#1 Posted by recordkeeper (374 posts) - - Show Bio

winners???
#2 Posted by lord_oraculous016 (9282 posts) - - Show Bio

hmmm.. let's see.. 
 
the Black Angel, the twisted Mother of Stars who once threatened to destroy all that exist and the Lord of the Undead who is described as the most powerful dark force in his continuity versus two powerful Asgardian Gods? 
 
i'll go to team one which basically outclasses the two in many aspects..

#3 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

Odin solos.

#4 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Dark Phoenix Solos.

#5 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

Dark Phoenix Solos.

How so?

#6 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris: Better Feats and is a Abstract of the Universe.

Abstracts > Skyfather.

Only thing that can take a Abstract is a Eldar God.

Eldar Gods > Odin.

Feat for Feat Phoenix is way better.

#7 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@Old_Chris: Better Feats and is a Abstract of the Universe.

Abstracts > Skyfather.

Only thing that can take a Abstract is a Eldar God.

Eldar Gods > Odin.

Feat for Feat Phoenix is way better.

Is that so? I have not seen a single feat from Dark Phoenix that suggests shes above Odin. Care to present some?

#8 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris: Why Certainly..

Lets look at this. She is a Realty, Time, and Matter Manipulator on the Universe Level.

Phoenix eats Stars.

Handily beats Fire Lord

A lot of the most Advance Aliens like Kree, Skrulls, and Shiar believe Phoenix > Galactus.

Phoenix held back the Universe Destroying power of the Neutron Galaxy in the M'Kraan Crystal and repaired said crystal. She even return a short time later.

Even Master Mind who had been working weeks of penetrating Phoenix Mind was easily cast back and sent into a stupor from the view of the Galaxy.

DP vs the X-Men and easily overpowers them.

The X-Men fight her for round 2 with a Inhibitor to cut off her powers. Epic Fail.

Then we have the feats of Jean and Rachel as the Weaker and more limited Green Phoenix.

As the weaker Green Phoenix. Rachel can simply take Soul Energy into herself.

Jean as Green Phoenix vs Emma in a Psy Battle. Easy win.

Here we have Multitude of Feats. Durability wise she was Able to fly into the center of a Neutron Galaxy (Universal Blackhole in power). She can Time Travel herself and others in time. Phoenix Speed can travel from Galaxy to Galaxy in a heartbeat.

Rachel as Green Phoenix takes in scope the WHOLE UNIVERSE!

With this power Rachel was the first to Drop Beyonder to his knees with shock and awe.

Rachel Spanks Galactus... nuff said.

#9 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@Old_Chris: Why Certainly..

Lets look at this. She is a Realty, Time, and Matter Manipulator on the Universe Level.

Phoenix eats Stars.

Handily beats Fire Lord

A lot of the most Advance Aliens like Kree, Skrulls, and Shiar believe Phoenix > Galactus.

Phoenix held back the Universe Destroying power of the Neutron Galaxy in the M'Kraan Crystal and repaired said crystal. She even return a short time later.

Even Master Mind who had been working weeks of penetrating Phoenix Mind was easily cast back and sent into a stupor from the view of the Galaxy.

DP vs the X-Men and easily overpowers them.

The X-Men fight her for round 2 with a Inhibitor to cut off her powers. Epic Fail.

Then we have the feats of Jean and Rachel as the Weaker and more limited Green Phoenix.

As the weaker Green Phoenix. Rachel can simply take Soul Energy into herself.

Jean as Green Phoenix vs Emma in a Psy Battle. Easy win.

Here we have Multitude of Feats. Durability wise she was Able to fly into the center of a Neutron Galaxy (Universal Blackhole in power). She can Time Travel herself and others in time. Phoenix Speed can travel from Galaxy to Galaxy in a heartbeat.

Rachel as Green Phoenix takes in scope the WHOLE UNIVERSE!

With this power Rachel was the first to Drop Beyonder to his knees with shock and awe.

Rachel Spanks Galactus... nuff said.

Don't really care much for the bio.

Eating stars is irrelevant.

Beating Fire Lord isn't impressive. Hes just a Herald. Odin has one shotted them.

Big deal. Statements mean nothing.

Holding in the Crystal is impressive, but I don't really see how it helps in a battle.

