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#101 Edited by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

Anyways, DD feats back up the idea that he takes a majority over Nightwing :D

Well that's true. But considering that you conceded that Cassandra Cain can get the majority win over DD, I don't see DD stalemating Bruce.

Hey, it's not like Cassandra wouldn't get the majority over Bruce either, it's debatable, but I think she would. And I think DD stalemating/beating Marvel's best fighters like Iron Fist, Black Panther, Captain America, Wolverine, Taskmaster (All superhumans with physical advantages over Matt) is proof enough that he could stalemate Bruce H2H. With gadgets, Bruce takes a majority over Matt though.

#102 Posted by nickzambuto (11423 posts) - - Show Bio

@slimj87d said:

@nickzambuto: prove it

There are plenty of stories about Batman and Joker's relationship, how in some way they are really the only person the other can rely on. Batman already stated he doesn't hate Joker in Killing Joke.

#103 Edited by nickzambuto (11423 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: What if Batman takes Bullseye out first? Bullseye is a weak link for team 1. I doubt DD and Bullseye will be walking down the streets side by side as an actual team. Batman can easily narrow the fight to a 1v1.

While Batman is barely surviving against Bullseye, Daredevil will oneshot Joker and then take Bats by surprise.

Team 2 is simply crippled by Joker.

#104 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2700 posts) - - Show Bio

Grayson beating daredevil? Give me an F'N break,,daredevil would kick his ass. He's stalemated tchalla, captain america and nearly every other top tier marvel fighter around,,yet people have the nerve to say he'd be beaten by sidekicks.

#105 Edited by MonsterStomp (13049 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

@monsterstomp said:

@wolverine08 said:

Anyways, DD feats back up the idea that he takes a majority over Nightwing :D

Well that's true. But considering that you conceded that Cassandra Cain can get the majority win over DD, I don't see DD stalemating Bruce.

Hey, it's not like Cassandra wouldn't get the majority over Bruce either, it's debatable, but I think she would. And I think DD stalemating/beating Marvel's best fighters like Iron Fist, Black Panther, Captain America, Wolverine, Taskmaster (All superhumans with physical advantages over Matt) is proof enough that he could stalemate Bruce H2H. With gadgets, Bruce takes a majority over Matt though.

You think Cassy can get a majority over Batman? Your second favourite character of all time? Its times like this when I doubt Batman is even in your top 5 favourites, lol. Cassy isn't taking a majority over Bruce. Her body reading is definitely a factor, but Bruce has more pain tolerance and is more tactical. Plus he has more feats.

#106 Edited by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@monsterstomp said:

@wolverine08 said:

@monsterstomp said:

@wolverine08 said:

Anyways, DD feats back up the idea that he takes a majority over Nightwing :D

Well that's true. But considering that you conceded that Cassandra Cain can get the majority win over DD, I don't see DD stalemating Bruce.

Hey, it's not like Cassandra wouldn't get the majority over Bruce either, it's debatable, but I think she would. And I think DD stalemating/beating Marvel's best fighters like Iron Fist, Black Panther, Captain America, Wolverine, Taskmaster (All superhumans with physical advantages over Matt) is proof enough that he could stalemate Bruce H2H. With gadgets, Bruce takes a majority over Matt though.

You think Cassy can get a majority over Batman? Your second favourite character of all time? Its times like this when I doubt Batman is even in your top 5 favourites, lol. Cassy isn't taking a majority over Bruce. Her body reading is definitely a factor, but Bruce has more pain tolerance and is more tactical.

Like I said it's debatable, because they both have advantages they could utilize for the win, but I'd probably side with Cass for an extremely small majority.

#107 Posted by MonsterStomp (13049 posts) - - Show Bio
#108 Posted by Shawnbaby (9301 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

@monsterstomp said:

@wolverine08 said:

Anyways, DD feats back up the idea that he takes a majority over Nightwing :D

Well that's true. But considering that you conceded that Cassandra Cain can get the majority win over DD, I don't see DD stalemating Bruce.

Hey, it's not like Cassandra wouldn't get the majority over Bruce either, it's debatable, but I think she would. And I think DD stalemating/beating Marvel's best fighters like Iron Fist, Black Panther, Captain America, Wolverine, Taskmaster (All superhumans with physical advantages over Matt) is proof enough that he could stalemate Bruce H2H. With gadgets, Bruce takes a majority over Matt though.

You think Cassy can get a majority over Batman? Your second favourite character of all time? Its times like this when I doubt Batman is even in your top 5 favourites, lol. Cassy isn't taking a majority over Bruce. Her body reading is definitely a factor, but Bruce has more pain tolerance and is more tactical. Plus he has more feats.

Just because he likes a character it doesn't mean he has to side with that character every time.

Personally, I think Bruce would struggle against Cassandra in Pure H2H.

