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#1 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops(No Phoenix Force)

vs

Human Torch

Battle Rules: Morals On

Win by KO or Death.

#2 Posted by JediXMan (31332 posts) - - Show Bio

Going with Cyclops.

Moderator
#3 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@JediXMan said:

Going with Cyclops.

LOL.

#4 Posted by sandiego008 (3280 posts) - - Show Bio

@JediXMan said:

Going with Cyclops.

ccurious to see if any reasoning ... as I could actually see cyclops winning a small margin.

#5 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

well idk Human Torch and Cyclops will just be doing shot for shot, example stream of fire vs optic beam, or fire blast vs optic blast etc... so who wins?

#6 Posted by karetaker (1565 posts) - - Show Bio

torch takes 7/10

#7 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

@karetaker: care to explain?

#8 Edited by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

Does Johnny still have the Cosmic Rod? Cause I'm guessing this is him without it.

I could see Cyclops taking a margin due to accuracy and power behind his blasts. Johnny's best bet is to take things to the air but I forgot how fast he is or if he has impressive reflex feats to say he can dodge Cykes' blasts considering he's tagged fast people like Northstar, Quicksilver, Spider-Man and Wolverine on a few occasions. It would be like duck hunting or a quickdraw and Scott just has to squeeze his fists for a blast.

Not saying Cyke wins but I'll make a case if I can but I've been out of FF for awhile so I won't say Scott wins on that notion too.

Moderator
#9 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: do you know the speed at which Human Torch flies?

#10 Posted by THUNDERBOLT30 (10861 posts) - - Show Bio

@SwordandShields: Where does the battle take place and the starting distance?

#11 Posted by XImpossibruX (5267 posts) - - Show Bio

Torch.

#12 Posted by henryarguelles5 (366 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops wins. His optic blasts are FORCE beams - he essentially smothers Johnny with beams of force, much like one would smother a fire with a blanket.

#13 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

Does Johnny still have the Cosmic Rod? Cause I'm guessing this is him without it.

I could see Cyclops taking a margin due to accuracy and power behind his blasts. Johnny's best bet is to take things to the air but I forgot how fast he is or if he has impressive reflex feats to say he can dodge Cykes' blasts considering he's tagged fast people like Northstar, Quicksilver, Spider-Man and Wolverine on a few occasions. It would be like duck hunting or a quickdraw and Scott just has to squeeze his fists for a blast.

Not saying Cyke wins but I'll make a case if I can but I've been out of FF for awhile so I won't say Scott wins on that notion too.

I'll say it. Cyke wins.

#14 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: Then say it. I'll still make a case since I think he can from what I know.

Moderator
#15 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: I just did :P He's quick on the draw, is accurate enough to hit someone much faster then Johnny, and is willing to blast him.

#16 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: You mean steal my case and just say I'll say it? It's a good case you made, Ferro.

Moderator
#17 Posted by 8bitGangsta (394 posts) - - Show Bio

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

#18 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

#19 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

#20 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

#21 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant: When has Hulk KO'd Thor a t-clap? And Hulk can control the strength of his thunderclap as to not kill someone. He's t-clapped a group of X-Men where Colossus and Emma Frost were conscious but Shadowcat was KO'd (I think Beast was too or he got up after, I can't remember), yet the same Hulk (I believe it was WWH or that mindset) who T-clapped Ross into the Lincoln Memorial IIRC. Point is, Hulk doesn't have one setting. If a more powerful incarnation of him has KO'd a human so Torch taking one isn't a huge deal.

Moderator
#22 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

#23 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@jeanroygrant: When has Hulk KO'd Thor a t-clap? And Hulk can control the strength of his thunderclap as to not kill someone. He's t-clapped a group of X-Men where Colossus and Emma Frost were conscious but Shadowcat was KO'd (I think Beast was too or he got up after, I can't remember), yet the same Hulk (I believe it was WWH or that mindset) who T-clapped Ross into the Lincoln Memorial IIRC. Point is, Hulk doesn't have one setting. If a more powerful incarnation of him has KO'd a human so Torch taking one isn't a huge deal.