Beating Master Mind won't help her against Odin.

Beating the X-men is nothing even remotely impressive.

Has she ever absorbed the soul energy of an Odin level being?

Beating Emma won't help her against Odin.

Won't help her against someone that can destroy galaxies. Odin can also control time.

Scoping the universe is irrelevant.

She had Beyonder's own power when she did that. Not relevant here.

Beating a starving Galactus is nothing impressive. Odin has actually had success over a fed Galactus.

Yeah, hate to break it you, but a very large amount of these do not help her at all against someone like Odin. I was hoping you would show some actual relevant battle feats or scans of her dishing out any kind of significant damage or something of the sort.

Odin has destroyed galaxies and dished out power felt throughout all realities in his fights, as well as releasing power stated to be capable of tearing the very fabric of the multiverse. Never seen Dark Phoenix do that.

Phoenix seems to pale in comparison.

Odin solos.

#10 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris said:

Don't really care much for the bio.

Eating stars is irrelevant.

Beating Fire Lord isn't impressive. Hes just a Herald. Odin has one shotted them.

Big deal. Statements mean nothing.

Holding in the Crystal is impressive, but I don't really see how it helps in a battle.

Beating Master Mind won't help her against Odin.

Beating the X-men is nothing even remotely impressive.

Has she ever absorbed the soul energy of an Odin level being?

Beating Emma won't help her against Odin.

Won't help her against someone that can destroy galaxies. Odin can also control time.

Scoping the universe is irrelevant.

She had Beyonder's own power when she did that. Not relevant here.

Beating a starving Galactus is nothing impressive. Odin has actually had success over a fed Galactus.

Yeah, hate to break it you, but a very large amount of these do not help her at all against someone like Odin. I was hoping you would show some actual relevant battle feats or scans of her dishing out any kind of significant damage or something of the sort.

Odin has destroyed galaxies and dished out power felt throughout all realities in his fights, as well as releasing power stated to be capable of tearing the very fabric of the multiverse. Never seen Dark Phoenix do that.

Phoenix seems to pale in comparison.

Odin solos.

LOL Fanboy at its best.

Odin cant even take Galactus hungry. Green Phoenix (the weaker one) aced him.

When was the last Time Odin had the durability or Power to stand in a Universal strength Black Hole unharmed or hold back its power? Didnt think so....

Clearly your a Odin fan and entitled such. Even tho Phoenix like Dark Phoenix is a Universe power and Abstract being.

So as to your Odin Galaxy Buster at best I am unimpressed.

#11 Posted by Agent9149 (2893 posts) - - Show Bio

Dark phoenix solos

#12 Posted by BlackArrow (12 posts) - - Show Bio

Dark Phoenix and Necrom. Dark Phoenix ate an entire sun for breakfast and Necrom is The Lord of the Dead. I'm thinking Asgard is going down.

#13 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

LOL Fanboy at its best.

Odin cant even take Galactus hungry. Green Phoenix (the weaker one) aced him.

When was the last Time Odin had the durability or Power to stand in a Universal strength Black Hole unharmed or hold back its power? Didnt think so....

Clearly your a Odin fan and entitled such. Even tho Phoenix like Dark Phoenix is a Universe power and Abstract being.

So as to your Odin Galaxy Buster at best I am unimpressed.

Uh, that was a fed Galactus. And yeah he lost because its freaking Galactus but as you can see he still did some damage, whereas the last I recall the Phoenix fighting a fed Galactus he was about to rip the force from her.

And where was the last time she tanked galaxy busting attacks? Didn't think so. Hell, I still haven't brought the time where the force was completely annihilated by a planetary EMP.

Actually I'm not, its just that Odin actually has battle feats against powerful foes like Surtur, Seth, and Infinity whereas the strongest opponents Dark Phoenix beat in your scans were a Herald and the X-men. How very impressive.

This scan does not show shes a universal being. It shows a bunch of meaningless statuses and platitudes.

If you are unimpressed with Odin being a galaxy buster then the Dark Phoenix is surely a pathetic being considering the greatest amount of damage she has ever even dished out was an attack that destroyed one solar system.

Odin has better feats. He solos.

