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#1 Posted by LubeMan (1067 posts) - - Show Bio

Odd combination, I know, pairing Sidious & Yoda, but unlike ROTS, they are fighting together in this duel.

1. strictly lightsaber battle in the original Deathstar

2. strictly force powers battle in Bespin, cloud city

3. all involved.in a free for all in the forrest of Endor

Bonus battle: Darth Maul vs Darth Malgus vs Exar Kun in a lightsaber battle! (Just wanted to see where Maul stands with these legends?)

#2 Posted by steelhound56 (1074 posts) - - Show Bio

oooooo......

1 and 2 are a stomp in Team Sidious' favor.

Sidious wins the third round.

#3 Edited by ImBoredLetsDebate (471 posts) - - Show Bio

Rounds 1 and 2 are a complete roflstomp in favor of Sidious and Yoda. Like, I don't think Kun and Malgus would last 2 seconds if the teams started right next to each other. If they are starting at a distance then Team 1 lasts as long as it takes Sidious and Yoda to get to them, then add on 2 seconds. Round 2 lasts only as long as Round 1, give or take 2 seconds.

Round 3, Sidious. It would just be a repeat of RotS. Malgus and Kun are non-factors.

Bonus battle - Kun isn't well known with his saber I don't think, and Malgus is pretty good from what I hear, but I'm going with Maul. He has defeated some very notable Jedi.

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#4 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (23816 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1 does not stand a chance in either round 1 or 2

Palpatine wins round 3.

Maul should win the bonus round.

#5 Posted by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio

The first three rounds have no discussion value. Sidious solos the first two rounds and wins Round 3. The debatable match up presented is Maul vs Malgus vs Exar. Maul is the most skilled duelist out of the three, but the other two are more powerful, though whether that would afford them wins over him is arguable. Personally, I would favor Maul for a slight majority, followed by Kun, then Malgus trailing last.

#6 Posted by LubeMan (1067 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow, looks like i've had the wrong idea bout Malgus and Kun especially, being exceptionally skilled with their lightsabers? From what i've read about Malgus's lighting, doesn't it exceeds anyone elses on the playing field?

#7 Posted by ImBoredLetsDebate (471 posts) - - Show Bio

@LubeMan said:

Wow, looks like i've had the wrong idea bout Malgus and Kun especially, being exceptionally skilled with their lightsabers? From what i've read about Malgus's lighting, doesn't it exceeds anyone elses on the playing field?

Sidious has the strongest lightning out of any Sith to ever live, if I recall correctly. Yoda is able to absord/block/redirect that lightning.

@Silver2467 said:

The first three rounds have no discussion value. Sidious solos the first two rounds and wins Round 3. The debatable match up presented is Maul vs Malgus vs Exar. Maul is the most skilled duelist out of the three, but the other two are more powerful, though whether that would afford them wins over him is arguable. Personally, I would favor Maul for a slight majority, followed by Kun, then Malgus trailing last.

But it is only lightsaber combat, so wouldn't Maul be more than a slight majority and Malgus > Kun?

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#8 Posted by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio
@ImBoredLetsDebate: Ah. That was an oversight on my part. I didn't notice it was exclusively a lightsaber duel. In that case, yes, I would favor Maul for a fair majority. He has the best skill feats and the best physical feats out of the three. Regarding Malgus surpassing Kun, personally, that was not my impression, but that could certainly be argued. Malgus has fought Jedi of comparable repute to the Jedi Exar has fought; so there is room for difference of interpretation.
#9 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3159 posts) - - Show Bio

...this is silly. Not only could Sidious solo, but Yoda could too.

Just to drive this home:

That first Jedi who Sidious killed before he could react is at worst, on Malgus and Kun's level, but probably a bit higher. Saesee and Kit are leaps and bounds better than Malgus and Kun, and they were cut down with similar ease.

Also...

Dooku is a vastly superior duelist to Kun and Malgus, and Yoda here had him on the defensive for the entire duel.

I think I've said what's needed to be said.

