#1 Posted by High Revolutionary (3178 posts) - - Show Bio

Another potentially great Marvel vs DC fight. I personally think Odin can take out Darkseid in the long haul. What do you all think?

#2 Posted by acewasp23 (6087 posts) - - Show Bio

well every one else is probably going to say odin but im going with Darkseid.

#3 Posted by High Revolutionary (3178 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump...
#4 Posted by glforthewin (2323 posts) - - Show Bio

new god vs god. nice battle dude. i gotta go with darkseid on this one (omega effect!!!)

#5 Posted by thetitan0 (833 posts) - - Show Bio

i say odin.

#6 Posted by Stormultt (5227 posts) - - Show Bio

odin would win horribly
#7 Posted by Strife (1027 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormultt: lol wut
 
 
Darkseid wins.
#8 Posted by Stormultt (5227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Strife said:
" @Stormultt: lol wut   Darkseid wins. "

does darksied bust galaxies?
#9 Posted by capall (8130 posts) - - Show Bio

good fight, darkseid i believe is physically stronger and more durable, i also believe that omega effect would have a greater damage to odin than odin's magic attacks doing damage to darkseid here 
#10 Posted by kagetaicho (1950 posts) - - Show Bio
@capall said:
" good fight, darkseid i believe is physically stronger and more durable, i also believe that omega effect would have a greater damage to odin than odin's magic attacks doing damage to darkseid here  "
Well Odin can augment his already superhuman strength at will. Also he can absorb all the gods of asgard into himself even Thor. Quite frankly Thor could beat him.
#11 Posted by ThanosIsMad (2215 posts) - - Show Bio

Darkseid wouldn't fare any better than Thanos did, in my opinion.

#12 Posted by capall (8130 posts) - - Show Bio
@kagetaicho said:  Quite frankly Thor could beat him. "

i really don't think so
#13 Posted by Ownerz (1098 posts) - - Show Bio
@capall said:
" @kagetaicho said:  Quite frankly Thor could beat him. "i really don't think so "
Superman etc has beaten Darkseid so Thor being almost equal to guys like Superman has almost the same chance of winning
 
Pre COIE Darkseid vs Odin is a better fight
#14 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17174 posts) - - Show Bio
@ThanosIsMad said:
" Darkseid wouldn't fare any better than Thanos did, in my opinion. "
Agree.
#15 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@czarny_samael:
I agree.  Especially since I don't think the Omega Beams would affect Odin.  Pre Ragnarok he was too important to the universe, besides that he is soooooo powerful.  This is functionally all the gods of Asgard vs Darkseid.  I don't see him winning.
#16 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @czarny_samael: I agree.  Especially since I don't think the Omega Beams would affect Odin.  Pre Ragnarok he was too important to the universe, besides that he is soooooo powerful.  This is functionally all the gods of Asgard vs Darkseid.  I don't see him winning. "
1. How was Odin in any way important to the universe?
2. all the gods of Asgard... What?
#17 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:
He's worshipped as a god by an entire culture, who were proven correct when Thor showed up. That makes him pretty important.  Plus without him you get things like him not being there for Ragnarok, or not being there to defeat Thanos, or any of the other potentially universe ending events he's involved in. 
He is more powerful than all the Asgardians put together, and can use all their abilities.  He can make himself stronger, more durable, resistant to specific attacks, etc...
#18 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: He's worshipped as a god by an entire culture, who were proven correct when Thor showed up. That makes him pretty important.  Plus without him you get things like him not being there for Ragnarok, or not being there to defeat Thanos, or any of the other potentially universe ending events he's involved in. He is more powerful than all the Asgardians put together, and can use all their abilities.  He can make himself stronger, more durable, resistant to specific attacks, etc... "
1. None of that makes him important to the universe. Only beings tied to the existence of the universe are protected by the source, like Galactus. Odin defeating Thanos and being there for Ragnarok has absolutely no importance to the life of the universe. 
2. Darkseid has worshipers throughout the universe, including plenty of Earth's underground, large portion of the now extinct Martian civilization and so on. He is worshiped by the entire Apokolips, and Apokolips is some 40 times bigger than the whole 8 worlds of Asgard (Earth not included). 
3. This means absolutely nothing. Darkseid is more powerful than all the Apokoliptians put together.
#19 Posted by Logic Mark III (2121 posts) - - Show Bio