#14 Posted by Killemall (18273 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2: Ah! you are being bombarded by feats i posted on our CAV :p

#15 Posted by dondave (34547 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1 ftw

#16 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Killemall said:

@CadenceV2: Ah! you are being bombarded by feats i posted on our CAV :p

Truth is the guy above me thinks Odin taking on Dark Phoenix. He posted Scans that just to compare to what DP had done.

@Old_Chris: Wow... simply wow.

Here DP is in the heart of the Neutron Galaxy. Do you know what the Density and pressure of a Neutron star is?! This is a Galaxy that would Blackhole the Universe. She is in the middle of it.

Phoenix Displays omnipresence through out the Universe with her Psy Power.

this is a Weaker Green Phoenix Jean. Even at her weakest she is Benching a Million Tons. Show me Odin Strength anywhere around that... please do.

As Galactus tells Rachel the Phoenix is LIMITLESS in power Supply. Odin is force into Odin sleep from using to much Odin Force.

Her power is the well spring of Creation and Life yet to be. Odin power pales in comparison.

So I displayed a Universe Level Telepathy (Mind Rape anyone), Durability vs Universe Destroying Density, Universe Source of power, and even a mere Million Tons at weakest TK.

Sorry but Odin doesn't match up.

#17 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@Old_Chris: Wow... simply wow.

Here DP is in the heart of the Neutron Galaxy. Do you know what the Density and pressure of a Neutron star is?! This is a Galaxy that would Blackhole the Universe. She is in the middle of it.

Phoenix Displays omnipresence through out the Universe with her Psy Power.

this is a Weaker Green Phoenix Jean. Even at her weakest she is Benching a Million Tons. Show me Odin Strength anywhere around that... please do.

As Galactus tells Rachel the Phoenix is LIMITLESS in power Supply. Odin is force into Odin sleep from using to much Odin Force.

Her power is the well spring of Creation and Life yet to be. Odin power pales in comparison.

So I displayed a Universe Level Telepathy (Mind Rape anyone), Durability vs Universe Destroying Density, Universe Source of power, and even a mere Million Tons at weakest TK.

Sorry but Odin doesn't match up.

I can name several times where the Phoenix has been put down and hurt by things far lesser than a neutron galaxy.

I admit that telepathy is what she has most going for her, but Odin clearly has more to offer.

.....she isn't bench pressing a million tons. Look at your own scan. She uses a telekinetic shield to protect herself, and barely at that. A million tons is nothing compared to galaxy busting power.

Right, the Phoenix supposedly has limitless power yet needs Cyclops's optic beams to survive.

Er, not its not. She has never created anything.

Outside that one durability feat the Phoenix Force has been hurt by Thor, annihilated by a planetary EMP, been blown to bits by a giant gun Iron Man created, and other incidents where it's durability has been portrayed at hilariously low proportions. Oh yeah, its also been killed by the destruction of a universe. On average the Phoenix wouldn't last a second against Odin's power.

How about this, show me Dark Phoenix's best feat in terms of destructive power. Then show me some battle feats of her fighting characters of Odin's level

Until you can do that, all she has going for her is telepathy. Outside that she loses to Odin. Badly.

#18 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris said:

@CadenceV2 said:

I can name several times where the Phoenix has been put down and hurt by things far lesser than a neutron galaxy.

I admit that telepathy is what she has most going for her, but Odin clearly has more to offer.

.....she isn't bench pressing a million tons. Look at your own scan. She uses a telekinetic shield to protect herself, and barely at that. A million tons is nothing compared to galaxy busting power.

Right, the Phoenix supposedly has limitless power yet needs Cyclops's optic beams to survive.

Er, not its not. She has never created anything.

Outside that one durability feat the Phoenix Force has been hurt by Thor, annihilated by a planetary EMP, been blown to bits by a giant gun Iron Man created, and other incidents where it's durability has been portrayed at hilariously low proportions. Oh yeah, its also been killed by the destruction of a universe. On average the Phoenix wouldn't last a second against Odin's power.

How about this, show me Dark Phoenix's best feat in terms of destructive power. Then show me some battle feats of her fighting characters of Odin's level

Until you can do that, all she has going for her is telepathy. Outside that she loses to Odin. Badly.

I love how you ignor the scans LOL.

