars in comics? You should check it out before you diss Dart Mual. Lesser man then Vader have beaten the Hulk.

#61 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

errrrrr, han solo is bad in his on right, lots of jedi have got WHOOOPED by lesser so call people you say.

Do you know much about han solo background and history, if you did you would have choose better

we may get whoop by the hulk, but hes not dumb enough to fight him, he could talk, smoothe his way out of it(if we base this off the books/movies)

han solo is teh second faster if not faster blaster pistol drawer...you can clam oh jedi/sith you want, but han can hold his on, and has done so without jedi force training.

no the lightsaber is not the ulimate energy weapon of starwars, a weapon is just as good as the one who weild it, fact of starwars is that its frozen blade techology, and that normal people use them before the jedi made it there symbol.

there are alot of things stronger than lightsaber, a sithsword it able to go toe n toe with a light saber, there are two metals that can stop a lightsaber, lightsaber are good weapons, but boba fett, best hunter stw does not use one?

injury and kill are 2 diffent thing, you can hurt someone that does not always mean you beat him, and hurting hulk is not good mojo...

adamantium and lightsaber are 2 different things, but i understand that you saying

what ma did darth maul do?(yes he wushu"imo" jump around ma, no real appcaltion in rl, but has it worth" , all he did was flip around,

"ma is fist of fury, druken monkey, fearless"in the 1st 3 stw where was this so called ma(they did that to hype stw up, make darth maul oooo to the eyes , it seemed to worked) even after esisope 1, you did not see that stuff???

now really do we need to drag swu in this, there are many forms in stw/swu, teras kasi was not made by jedi, some take it, not many... there is really no jedi ma made by them, execpt the lightsaber form(which is sword play)

where does darth varder use ma, why not aginst luke?, why not agianst obi wan? why he did not have it, the movies have shown it all of them, darth maul is the only one that may do something that was close, and that was just flippin n stuff, no fighting without lightsaber? all jedi do when a lightsaber is away is use the force, which as seen in movies.(which are the main source)

they have never really went up and kapow.

who cares what made him, hes surives nuclear blast, radation, plamsa beams

i guess is best to say, that will all for the sake of this trend say, it can injury him(thats is fair)

#62 Posted by TimeKeeper (1222 posts) - - Show Bio

I gotta say that although the Hulk is extremely powerful, Vader has the force which trumps power. I don't know everything there is to know about the Hulk, and I don't know everything that's ever made him bleed, but knowing the kinds of things light sabers have penetrated before, there's no way Hulk's skin could stand up to one like another saber would. That being the case, all Vader has to do is keep his distance from the Hulk, while using his light saber to keep Hulk away. Hulk MIGHT stand .001% chance to take out that saber and beat Vader. And he's only got that if Vader has only one saber on him. Think of the Hulk shake Vader would enjoy if he had several sabers against the Hulk!

And I really fail to see how someone (I forget who, sorry!) thinks that if Vader can't beat the Hulk, Luke could. Maybe someone could explain that one to me.

He also could use the force to move, crush, and implode Hulk's internal organs and/or wind pipe. Vader wins.

#63 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

Kalesniko says:

"Its clear to me all your Star War knowledge comes from the movies, did you know theres a whole universe of Star Wars in comics? You should check it out before you diss Dart Mual. Lesser man then Vader have beaten the Hulk."

are you applying to me,

as if, so now the expanded staw wars is now in use, what about it.

darth maul still does not uses any martial arts in it!!

he beats a sith witch, he uses no ma

he comes back and fights obi wan, and gets shot by luke uncle

and less men have beat vader/ trick him(hes not too much smarter hulk, but thats "imo")

the only time darth maul comes close to ma, really in the books is when he fights a jedi master that has master a hand form, and even than they do not use ma but force power

vader will never or can never reach the skywalker true power, thanks to a lesser(more smarter/dangerous) chopping him down(vader has ego and pride, why he almost all robot/machine now)

im almost a bigger stw fans than comic, i have all the games made current, most of the books(not older version worth lot money)

ma(martial arts mean just that, hand fighting, kicks leg work, bridgeing,blocking, etc)

maybe do jedi use or shown they use ma trend should be made???( so not to take away form this post main focus)

#64 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio

You keep avoding the fact that Vader could use the force and crush the Hulks windpipe, does the Hulk still need to breath? If so he's going down.

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#65 Posted by Nameless one (516 posts) - - Show Bio

Darth Paul says:

"Ms. Invisible says:
"Sync says:
" what if hulk catches the light saber and break it/eats it lol, not looking good "
Well that would be an embarrassing death. "
The Hulk wouldn't be able to catch the lightsaber, Vader could make the blade spin so fast that it would be a whirling blade of energy that would cut the Hulk to shreds. It would be similiar to what the Emperor did to Yoda in Revenge of the Sith where he spun all the senate chamber seats at him. Bottom line is that the Force is the deciding factor here. Without it Vader isn't anything, he's not even himself, he's Han Solo. Han Solo wouldn't stand a chance since he doesn't have command of the Force and just his puny blaster. Vader has way to many tricks up his sleave with his Force powers. You can't take away the Force powers, it negates the entire battle. As for whether or not Hulk could actually withstand the blade of the lightsaber and comparing it to him surviving other energy attacks and nuclear blasts, etc. Well look at it this way, Hulk can survive nuclear basts because he was created from one. and the lightsaber isn't just a white hot plasma energy blade, it's the ultimate weapon of the Star Wars Universe, it's blade is indestructable and it can cut through anything. It's equivalent to Admantium, but instead of a metal it's energy, but it does the same thing, and Wolverine's adamantium can injure the Hulk and so could Vader's lightsaber. Oh, and Jedi and Sith do use martial arts, look at Darth Maul. It also has a name in the SWU, it's called Teras Kasi and there was even a video game for it. It involves more than just the swordplay and there are various forms of it."