Omega Effect wouldn't work. 1. Odin could probably absorb/counter/block it 2. He is important. He has been in a few fights that have 'imperilled the universe'. He is a scion of life.
#20 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@Logic Mark III said:
" Omega Effect wouldn't work. 1. Odin could probably absorb/counter/block it 2. He is important. He has been in a few fights that have 'imperilled the universe'. He is a scion of life. "
Fights mean nothing. It's not your actions that make you important to the universe, it's your existence. If galactus dies, the universe goes out. If Odin dies, someone else can take his place in those fights.
#21 Edited by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:

#1 It does make him important to its existence because Thanos is a nihilist who would wipe out existence if he could and if Ragnarok didn't happen as it was supposed to it could unmake everything so he is necessary. 
#2   I'll give you that Darkseid has a greater base of worship. 
#3  This does mean something.  The majority of Apokoliptikans aren't that powerful comparitively.  When's the last time Darkseid destroyed a galaxy or fought another skyfather level being?  Darkseid gets beaten by Superman.  Odin wouldn't.  Darkseid is only slightly above Thanos.  Odin owned Thanos.
#22 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" #1 It does make him important to its existence because Thanos is a nihilist who would wipe out existence if he could and if Ragnarok didn't happen as it was supposed to it could unmake everything so he is necessary. #2   I'll give you that Darkseid has a greater base of worship. #3  This does mean something.  The majority of Apokoliptikans aren't that powerful comparitively.  When's the last time Darkseid destroyed a galaxy or fought another skyfather level being?  Darkseid gets beaten by Superman.  Odin wouldn't.  Darkseid is only slightly above Thanos.  Odin owned Thanos. "
1. No it does not. If Odin didn't stop him, someone else might have. Look at my post above.
 
3. a)Darkseid gets beat by Superman because he doesn't use his powers on him.
b) I doubt Marvel Skyfathers would fare much better. Zeus wasn't really high and mighty when Hulk wound up on Olympus recently.
c) Odin destroying galaxies is bad writing. He was doing that when far more powerful being than him could not. Thor with Odin force KOed himself while performing a planet wide spell. I'm supposed to believe he can waste a galaxy?
#23 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:
The Thor thing was bad writing.
#24 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: The Thor thing was bad writing. "
Why? It makes more sense. Odin destroyed galaxies when Exitar the exterminator, a being who could pwn every god on Earth combined, took centuries of gathering energy to teraform one world. A pissed off Galactus unleashed a blast which destroyed three star systems, even though his enemies, the wave, stretched far longer (and nobody say he was hungry or anything, you can clearly see him absorbing power cosmic from Annihilus' ship). Not to mention that we would have to write off the entire new Thor series as bad writing, since there is ample evidence of his inability to produce destruction much farther than this planet.
#25 Posted by Ownerz (1098 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom said:

" a)Darkseid gets beat by Superman because he doesn't use his powers on him. b) I doubt Marvel Skyfathers would fare much better. Zeus wasn't really high and mighty when Hulk wound up on Olympus recently. c) Odin destroying galaxies is bad writing. He was doing that when far more powerful being than him could not. Thor with Odin force KOed himself while performing a planet wide spell. I'm supposed to believe he can waste a galaxy? "

You can make all the excuses you want but the fact is he lost fights that pre COIE Darkseid would never have lost
 
@AtPhantom said:

" b) I doubt Marvel Skyfathers would fare much better. Zeus wasn't really high and mighty when Hulk wound up on Olympus recently."