True, and i didn't mean KO Thor, i meant tossed him with it.

#24 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

#25 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

#26 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

Hulk's KO'd people with his t clap like Hyperion and Ironclad IIRC, both are superhumanly durable. Regardless, Cyclops possesses the necessary power here to drop Torch in one or 2 shots. Adding onto what Ferro said, as a teen, Cyclops has obliterated entire icebergs to save a ship carrying hundreds. He's only gotten stronger since then.

Moderator
#27 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

Hulk's has no focus. He can hit in every direction. Cyclops' blasts are concentrated. Even his wide beams pack more punch.

#28 Posted by ghost_rider1 (3630 posts) - - Show Bio

Ill say cyclops here

#29 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

Hulk's KO'd people with his t clap like Hyperion and Ironclad IIRC, both are superhumanly durable. Regardless, Cyclops possesses the necessary power here to drop Torch in one or 2 shots. Adding onto what Ferro said, as a teen, Cyclops has obliterated entire icebergs to save a ship carrying hundreds. He's only gotten stronger since then.

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

Hulk's has no focus. He can hit in every direction. Cyclops' blasts are concentrated. Even his wide beams pack more punch.

I see.

#30 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jeanroygrant said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@god_spawn: I know, right? Original too.

@8bitGangsta said:

Torch. The guy who actually has durability

He was taken out by one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Which would kill Cyclops if it was used against him. Also Hulk's thunder claps have dropped people like Thor & Rulk. So it ain't bad.

It has knocked them over, but it hasn't dropped them. And Cyclops' durability isn't in question here. He can hit harder then one of Hulk's thunder claps.

Are you sure about that?

Teenage Cyclops punched through a mountain. His attacks have greater piercing power.

That's true, Hulk's is for dropping foes and such.

Hulk's KO'd people with his t clap like Hyperion and Ironclad IIRC, both are superhumanly durable. Regardless, Cyclops possesses the necessary power here to drop Torch in one or 2 shots. Adding onto what Ferro said, as a teen, Cyclops has obliterated entire icebergs to save a ship carrying hundreds. He's only gotten stronger since then.

Both of whom have crazy power fluctuations. Just saying.

#31 Posted by rd2race (289 posts) - - Show Bio

Torch could win in a number of ways he doesn't to hit cyke directly depending where they are fighting. If they fight in an unpopulated area torch can just light up the whole area around scott and fly off, leaving cyke to be roasted since he cant fly. He could also go super nova and roast him. However, in that same situation scott could remove his visor and it would turn into a super nova vs a mountain moving blast. Im going to go with the nova winning out in that scenario. However, scott is too skilled of a shot for torch to evade him in any other situation. Im giving it to cyke 7/10.

#32 Posted by Lord Shiva (810 posts) - - Show Bio

Human Touch for the win.....8/10 times

#33 Posted by YoungJustice (6919 posts) - - Show Bio

Right Trigger + A attack.

#34 Posted by Bo88gdan (4676 posts) - - Show Bio

Torch wins

#35 Posted by JediXMan (31332 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeanroygrant said:

@JediXMan said:

Going with Cyclops.

LOL.

I was serious.

Moderator
#36 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh snap. Who hits harder Torch or Cyclops?

#37 Posted by Vouile (678 posts) - - Show Bio

The Human Torch

@SwordandShields said:

@god_spawn: do you know the speed at which Human Torch flies?

The Human Torch can fly at speeds of Mach 1 and very good question. According to my opinion, the speed of The Human Torch is what determines who wins the majority int his battle.

So due to The Human Torch's fast flying capabilities, I give this to him 8 or 9/10.

And also since Cyclops only has his eyes as an offensive attack and his body is defenseless from The Human Torch's beams, Johnny wins.

I give it to Cyclops on some occasions, due to the effort of accuracy Cyclops puts into his optic beams.

