D B T R1: Elite Predator vs Wolverine (Votes are Open)

You do realize that Wolverine was up right after that, right? And of course you were trying to disprove Logan's showing against Peter with a showing of Spock.

"Wow dude, context, look it up, here is the whole fight." - sirfizzwhizz

I find this statement hilariously ironic considering the fact that you have left out context on your wolverine scans and some of your predator scans. On your second comment right now and I hope the rest of the debate doesn't consist of the same lowballing and out of context scans

@thenaughtytitan: People say Logan was up right after that but he was actually down for a page or 2 and we do see his body unconscous iirc. People bring up how Logan pinned spOck while he had his back turned but people never mention spOck wasn't use to peters powers yet. He had issues using his wall crawling powers and stated that "my mind still oberrides this body".

I do think Logan can give Peter a good fight on average showings but spOck stomped him fair and square.

All though that said I just realized voting is still going on...I choose not to vote and I wont say anymore until voting is done. Apologies to the debaters.

IIRC Spock more or less cheap shotted logan. I don't recall it showing him being completely down and out though, you're probably right as my memory is terrible. Anyway him being right up or KO'd doesn't matter much, the fact still remains that it was Spock and fizzz didn't mention that.

Fact is Wolverine was down, and lying in a dirt nap, not springing up ready to go. I know the context and showed as much. I know you like Wolverine, and may not appreciate my views on him being vastly overatted, but in the end thats my opinion on him.

So vote how ya feel, I make no apologies for what I see as truth. Wolverine is not some un koable foes who is immune to KO. Period.

This debate was lackluster if to be honest. I feel like a lot of the debate was lowballing and posting out of context scans. And tbh @sirfizzwhizz if you were debating against a more experienced debater who knew a bit more about Wolverine you would have gotten embarrassed on certain matters (such as durability, speed and your out of context scans). I felt a lot of the speed feats you showed were not very impressive, some were aim dodging and one has predator getting hit by a bullet, i'm not sure what's so impressive about that scan.

Most of your durability scans didn't prove much of anything, tanking explosions wont help him against a clawed foe like Logan. I've noticed that on more than one occasion you've shown durability scans that are out of context to the debate, such as your debate with lunacyde where you threw out a bunch of blunt force durability scans against a team that was coming at you with mainly piercing attacks and deconstruction. In the future try and cite things that actually say something about the fight at hand.

@justicethorpsylocke I feel that you missed out on key counters that could have won you the debate, you really needed to show more for Logan durability wise and you didn't really make an argument as to how the fight would go, you mainly just threw out scans and let them do the talking and they didn't really do much. And like fizz you left out context on certain things, overall you did decent for how new you are but you need to work on some things.

I can't really pick a clear winner, the debate was just overall lackluster and you both really didn't do enough to make you the clear winner in my mind. Not really a draw either, it's just not a debate I really feel I can vote on and I don't feel like either of your arguments were strong enough based on the large amount of things weighing them down.

This post may seem a tad straight forward and harsh but it's truly how I feel about the debate. Take my criticism however you like, and good luck in future debates.

@bullet_to_the_head: @visemoon: That was my mistake, as I realize I open the post, and he had to finish it.

Thank you.

Wolverine isn't necessarily overrated, he is just really inconsistent so if you view only his low end feats as representing his power level then he will seem overrated (it seems that you only like to acknowledge his lower end showings). I am not claiming he is immune to being KO'd but he has low and high end showings of how much he can withstand before being knocked out, and it appears you only cite lower end showings. I will admit of course that your opponent didn't do the best job of showing wolverine's more impressive showings.

And of course him being downed by Spock doesn't really prove anything in this debate, especially when you left out the fact that it was Spock and tried to claim that a showing of Spock vs Wolverine more accurately represents how Spiderman vs Wolverine would go nowadays.

@sirfizzwhizz: Jashro's post doesn't do much to combat your hypocrisy in mocking your opponent for leaving context out when you did that as well on more than one occasion. Anyway that's all I have to say, take it or leave it.

I will take it, and appreciate your honesty. I disagree with it of course lol, but again, I can understand it.

@justicethorpsylocke: Vote goes to you.