  After COIE, Marvel Skyfathers usually have better feats than DC skyfathers
Marvel Zeus is much stronger than DC Zeus, unless you're talking about the guys who was de-powered and turned into a child again
 
 
@AtPhantom said:

" Thor with Odin force KOed himself while performing a planet wide spell. I'm supposed to believe he can waste a galaxy? "

Thor with Odin Force doesn't have even a fraction of the capabilities or experience of his father 
Odin powers:  He fights the Celestials, he shakes the Universe on Galactic scales, he can teleport the entire population of a planet into another dimension,  Odin is a powerhouse, even when not in Asgard. He has alot more experience under his belt than Thor even with the OF, Odin has chopped a Celestials arm off and he has smashed Galaxies
 
Darkseid after COIE has no chance against Odin
#26 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:
Also if fights mean nothing then why is Superman necessary.  His continued existence shouldn't make or unmake the universe.  Plus things like Ragnarok if they don'y happen the way they are foreordained can unmake existence, and Odin is central to Ragnarok.  And I do think that most of the new Thor was badly written.  In Marvel Odin is near Galactus' level.  That's above Darkseid.
#27 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ownerz said:
" You can make all the excuses you want but the fact is he lost fights that pre COIE Darkseid would never have lost"
All avatars and PIS. And I can prove it.

"  After COIE, Marvel Skyfathers usually have better feats than DC skyfathers"
No, I'm talking about Hercules 155.5 when Hulk came to Olympus and the Gods were like "Oh F---, should we evacuate? 

"Thor with Odin Force doesn't have even a fraction of the capabilities or experience of his father  Odin powers:  He fights the Celestials, he shakes the Universe on Galactic scales, he can teleport the entire population of a planet into another dimension,  Odin is a powerhouse, even when not in Asgard. He has alot more experience under his belt than Thor even with the OF, Odin has chopped a Celestials arm off and he has smashed Galaxies  Darkseid after COIE has no chance against Odin "
Odin is an ant to Celestials, and your post clearly shows you read nothing I wrote.
#28 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: Also if fights mean nothing then why is Superman necessary.  His continued existence shouldn't make or unmake the universe.  Plus things like Ragnarok if they don'y happen the way they are foreordained can unmake existence, and Odin is central to Ragnarok.  And I do think that most of the new Thor was badly written.  In Marvel Odin is near Galactus' level.  That's above Darkseid. "
I never said he was important, I merely said Darkseid doesn't use his power on him. If Ragnarok doesn't happen. Earth might be in trouble... Universe could care less. 
In Marvel Odin is nowhere near Galactus. Galactus is a prime cosmic entity, he hangs around with Celestials and vaporizes Watchers. But yes, Galactus is way above Darkseid.
#29 Posted by Logic Mark III (2121 posts) - - Show Bio

@AtPhantom: I know they say Galactus has a purpose, but i don't quite buy it. Can you show me a referrence to that please, not saying you are lying, its just that Celestials do the same job, many characters have destroyed planets. And i just can't see myself what someone who destroys planets brings to the survival of the universe. He has been killed in several alternate universes and nothing bad happened to them. He wasn't even a product of this universe. 
 