Vouile

#38 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@Vouile: Torch doesn't just start at mach 1 though. He has to build up and he isn't fast enough to speedblitz Scott before he can get a shot off.

Moderator
#39 Posted by SwordandShields (712 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: that right there is true, he needs to build up his speed to even reach half of that but if he does, it's another story.

#40 Posted by spiderbuck (2452 posts) - - Show Bio

Torch.

#41 Edited by Hksaru (463 posts) - - Show Bio

I gotta say, even with Cyclops' master marksmanship skills he is more likely than Torch to be hit by the other's projectile and incapacitated. And I think Torch is smart enough (not implying genius or anything, just not an idiot) to be prepared for wide beams or even Cyclops taking off his visor if he brings him to the edge without finishing him quick enough. Probably a 6 or 7/10 for Torch, though I'm still unsure just how hard Cyclops' beams hit. I suspect if either of them get hit even once it will snowball into their defeat in seconds unless they find cover or get out of the other's line of sight.

#42 Posted by randumo24 (4654 posts) - - Show Bio

Don't forget that the mental edge is way in favor of Cyke.

#43 Posted by jashro44 (25557 posts) - - Show Bio

Johnny does seem pretty quick...He has dodged missiles quite effortlessly and I don't think it takes him long to become faster then sound. I don't know how much of a good shot cyclops is but Johnny is pretty fast and has some great maneuverability.

Can cyclops tag some one this fast who can also do a 90 degree turn in the last second?

#44 Posted by Strafe Prower (11892 posts) - - Show Bio

Why would Cyclops put someone like Torch down in 1 or 2 hits? With morals on, I don't seem him doing that.

I would also say that Torch should be able to block an attack from Cyclops with his own. Torch's reaction timing is slower, but not by a big margin.

#45 Posted by karetaker (1565 posts) - - Show Bio

considering this battle doesn't have a set location its supposed to be assumed its in a city like new york bla bla bla. with no civilians i think im not sure about that one. but anyway torch can fly has a wider variety of attacks he can preform with his power is more durable and he can make his surface so hot that he can melt the skin off of cykes bones just by standing near him. ect@SwordandShields: thats my basic thoughts on it. i also think a person who can fly has an advantage over a crowded (not by people) open top style terrain

#46 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: To Cyclops' credit, he's tagged Northstar and Quicksilver before. Also, he has blasted multiple missiles out of the air in quick succession. I'll get my scans tomorrow.

Moderator
#47 Posted by Gritterr (491 posts) - - Show Bio

With the cosmic control Rod I think torch takes it. He has shown the ability to ignite people without having to actually fire a blast at them. as he did to about 20 Kree soilders at the same time in F4 601 or 602 I believe. He also was able to Tank a Direct Blast from a Celestial. he also turned the arm of a celestial to slag with a nova blast(Though the Celestaial did Regenerate quickly. still impressive imo)

#48 Posted by Bitchgurl (131 posts) - - Show Bio

The Torch. Storm, sans powers, defeated Scott once, for leadership on the X-Men, so he can be had.

#49 Posted by God_Spawn (38406 posts) - - Show Bio

@Gritterr said:

With the cosmic control Rod I think torch takes it. He has shown the ability to ignite people without having to actually fire a blast at them. as he did to about 20 Kree soilders at the same time in F4 601 or 602 I believe. He also was able to Tank a Direct Blast from a Celestial. he also turned the arm of a celestial to slag with a nova blast(Though the Celestaial did Regenerate quickly. still impressive imo)

I'm assuming the OP didn't want the CCR. If he has it Scott gets merced easily, very easily.

Moderator
#50 Posted by McKlayn (1121 posts) - - Show Bio

Scott is a master tactician, i think he would use where ever he was to his advantage, find cover and deal with the Torch. his eye blast aren't jokes and as stated before it's not like this is the first flier or super fast son of a gun he has dealt with. Cyclops wins if by no other reason then he out thinks Torch on the field of combat