@thenaughtytitan: @sirfizzwhizz: Heres the full scans:

Gallery

Logan wasn't knocked out for long but he was knocked out for more than 10 seconds. I will also upload this scan as well to show you guys that spOck hadn't adjusted to Peters body at this point:

Again I think Logan can do better but the showing is what it is.

@jashro44: Eh, considering the fact that Fizz didn't point out that it was spock and he never pointed out he wasn't adjusted to Peters body yet I still see it as leaving out context and overall it's still one of the blemishes in his argument. I know you say he wasn't adjusted to peter's body yet but didn't he do things beyond what peter would normally do with morals on even before the showing against Logan? I didn't follow Superior spiderman so I wouldn't know but I am aware of some of the showings due to comic vine's previews, threads and some of my friends have said bits and pieces here and there.

Nope. HIs better feats came after he defeated wolverine to be honest. I would say most of his low showings were early on. As for Cadence leaving out context, the context didn't really affect his point. I agree he did low ball wolverine from what I read of the discussion though.

I feel like it affected how he looked in the overall debate though, maybe it didn't affect the point he was making but considering he gave his opponent a lot of flack for leaving out context and it being Spock is one of the multiple instances of him leaving out context.

@thenaughtytitan: Yea I see what your saying.

So your bashing me for me saying this already in my arguments?

You mean you showed a younger, and I mean way more inexperience Spider Man who had issues with Punisher at that point of time,matching Wolverine. What happens when Wolverine and Spider man of a more current battle happen?

Oh yeah, he gets blitz where he could not defend himself, and gets one shotted. Just saying. older scan of a less powerful and in experience Spidey is not proof of anything.

This is what i stated, and it all happen as i said. Spock punked wolverine pretty easy, and even worse he was not adjusted to the body. So your calling me out for stating what seems to me the obvious truth of Spidey vs Wolverine.

Thank you again @jashro44 for bringing the points up better than I could anyway.

Your just mad because Predator crush Fett in the Battle of the Week ;) We also never finish that Ultimate Cap vs Fett debate. We should re make that sometime.

@higorm@thetruebarryallen@esquire@beaconofstrength@wolfrazer@mr_ingenuity@cosmicallyaware1@granitesoldier@killerwasp Some call outs if interested.

So far everyone is b*tching I am lowballing Wolverine. That Hard Stabs and massive Healing factor taxing is not a thing. Get a chance to read, and let me know lol.

@sirfizzwhizz: I think the issue is you refereed to SpOck as spider-man. I mean I guess he was calling himself spider-man, but it sounded like you were saying it was Peter. Also technically wolverine was 3 shotted and he was keeping his claws sheathed.

I get this doesn't affect your point much (since you were trying to argue spider-man can KO wolverine and that Peter is faster) but I think its worth noting. And no problem.

I see, but he is Spider man. Different mind set, same body with memories of peter in it as well, but I can see why someone may have a problem with that lol.

Though Wolverine claws were sheathe, I chalk it up to being blitzed lol. Yeah thanks again.

I know but other people might get confused. Its better to differentiate Otto from Peter even though there stats are the same. As for the claws sheathed, Otto stated that Logan kept them sheathed out of respect. Not sure if I would say logan was blitzed. He got stomped for sure though.

@sirfizzwhizz: You dare! Shameth on thine soul!

In all seriousness though, Boba's always at a disadvantage in those types of things because there are too many people who don't know squat about the EU and only look at his movie... "feats" (embarrassments more rather). Not so with Predator. Predator has a healthy amount of good feats in the movies.

And we had a Boba vs Ultimate Cap CaV? Must have been forever ago because I honestly don't remember it. I remember having one with Cadence, however.

@sirfizzwhizz: Wait what? I already voted. Check page one.

@sirfizzwhizz: your Cadence? well the more you know, :P

@sirfizzwhizz:

So your bashing me for me saying this already in my arguments?

I never bashed you, why do you always get so defensive? Funny how one of the older members and one of the older people on the site acts so defensive and immature, you pull this BS a lot. Are you seriously going to play the victim card when I didn't say anything close to bash worthy? Please tell me how I bashed you in that comment. Are you referring to when I said it was a blemish? That's the truth, I feel it is one of the multiple blemishes in your comments.

