#1 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

Daredevil and Black Widow Vs. The Shredder and Karai as they appeared in the 4Kids TMNT show.

Widow has no guns, but she does have her Widow's Bite. Shredder has no weapons other than his trademark Tiger-Claws. Karai has her katana, and DD has his billy-clubs.

Versus

#2 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

Anyone have an opinion?

#3 Posted by protectyournose (908 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2

#4 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, that's one.

#5 Posted by TheWitchingHour (1340 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll go with team 1, although I'll confess that I don't know anything about Karai. Assuming she's somewhat equal to Shredder, Matt and Natasha should edge out a win.

#6 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheWitchingHour said:

I'll go with team 1, although I'll confess that I don't know anything about Karai. Assuming she's somewhat equal to Shredder, Matt and Natasha should edge out a win.

Both Shredder and Karai were consistently shown to be the Turtle's equals at worst and their superiors at best. Shredder in particular was often shown to be their better by a fair margin.

#7 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1... DD took on hundreds of yakuza ninjas hopped up on MGH (which gives you temporary super powers) and his training by the hand and the chaste have prepared him for ninjas such as these...he might even solo here...being that he could easily one shot both of these two and sense every blow coming in at him

#8 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@Bane_of_sith said:

Team 1... DD took on hundreds of yakuza ninjas hopped up on MGH (which gives you temporary super powers) and his training by the hand and the chaste have prepared him for ninjas such as these...he might even solo here...being that he could easily one shot both of these two and sense every blow coming in at him

How could DD one-shot them? Also, if his radar-senses were that uber, then realistically, he never would have lost to anyone short of Thor or Hulk. He obviously can't sense every attack that comes his way, or he'd never lose.

#9 Posted by Crom-Cruach (8857 posts) - - Show Bio

If you're talking about Ch'rell as your Shredder then he could take both And Natasha and DD. He was capable of taking out the entire Turtle team with Splinter and either win or hold his own. He was stronger then a Triceraton and he was Battle Nexus Champion. The only reason the turtles defeated him was either luck, surprise or overwhelming advantage with some gadget or tool.

That's on top of being a cybernetic battle suit with super-human attributes across the board.

Anyone saying DD could solo the other team. Has no idea who Ch'rell is.

#10 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@Crom-Cruach said:

If you're talking about Ch'rell as your Shredder then he could take both And Natasha and DD. He was capable of taking out the entire Turtle team with Splinter and either win or hold his own. He was stronger then a Triceraton and he was Battle Nexus Champion. The only reason the turtles defeated him was either luck, surprise or overwhelming advantage with some gadget or tool.

That's on top of being a cybernetic battle suit with super-human attributes across the board.

Anyone saying DD could solo the other team. Has no idea who Ch'rell is.

This guy, he knows his stuff.

#11 Edited by Crom-Cruach (8857 posts) - - Show Bio

@shroudofsorrow said:

This guy, he knows his stuff.

I'm on my third time watching the entire series (except for the Fast Forward season, that sucked). Anyone Saying DD can take Ch'rell has not watched the show. Ch'rell was so powerful that he was stronger then Hun, who based on displays had strength above human (no explanation ever given mind you). But the man was nearly as strong as a Triceraton and Shredder would crush him like a bug.

Karai in her first fight with the turtles walked all over them. Then even as their skills improved considerably, the only one that could hold his own against her was Leo or the super-human agent Bishop (who made it a habit of humiliating the turtles. managing in their first fight to take on all of the turtles and place in a position where he could have murdered Michaelangelo with a tie)

#12 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

DD has defeated infomorph who is a cyborg programmed with daredevil and captain America's fighting abilities along with all of hydras top fighters,,,and he defeated a royal wakandan guardsman who was wearing bullet proof battle armor equipped with jet flight and the ability to rip apart a tank,,,and he has stalemated iron fist in daredevil #178 which none of these two could ever dream of,,,not to mention he is a master of pressure point and bone breaking techniques..he would win for sure especially with black widow in the mix...I never said he definitely solos but it's very likely he could since he had taken on a hundred MGH enhanced ninjas,,,and beaten spiderman and taskmaster and countless others who would destroy shredder

#13 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@Bane_of_sith: You don't know who Ch'rell is do you? Read the above posts, his feats are pretty intense. Karai I could see him beating, but Shredder? By himself? Doubtful.

#14 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

DD beat mr.hyde who is ridiculously strong he is ranked 5/7 on the marvel scale which I know is folly but I don't know what his ton limit is, he also beat spiderman who is much stronger than himself,,,I have only watched the Tmnt show once all the way through but I don't think ultrom shredder could beat Matt, it's just my opinion. Matt has some incredible feats of strength as well like using a 450 weight bar as a weapon and using a tire to launch a car engine through a truck...he is very strong and paired with his extraordinary senses which he uses to see incoming bullets and swat them away with ease, and has saved spiderman from sniper fire before, I think he could win this especially with BW there,,,I honestly think he could one shot Karai and concentrate on putting down shredder. I'm not trying to offend here. But DD has feats beyond just fighting ninja turtles,,the guy has fought off dozens of MGH enhanced yakuza ninjas all armed with katanas and enemies that would destroy the ninja turtles

#15 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@Bane_of_sith: All true, but Shred-Head's a Battle Nexus champion who also possess super strength. Since neither he nor Karai have guns, bullets will not be an issue. I don't see DD, good as he is, being able to dodge every attack thrown his way, or he never would have lost a fight. Pre-death Elektra has beaten or outmaneuvered him several times, and I'd put Karai on at least pre-death Elektra's level, but probably higher. Shredder's even better, so no matter who wins, I definitely see Shredder and DD going at it for a while. As for Widow Vs. Karai, I don't know. She managed to avoid getting killed by Elektra at least once, but I don't really know of her hand-to-hand feats beyond that she's kick-ass enough to hang with the likes of Bucky and of course, DD.

And never underestimate the TMNT. They're all awesome, especially later on.

#16 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

I love Tmnt as a kid I was Michelangelo lol,,,I still rip up the nunchaku because of that show I got into martial arts 20 years ago,,but that when my love for DD started growing as well, I think Karai would beat BW Tough,,,Elektra beating DD was really because he holds back fighting her,,he even saved her life by catching one of bullseyes cards before it could slice her throat..I think the shredder DD fight would be epic though...DD couldn't dodge every hit tour right on that but I think the rogues and other comic characters he has fought in the past make him ready for this challenge

#17 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1

#18 Posted by IncredibleBongoBands (69 posts) - - Show Bio

Ahh i used to love that show!!

Still the TMNT cartoon villians lose to BW and DD

DD messes around with Hand baddies and my opinion is

Hand baddies > Shredder goons

Natasha has way more exp. than Karai. Still, they're ninjas and ninjas are pretty cool. lol.

#19 Posted by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

@IncredibleBongoBands: The one problem with that argument is that these aren't Foot "goons". They're Shredder and Karai.

#20 Edited by shroudofsorrow (3163 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump

#21 Posted by AllStarSuperman (21865 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2, idk how they would put Shredder down.

#22 Posted by Jmarshmallow (6948 posts) - - Show Bio

Wasn't Shredder supposed to be like Batman's equal?

If that's true, he solos here.

Jmarshmallow

#23 Posted by CaptainMarvelThunder (1106 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2. In fact I think that Shredder can solo.