Wow that was actually quite interesting and informative

good read real good

#66 Posted by Ms. Invisible (3292 posts) - - Show Bio

Which I forgot to mention in my first post that Vader could just throw the lightsaber and boom, there goes Hulk's head. Even if the Hulk were to catch it, it's most likely he'll catch the energy of the blade rather than the hilt. It spins pretty fast.

#67 Posted by shamgar (164 posts) - - Show Bio

ok hulk has bliding speed and can heal faster than logan plus vader is considered one of the weakest sith known his own master said that he said i even built him with clumbys limbs. read the book dark lord this will explain vaders life as a dark lord.

#68 Posted by Darth Paul (273 posts) - - Show Bio

Sync says:

"errrrrr, han solo is bad in his on right, lots of jedi have got WHOOOPED by lesser so call people you say.Do you know much about han solo background and history, if you did you would have choose betterwe may get whoop by the hulk, but hes not dumb enough to fight him, he could talk, smoothe his way out of it(if we base this off the books/movies)han solo is teh second faster if not faster blaster pistol drawer...you can clam oh jedi/sith you want, but han can hold his on, and has done so without jedi force training.no the lightsaber is not the ulimate energy weapon of starwars, a weapon is just as good as the one who weild it, fact of starwars is that its frozen blade techology, and that normal people use them before the jedi made it there symbol.there are alot of things stronger than lightsaber, a sithsword it able to go toe n toe with a light saber, there are two metals that can stop a lightsaber, lightsaber are good weapons, but boba fett, best hunter stw does not use one?injury and kill are 2 diffent thing, you can hurt someone that does not always mean you beat him, and hurting hulk is not good mojo...adamantium and lightsaber are 2 different things, but i understand that you sayingwhat ma did darth maul do?(yes he wushu"imo" jump around ma, no real appcaltion in rl, but has it worth" , all he did was flip around,"ma is fist of fury, druken monkey, fearless"in the 1st 3 stw where was this so called ma(they did that to hype stw up, make darth maul oooo to the eyes , it seemed to worked) even after esisope 1, you did not see that stuff???now really do we need to drag swu in this, there are many forms in stw/swu, teras kasi was not made by jedi, some take it, not many... there is really no jedi ma made by them, execpt the lightsaber form(which is sword play)where does darth varder use ma, why not aginst luke?, why not agianst obi wan? why he did not have it, the movies have shown it all of them, darth maul is the only one that may do something that was close, and that was just flippin n stuff, no fighting without lightsaber? all jedi do when a lightsaber is away is use the force, which as seen in movies.(which are the main source)they have never really went up and kapow.who cares what made him, hes surives nuclear blast, radation, plamsa beamsi guess is best to say, that will all for the sake of this trend say, it can injury him(thats is fair)"

1.) Not to discredit Han or anything, and he's not really the focus of this topic anyway, but I was just using Han as an example because if Anikin wasn't a Jedi he'd be a similar "Han Solo like character". Their traits are very similar, cocky, hot shot pilots, cunning warriors. Anikin/Vader has the edge because of his ability to use the Force…oh, and btw it was The Force that allowed Vader to block all of Han's blaster bolts with his freakin' hand and snatch ol' Han's reliable blaster from his hand in seconds in ESB. So, no matter how fast Han is at drawing his weapon, he can't fight a Jedi/Sith and he wouldn't just smooth talk the Hulk into calming down. He might have the balls to deal with Chewbacca, but as formidable as Wookies are they aren't Hulks. Perhaps we could make another battle topic for this, but that's all I'm saying for now as I've explained my point.

2.) Where do you get that normal people used lightsabers before the Jedi made it their symbol. I've read quite a few Star Wars novels myself and a lightsaber is one of the most difficult things to construct, it takes a knoweldge of the Force to even get the crystals that power them to align properly or you'd kill yourself just by turning it on! Plus the more crystals you use to power it the hotter and more powerful the energy blade is, we don't know how much power Vader's saber has, and it's probably the same as all the others, but the Sith have been known to experiment with making their weapons more powerful than what the Jedi use just so that they can destroy the Jedi so there's a possiblity that Vader's is better made than most others. Oh, and you obviously don't even know what a Sith Saber is. Of course it can go toe to toe with a lightsaber, it is a lightsaber. It's just two lightsabers attached together. If it's more powerful than a standard lightsaber, which it might well be than it is, but it doesn't make it the ultimate weapon in the SWU over a standard lightsabler, because they are still basically the same thing. Now don't go twisting this and saying that I am condtricting myself because I'm not, all I'm saying is that these weapons all have different power levels and you need to be a Jedi or Sith to even know how to construct one, and use it properly - sure Han wielded Luke's to cut open the Tauntaun but he could never fight with it properly, and thirdly that just because one version of the weapon is more powerful than the other weapon doesn't make the stronger version of the same weapon the ultimate weapon - it's just a stronger version of the same thing.