1) Go on and name Phoenix hurt by alot less. Please do......

Like how Thor harm Emma with 1/3 of the PF? Looks like she instantly Regen and harm Thor in the process to me LOL.

Go on please show PROOF of Dark Phoenix being harm... I love to see it.

2) Odin is outclass in Matter Manipulation, Telepthy, and Telekinesis.

3) Yeah the fact she easily holds it at her WEAKEST Level (Green Phoenix) is a Bench press pretty much. You fail to pick that apart.

4)... what are you talking about lol. She can pull souls and life force with ease.

As seen here her power is the Life of the Universe itself as Galactus said. Thats why she was a big deal in AvX.

5) Created all life and stars. Galactus found that out the hard way when he tried to attack the Weaker Green Phoenix.

6) Phoenix Force without a Host is weaker than with a Host. dark Phoenix is the strongest besides (PotWC). So again you prove nothing against Dark Phoenix here. Also Tony plan to stop Phoenix was a Epic Fail. Instead it merely split it up to 5 Hosts who then Spank Thor and iron man with ease.

Also the destruction of the Universe would kill Odin as well who been killed by less power. Whats your point?

LOL How about the only being to Telepathically and Emphatically Stagger Pre Retcon Beyonder? Or the weakest Green Phoenix overpowering Galactus?

Seriously if Odin is your favorite that's cool. He outclass here.

#19 Edited by Killemall (18273 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2: The one against Galactus is Rachel not Jean , minor correction from my part, although i think its a honest to goodness typo from your side. Also as per Galaxy busting, Phoenix has busted a universe, while non -canon for Jean 616 its still canon for Phoenix Force as a whole :) and that was Dark Phoenix avatar too, and given Jean as a primary host of Phoenix has the highest power level, i suppose that feat might count.

M'kraan feat from Adventures of X-men 12 , was universe when the issue was written, but the feat has been revalued to multiversal explosion. Furthermore, Adventures of X-men back then was a non-canon publication as its based on TV series. It was only canonised, retrospectively during Annihilation 2005, but by then the feat was multiversal.

I can bring in scans if needed.

#20 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Killemall said:

@CadenceV2: The one against Galactus is Rachel not Jean , minor correction from my part, although i think its a honest to goodness typo from your side. Also as per Galaxy busting, Phoenix has busted a universe, while non -canon for Jean 616 its still canon for Phoenix Force as a whole :) and that was Dark Phoenix avatar too, and given Jean as a primary host of Phoenix has the highest power level, i suppose that feat might count.

M'kraan feat from Adventures of X-men 12 , was universe when the issue was written, but the feat has been revalued to multiversal explosion. Furthermore, Adventures of X-men back then was a non-canon publication as its based on TV series. It was only canonised, retrospectively during Annihilation 2005, but by then the feat was multiversal.

I can bring in scans if needed.

Hold need to make sure I have this...

1) There is a What If where Phoenix destroyed the Universe?

2) M'kraan Crystal is no longer Universal Destruction (Its described as a Universal Black Hole in the Scans) but Multiversal Buster officialy now?

I like scans of that confirmation if its true.

#21 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

I love how you ignor the scans LOL.

1) Go on and name Phoenix hurt by alot less. Please do......

Like how Thor harme Emma with 1/3 of the PF? Looks like she instantly Regen and harm Thor in the process to me LOL.

Go on please show PROOF of Dark Phoenix being harm... I love to see it.

2) Odin is outclass in Matter Manipulation, Telepthy, and Telekinesis.

3) Yeah the fact she easily holds it at her WEAKEST Level (Green Phoenix) is a Bench press pretty much. You fail to pick that apart.

4)... what are you talking about lol. She can pull souls and life force with ease.

As seen here here power is the Life of the universe itself as Galactus said. Thats why she was a big deal in AvX.

5) Created all life and stars. Galactus found that out the hard way when he tried to attack the Weaker Green Phoenix.

6) Phoenix Force without a Host is weaker than with a Host. dark Phoenix is the strongest besides (PotWC). So again you prove nothing against Dark Phoenix here. Also Tony plan to stop Phoenix was a Epic Fail. Instead it merely split it up to 5 Hosts who then Spank Thor and iron man with ease.