Surely fighting the good fight at the right time, thats the key; the right time, means you are important. It doesn't matter that someone else COULD fight that fight, what matters is if they are able/willing to. Even now Odin serves the purpose of keeping Surtur [a guy that can cleave through reality] trapped in that Limbo-hel dimension. Odin has stopped the death of the Universe a few times and set in motion the events that freed them from their deities. He is/was an integral character.
#30 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:
Omega beams have hit Superman but didn't work because he's too important to the universe.  I have a hard time believing Superman is more important to the universe than a god, any god. 
Odin is only slightly lower tier than Galactus.  Darkseid would be in the same tier as Thanos IMO.  Significantly below Odin.
#31 Posted by Morpheus_ (29696 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: Omega beams have hit Superman but didn't work because he's too important to the universe.  I have a hard time believing Superman is more important to the universe than a god, any god. Odin is only slightly lower tier than Galactus.  Darkseid would be in the same tier as Thanos IMO.  Significantly below Odin. "
I've never seen Superman being hit by the beams. When was this?
Moderator
#32 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@Logic Mark III said:
" @AtPhantom: I know they say Galactus has a purpose, but i don't quite buy it. Can you show me a referrence to that please, not saying you are lying, its just that Celestials do the same job, many characters have destroyed planets. And i just can't see myself what someone who destroys planets brings to the survival of the universe. He has been killed in several alternate universes and nothing bad happened to them. He wasn't even a product of this universe.  Surely fighting the good fight at the right time, thats the key; the right time, means you are important. It doesn't matter that someone else COULD fight that fight, what matters is if they are able/willing to. Even now Odin serves the purpose of keeping Surtur [a guy that can cleave through reality] trapped in that Limbo-hel dimension. Odin has stopped the death of the Universe a few times and set in motion the events that freed them from their deities. He is/was an integral character. "
Celestials and Galactus have completely different purposes. Celestials govern the evolution of species, and only if the species doesn't meet up to their expectations do they waste the planet. Galactus eats planets to serve as a balance between Eternity and death. Here are two links to his bios from Annihilation and OHOTMU to support this.
 
No, it's not the key. Like I said, even of Odin dies before his time, someone else may still take his place. Being part of a prophecy or destiny doesn't make you an integral part of the universe. The Source doesn't care about Odin's fights with other deities, or Surtur, or Ragnarok.
 
Besides, I don't know where this "Important to the universe - immune to the effect" comes from at all.
#33 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: Omega beams have hit Superman but didn't work because he's too important to the universe.  I have a hard time believing Superman is more important to the universe than a god, any god. "
Evidence? Omega beams didn't work because they weren't omega beams, they were simple force beams. Darkseid never used the actual effect on Superman.

"Odin is only slightly lower tier than Galactus.  Darkseid would be in the same tier as Thanos IMO.  Significantly below Odin. "
Odin is massively lower tier than Galactus. And I have given arguments to support this.
#34 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@Morpheus_:

It was at least a few years ago.  That's when the "too important to the universe" thing first came up I believe.  Anyway its one of the things that really put me off DC.  If he had been hit with a controlled weaker blast it's one thing, but I always hated the explanation they gave.
#35 Posted by Morpheus_ (29696 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @Morpheus_: It was at least a few years ago.  That's when the "too important to the universe" thing first came up I believe.  Anyway its one of the things that really put me off DC.  If he had been hit with a controlled weaker blast it's one thing, but I always hated the explanation they gave. "
I have seen him  dodging. Not getting hit, and surviving. But, it could also be explained by the fact that Darkseid hardly ever utilizes the most devastating use of the Omega effect. The reason he doesn't use it against Superman is...plot. Superman can't die for the sake of the plot. I don't believe he is essential to the cosmos, like p.e. the Spectre.
Moderator
#36 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @Morpheus_: It was at least a few years ago.  That's when the "too important to the universe" thing first came up I believe.  Anyway its one of the things that really put me off DC.  If he had been hit with a controlled weaker blast it's one thing, but I always hated the explanation they gave. "
I still have yet to see any evidence of that. IMO, that was a fan made excuse, not actual canon.
#37 Posted by yodagod (2263 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom:
i could be mistaken.  It was quite some time ago, and I don't remember the details.  He could have been hit by a weaker beam, which I wouldn't mind, but I don't think that was the case.
#38 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17174 posts) - - Show Bio