This is what i stated, and it all happen as i said. Spock punked wolverine pretty easy, and even worse he was not adjusted to the body. So your calling me out for stating what seems to me the obvious truth of Spidey vs Wolverine.

My problem is with you acting like it's peter and not even addressing the fact that it's Spock, Jashro has of course proven parts of what I said wrong but you still left out context after you made such a big deal about your opponent doing the same thing.

And lol, thanks for quoting yourself, it appears you actually did leave out some major context, you claim that Wolverine got one shotted, Spock through a combo right before that out of context scan you posted ;)

@jashro44: Thanks to Sirfizz graciously quoting what he said it looks like he did leave out some context though Jash...

"and gets one shotted" - sirfizz

Hehe

Meh, I guess my term for the face slam in the concrete as the one shot to KO him is un accurate to a not picker, even though i stated he was blitz (the attack before that final blow) was in my qoute. :)

My problem is with you acting like it's peter and not even addressing the fact that it's Spock

Spock and peter are the same. Same stats, same memories, only difference is personality and knowledge in some things. Thats really it.

Stop nit picking.

Boba got some decent feats in the Clone Wars as a damn kid. But yeah.

Also that was the CaV I was referring to lol.

Really, you never knew?

Personality can go a long way when you hold back as much as peter, which is what I was saying at first. Anyway that doesn't matter as much as this:

"Oh yeah, he gets blitz where he could not defend himself, and gets one shotted." - fizz

Not sure how you saying he got blitzed debunks what you said above, which is that he got one shotted... when he clearly didn't get one shotted. Whatever floats your boat I guess.

I see that you haven't addressed this:

I never bashed you, why do you always get so defensive? Funny how one of the older members and one of the older people on the site acts so defensive and immature, you pull this BS a lot. Are you seriously going to play the victim card when I didn't say anything close to bash worthy? Please tell me how I bashed you in that comment. Are you referring to when I said it was a blemish? That's the truth, I feel it is one of the multiple blemishes in your comments.

So either tell me how I was bashing or admit that you wrongfully accused me ... not that hard.

Stop nit picking.

Stop paying attention to the flaws in my comment, blindly give me votes because I am in the HOF*

Fixed.

Just for the record SpOck only had access to some of Peters memories. This doesn't impact anything you said I'm just saying this for the record.

@thenaughtytitan:

Stop paying attention to the flaws in my comment, blindly give me votes because I am in the HOF*

Fixed.

Oh boy.

I know :)

@sirfizzwhizz: I assumed you were, but never got that confirmed intill now

I'm voting for the predator

Counters were spot on, seemed like he knew more about tee scans the other guy was posting than the other guy did.

Plus the fact that the predator guy was using low end feats of predators of lower tiers while the wolverine guy was using super high end feats as a crutch.

So predator by a small margin, mainly due to the Molecular Cutting Discs, which will be wolverines bane.

@sirfizzwhizz: Wow! Hey! You're Cadence?? I'll be honest, I had no idea dude.

@fetts: set up a CaV sometime.

@sirfizzwhizz: Will if I can. It's likely I'll be getting a job at Dunkin Donut's soon, and I'm already in a tourney of Luna's, so my availability will be questionable.

I hear that, good luck with the job, I love their Ice Coffees and Glaze donuts. Mmmm, I might go for some now lol.

@sirfizzwhizz: Give me a day or so and i can give u an answer, works always in the way! argh D:

@bullet_to_the_head: I think I'm going with @justicethorpsylocke here. They are about as fast, and maybe as skilled. The main reason is Wolverine's massive durability. Most things Predator has against him won't KO him, while Wolverine can tank a massive amount of damage and then strike Predator. It's really, really close though.

Vote goes to fizz, reason is he actually stated how he could take down wolverine and countered examples given by justice like the Spider-man one which IMO was a good thing to do fizz I don't think the debate was great in the aspect of who would actually win due to the fact that like I said one didn't even really present a way or reason why they'd win and well the other did but it was only minor I think the debate could of gone better if both debaters debated how they could plan out and use the environment to their advantage as to why they'd win, anyway good cav in the aspects of scans, kinda lacking in the whole text debate, if anyone has any questions feel free to pm me. :D

@killerwasp: @arathorn_ii: thanks for the votes :)

Votes have been Collected, and the Elite Predator WINS