Also the destruction of the Universe would kill Odin as well who been killed by less power. Whats your point?

LOL How about the only being to Telepathically and Emphatically Stagger Pre Retcon Beyonder? Or the weakest Green Phoenix overpowering Galactus?

Seriously if Odin is your favorite that's cool. He outclass here.

1. I already did name a bunch of times. Go back and read them.

I was referring to the times where Thor one shotted the Phoenix Force with a single hammer throw and the other time where he dropped her instantly by re-directing her own attack psy bolt.

2. There is nothing she has done with matter manipulation or telekinesis that suggests she can do anything to someone of Odin's level. As I said before, telepathy is her best bet.

3. ...okay? Big deal. Seeing as she was struggling with a million tons, galaxy level power would easily destroy her.

4. Now show her doing it against someone of Odin's level.

5. Uh, no she didn't. The Phoenix has never created the life in the universe. This is a major lie.

6. Great, she can beat Iron Man and Thor.

7. My point is you want to harp on this one feat where she resists universal level density or whatever you were saying, and the time where similar destruction kills her goes against that, on top of many other incidents which you seem to be ignoring.

With his own power. Is there a reason you keep forgetting that? Phoenix only accomplished anything against Beyonder when she had his own power. Since in this fight she does not, it is completely irrelevant. Did you also fail to see that under her own power she hit him with her best shot and literally did absolutely nothing?

Over powering a starving Galactus is nothing to harp on about. Thor has done it, Beta Ray Bill has done. Both are only Herald level beings.

Nah, hes not. All of your points have all failed miserably. Odin wins because he has considerably better battle feats, and can dish out considerably more damage.

Deal with it.

#22 Posted by Killemall (18273 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

Hold need to make sure I have this...

1) There is a What If where Phoenix destroyed the Universe?

2) M'kraan Crystal is no longer Universal Destruction (Its described as a Universal Black Hole in the Scans) but Multiversal Buster officialy now?

I like scans of that confirmation if its true.

1. Yes. Phoenix (Jean Grey) Destroys the universe in What If , in fact there are 2 What If Stories where Jean Grey Destroys an entire universe. The first one would be What If Phoenix had lived.

What If Phoenix had lived:

What if Wolverine fought Conan

2. My reply in regards to M'Kraan crystal was actually in regards to Phoenix being killed with a universal explosion, which was orginally stated to be universe, later the power of M'kraan crystal (2007) has been elevated to multiversal.

Here are the supporting scans:

Phoenix Handbook:

"The Crystal or a previous incarnation existed in the last multiverse, and the Crystal's destruction at demonic hands obliterated the entire multiverse"

#23 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris: Well I guess you will stand your ground. I know from everyone else who posted here that they agree with Odin getting Punked by the Abstract. Enjoy.

#24 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Killemall said:

@CadenceV2 said:

Hold need to make sure I have this...

1) There is a What If where Phoenix destroyed the Universe?

2) M'kraan Crystal is no longer Universal Destruction (Its described as a Universal Black Hole in the Scans) but Multiversal Buster officialy now?

I like scans of that confirmation if its true.

1. Yes. Phoenix (Jean Grey) Destroys the universe in What If , in fact there are 2 What If Stories where Jean Grey Destroys an entire universe. The first one would be What If Phoenix had lived.

What If Phoenix had lived:

What if Wolverine fought Conan

2. My reply in regards to M'Kraan crystal was actually in regards to Phoenix being killed with a universal explosion, which was orginally stated to be universe, later the power of M'kraan crystal (2007) has been elevated to multiversal.

Here are the supporting scans:

Phoenix Handbook:

"The Crystal or a previous incarnation existed in the last multiverse, and the Crystal's destruction at demonic hands obliterated the entire multiverse"

Niiiice. Thanks alot.

#25 Posted by Old_Chris (58 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@Old_Chris: Well I guess you will stand your ground. I know from everyone else who posted here that they agree with Odin getting Punked by the Abstract. Enjoy.

Good for them. I don't really care about the majority of something when its mostly based off jumping on the bandwagon and not giving any reason or evidence to support claims.

Oh and by the way; Odin still solos.

#26 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Old_Chris: Yup I think this thread has a clear winner.