3.) What two metals can stop a lightsaber, George Lucas himself has stated in an interview that the only thing that can stop a lightsaber is those funky energy rods that General Grevious' troops carried and the Jedi were even able to find a way around that obsticle. Oh and regarding Jango/Boba Fett (Yes, you only mentioned Boba, but he's a clone of Jango so they're basically the same guy) yeah they really held their own against the Jedi. If if wasn't for his ship the Slave I, Jango would've gotten his ass handed to him by Obi Wan and Oops He did later by Mace Windu, or was that his head? I can't remember, LOL! Well anyway he got litterally got a part of him handed to himself when his clone "son" picked up his "father'" severed head. Oh, and then "jr." was such a badass in his own right when Luke cut his blaster in half and a blind Han hit his rocket pack sending him into the Sarlacc pit. Yeah, a non-Jedi/Sith can really take them on one on one with their "superior weapons" that aren't lightsabers.

4.) If Vader can injure the Hulk with his lightsaber and/or his Force powers he can kill the Hulk with them. Oh, and in case you didn't know that even though the Hulk is a rampaging force of nature he doesn't kill. Vader does.

5.) Yes, I know that Adamantium and lightsabers are two different things. I wasn't saying that they were one and the same, I was just trying to make the annalogy between them based on the fact that they are both indestrucitble forms of matter that can't be destroyed and cut through everything. I'm glad that you at least understood that.

6.) Since when are acrobatics not a part of martial arts? It's not all just punches and kicks and blocks. There are hand to hand martial arts and weaponry martial arts. Ok, Teras Kasi may not have been invented by the Jedi or Sitm and some might take it and others not, but I didn't say that. True, all they might have is the swordplay and even in that there are different levels and styles, but the Jedi and Sith are based upon Samurai and Ninja respectively. The Jedi being the Samurai live by a strict code of conduct, they will kill if need be, but take no pleasure in it, nor do they have a fighting style full of flashy acrobatic martial arts moves, it's mostly just defesive swordplay yes, but the Sith are the shadowy ninja they fight dirty and have lots of tricks up their sleaves and make a show of it. Darth Maul is the prime example of this. Even Dooku/Tyrannus and to some extent Sidious were shown to have some aerial manuevers and as sense of style to their swordfighting. When Vader was Anikin he didn't flip around so much, but he was a fast and furious sword fighter and could hold two swords, and even Yoda's fighting style was full of blinding fast acrobatics. I know it's a round about way of saying this but what I'm getting at is that the nature of the Force is that if one user can do a particular trick with it such as the martial arts acrobatics then another can. Just because Vader has never been shown doing it doesn't mean he can't. Perhaps he chooses not to since he's mostly a machine and doesn't care to risk any more damage to himself than what he's already sustained who knows, maybe he finally learned not to be so reckless as he was when he was younger and that's why he mostly just chokes people. However, if you want the real reason Vader doesn't do all of the stuff that Maul does and none of the others do anything of that that's even close except for maybe Yoda and his fighting style, well it's quite simple really it's because it's a series of films that were created backwards. The first 3 were made in the late 70's/early 80's and they didn't have the computer technology to make Obi Wan and Vader do all kinds of neat tricks and plus the budgets were too low to get decent coreography so they mostly just stood around like they were having a kendo match. It got better in ROTJ, between Luke and Vader with the close ups and somewhat faster swordfighting, but they still weren't at the level that they could achieve with the pre-quels. Oh, and would it really be all that interesting if they all were shown on screen fighting the same way as Maul? You can't have 3-6 movies with all the Jedi & Sith all fighting exactly alike with flips and kicks and things geting thrown about everywhere it would be pretty boring. Different characters, different personalities, different fighting styles, doesn't mean that they all can't do it, it just wasn't shown that way to give some variety. I'll reiterate my point, the Force here is the deciding factor, it allows Force users the following powers & abilities: mind control, telekinesis, martial arts skill and acrobatics, proper construction of and ability to wield a lightsaber the deadlist hand weapon ever created in their universe and even wield two or a double bladed one which is even more dangerous, and dark side users gain the added skills of line of sight strangulation and force lightning and anything ever exhibited by any one Force user can potentially be used by another.

#69 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio

Finally someone who knows what there talking about.

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#70 Posted by Buckshot (18913 posts) - - Show Bio

Look at the beautiful wall. And you guys say I post big.

EDIT: And it reads good too.
Post Edited:2007-04-19 12:29:07

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#71 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

a sith sword is a crytal alloy.. thats hard enough to withtand light saber blows," you dont know is a attacking remark, but oh well" for some who saids i dont know, all that i will state will show that i do, if it applys to stw, and for you to say i dont, mean your not a trun stw fan or know alot, just maybe have a little info????

i agree the han talkinh to hulk is funny, but that his power smoothness, he talks his way out and is street smart, but im glad you know about han solo..