#109 Edited by MonsterStomp (13049 posts) - - Show Bio
#110 Posted by jashro44 (16462 posts) - - Show Bio

I personally believe Cassandra Cain >batman>daredevil in hand to hand. All though I am leaning towards the marvel duo here.

#111 Posted by dondave (26498 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

I personally believe Cassandra Cain >batman>daredevil in hand to hand. All though I am leaning towards the marvel duo here.

Agreed

#112 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2700 posts) - - Show Bio

Daredevils senses allow him to hear muscle tension building up before someone throws a strike,,It's one of the things that allows him to dodge not only incoming bullets, arrows, and cards but kicks and punches, he knows a hit is coming before its thrown. Honestly I don't know why so many believe batman is so much better than daredevil in h2h combat. He may have mastered every martial art in the world but it only takes one to be effective..perfect example is Bruce lee,,he didnt hold one black belt nor did he attain top level in wing chun yet he was and still is considered one of the best fighters ever. I think daredevil is underrated, his ability to sense incoming attacks is well documented and is comparable to Cassandra's ability to read body language,,except that DD listens to the body and his surroundings

#113 Posted by SlimJ87D (8905 posts) - - Show Bio
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#114 Edited by cooljammy18 (771 posts) - - Show Bio

It's been repeatedly agreed upon that DD could beat Nightwing in a fight. I don't even know why that's being disputed in this thread other than people's biases being threatened. I'm personally leaning towards Team 1 for a small majority.

#115 Posted by cooljammy18 (771 posts) - - Show Bio

Grayson beating daredevil? Give me an F'N break,,daredevil would kick his ass. He's stalemated tchalla, captain america and nearly every other top tier marvel fighter around,,yet people have the nerve to say he'd be beaten by sidekicks.

LOL

Daredevils senses allow him to hear muscle tension building up before someone throws a strike,,It's one of the things that allows him to dodge not only incoming bullets, arrows, and cards but kicks and punches, he knows a hit is coming before its thrown. Honestly I don't know why so many believe batman is so much better than daredevil in h2h combat. He may have mastered every martial art in the world but it only takes one to be effective..perfect example is Bruce lee,,he didnt hold one black belt nor did he attain top level in wing chun yet he was and still is considered one of the best fighters ever. I think daredevil is underrated, his ability to sense incoming attacks is well documented and is comparable to Cassandra's ability to read body language,,except that DD listens to the body and his surroundings

Agree.

#116 Posted by Hyperlight (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

to be honest I don't think joker is much of a problem seeing as neither bullseye or daredevil will deal with his games. bullseye will just kill him. its a toss up if either have the skills to deal with a stealthy Batman

#117 Posted by Shawnbaby (9301 posts) - - Show Bio

to be honest I don't think joker is much of a problem seeing as neither bullseye or daredevil will deal with his games. bullseye will just kill him. its a toss up if either have the skills to deal with a stealthy Batman

It's not a Toss up. Batman can't hide his 100kg of Mass from Daredevil's Radar Sense.

#118 Posted by Hyperlight (4286 posts) - - Show Bio
#119 Edited by Shawnbaby (9301 posts) - - Show Bio
#120 Posted by sync1 (2154 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

#121 Posted by GhostRavage (7554 posts) - - Show Bio

Dick and Matt already had a "ComicVine battle of the week" in which Matt got the majority but barely... However, i do think Matt is significantly more skilled than Dick.

#122 Posted by CF12793 (2675 posts) - - Show Bio

Joker and Batman both get a couple of cards through their heads thrown at them by Bullseye, then DD and Bullseye continue their never ending rivalry.

#123 Posted by Strider92 (15246 posts) - - Show Bio

Bullseye going all out could solo this. In character with DD as back-up they take a very solid majority.

#124 Posted by MonsterStomp (13049 posts) - - Show Bio

Dick and Matt already had a "ComicVine battle of the week" in which Matt got the majority but barely... However, i do think Matt is significantly more skilled than Dick.

Still on that?

#125 Posted by The_Titan_Lord (4465 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1

#126 Edited by jashro44 (16462 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92 said:

Bullseye going all out could solo this. In character with DD as back-up they take a very solid majority.

I have to disagree with bullseye soloing. He's good but I feel as if batmans gear, pain tolerance, speed and agility will close the gap.

I agree the marvel duo will take it though.

#127 Posted by i_like_swords (7486 posts) - - Show Bio

Here's the only two ways I see this fight going down.

1. Batman goes stealth immediately, but Daredevil's senses allow him to catch up to him and appear right infront of him. Bang, 1v1. While those two duke it out, Bullseye puts something sharp inside of Joker, and he dies. Plain and simple. Then the Marvel Team win in a 2v1.

2. In an all out brawl between the four of them, no stealth, Joker is dispatched almost immediately leaving Batman to deal with the equally skilled and out-sensed Daredevil and the adamantium marksman Bullseye. They win with moderate difficulty.

