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#1 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

VS

AT field is off.

Eva-09 has his jet-pack cape

Ichigo's intangibility/invisbility/soul crush/attacking souls is OFF

Speed is equalized.

Starting points: Opposite ends of New York City

Eva cannot awaken, unless Ichigo stomps then it awakens.

No Mugetsu or FGT for Ichigo.

P.S. I'm trying to get a good fight for the eva's, they survive mountain busting attacks and Ichigo had mountain busting attacks. So I figured I would try.

#2 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Ichigo has a hard time that thing is massive and it is the same speed as him I still give it to him as he is smaller and can still avoid those attacks

#3 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

Speed equalized? Eva wins.

Ichigo can't do anything to it. They tank nukes without issue, which is probably the highest end estimate of his destructive power. They're much more than mountain level.

#4 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager: He obliterates entire mountains, that is a bit more than a nuke, and they still cant hit him he is just to small and he can fly ( air walk)making it difficult for them to hit him while he can hit them

#5 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103 said:

@fallschirmjager: He obliterates entire mountains, that is a bit more than a nuke, and they still cant hit him he is just to small and he can fly ( air walk)making it difficult for them to hit him while he can hit them

Unit 00 set a N2 missile off in its hand and only lost its arm.

Unit 00 is the weakest version being a prototype.

And mountain isn't necessarily better than nuke. It depends on the size.

He can't damage them whatsoever. If they are as fast as him they will eventually grab him.

#6 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

Speed equalized? Eva wins.

Ichigo can't do anything to it. They tank nukes without issue, which is probably the highest end estimate of his destructive power. They're much more than mountain level.

This. Not to mentioned Eva is 100% as a series.....

#7 Edited by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager:

Ichigos mountain was pretty big

eventually, but keep in mind he is shattering massive spells with one hand and blocking blades ( of serious power) without getting cut he can tank punishment all day and break out when ever they catch him and he can always parry there strikes if he needs to not to mention he can always knock them away ( their hands, and weapons)

either way this is a long fight

#8 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103 said:

@fallschirmjager:

Ichigos mountain was pretty big

eventually, but keep in mind he is shattering massive spells with one hand and blocking blades ( of serious power) without getting cut he can tank punishment all day and break out when ever they catch him and he can always parry there strikes if he needs to not to mention he can always knock them away ( their hands, and weapons)

either way this is a long fight

Eva's are pretty strong. I forgot which unit (Reis again maybe), but one of them threw the lance of Longinus from Earth, through orbit, killed an angel and it landed on the moon.

Asuka in End of Evangelion threw a battleship at another Eva.

#9 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager:

Still not seeing the grappling strength in there fingers to match Ichigo

seriously he is tiny compared to them like an ant we are looking at Kratos senerio here sure they are stronger but even with the same speed they will find it impossablle to hit him , Have you ever tried to hit a fly mid flight? it is difficult not just becaue of the speed of the fly but because of how tiny it is we have a hard time tracking it, and these are robots designed to fight giant beings

#10 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103 said:

@fallschirmjager:

Still not seeing the grappling strength in there fingers to match Ichigo

seriously he is tiny compared to them like an ant we are looking at Kratos senerio here sure they are stronger but even with the same speed they will find it impossablle to hit him , Have you ever tried to hit a fly mid flight? it is difficult not just becaue of the speed of the fly but because of how tiny it is we have a hard time tracking it, and these are robots designed to fight giant beings

Not really. You can smash a mosquito can't you? That's because they fly A LOT slower than a fly.

Size a factor, but the speed is equalized. They'll hit him.

#11 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

seriously he is tiny compared to them like an ant we are looking at Kratos senerio here sure they are stronger but even with the same speed they will find it impossablle to hit him , Have you ever tried to hit a fly mid flight? it is difficult not just becaue of the speed of the fly but because of how tiny it is we have a hard time tracking it, and these are robots designed to fight giant beings

Honestly, this is a blatant appeal to ignorance .

#12 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager:

Thank you for proveing my point mosquito<<<<horse fly <<<<< human being

and this bug has a sting that is compareable to theres

lets say they grab him they would need to prove more strength in their fingers then Ichigos full body and by a massive amount as well ( he only has to move them far enough for him to get out

they hit him with their hand they send him flying... and he recovers and that's if they hit him with a good strike weaker attacks he stops dead

they hit him with their weapon ( this is the hardest option) why cant he just block it? he has to move a much smaller distance then them so he can block it

#13 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio
#14 Posted by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager:

Thank you for proveing my point mosquito<<<<horse fly <<<<< human being

In this continuing metaphor Eva = Human. and Ichigo = bug.

So Ichigo gets smashed?