Cortosis ore , which will shut lightsaber downs, in refine state(expanded) but it was used in major marvel stw comic(cannon)

Phrik , is a heavy alloy in stw

IG-100 series MagnaGuards, who wielded electrified staffs made of Phrik. Darth Sidious' lightsaber had a Phrik alloy covering. The dark troopers also had body armor made of the alloy.(this it what the droids use, though they ahve been confuse as stunstaffs)cannon

mandarioan iron is said to resust stop lightsaber(cannon)

in shatterpoint virbosheilds" resit lightsabers"(cannon)

if you pm or want to ,i will give info and more ,(not to take form trend)

how many jedi died in the mandarioian wars,(jango/boba where mandariona) by these normal hardcore soldiers... a jedi/sith can still be killed you just have to know how, they have been, and i know you know that, if you are a true stw fan.."maybe you love em "

how many "so called i can block blaster fire with my hand" jedi have died, they would have never fallen, no matter how tricked?(seen esposide 3) on the bridge, the soldiers mowed him down, no blocking with hands there and he was "jm"

(but again this is taking form trend)

in rl life, no one jumps around and flips like that, just being honest with you, and even if you process that skill level, a person that goes though the air is a open target, it really fighting 101. It safier to say on you feet, and not expouse your back but please dont take my word for , ask around, even call teh call who played darth maul and ask him?

i agee the force is there weapon "so to speak" it just not ma used lol... teh only one who came close was yoda(they did for oooo ahhh effect) and many fans where mad because they thought he would fight with a more smoothe less physcal way,

being base and doing is to diffent things,, ninja and samurai, are 2 diffent things, a ninja would kill you in your sleep, a smaurai would use honor and wake you 1st...

im glad you say the fact we agree on, honestly lucas could have use ma in his flims he choose not to, i agree that, lightsaber where his things, but there are many ways to show cool ma, he just didnt do, and i accept that they cant, since he didnt really use....even if BASED on samurai/ninja . All the action movies..kung fu movies, and they never got boring, and to tell the truth some of the guys used the same form, in alot of them.. 1-6 movies use and youll saying jedi weilding lightsabers all the time, using the force all the time...(1-6) is not boring???"it was to me.

but that people for ya huh?? lol

a better place as we have said to look, are the comics, expanded universe, and even better the rpg books(they have lots of isssues)

also if the force was use to choke hulk, would that not make him mad???

he goes aganist blackbolt who smallest whisper is like a major force push??

but all in all, dude, im not so sure plasma blade would harm him???

#72 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio

Choking the Hulk wouldnt make him mad, it would make him dead. I admit I didnt read all of your post Sync, cause I cant follow what you say. Thats not a put down its just the way it is.

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#73 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

thank you saying that, english is not my 1st langauge and the keyboard i use is diffent, when the word proceser/trasnlate works, if it does, i do okay if not.....

i did not know if choking would make him mad, or not it seem that if any gets choke they resist the best the can, and hulk seems to get mad when he resist????

but thats thats

so have we estalish if he can withstand a "plasma" blade or not??

#74 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

Buckshot says:

"Look at the beautiful wall. And you guys say I post big. EDIT: And it reads good too.
Post Edited:2007-04-19 12:29:07"

sorry for the typos/mispellings

#75 Posted by shamgar (164 posts) - - Show Bio

Darth Paul says:

"Sync says:
"errrrrr, han solo is bad in his on right, lots of jedi have got WHOOOPED by lesser so call people you say.Do you know much about han solo background and history, if you did you would have choose betterwe may get whoop by the hulk, but hes not dumb enough to fight him, he could talk, smoothe his way out of it(if we base this off the books/movies)han solo is teh second faster if not faster blaster pistol drawer...you can clam oh jedi/sith you want, but han can hold his on, and has done so without jedi force training.no the lightsaber is not the ulimate energy weapon of starwars, a weapon is just as good as the one who weild it, fact of starwars is that its frozen blade techology, and that normal people use them before the jedi made it there symbol.there are alot of things stronger than lightsaber, a sithsword it able to go toe n toe with a light saber, there are two metals that can stop a lightsaber, lightsaber are good weapons, but boba fett, best hunter stw does not use one?injury and kill are 2 diffent thing, you can hurt someone that does not always mean you beat him, and hurting hulk is not good mojo...adamantium and lightsaber are 2 different things, but i understand that you sayingwhat ma did darth maul do?(yes he wushu"imo" jump around ma, no real appcaltion in rl, but has it worth" , all he did was flip around,"ma is fist of fury, druken monkey, fearless"in the 1st 3 stw where was this so called ma(they did that to hype stw up, make darth maul oooo to the eyes , it seemed to worked) even after esisope 1, you did not see that stuff???now really do we need to drag swu in this, there are many forms in stw/swu, teras kasi was not made by jedi, some take it, not many... there is really no jedi ma made by them, execpt the lightsaber form(which is sword play)where does darth varder use ma, why not aginst luke?, why not agianst obi wan? why he did not have it, the movies have shown it all of them, darth maul is the only one that may do something that was close, and that was just flippin n stuff, no fighting without lightsaber? all jedi do when a lightsaber is away is use the force, which as seen in movies.(which are the main source)they have never really went up and kapow.who cares what made him, hes surives nuclear blast, radation, plamsa beamsi guess is best to say, that will all for the sake of this trend say, it can injury him(thats is fair)"

1.) Not to discredit Han or anything, and he's not really the focus of this topic anyway, but I was just using Han as an example because if Anikin wasn't a Jedi he'd be a similar "Han Solo like character". Their traits are very similar, cocky, hot shot pilots, cunning warriors. Anikin/Vader has the edge because of his ability to use the Force…oh, and btw it was The Force that allowed Vader to block all of Han's blaster bolts with his freakin' hand and snatch ol' Han's reliable blaster from his hand in seconds in ESB. So, no matter how fast Han is at drawing his weapon, he can't fight a Jedi/Sith and he wouldn't just smooth talk the Hulk into calming down. He might have the balls to deal with Chewbacca, but as formidable as Wookies are they aren't Hulks. Perhaps we could make another battle topic for this, but that's all I'm saying for now as I've explained my point.