Joker is a weak link. Batman's stealth is null against Daredevil, and Bullseye's accuracy is a legitimate problem for Batman, and also allows him to remove Joker from the equation with ease.

Daredevil and Bullseye win. I don't see how they can't.

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#128 Edited by i_like_swords (7486 posts) - - Show Bio

Bullseye going all out could solo this. In character with DD as back-up they take a very solid majority.

I don't think he could solo this. His projectiles have been dodged by people slower/as fast as Batman pretty consistently.

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#129 Edited by Hyperlight (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@shawnbaby: reasonable

Here's the only two ways I see this fight going down.

1. Batman goes stealth immediately, but Daredevil's senses allow him to catch up to him and appear right infront of him. Bang, 1v1. While those two duke it out, Bullseye puts something sharp inside of Joker, and he dies. Plain and simple. Then the Marvel Team win in a 2v1.

2. In an all out brawl between the four of them, no stealth, Joker is dispatched almost immediately leaving Batman to deal with the equally skilled and out-sensed Daredevil and the adamantium marksman Bullseye. They win with moderate difficulty.

Joker is a weak link. Batman's stealth is null against Daredevil, and Bullseye's accuracy is a legitimate problem for Batman, and also allows him to remove Joker from the equation with ease.

Daredevil and Bullseye win. I don't see how they can't.

this seems legit

#130 Edited by Strider92 (15246 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: @jashro44: Bullseye can and has hit people significantly faster than Batman and Joker despite only shooting to wound as Lester likes to play with his enemies in an all out no holds barred situation I see no reason why Bullseye couldn't put these two out of the running when actually trying to kill off the bat rather than play around.

#131 Posted by i_like_swords (7486 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: On the same token, what if Batman went all-out and for the kill against Lester? His armor and speed should afford him enough protection to close the gap, and given the setting he can definitely out-stealth Lester. Bullseye is definitely formidable, but if we're making him morals off it's only fair to apply it to his opponents. But.. an all-out Lester vs in character Batman is a toss up in my opinion. Especially in a random encounter. Batman could be out of his depth in that type of fight.

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#132 Posted by jashro44 (16462 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: On the same token, what if Batman went all-out and for the kill against Lester? His armor and speed should afford him enough protection to close the gap, and given the setting he can definitely out-stealth Lester. Bullseye is definitely formidable, but if we're making him morals off it's only fair to apply it to his opponents. But.. an all-out Lester vs in character Batman is a toss up in my opinion. Especially in a random encounter. Batman could be out of his depth in that type of fight.

Pretty much. A morals off batman is actually pretty scary for any non super powered or low level super human opponent.

All though I favor a morals on batman over a morals off Lester due to his armor. Lester is rarely packing heavy duty weapons (all though his gear does vary). The armor may not hold forever but its still a pretty big edge.

#133 Posted by daredevil21134 (9039 posts) - - Show Bio

DD & Bullseye

#134 Edited by Auction_Sniper (1019 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

#135 Posted by patrat18 (6721 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman is a detective, within 2 minutes of the fight he would have already detected how DD's senses work. Batman is packed with sonic gadgets. Team 2 should take this.

#136 Posted by lesterlawton (465 posts) - - Show Bio

Bullseye would take out Joker in the first minute, leaving him free to pin-cushion Bats while he's fighting Daredevil.

#137 Posted by DigitalShooter9 (1099 posts) - - Show Bio

Joker is the weak link here.

Hell no, a tad bit joker gas and bye bye DD.... He has enhanced senses remember.

#138 Posted by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@patrat18 said:

Batman is a detective, within 2 minutes of the fight he would have already detected how DD's senses work. Batman is packed with sonic gadgets. Team 2 should take this.

It's not really obvious that Daredevil has enhanced senses. All detectives need clues to figure out things, and Daredevil leaves none around about his enhanced senses. That most likely will not happen though a case for Team 2 can be made.

#139 Edited by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

Joker is the weak link here.

Hell no, a tad bit joker gas and bye bye DD.... He has enhanced senses remember.

Joker would get obliterated by either Daredevil or Bullseye in hand to hand combat, which because the OP didn't specify, these two teams will start in that range.

#140 Edited by Perethorn (2747 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1. DD as MVP

#141 Posted by DigitalShooter9 (1099 posts) - - Show Bio

@digitalshooter9 said:

@wolverine08 said:

Joker is the weak link here.

Hell no, a tad bit joker gas and bye bye DD.... He has enhanced senses remember.

Joker would get obliterated by either Daredevil or Bullseye in hand to hand combat, which because the OP didn't specify, these two teams will start in that range.

I don't think you understand my point... Okay so a lot of people here are missing out on an idea. Take a minute and think about this scenario.