Or should we drop this dumb metaphor?

#15 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011: What am I missing here?

You're assuming the proposition of Eva's not being able to hit an smaller opponent because they haven't aren't you?

#16 Edited by uberhikari (1851 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager:

Ichigos mountain was pretty big

eventually, but keep in mind he is shattering massive spells with one hand and blocking blades ( of serious power) without getting cut he can tank punishment all day and break out when ever they catch him and he can always parry there strikes if he needs to not to mention he can always knock them away ( their hands, and weapons)

either way this is a long fight

Ichigo never busted a mountain. It was basically a hill.

That hill doesn't even look like it was more than 200 feet high. Granted, Ichigo did this with the shockwave from his sword but that's nowhere near mountain-busting range.

#17 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@fallschirmjager: He is a bug that can tank our best hits and dish out comparable damage

#18 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio
#19 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: i knew i remembered it being smallish :p

#20 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011: have they taged some one human sized that can fly?

And that brings me back to what I've stated from the get-go; your entire argument is an appeal to ignorance.

You're saying your proposition is true because it has not been proven false.

#21 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011:

Is't the burden of proof on you?

and again lets say they can hit each outer with ease Ichigo blocks Eva tanks and they extrange blows for days

#22 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

Is't the burden of proof on you?

Nope. Because I haven't made any claims. You claimed they can't hit small oppoents because they never have. The burden of proof falls upon you, not me.

and again lets say they can hit each outer with ease Ichigo blocks Eva tanks and they extrange blows for days

Not really. As Falls pointed out, Rei Eva unit has been able to hurl the massive Lance of Longinus through an Angel, it then proceeds to exceed the speed needed for escape velocity to then become trapped in the lunar orbit. That put's the Eva unit in the million ton range with ease. Ichigo has done nothing to say he could replicate such a feat.

#23 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011:

already given an example ( flys) and I have to point out Logicly that it is much harder to hit a smaller target then a bigger one

show me feats for there fingers and there highest attacks ( you are using ) are wind ups that would be easy to doge for most Ichigo is smaller and hardeer to hit

#24 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

already given an example ( flys) and I have to point out Logicly that it is much harder to hit a smaller target then a bigger one

Humans =/= Eva's I fail to see how that logic applies here.

show me feats for there fingers

I have no idea what this is even supposed to mean.

and there highest attacks ( you are using ) are wind ups that would be easy to doge for most Ichigo is smaller and hardeer to hit

Even if it was as you say "wind ups" If they're normal swings are even 1/10 that power it is much more powerful then what Ichigo has ever done. But to be frank, I don't recall Rei even "winding up" to throw the Lance from the start.

#25 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011:

Your right Evas are < human reaction speed because they are piloted by humans they have to react then move the Eva so there is a delay as well

and how is the logic of small target = harder to hit in debate ?

#26 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

Your right Evas are < human reaction speed because they are piloted by humans they have to react then move the Eva so there is a delay as well

That didn't stop the Eva from battling other Eva's moving at super fast speed. I doubt it would be a problem here. Not to mention the Eva actually syc's with the pilot so it may raise it's reaction time.

and how is the logic of small target = harder to hit in debate

Because I don't really think it would help Ichigo out as much as you're letting on.

#27 Edited by KaijuKingGojira (1375 posts) - - Show Bio

Aren't the soul reapers from bleach abstract spirits/ghost of some sort?

#28 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011: in sync means they only have human reflexes

It is a major factor!

#29 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (21278 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

in sync means they only have human reflexes

It is a major factor!

Or it means they the pilots have superhuman that matches the Eva's reflexes O_o Eva's move at supersonic speeds IIRC.

#30 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@kaijukinggojira said:

Aren't the soul reapers from bleach abstract spirits/ghost of some sort.

I turned off their ghostly stuff so he can be hit, otherwise The Eva's wouldn't see him, and just being near him would destroy their souls. But they are not abstracts.

@uberhikari Since when are hills made of rock and come to a point?

@dccomicsrule2011 @cjdavis103 I think Eva 01 is the one that threw the lance of longinous. But @cjdavis103 Eva's are very very fast, eva 01 can run fast enough to break the sound barrier, and their combat speed is nothing to laugh at, they might be huge but they might as well be a human+ speed. And they are very strong, Eva-01 held up a city sized angel that was falling towards earth. And he held it there while his arms were impaled. That's about or above Thor levels of strength, (iirc he needed beta ray bill to lift Asgard. Oh and thanks for calling me out, it made it a lot easier to come back to the thread, I had no idea this thread would gain so much traction without even using the callout book.

