Daredevil (Netflix) vs. Arrow (CW)

@kokemabb200 which is why half the battles on this site shouldn't happen..but on this site we debate with feats, and if that 112 lb pound can defeat hardened criminals just like Arrow, that actually puts him in a disadvantage in this scenario LOL. It means that all the times Arrow has one-punched criminals, their durability is low/their technique is unskilled and thus Arrow winning isn't much of an accomplishment. The only things Arrow has over Daredevil(without radar sense, but he has the sense so useless) is accuracy/precision and efficiency with a bow. Arrow's skill level has been somewhat inconsistent imo anyways...can beat the daughter of the Demon's Head but has trouble with lesser thugs. But that's a discussion for another time!

@ganon15 both

How does Daredevil have poor writing? Every episode has been brilliant so far

This is a battle thread so I don't want to dwelve too much into that so you can pm me if u'd like (does CV have a pm system?). Anyways, Daredevil's physical stats alone are better than Arrow's, and Daredevil's technique/martial arts.

Do you have proof of this?

Bump

Bump

Uhhh....

Daredevil doesn't have the striking to put Arrow down without his billy clubs. So those rounds go straight to Arrow.

With the billy clubs and armor...

He still probably loses a rather severe majority because Arrow's durability is so stupid high.

Daredevil is my new favorite Superhero show period, but he never really faces anyone particularly skilled... and when he finally does, he basically gets stomped.

I don't think anyone here would put Nobu up against Deathstroke (equipment/reaction speed) or Merlyn (reaction speed) or Ra's (reaction speed/skill) without expecting a lopsided stomp.

EDIT:

Matt kicking the arrow out of the air was him predicting... unless we're saying he can suddenly move at 200+ mph... Get real. The scene makes a point of showing that it's a prediction.

Human beings have equal durability. Matt doesn't punch out anyone in the entire series with one punch to the head. Rather realistically, it always takes him multiple shots. That being said, Matt has terrible durability but great damage soak. Generally poor striking. Gets tagged and grappled and thrown by fodder.

Arrow > Nobu > Daredevil

@boringperson: I think Nobu could take Merlyn possibly, especially with the kusarigama

Sure, but I seriously doubt it in a majority. Nobu also has poor feats of deflection, most likely the fight starts like in Daredevil with Nobu throwing the knives at Merlyn... only to have Merlyn catch them and throw them back.

Ollie should win this in a good fight, say what you want about which show looks better or has better writing (I personally love both shows) but Ollie has faced considerably better overall opposition than Matt, to be expected given we only have on season for Matt here. In Season 2 of Arrow you can see even the fodder LoA member that was with Al-Owal was dodging gunfire up close using DD style maneuvers start around 2:30 mark.

R1- Probably Oliver, impressive enough aim to shoot him in the unprotected areas. Matt have a good chance depending on the enviroment, in a dark place I have no doubts that he would stomp Oliver for obvious reasons.

R2- Probably Oliver, he got some impressive showings and being Morals Off helps him here, he is less agile and have slower reflexes, but showed more skill than Matt and he can match him to the upper hand.

R3- We don't know if the armour can stop an arrow, of course it can stop bullets but the arrowheads act differently and the projectile is way bigger. I know that Matt caught an arrow mid-air but he wouldn't be able to evade a barrage. Siding with Matt, he is way more agressive than Oliver and if he closes the gap between them, depending on the enviroment, he can earn the upper hand.

R4- Probably Matt, in character he is way more dangerous than Oliver and if one of them is open to dirty moves, Matt is the guy.

To sum it up, in Dark places, Matt for the majority, if the fight takes place in somewhere illuminated, Oliver takes the advantage.

Oliver is stronger and has also learned how to Ignore pain. They are about even in terms of skill. However I regularly see Oliver taking out a multitude of thugs making it look easy and barely breaking a sweat. Also arrow seems to have more showing of him dealing with skilled opponent's, I felt Nabu was impressive but not as impressive as Nyssa or Merlyn. I felt kingpin was similar to block in strength skill and durability being able to resist small weapons fire to the head with little damage, good especially for the show but not that impressive to me. I think arrow brings a bit more strength, skill, and experience to the table in this fight.

For now I am backing Oliver across the board, he has faced far better opposition overall, I feel like this match will be interesting to revisit once Daredevil gets a second season under his belt as he is only going to get better, then again I feel the same way about Oliver given his new position, he is going to get full immersion into the leagues training barring that they don't cut his time short/have him escape, which seems unlikely given how the most recent episode ended.

Cool fight

Except in the newest episode of the Arrow Felicity knocked one out with a pole..

@kokemabb200: I think she was just finishing off one that Diggle had already shot, you can see him just limping away when Felicity comes along and bashes him.

@nickzambuto: The guy was walking backwards and was hit, I don't remember Diggle hitting him but I definitely could be wrong. It's just that even if he was limping, a 5'2 girl shouldn't be able to put down any decent ninja/assassin--especially not with a blow like that. I'm just saying that the LoA isn't all its cracked up to be.

Does anyone have a clip of the scene in ep 1x12 where Ollie stormed The Count's HQ and took out all his men without his bow after being overdosed on Vertigo? I want to make an argument for him but I need that clip.