1.I am not sure that OB will affect someone who isn't from DC's multiverse.
2.Marvel has something what we can compare to source - Ydgrasil. Odin by himself isn't important for Ydgrasil, but as a King of Asgard and man who has Odin Force - he is.
3.We can't talk what or who is important to the Marvel Universe in the same why as we are talking about  someone who is important to DC Universe, because if someone is powerfull enough or if his orgin is close to Abstract-level beings he is important to DCU. In Marvel U it is not going the same. Eternity is Universe which means he is importent to it, but when Thanos kill him, LT did nothing to him because there are other rules in MU. That is one of reasons why I don't belive OB won't affect anyone in MU.
4.WW's bracelets block OB, yes? And it was maked by very powerfull gods to be indestructible? a) It is a prove that it OB can be blocked by god's power, b)Uru has very close role in MU to her weapon.

#39 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@czarny_samael said:
" 1.I am not sure that OB will affect someone who isn't from DC's multiverse. 2.Marvel has something what we can compare to source - Ydgrasil. Odin by himself isn't important for Ydgrasil, but as a King of Asgard and man who has Odin Force - he is. 3.We can't talk what or who is important to the Marvel Universe in the same why as we are talking about  someone who is important to DC Universe, because if someone is powerfull enough or if his orgin is close to Abstract-level beings he is important to DCU. In Marvel U it is not going the same. Eternity is Universe which means he is importent to it, but when Thanos kill him, LT did nothing to him because there are other rules in MU. That is one of reasons why I don't belive OB won't affect anyone in MU. 4.WW's bracelets block OB, yes? And it was maked by very powerfull gods to be indestructible? a) It is a prove that it OB can be blocked by god's power, b)Uru has very close role in MU to her weapon. "
1. Just like we don't know if Odin force would affect anyone from DCU. We tend to look beyond that in battles, you should know that.
 
2. And this is important...How?
 
3. Who cares who is important. There is no evidence of any kind of importance affecting OE at all.
 
4. Yes, OE can be blocked by God power, but a) Wonder Woman was not the intended target of the beams. b) Odin has never displayed reaction time to block the beams like WW.
#40 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17174 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom said:
 
1.You misunderstood me. I just think that power of Omega Beams,Infinity Gauntlet and couple other things like that are working only in their universes. I think that OB depends on The Source in DC, it can defend Supe form OB. And I think that did it because of orgin of Darkseid. It of course is only an opinion.
2.Ydgrasil is important to all beings in Asgrad, it is important to Those Who Sit Above In Shadow,it can "rule" over the time and space and it is higher being than Skyfather.
3.If we won't cares about important than we can say that Superman and Doomsday survive it. We have two ways here: a)OB aren't powerfull enough to destroy this guys (which means it can't harm Odin), b)OB aren't depends on "classic" power but on something else, like important to The Source( Supe can be an example for that)
4.a)it doesn't matter if her block and defending target was succeeded, b)There are many opinions about that (it is the same with Thor), I accept that he is beyond speed.
#41 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@czarny_samael: 
1.  Yes, but like Infinity Gauntlet taking on someone from DC, we always turn a blind eye on such look holes.
 
2. I still don't see how Yggdrasil is important to this fight.
 
3. Superman and Doomsday have never endured the full effect. In hunter prey, when killing Doomsday, Darkseid states that his omega beams burn hotter than the firepits of Apokolips. This means that he opted for the force beams, rather than the effect, which carries no force and has no heat level. Same can be said with Superman. the only people Darkseid has used the effect on were Lobo, Batman in JLA and FC, Supergirl in Batman/Superman and numerous beings in New gods titles. Superman has never experienced the effect, other than to be teleported by it.
 