#31 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: here's the thing Ichigo is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> faster then them even if speed is the same the reaction speed is still vastly different Ichigo can track there smallest movements and doge accordingly

#32 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio
@dccomicsrule2011 said:

@cjdavis103:

in sync means they only have human reflexes

It is a major factor!

Or it means they the pilots have superhuman that matches the Eva's reflexes O_o Eva's move at supersonic speeds IIRC.

Um, yeah, lets go with that. And that Ichigo is stuck at the same speed as the eva's.

#33 Posted by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: here's the thing Ichigo is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> faster then them even if speed is the same the reaction speed is still vastly different Ichigo can track there smallest movements and doge accordingly

How can he do that when their speeds are the same? No blitzing or flying behind them before they blink. D=

#34 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: reaction speed not actual speed

#35 Edited by uberhikari (1851 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

Since when are hills made of rock and come to a point?

What? You mean like this?

This happens all the time in nature. What Ichigo destroyed is just a large rock formation.

#36 Posted by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: reaction speed not actual speed

I know this, but knowing it's coming doesn't help if you're not fast enough to move.

@uberhikari That doesn't look like a hill. Looks like limestone formations, where they were was most certainly rocks. If you are using them for reference it's probably just artistic representation so you can know what happened.

#37 Edited by uberhikari (1851 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

That doesn't look like a hill. Looks like limestone formations, where they were was most certainly rocks. If you are using them for reference it's probably just artistic representation so you can know what happened.

I don't understand anything you're saying here. Are you saying that hills can't be made out of rock? From dictionary.com:

a natural elevation of the earth's surface, smaller than a mountain.

#38 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: actually with his reaction speed he can predict their movements and doge well before ther initiate their actual attacks

@uberhikari: so dailaga Ichigo ad full Aizen is <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 4 esapda? really?!?

#39 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

That doesn't look like a hill. Looks like limestone formations, where they were was most certainly rocks. If you are using them for reference it's probably just artistic representation so you can know what happened.

I don't understand anything you're saying here. Are you saying that hills can't be made out of rock? From dictionary.com:

a natural elevation of the earth's surface, smaller than a mountain.

The general idea of a hill tends to be round at the top and covered in grass, that's the general idea. Is there a legitimate number system that says "Anything under 200 ft is a hill" "anything over 500 ft is a mountain" or something? But even if it was a hill, notice that it was vaporized, not just destroyed. Now if he actually hits it, then if he uses a Getsuga Tenshou....

#40 Posted by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: actually with his reaction speed he can predict their movements and doge well before ther initiate their actual attacks

Reaction speed feats? Have you ever seen Evangelions move?

#41 Edited by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

She takes 2 steps and throws it. I guess its technically wind up, but extremely impressive nonetheless. And again. Unit 00 is a prototype unit and Rei has the lowest sync ratio of the 3. Its the weakest unit/combo of any of the EVAs

@jeepeh said:

@dccomicsrule2011 @cjdavis103 I think Eva 01 is the one that threw the lance of longinous. But @cjdavis103 Eva's are very very fast, eva 01 can run fast enough to break the sound barrier, and their combat speed is nothing to laugh at, they might be huge but they might as well be a human+ speed. And they are very strong, Eva-01 held up a city sized angel that was falling towards earth. And he held it there while his arms were impaled.

It was definitely Rei and unit 00.

And Shinji held up the Angel with his AT field. He wasn't physically holding it up. Skip to 2:30

#42 Edited by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: have you seen Ichigo? unequlized speed Ichigo curbs eyes closed he just that much faster

#43 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio
@fallschirmjager said:

Speed equalized? Eva wins.

Ichigo can't do anything to it. They tank nukes without issue, which is probably the highest end estimate of his destructive power. They're much more than mountain level.

What about when he uses Getsuga Tenshou?

@cjdavis103 said:

@jeepeh: have you seen Ichigo? unequlized speed Ichigo curbs eyes closed he just that much faster

I have, but if he can't move faster than the eva's I don't see how it helps exactly.... But what do you think happens if Zangetsu connects with the scythe? Is it safe to assume the scythe has the same ability as progressive knives?

@fallschirmjager Ah, okay. I could've sworn it was 01. But if it was the AT field holding it up.... then what's the point of impaling his arms? I don't see the purpose behind it. Why not impale his head instead? What's the Eva's best strength feat if this one doesn't count?

Oh, and annoying music is annoying. XD

#44 Posted by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Getsuga isn't doing anything. EVA's can tank nukes without AT fields. Unit 00 (again the weakest one) set one off in her hand and it only blew off her arm. Unit 09 is twice the sized and has double layered armor.

I don't know why its piercing its arms...cos its cool?

Unit 02 picked up and threw a battleship at another EVA in End of Evangelion. And Unit 00 throwing the spear into Lunar Orbit was awesome as well.