2.) Where do you get that normal people used lightsabers before the Jedi made it their symbol. I've read quite a few Star Wars novels myself and a lightsaber is one of the most difficult things to construct, it takes a knoweldge of the Force to even get the crystals that power them to align properly or you'd kill yourself just by turning it on! Plus the more crystals you use to power it the hotter and more powerful the energy blade is, we don't know how much power Vader's saber has, and it's probably the same as all the others, but the Sith have been known to experiment with making their weapons more powerful than what the Jedi use just so that they can destroy the Jedi so there's a possiblity that Vader's is better made than most others. Oh, and you obviously don't even know what a Sith Saber is. Of course it can go toe to toe with a lightsaber, it is a lightsaber. It's just two lightsabers attached together. If it's more powerful than a standard lightsaber, which it might well be than it is, but it doesn't make it the ultimate weapon in the SWU over a standard lightsabler, because they are still basically the same thing. Now don't go twisting this and saying that I am condtricting myself because I'm not, all I'm saying is that these weapons all have different power levels and you need to be a Jedi or Sith to even know how to construct one, and use it properly - sure Han wielded Luke's to cut open the Tauntaun but he could never fight with it properly, and thirdly that just because one version of the weapon is more powerful than the other weapon doesn't make the stronger version of the same weapon the ultimate weapon - it's just a stronger version of the same thing.

3.) What two metals can stop a lightsaber, George Lucas himself has stated in an interview that the only thing that can stop a lightsaber is those funky energy rods that General Grevious' troops carried and the Jedi were even able to find a way around that obsticle. Oh and regarding Jango/Boba Fett (Yes, you only mentioned Boba, but he's a clone of Jango so they're basically the same guy) yeah they really held their own against the Jedi. If if wasn't for his ship the Slave I, Jango would've gotten his ass handed to him by Obi Wan and Oops He did later by Mace Windu, or was that his head? I can't remember, LOL! Well anyway he got litterally got a part of him handed to himself when his clone "son" picked up his "father'" severed head. Oh, and then "jr." was such a badass in his own right when Luke cut his blaster in half and a blind Han hit his rocket pack sending him into the Sarlacc pit. Yeah, a non-Jedi/Sith can really take them on one on one with their "superior weapons" that aren't lightsabers.

4.) If Vader can injure the Hulk with his lightsaber and/or his Force powers he can kill the Hulk with them. Oh, and in case you didn't know that even though the Hulk is a rampaging force of nature he doesn't kill. Vader does.

5.) Yes, I know that Adamantium and lightsabers are two different things. I wasn't saying that they were one and the same, I was just trying to make the annalogy between them based on the fact that they are both indestrucitble forms of matter that can't be destroyed and cut through everything. I'm glad that you at least understood that.

6.) Since when are acrobatics not a part of martial arts? It's not all just punches and kicks and blocks. There are hand to hand martial arts and weaponry martial arts. Ok, Teras Kasi may not have been invented by the Jedi or Sitm and some might take it and others not, but I didn't say that. True, all they might have is the swordplay and even in that there are different levels and styles, but the Jedi and Sith are based upon Samurai and Ninja respectively. The Jedi being the Samurai live by a strict code of conduct, they will kill if need be, but take no pleasure in it, nor do they have a fighting style full of flashy acrobatic martial arts moves, it's mostly just defesive swordplay yes, but the Sith are the shadowy ninja they fight dirty and have lots of tricks up their sleaves and make a show of it. Darth Maul is the prime example of this. Even Dooku/Tyrannus and to some extent Sidious were shown to have some aerial manuevers and as sense of style to their swordfighting. When Vader was Anikin he didn't flip around so much, but he was a fast and furious sword fighter and could hold two swords, and even Yoda's fighting style was full of blinding fast acrobatics. I know it's a round about way of saying this but what I'm getting at is that the nature of the Force is that if one user can do a particular trick with it such as the martial arts acrobatics then another can. Just because Vader has never been shown doing it doesn't mean he can't. Perhaps he chooses not to since he's mostly a machine and doesn't care to risk any more damage to himself than what he's already sustained who knows, maybe he finally learned not to be so reckless as he was when he was younger and that's why he mostly just chokes people. However, if you want the real reason Vader doesn't do all of the stuff that Maul does and none of the others do anything of that that's even close except for maybe Yoda and his fighting style, well it's quite simple really it's because it's a series of films that were created backwards. The first 3 were made in the late 70's/early 80's and they didn't have the computer technology to make Obi Wan and Vader do all kinds of neat tricks and plus the budgets were too low to get decent coreography so they mostly just stood around like they were having a kendo match. It got better in ROTJ, between Luke and Vader with the close ups and somewhat faster swordfighting, but they still weren't at the level that they could achieve with the pre-quels. Oh, and would it really be all that interesting if they all were shown on screen fighting the same way as Maul? You can't have 3-6 movies with all the Jedi & Sith all fighting exactly alike with flips and kicks and things geting thrown about everywhere it would be pretty boring. Different characters, different personalities, different fighting styles, doesn't mean that they all can't do it, it just wasn't shown that way to give some variety. I'll reiterate my point, the Force here is the deciding factor, it allows Force users the following powers & abilities: mind control, telekinesis, martial arts skill and acrobatics, proper construction of and ability to wield a lightsaber the deadlist hand weapon ever created in their universe and even wield two or a double bladed one which is even more dangerous, and dark side users gain the added skills of line of sight strangulation and force lightning and anything ever exhibited by any one Force user can potentially be used by another."