@kokemabb200 said:

@nickzambuto: The guy was walking backwards and was hit, I don't remember Diggle hitting him but I definitely could be wrong. It's just that even if he was limping, a 5'2 girl shouldn't be able to put down any decent ninja/assassin. I'm just saying that the LoA isn't all its cracked up to be.

Well they needed to give Felicity something to do, I don't see what's wrong about a half-defeated ninja being fully-defeated after Felicity blindsided him with a pole when he was distracted. The ninjas still have feats of dodging bullets and arrows, appearing out of nowhere, making impressive distance shots with their archery, ignoring pain completely, and being trained in numerous fighting styles and weapons in addition to all the hype around them. I mean the hype alone puts them above standard canon fodder, but their feats just solidifies that, I don't think Felicity fanservice changes that.

@nickzambuto: Fair enough. I like the show, but I'm just not a fan of fighting/action sequences. I think in the context of the show the stuff they do is impressive, but objectively it's pretty lackluster and too inconsistent.

It's like if someone cleared a video game on easy versus someone beating it on hard.

The person winning on easy seems pretty good, but the stuff they're up against is weak so in comparison they look better. Whereas the person winning on hard might have a harder go at it but because what they are facing is tougher they are more impressive.

I think you're only judging that because season 3 has been pretty subpar in all areas so far. I've noticed that a LOT of people have been jumping on the bandwagon and making certain complaints about Arrow, but they really only apply to the third season which is by far the low point of the series. The action in the first two seasons was consistently phenomenal, people need to remember that.

@nickzambuto: I've watched all three seasons, definitely hated season 1 the most (almost quit after it) but season 3 isn't that bad. My only gripe with it is Laurel and her Dad's spat. Also, Felicity leaving Ray, taking his plane, then hooking up with Oliver in the same day seems a bit rude.

I don't like ancillary romances and forced conflicts since that makes it feel much more like a tween soap opera than a superhero serial, coupled with the fact that a lot of the acting/writing is sub-par and fluctuates between episodes. But that's just a personal hang-up, it's a fun Wednesday night flick.

The fighting in the show just doesn't seem that fluid to me and looks overly choreographed to make the protagonists "look good". Show's like Daredevil seem like they are in another league, and rightfully so since they have a higher budget. Its streamlined and this could be personal opinion but much better written and acted. Daredevil fights look ruthless and have people going all out and everyone seems like they are fighting for a purpose. If you look at it closely, Arrow fight sequences are not very impressive and often times you can see half second pauses where characters pause to be hit, and it just comes of as dodgy and fake. That's why I heavily favor Matt Murdock over Oliver Queen. Matt's fights seem superior and his opponents are significantly more durable, skilled, and hardened.

Well that's just a matter of preference. Personally I found most fight scenes in Daredevil, frankly boring and underwhelming. The final fight with Fisk was about as good as Arrow has ever gotten, but that's all it has. Meanwhile the first two seasons of Arrow had kick-ass action in almost every episode.

I'm going with Ollie. He does better against a higher caliber opponent.

Except in the newest episode of the Arrow Felicity knocked one out with a pole..

You mean it's possible that sometimes henchman are fodder and other times they aren't when it's useful to the plot?

@devil_driver: But they should still be at or around a consistent level. The problem is, they aren't. They can't go from one assassin being a problem for the title character and another main character, to being knocked out by a character who has no fighting skill whatsoever, or even a dozen being slaughtered effortlessly.

@stormdriven: Well yes but that is what they exist for, in any event it doesn't change the fact that Oliver has faced better overall opposition than Matt, which is to be expected. Hopefully Daredevil will pick up some even better feats in the next season, I look forward to it.

Just finished Daredevil, he is not beating Arrow

Daredevil stomps, not really a fight here.

Arrow.

Amen

...

Ollie stomps.

Ollie.

Ollie still wins.

I see DD as more of Canary level.

Honestly, Ollie takes it. But IMO Daredevil is a much better show. DD is realistic, while Arrow can be over the top.

Ollie takes this.

Oliver is just superior in every way

A blind guy beating crap out of grown men in h2h is more realistic than a guy dressing in green hood and shooting arrows?

As much as I wanna say Daredevil Oliver would win his feats are simply better.

Arrow takes it pretty handidly. I don't see Arrow struggling to beat Fisk at all and DD barely beat him.

@rbt: you're right, the show where the main character was stabbed through the chest, thrown off a mountain and brought back to life with magic water is MUCH more realistic.

@miamishaman: you haven't watched arrow enough, Maseo took him to Tatsu's house, he wasn't saved by the pit

Arrow should win all rounds

@jackjack390: i didn't say the pit, he was dead, he drunk "something" and now he's alive. People dont survive being stabbed through the heart, people definately dont survive being stabbed in the heart and thrown off a mountain in freezing temperatures.

Exactly. Neither of the shows are realistic.

@rbt: i didnt say the shows were, I just said the fight scenes were. Apart from Matt being blind, the way he gets tired and the way he takes blows is pretty on point.

I'm only on episode four and season two respectively. I guess they each have an edge, Oliver in the form of equipment, and Matt in the form of enhanced senses. In hand to hand they appear to be entirely equal. Draw, I guess.

Ollie has much better feats as of now, that's just how it is.