#10 Posted by ImBoredLetsDebate (471 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@ImBoredLetsDebate: Ah. That was an oversight on my part. I didn't notice it was exclusively a lightsaber duel. In that case, yes, I would favor Maul for a fair majority. He has the best skill feats and the best physical feats out of the three. Regarding Malgus surpassing Kun, personally, that was not my impression, but that could certainly be argued. Malgus has fought Jedi of comparable repute to the Jedi Exar has fought; so there is room for difference of interpretation.

I was just wondering about Kun and Malgus because before, on the ToR forums, he was held in such high regard; both as a force user and lightsaber duelist and was regularly put over Bane (w/o Obelisk) in both categories, who Malgus was compared to (besides being compared to Vader), but here I am learning different.

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#11 Posted by ShootingNova (16119 posts) - - Show Bio

Sidious soloes the first two rounds, and wins round 3. Either Maul or Kun wins 3, but Maul is probably the most likely one.

#12 Posted by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio
@ImBoredLetsDebate: I recall those estimations of Malgus on the TOR forums, and Malgus being compared to Vader with respects to formidability is nonsense. Vader is better at literally everything. His Force feats surpass Malgus', his combat feats surpass Malgus', his physical feats surpass Malgus', his knowledge surpasses Malgus'; he is just...plain...better. Malgus is powerful and does have decent skill feats, but I have seen nothing from him that escalates him to Vader's tier. The only justifiable parallels that can be outlined between Vader and Malgus are the obvious character and design similarities, since Malgus is a blatant imitation of Vader in the OR era. Excluding that, weighing one against the other, Vader preponderates him in very area. The problem with TOR users is their general ignorance of more obscure EU stories; they play a video game like KOTOR, assume that makes them knowledgeable on EU lore, and then arrive at all kinds of absurd conclusions. If you contrasted my opinion with the opinions of most TOR users, you would find disparities between them almost every time.

But back on topic, analogizing Malgus to Bane might be a closer resemblance, but even then, I would be inclined to favor Bane over Malgus as a Force adept. Bane just impresses me more from what I have seen from both, but there might be showings for Malgus in TOR that I'm just unaware of. Skillfully speaking, that again could be argued. Both have their respective skill feats that, when contrasted side by side, could leave some ambiguity as to which should be held in higher esteem. If nothing else though, Malgus might inscrutably eclipse Bane, but I would be very slow to agree that he clearly or definitely does. If you were to align Bane and Malgus feat for feat, category for category, you would probably find more correspondence than outright discrepancy. One might excel in one area more than the other (for instance, Malgus' feats with Force Scream exceed Bane's, in my opinion), but the other would excel in other areas more than the other too (for instance, Bane's feats with Absorption exceed Malgus', in my opinion). And there would be plenty of departments where the two are near identical (for instance, the two equalize one another with Force Speed and Lightning, in my opinion).

As for how that relates to Kun, Exar to me has always seemed to be of similar power to characters like Vader or Bane, but the reason I sometimes am at a loss for whether he might supersede them or not is because his powers are so different from theirs. Vader and Bane, though they do possess many distinct powers from one another, do have talents in related abilities, such as Telekinesis or Rage. But Exar is not an especially powerful telekinetic, his strength feats are few, and he never evinced defensive powers such as Absorption or Deflection. On the other hand, Exar knows more sorcerous powers than Bane or Vader do. So because of the very different nature of Exar's powers as opposed to characters like Vader, Bane, or Malgus, whether he is certainly more powerful than them or not is nebulous. With that said, in terms of lightsaber skill, Kun always seemed somewhat more adroit than Bane or Malgus are. When comparing Exar and Bane, I have long maintained that Exar is the superior duelist; he always just came across as more impressive in his duels than Bane did. Pertaining to Exar and Malgus, once again, my impression between the two also was that Kun was the more exceptional fighter, but like I said, that could just be me. If you objectively look at Malgus and Exar's combative feats and draw the conclusion that Malgus is equal or greater than Kun in that regard, then I can respect that. I might argue it, but if I can at least see how you came to that judgment, you will receive no complaints from me, even if I do disagree (which I may or may not depending on how you explain your case).