Thank u for the info however i dont think u have ur ducks in a row talk to me on my vine page. and the metal corsca is light saber proof.

#76 Posted by Darth Paul (273 posts) - - Show Bio

shamgar says:

"Darth Paul says:
"Sync says:
"errrrrr, han solo is bad in his on right, lots of jedi have got WHOOOPED by lesser so call people you say.Do you know much about han solo background and history, if you did you would have choose betterwe may get whoop by the hulk, but hes not dumb enough to fight him, he could talk, smoothe his way out of it(if we base this off the books/movies)han solo is teh second faster if not faster blaster pistol drawer...you can clam oh jedi/sith you want, but han can hold his on, and has done so without jedi force training.no the lightsaber is not the ulimate energy weapon of starwars, a weapon is just as good as the one who weild it, fact of starwars is that its frozen blade techology, and that normal people use them before the jedi made it there symbol.there are alot of things stronger than lightsaber, a sithsword it able to go toe n toe with a light saber, there are two metals that can stop a lightsaber, lightsaber are good weapons, but boba fett, best hunter stw does not use one?injury and kill are 2 diffent thing, you can hurt someone that does not always mean you beat him, and hurting hulk is not good mojo...adamantium and lightsaber are 2 different things, but i understand that you sayingwhat ma did darth maul do?(yes he wushu"imo" jump around ma, no real appcaltion in rl, but has it worth" , all he did was flip around,"ma is fist of fury, druken monkey, fearless"in the 1st 3 stw where was this so called ma(they did that to hype stw up, make darth maul oooo to the eyes , it seemed to worked) even after esisope 1, you did not see that stuff???now really do we need to drag swu in this, there are many forms in stw/swu, teras kasi was not made by jedi, some take it, not many... there is really no jedi ma made by them, execpt the lightsaber form(which is sword play)where does darth varder use ma, why not aginst luke?, why not agianst obi wan? why he did not have it, the movies have shown it all of them, darth maul is the only one that may do something that was close, and that was just flippin n stuff, no fighting without lightsaber? all jedi do when a lightsaber is away is use the force, which as seen in movies.(which are the main source)they have never really went up and kapow.who cares what made him, hes surives nuclear blast, radation, plamsa beamsi guess is best to say, that will all for the sake of this trend say, it can injury him(thats is fair)"

1.) Not to discredit Han or anything, and he's not really the focus of this topic anyway, but I was just using Han as an example because if Anikin wasn't a Jedi he'd be a similar "Han Solo like character". Their traits are very similar, cocky, hot shot pilots, cunning warriors. Anikin/Vader has the edge because of his ability to use the Force…oh, and btw it was The Force that allowed Vader to block all of Han's blaster bolts with his freakin' hand and snatch ol' Han's reliable blaster from his hand in seconds in ESB. So, no matter how fast Han is at drawing his weapon, he can't fight a Jedi/Sith and he wouldn't just smooth talk the Hulk into calming down. He might have the balls to deal with Chewbacca, but as formidable as Wookies are they aren't Hulks. Perhaps we could make another battle topic for this, but that's all I'm saying for now as I've explained my point.

2.) Where do you get that normal people used lightsabers before the Jedi made it their symbol. I've read quite a few Star Wars novels myself and a lightsaber is one of the most difficult things to construct, it takes a knoweldge of the Force to even get the crystals that power them to align properly or you'd kill yourself just by turning it on! Plus the more crystals you use to power it the hotter and more powerful the energy blade is, we don't know how much power Vader's saber has, and it's probably the same as all the others, but the Sith have been known to experiment with making their weapons more powerful than what the Jedi use just so that they can destroy the Jedi so there's a possiblity that Vader's is better made than most others. Oh, and you obviously don't even know what a Sith Saber is. Of course it can go toe to toe with a lightsaber, it is a lightsaber. It's just two lightsabers attached together. If it's more powerful than a standard lightsaber, which it might well be than it is, but it doesn't make it the ultimate weapon in the SWU over a standard lightsabler, because they are still basically the same thing. Now don't go twisting this and saying that I am condtricting myself because I'm not, all I'm saying is that these weapons all have different power levels and you need to be a Jedi or Sith to even know how to construct one, and use it properly - sure Han wielded Luke's to cut open the Tauntaun but he could never fight with it properly, and thirdly that just because one version of the weapon is more powerful than the other weapon doesn't make the stronger version of the same weapon the ultimate weapon - it's just a stronger version of the same thing.

3.) What two metals can stop a lightsaber, George Lucas himself has stated in an interview that the only thing that can stop a lightsaber is those funky energy rods that General Grevious' troops carried and the Jedi were even able to find a way around that obsticle. Oh and regarding Jango/Boba Fett (Yes, you only mentioned Boba, but he's a clone of Jango so they're basically the same guy) yeah they really held their own against the Jedi. If if wasn't for his ship the Slave I, Jango would've gotten his ass handed to him by Obi Wan and Oops He did later by Mace Windu, or was that his head? I can't remember, LOL! Well anyway he got litterally got a part of him handed to himself when his clone "son" picked up his "father'" severed head. Oh, and then "jr." was such a badass in his own right when Luke cut his blaster in half and a blind Han hit his rocket pack sending him into the Sarlacc pit. Yeah, a non-Jedi/Sith can really take them on one on one with their "superior weapons" that aren't lightsabers.

