#1 Posted by brainiac 1.0 (4150 posts) - - Show Bio

vs

Who wins and why.

#2 Posted by Platinumwarrior (2967 posts) - - Show Bio

Monarch with ease.

#3 Posted by Nighthunter (28580 posts) - - Show Bio

Monarch

#4 Posted by brainiac 1.0 (4150 posts) - - Show Bio

What if cyborg superman has power rings.

#5 Posted by Buckshot (18913 posts) - - Show Bio

Platinumwarrior says:

"Monarch with ease."

Please explain.

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#6 Posted by King Saturn (223834 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyborg Superman could win here guys. Keep in mind Cyborg Superman has the Speed and Strength advantage here. Plus sense Hank really cant be killed I dont know how effective Monarch's Matter transmutation powers will be against Cyborg Superman. I wouldnt even worry about Monarch's energy blasts since Hank does have his power rings and like I said he has the speed factor and stregth here through his kryptionian level attributes. I think Cyborg Superman can win here against Monarch.

#7 Posted by the creator (8560 posts) - - Show Bio

King Saturn says:

"Cyborg Superman could win here guys. Keep in mind Cyborg Superman has the Speed and Strength advantage here. Plus sense Hank really cant be killed I dont know how effective Monarch's Matter transmutation powers will be against Cyborg Superman. I wouldnt even worry about Monarch's energy blasts since Hank does have his power rings and like I said he has the speed factor and stregth here through his kryptionian level attributes. I think Cyborg Superman can win here against Monarch. "

Seeing as how Monarch easily beat 3 GL's in a single combat, 3 Supermen (1 being slightly more powerful than our current one and the other being far more powerful) in a single combat, fought Superman Prime and easily held his own and finally fought approx 50 Capt Atoms (killing them all) at the same time.

I will back Monarch for the win.

#8 Posted by Buckshot (18913 posts) - - Show Bio

We had gotten a little further and I had posted last but when CV 2.0 came in it was lost and I don't think you got a chance to see it and respond. I was going to let it go but I think the discussion is interesting and I want to finish it. This was my post. It doesn't have what you said so I'm filling in what I can piece together from my responses.

Not sure but I think here you were referencing Monarch's fights in Countdown Arena, including how easily he beat 3 GLs.

Hank's rings are powered by willpower or fear depending on which he's using and while we don't know how powerful those forces are in him (can you accurately state how powerful they were in the GLs in Arena?) they're strong enough for him to have beaten GLs to get the rings and for the Anti-Moniter to want him as a herald, one of his higher ranked members of the Sinestro Corps because of his ability to cause great fear (I know there were other things involved). He's fought Hal, Guy and the Lost Lanterns and took their best hits until they increased their power a hundred times over, but he also has that technology so he could increase his power in this fight. He was able to kill numerous GLs when the Sinestro Corps attacked Earth and they were able to use lethal force. As for Superman Prime, I personally think Cyborg Superman could take him if he needed to. SMP is more powerful because he has a ton of extra energy. Cyborg Superman can change how he absorbs energy and radiation and whatnot. He could make it so he can absorb any kind of energy in the area (maybe even from enemies, from his rings, celestial bodies, whatever) and alter his cyborg body (using SMP's as a base instead of Superman's maybe) and put himself on the level of SMP.

Comments about why you don't think Cyborg Superman could do anything to Monarch's armor or if he could that it would save him. Also about using radiation attacks like the ones that hurt him in Arena.

The armor has been damaged, but was that by the energy itself? It could be that armor is somehow keyed to the energy that Monarch is made of so it handles that different than other kinds of stresses on it. How else could it contain him when his energy is constantly trying to loose itself from him? There's some aspect of the suit that allows it to not be utterly destroyed like everything else his power touches. If Henshaw inhabits the suit or studies it, he can figure out what that is and incorporate that into himself and even upgrade it. And if for some strange reason he can't, he can still just take the suit from Monarch. Even if putting it around himself doesn't save him and his body is destroyed, he'd still be alive.

I think Henshaw would be able to determine Monarch's radiation weakness. That it's tied into who he is and the energy he gives off makes it even easier (as opposed to something almost totally unrelated like a GLs weakness to a color). Henshaw has already shown that he understands radiation and energy enough to change himself so he's no longer weak to it. Even if he couldn't just figure it out from the kind of energy Monarch is using and knowing what radiation might affect it negatively, Monarch's suit carries all kind of information on him, his energies, his vitals, etc. Tapping into it would probably give Henshaw all kinds of details he can use. 

The ring can make radiation of different kinds so as long as Henshaw knows what he wants to make, I don't see why he couldn't make quantum radiation. The ring can also draw out energy so Henshaw could try that tactic on Monarch. I doubt he'd be able to contain it all himself (though maybe he could use some to amp himself up) but he could get rid of the excess, blasting it away from Monarch or shunting it into another dimension or area of space.

I don't see why Monarch's matter manipulation would override Henshaw's machine control. There aren't many examples of Henshaw trying to take over something with that ability though. The only two I can think of that might be similar are when he took over a section of the Source Wall (it doesn't really have matter manipulation, but it's supposed to control everything on it preventing it from any action and beings with matter manipulation, like Darkseid, haven't been able to alter it in any way) and that Carrier-like ship Henshaw took over that could not only control its own matter, but the space inside of it (being able to fold it up and increase it). I don't think Monarch having matter manipulation and having a lot of power is enough to say that he can prevent Henshaw from doing anything.

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