What will happen if the joker gassed DD? We are talking about someone who gets the smell of an object from god knows how far away... Nevertheless if DD can dodge the normal spread area of the gas, he WILL smell it, he can't escape it, his senses won't allow him to survive the smell of the joker gas... SO, simply saying, the moment the fight starts, joker shoots the gas at a random direction and DD dies laughing... This allows Batman and the Joker to stomp Bullseye.

Another point. I don't think the joker and DD can stay in the same vicinity, DD can't survive it.... The joker's hair is toxic, so are the polish on his nails, they are all the joker poison. If DD can smell them from a lot far away, he simply can't get near the joker, he dies the moment he catches the scent.... The joker poison is really lethal, it kills literally in seconds the moment someone catches the scent. And what more, The Joker is COMPLETELY immune to it....

#142 Posted by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

@digitalshooter9 said:

@wolverine08 said:

Joker is the weak link here.

Hell no, a tad bit joker gas and bye bye DD.... He has enhanced senses remember.

Joker would get obliterated by either Daredevil or Bullseye in hand to hand combat, which because the OP didn't specify, these two teams will start in that range.

I don't think you understand my point... Okay so a lot of people here are missing out on an idea. Take a minute and think about this scenario.

What will happen if the joker gassed DD? We are talking about someone who gets the smell of an object from god knows how far away... Nevertheless if DD can dodge the normal spread area of the gas, he WILL smell it, he can't escape it, his senses won't allow him to survive the smell of the joker gas... SO, simply saying, the moment the fight starts, joker shoots the gas at a random direction and DD dies laughing... This allows Batman and the Joker to stomp Bullseye.

Another point. I don't think the joker and DD can stay in the same vicinity, DD can't survive it.... The joker's hair is toxic, so are the polish on his nails, they are all the joker poison. If DD can smell them from a lot far away, he simply can't get near the joker, he dies the moment he catches the scent.... The joker poison is really lethal, it kills literally in seconds the moment someone catches the scent. And what more, The Joker is COMPLETELY immune to it....

I already told you. The teams are going to be starting up close. No time for Joker to get distance and drop Joker gas. He's going to be absolutely manhandled in H2H combat here.

#143 Posted by DigitalShooter9 (1099 posts) - - Show Bio

@digitalshooter9 said:

@wolverine08 said:

@digitalshooter9 said:

@wolverine08 said:

Joker is the weak link here.

Hell no, a tad bit joker gas and bye bye DD.... He has enhanced senses remember.

Joker would get obliterated by either Daredevil or Bullseye in hand to hand combat, which because the OP didn't specify, these two teams will start in that range.

I don't think you understand my point... Okay so a lot of people here are missing out on an idea. Take a minute and think about this scenario.

What will happen if the joker gassed DD? We are talking about someone who gets the smell of an object from god knows how far away... Nevertheless if DD can dodge the normal spread area of the gas, he WILL smell it, he can't escape it, his senses won't allow him to survive the smell of the joker gas... SO, simply saying, the moment the fight starts, joker shoots the gas at a random direction and DD dies laughing... This allows Batman and the Joker to stomp Bullseye.

Another point. I don't think the joker and DD can stay in the same vicinity, DD can't survive it.... The joker's hair is toxic, so are the polish on his nails, they are all the joker poison. If DD can smell them from a lot far away, he simply can't get near the joker, he dies the moment he catches the scent.... The joker poison is really lethal, it kills literally in seconds the moment someone catches the scent. And what more, The Joker is COMPLETELY immune to it....

I already told you. The teams are going to be starting up close. No time for Joker to get distance and drop Joker gas. He's going to be absolutely manhandled in H2H combat here.

For that matter he doesn't even need to drop the gas, the smell in his hair is enough to kill DD alone. Plus the joker gives Batman a though time in h2h on some occasions, he isn't getting manhandled or anything. If not any of these, the joker can survive until he drops the gas, he might not be the most skilled fighter but he is a brawler and DD isn't dropping him without a small fight whatsoever......

#144 Posted by Wolverine08 (26239 posts) - - Show Bio

@digitalshooter9: The smell of his hair won't kill him. It might smell strong to him, but it won't kill him. Also, Joker is a horrid H2H fighter. Most of his skill feats have already been debunked in this thread.

#145 Edited by DigitalShooter9 (1099 posts) - - Show Bio

@digitalshooter9: The smell of his hair won't kill him. It might smell strong to him, but it won't kill him. Also, Joker is a horrid H2H fighter. Most of his skill feats have already been debunked in this thread.

Oh it will kill him. DD can smell something from a mile away or something as far as I know. And the joker toxin kills if you smell it in. Plus as I said he can easily drop the gas before DD can do anything to him. I didn't see any of the jokers feats get debunked here, in fact, his fight with Cass cain being a good feat or not is debatable. You haven't even seen most of his skill feats. Jokergeist might have some.....