4. It matters because the the effect didn't activate on the bracelets. If it had, it might have destroyed them (given that Darkseid has defeated the Gods which created the bracelets a total of three times)
b) I'm not an expert on that so I can't comment, but the fact remains that Odin has no speed feats, nor has he battles anyone who does.
#42 Posted by GhostPool (660 posts) - - Show Bio

i go with Odin the omega beams would hurt him but he can still counter/dodge them
#43 Posted by MKF30 (11528 posts) - - Show Bio

Which version of DS? PC I'm definitely going DS
#44 Posted by vuviper (5531 posts) - - Show Bio
@yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: Also if fights mean nothing then why is Superman necessary.  His continued existence shouldn't make or unmake the universe.  Plus things like Ragnarok if they don'y happen the way they are foreordained can unmake existence, and Odin is central to Ragnarok.  And I do think that most of the new Thor was badly written.  In Marvel Odin is near Galactus' level.  That's above Darkseid. "
Actually Superman is a little more important to the DC universe. When Superman, Batman, and Wonderwoman are replaced in Trinity with the combination of powerful magic and advanced future technology powered by the cosmic egg, the universe groans to have the trinity which anchors reality back and eventually rights things. Whenever the universe is threatened it is always superman who is needed to save it. When Mandrakk threatened the multiverse the monitors chose superman to save the universe, he's not the most powerful being, (true most of the people stronger than him are evil, but most still value their own lives at least) but he's basically DCU's "chosen one" Its similar to how it has been stated many times that if earth was ever to be destroyed that the universe would collapse and that is why earth is always target by those who want to destroy everything, (ie Imperiex) Superman is protector of America, Earth, and the Universe.
#45 Posted by bumnut (1789 posts) - - Show Bio

Darkseid is a notch or so under Odin, in my book.  Odin ftw.
#46 Edited by castleking (24119 posts) - - Show Bio

odin's power is given to him by a celestial/heavenly cosmic source of righteousness and all that is good ect ect.... odin is an embodiment of good and has a purpose. odin was the one responsible for creating humanity... odin has nulled a contract with mephisto over eric masterson soul... odin has even gone to mephisto's realm and banished his own sons soul via his own version of the omega effect..

#47 Posted by vuviper (5531 posts) - - Show Bio
@castleking:  Not sayin Odin isn't important, or even that he wouldn't win this fight.
 But if you were going to list beings essential to the Marvel universe odin probably wouldn't be at the top, but Superman probably would be for DC. Don't really know why, don't really know why the Earth is so important either, but for some reason it is.
#48 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
" @yodagod said:
" @AtPhantom: Also if fights mean nothing then why is Superman necessary.  His continued existence shouldn't make or unmake the universe.  Plus things like Ragnarok if they don'y happen the way they are foreordained can unmake existence, and Odin is central to Ragnarok.  And I do think that most of the new Thor was badly written.  In Marvel Odin is near Galactus' level.  That's above Darkseid. "
Actually Superman is a little more important to the DC universe. When Superman, Batman, and Wonderwoman are replaced in Trinity with the combination of powerful magic and advanced future technology powered by the cosmic egg, the universe groans to have the trinity which anchors reality back and eventually rights things. Whenever the universe is threatened it is always superman who is needed to save it. When Mandrakk threatened the multiverse the monitors chose superman to save the universe, he's not the most powerful being, (true most of the people stronger than him are evil, but most still value their own lives at least) but he's basically DCU's "chosen one" Its similar to how it has been stated many times that if earth was ever to be destroyed that the universe would collapse and that is why earth is always target by those who want to destroy everything, (ie Imperiex) Superman is protector of America, Earth, and the Universe. "
This means nothing unless you can prove that the source actually protects people important to the universe. Which I have seen no evidence of.
 
Besides, the effect has worked on Superman many times before. He has used it to teleport Superman against his will on numerous occasions. The fact that he didn't use it to erase him is inconsequential. The effect works on him.
#49 Posted by Ownerz (1098 posts) - - Show Bio
@ThanosIsMad said:
" Darkseid wouldn't fare any better than Thanos did, in my opinion. "
that's why they call him Jobberseid
#50 Posted by BatDance (2206 posts) - - Show Bio
Odin should win, easy