4.) If Vader can injure the Hulk with his lightsaber and/or his Force powers he can kill the Hulk with them. Oh, and in case you didn't know that even though the Hulk is a rampaging force of nature he doesn't kill. Vader does.

5.) Yes, I know that Adamantium and lightsabers are two different things. I wasn't saying that they were one and the same, I was just trying to make the annalogy between them based on the fact that they are both indestrucitble forms of matter that can't be destroyed and cut through everything. I'm glad that you at least understood that.

6.) Since when are acrobatics not a part of martial arts? It's not all just punches and kicks and blocks. There are hand to hand martial arts and weaponry martial arts. Ok, Teras Kasi may not have been invented by the Jedi or Sitm and some might take it and others not, but I didn't say that. True, all they might have is the swordplay and even in that there are different levels and styles, but the Jedi and Sith are based upon Samurai and Ninja respectively. The Jedi being the Samurai live by a strict code of conduct, they will kill if need be, but take no pleasure in it, nor do they have a fighting style full of flashy acrobatic martial arts moves, it's mostly just defesive swordplay yes, but the Sith are the shadowy ninja they fight dirty and have lots of tricks up their sleaves and make a show of it. Darth Maul is the prime example of this. Even Dooku/Tyrannus and to some extent Sidious were shown to have some aerial manuevers and as sense of style to their swordfighting. When Vader was Anikin he didn't flip around so much, but he was a fast and furious sword fighter and could hold two swords, and even Yoda's fighting style was full of blinding fast acrobatics. I know it's a round about way of saying this but what I'm getting at is that the nature of the Force is that if one user can do a particular trick with it such as the martial arts acrobatics then another can. Just because Vader has never been shown doing it doesn't mean he can't. Perhaps he chooses not to since he's mostly a machine and doesn't care to risk any more damage to himself than what he's already sustained who knows, maybe he finally learned not to be so reckless as he was when he was younger and that's why he mostly just chokes people. However, if you want the real reason Vader doesn't do all of the stuff that Maul does and none of the others do anything of that that's even close except for maybe Yoda and his fighting style, well it's quite simple really it's because it's a series of films that were created backwards. The first 3 were made in the late 70's/early 80's and they didn't have the computer technology to make Obi Wan and Vader do all kinds of neat tricks and plus the budgets were too low to get decent coreography so they mostly just stood around like they were having a kendo match. It got better in ROTJ, between Luke and Vader with the close ups and somewhat faster swordfighting, but they still weren't at the level that they could achieve with the pre-quels. Oh, and would it really be all that interesting if they all were shown on screen fighting the same way as Maul? You can't have 3-6 movies with all the Jedi & Sith all fighting exactly alike with flips and kicks and things geting thrown about everywhere it would be pretty boring. Different characters, different personalities, different fighting styles, doesn't mean that they all can't do it, it just wasn't shown that way to give some variety. I'll reiterate my point, the Force here is the deciding factor, it allows Force users the following powers & abilities: mind control, telekinesis, martial arts skill and acrobatics, proper construction of and ability to wield a lightsaber the deadlist hand weapon ever created in their universe and even wield two or a double bladed one which is even more dangerous, and dark side users gain the added skills of line of sight strangulation and force lightning and anything ever exhibited by any one Force user can potentially be used by another."

Thank u for the info however i dont think u have ur ducks in a row talk to me on my vine page. and the metal corsca is light saber proof."

What just because I didn't know about a metal or two that is lightsaber proof? Give me a break, I said specifically that Lucas himself said that nothing but those staffs can stop a lightsaber. Now, if these metals are from somewhere from the expanded universe which anyone who follows SW knows isn't neccessarily cannon because it's not what Lucas has said. Geez, I never said I was the ulimate SW expert, but I'm just as old as the franchise it self and have grown up following it and know more about it than most, some of you might know more than me, so what, it's not possible to know everything about every character and every single aspect of the SWU. Based on what I do know I think that I've made some pretty good arguments and some others here have agreed with me. Besides, George Lucas is the be all end all to SW and if he doesn't agree with it it doesn't exist. Either way that's somewhat moot here, the real point is that I'm saying that a lightsaber could hurt the Hulk you Sync, and some others are saying no. Others are saying that he wouldn't need the saber and would just use the Force choke and end it as quick as that. I never disagreed with that position and really based upon Vader's character that's probably the way he would go. Even though I stated that he could do all of the Force moves like the others and perform all sorts of aerial maneuvers, etc. he probably wouldn't since that's what turned him into the cyborg in the first place when he tried it on Obi Wan. So therefore Vader is a more cautious individual who has been shown to rely more on his other Force skills instead of the acrobatics and lightsaber. Therefore most likely he would defeat the Hulk with the Force choke or the calming technique, or even a combination of both, and then when he reverts to Banner and is unconscious or even dead from the lack of oxygen Vader moves in for the kill and severs the now vulnerable Banner's head with his lightsaber. End of battle, end of story.

#77 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

WOW Darth Paul,....

1st) relax take a chill pill???? thatst a big wall of ahhhhhhh.

2nd) no ones not knocking you for not knowing, if you dont known you just dont know, but if someone informs you and you still at against....not much to say there...