There's prolly more, I can't remember right now.

#45 Posted by uberhikari (1851 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh said:

@uberhikari said:

@jeepeh:

That doesn't look like a hill. Looks like limestone formations, where they were was most certainly rocks. If you are using them for reference it's probably just artistic representation so you can know what happened.

I don't understand anything you're saying here. Are you saying that hills can't be made out of rock? From dictionary.com:

a natural elevation of the earth's surface, smaller than a mountain.

The general idea of a hill tends to be round at the top and covered in grass, that's the general idea. Is there a legitimate number system that says "Anything under 200 ft is a hill" "anything over 500 ft is a mountain" or something? But even if it was a hill, notice that it was vaporized, not just destroyed. Now if he actually hits it, then if he uses a Getsuga Tenshou....

This is wrong. Just because people have a general idea doesn't mean they're right. Furthermore, you do realize that words can have more than one definition, right? In colloquial language a hill is generally a small mound of material gathered into a pile or it could be what you're describing. But in orology this is not true. A mountain, by definition, is just the elevation of the surface of the Earth. A hill is smaller than a mountain like I just showed you in the picture. As for what size constitutes a mountain rather than a hill, there is no universally accepted size. However, a mountain is almost always more than 2.5 km high. That's the standard used by the UN Environmental Programme, for example.

As for vaporizing the mountain rather than simply pulverizing it...who cares? Scaling that thing from pictures is a nightmare and, therefore, makes the feat unquantifiable. Is it impressive? Sure. But you can't stretch it into a true mountain-busting feat. Based on the only picture we have it's clearly nowhere near 2.5 km high; like I said it barely looks like it's 200 feet high. And not even mugetsu was a true mountain-busting feat. It was a thin slice of reiatsu that didn't even do any damage to the surrounding landscape:

#46 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Getsuga isn't doing anything. EVA's can tank nukes without AT fields. Unit 00 (again the weakest one) set one off in her hand and it only blew off her arm. Unit 09 is twice the sized and has double layered armor.

I don't know why its piercing its arms...cos its cool?

Unit 02 picked up and threw a battleship at another EVA in End of Evangelion. And Unit 00 throwing the spear into Lunar Orbit was awesome as well.

There's prolly more, I can't remember right now.

Twice the size? O_o

Is it possible that it's some kind of mixture of AT field and strength? If he wasn't doing anything it would've made more sense to attempt to kill the Eva so the AT field wouldn't be holding it back anymore.

Threw a battle ship... like Sentry? These guys are mirroring Sentry's feats now? Yikes. Is it okay to assume that 09 is stronger than the earlier ones?

@uberhikari I actually have a thread floating around about how Mugetsu isn't an attack that's made to destroy anything, it is to attack the enemy and destroy it utterly. If normal swinging to destroy a "hill" then Mugetsu would've done a lot more than that if it was meant to.

#47 Posted by Cjdavis103 (7085 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: what I am trying to say is if his eyes can keep up with people on his level of speed something at barley sonic speeds are slow as hell to his eyes he can track there moments and predict what they are going to do ahead of time and move accordingly

and I am pretty sure he can block it

#48 Posted by uberhikari (1851 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Mugetsu is just like Byakuya's senkei. It's just designed to increase the killing power of the user's attack. Mugetsu is just a blade made out of condensed reiatsu.

#49 Edited by Jeepeh (2805 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103 said:

@jeepeh: what I am trying to say is if his eyes can keep up with people on his level of speed something at barley sonic speeds are slow as hell to his eyes he can track there moments and predict what they are going to do ahead of time and move accordingly

and I am pretty sure he can block it

Doesn't equalizing speed also imply equalizing reaction speed? But I can't prove it, aside from how easily the scythe cut through 06 (which a normal piece of metal shouldn't be able to do) but it would make sense to say that the Scythe 09 uses is the same technology as the Progressive knives the rest of them use, They vibrate so fast that they can cut things on a molecular level, that wouldn't do any damage to Ichigo or Zangetsu at all?

#50 Posted by Fallschirmjager (11558 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Twice might be exaggerating, but its bigger.

I'm pretty sure it was brute strength alone.

Skip to 2:40. Rei is holding the nuke inside her own AT field because she's trying to break Zeruel's. There's no way it protected her against the explosion. She's standing right next to the blast - unfortunately it cuts off before we see what happens, but I'm like 99% sure she only lost an arm.

Yep. She picks it up at 0:16, uses it to block missiles then throws it across the lake (she was actuallly killing missile batteries, not an EVA though, I remembered it slightly wrong) Also she picks up and rips another EVA in half at 3:45, I think EVA's are suppose to weight 10,000-15,000 tons.