I have hard time following george lucas, and i really dont listem too much to him, cause all he does is try to make things his way, as a fan you should all to well know that, in marevl comics which came out in the stw time your days (iguess, 70/80s) they use those items/metal....

i agree some things are tricky when expanded are use, but they took 2 of the main charcthers form expanded and put them in the main stw, and in there back ground the use/encounter the metal..

also in the rpg, which lucas approves/the minture games they have stats/usage with the metal..

but oh well, this is just small info no need to get bent about it my friend....

this is just one of those post where the line are divided, either for or against. I feel any attack on the hulk pisses him off, from a lame choke hold, which seems to be the bread butter agurement or force clam(which has not been use in a movie really,but comics alot)

also no one knows or is sure about if a plamsa blade would harm him or not, some feel it does other not?

and over all this is why vaders loses,(YEAH IM EVIL FOR THIS) the lame idiots is in a envoiment suit, if it gets damage or mess up he will die.....in a battle with hulk, that suit is going to get messed up crack or what ever....

even in the deathstar, the only ,ONLY place he can rest is in a SPECIAL room for him....

#78 Posted by Boken (7756 posts) - - Show Bio

Vadar wins hands down

#79 Posted by Emperor Gonzo Noir (19714 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk dismembers

#80 Posted by wolverine54 (353 posts) - - Show Bio

vader would kick his a$$

#81 Posted by Dro (941 posts) - - Show Bio
@Gambler said:
"

Choking the Hulk wouldnt make him mad, it would make him dead. I admit I didnt read all of your post Sync, cause I cant follow what you say. Thats not a put down its just the way it is.

"
Hulk doesn't need to breathe very often. He can hold his breath for very long periods of time, and can survive in space without a breathing apparatus. Choking Hulk would just make him mad. Exploding Hulk's internal organs wouldn't necessarily win the fight, as he has a better healing factor than Wolverine, who's survived such attacks. Unfortunately, I don't see a way that Hulk can win this, as Darth Vader can suspend him in the air and destroy him any number of ways. Unfortunately, regardless of Hulk's strength, the nature of his opponent's powers prevents him from bringing his power to bear. Darth Vader wins.

#82 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio
@Dro: LMFAO did you really just respond to something I posted two years ago O_O
Moderator Online
#83 Posted by JThree47693 (2538 posts) - - Show Bio

Hmm....I would go with Vader I dont say a way the Hulk could win.

#84 Posted by Dro (941 posts) - - Show Bio
@Gambler said:
" @Dro: LMFAO did you really just respond to something I posted two years ago O_O "
Yeah, well, it's as wrong today as it was back then.

I don't get why people bring these obvious curbstomps back up though...
#85 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84477 posts) - - Show Bio
@Dro said:
" @Gambler said:
" @Dro: LMFAO did you really just respond to something I posted two years ago O_O "
Yeah, well, it's as wrong today as it was back then.I don't get why people bring these obvious curbstomps back up though... "
He's been defeated by lack of oxygen before ;) its no stretch to think it could be done again.
Moderator Online
#86 Posted by Dro (941 posts) - - Show Bio
@Gambler said:
" @Dro said:
" @Gambler said:
" @Dro: LMFAO did you really just respond to something I posted two years ago O_O "
Yeah, well, it's as wrong today as it was back then.I don't get why people bring these obvious curbstomps back up though... "
He's been defeated by lack of oxygen before ;) its no stretch to think it could be done again. "
I concede the point. Vader would have to hold him still to keep himself from being pulverized, though. Not that it's any problem for one of the most powerful force-users of all time to play force-pinball with a guy who only weighs about half a ton. So I'm wrong and Hulk still loses. Not a good showing for me.
#87 Posted by Cybrilious4 (1766 posts) - - Show Bio

If this is Force Unleash Vader, Hulk wins but with a couple of minutes of difficulty, Vader can jump across 300 ft, force blast open a 70 ton gate on Kashyyke, but Hulk is too strong for Vader. Vader isn't even a moon buster with the force.

#88 Posted by guttridgeb (4831 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk should be able to take this.

#89 Posted by Oscars94 (2322 posts) - - Show Bio

HULK MURDERS PUNY SKYWALKER!

#90 Posted by quatro_briefs (384 posts) - - Show Bio

Would the light sabre slice off Hulk's arms? Can the Force hold him in place?

#91 Edited by Hksaru (463 posts) - - Show Bio

^yes and yes

Vader stomps

#92 Posted by guttridgeb (4831 posts) - - Show Bio

@quatro_briefs said:

Would the light sabre slice off Hulk's arms? Can the Force hold him in place?

Yes, but Hulk has a healing factor that could deal with it. The Force could only restrain Hulk temporarily, Hulk would get angrier and stronger until Vader's telekinetic abilities could not handle Hulk.

#93 Posted by Simon_the_digger (2829 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader would beat Hulk anyday.

#94 Posted by Wolfrazer (6021 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader could just force crush Hulk.

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#95 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@thegaminboy said:

the hulk would rip darth vader to shreads!!! go HULK!!!!

#96 Edited by KnightRise (4785 posts) - - Show Bio

@Cybrilious4: Why the bump?!

Zombie thread!

Vader isn't even a moon buster with the force.

"The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Force."

#97 Posted by quatro_briefs (384 posts) - - Show Bio

Than Vader dies...unfortunately.

#98 Posted by Wolfrazer (6021 posts) - - Show Bio
@KnightRise:  Cookie for you, for getting the line RIGHT!
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#99 Posted by MasterJohn (2471 posts) - - Show Bio

Who brought this thread back!?

#100 Posted by KnightRise (4785 posts) - - Show Bio
Vader isn't even a moon buster with the force.

"The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of Force."

@Wolfrazer: my coworker friend and I speak in Star Wars qoutes lol

@MasterJohn: New guy