Cosmically vs Ssj_god HE: Tourney! (Voting)

@cosmicallyaware1:

yeah.. i said in the pm .. i was out for last 14 hours .. i'm writing my last post right now

cool.

@cosmicallyaware1:

Your team does:

• Fate ; defensive shielding spells and moves Sith out of engine room with TK

• Spawn ; uses invisibility to "cloak" engine core

• Nate; uses TP to mess with team's minds and cause hallucinations and such (messing with Sersi's abilities). targets MMH mostly

• Kal; Sundipped and defends against Orion's initial attack

• Thor; BFR Hammer travels and brings in random outsides (normal people = "innocents") to use as "hostage fodder" against my team

more or less spot on .. just .. those siths were outside of the room.. he'll bring them inside and hold them captive... and kal has blue sundipped .. and thor has amplified that .. and just as i explained.. now kal has 4 days and 5 hours of blue sundipping energy inside of him... and you forgot to mention .. nate built up a tp immunity shield inside the room aswell

My team does:

• Sersi ; transmutes 75% of ship to Kryptonite

• Orion ; Boom tubes to Engine Core door. Lays waste with Astro Force blast. Begins Speed blitzing attacks with ranged Astro Force blasts

• Strange ; casts initial protection spell on team at very beginning. Works on spells to breach Fate's defensive shileds. Eye of Agamotto alerts to Spawns supernatural tactics.

• MMH ; TP links team. Protect s against Nate's TP intrusions. Begins makin way to Engine Core room, causing damage on the way, "making noise"

• Kallark ; makes way to Engine Core with MMH, same situation.

ok .. your team tries to do these things..

Your major point for victory thus far centers around Thor bringing in hostages. Which is an OP violation "no summoning minions" which is what they are acting as.

say what!!....whaaat!!!..... WHAAAT!!!!!

ROFL ..... hahahahaha

random people from outside are thor's summonings and minions now??!!

yes, Strange can negate spawn's capabilities...especially invisibility

ok ... dr. strange can see spawn through invisibility using eye of agamotto.. but he has to come near spawn first to use it.

okay then. Well first off, I've already stated why Strange's magic is as powerful if not more so than Fate's but I will show more. There are substantial reasons why Strange will work here......

i agreed strange's magic being on par with fate's if not fate's being greater..... the reason i said strange's won't work is .. fate was raising that shield for 1 hour... so try to think of it this way .. on one side .. a powerful magic working for 1 hour time period .. and on the other side .. an equally strong magic tries to defy it with an instant attack... i don't think it'll work at all...

and what are you talking about hector? if you get classic strange, i get classic fate .. it's as simple as that.. and classic fate means kent.

yes strange has good showings against guys like dormammu, galactus, mephisto... but do not forget .. fate has real good showings against guys like spectre.. who is stronger than either of them.

here he lifts spectre's curse and repairs hal's soul.. strange's magic is nothing compared to the spectre's.

his magic actually compares upto spectre .. and he has shown many times to hold stalemate against the spectre... even if it's for a period of time... by wearing the helmet .. he gets access to the power of life and order (the power of nabu) .. which (nabu) holds a stalemate against the spectre

he holds the chaos of worlds from bursting out.. and taking out the universe along with the spectre

he is strong enough to defy and overpower gods

he is shown to be stronger than cosmic abstracts and underworld beings all the time

it is as i said ... even if we think dr. strange is as strong as dr. fate .. still his instantaneous magic can not break through dr. fate's magic .. which has been effected through one hour time period.

In regards to this about Sersi.......her TP is substantial enough to probe every mind on a planet. She can resist Nate well enough, at least from intrusion.

hahaha... u seriously don't want to compare sersi tp with the x-man ... even MMH would struggle to do that... nate can easily kill sersi through his tp if that was allowed.... u simply went by the counter u needed for sersi's tp resistance with few words and started describing things what she'll do afterwards.. u did not showed ANY counter for nate's tp on sersi after i showed how powerful his tp is even against renowned strong telepaths.. in my previous post

here look how easily he kills tp user through tp (actually he killed 13 tp users atonce in this instant.. but i do not have that scan).. while he was faaar away

so u think scanning an area is good feat for sersi tp? .. scanning the world is snack time play for nate .. he can do that in an instant

here he fights a being .. who became neigh omnipotent himself and became a part of the existence.. the devour and harvester of the worlds.. nate resists his cosmic blasts .. enters his mind .. frees the essence of the world he devoured. the harvester admits himself that nate would've won if they had fought till the end.

professor x isn't a match against nate's tp .. what makes u think sersi can resist nate?

here after a clash with out of control nate (he wasn't a shaman back then)

and .. did i read right? .. did u really brought tk in front of me when i have nate?

here he accidentally destroys a far away city through his tk while he was sleeping (he wasn't a shaman back then .. he often struggled to control his powers)

easily destroys a falling moon with his tk (again he wasn't even shaman x-man back then)

u see .. u simply can not go against x-man tp or tk

though his psionic raw power is quit horrible for opponents aswell

here while he was out of control against cable (he wasn't a shaman) .. his psionic out burst meant complete annihilation of the world.

his psionic out burst literally matches phoenix..

and at last .. as shaman .. his raw psionic power has enough potential to devour the universe .. in his word 'every universe'

my advice would be .. do not go against nate grey :D

alright first off, you mentioned Morals off being a big factor. Not really. All my characters have exhibited questionable morals, especially in a groim battle setting.

ha!! haaa!!! haaaaa!!!

i told ya so :) (ohh how happy i am saying it)

you are doing exactly what i said you would

you did that even after u said u won't :D

ok .. let me get this over quickly ... every hero and i mean EVERY hero has shown ruthlessness towards their opponent at some point of time.. .. that does not mean they will harm innocent people while staying moral on.. here i have a room full of innocent people who are held hostage and who will be killed if your team even tries to enter the room... or tries to do anything to destroy the core during the next 4 hours.. if you're saying your strong morals heroes such as dr. strange , MMH etc.. won't mind harming those innocent people ... sorry pal .. that simply ain't happening.. the rules clearly say that

11. Heroes are now willing to kill but not harm innocents

this won't even go to individual fights.. so i really don't have to provide any feats for that.

sleep tight........ nighty night........ thanks for staying in the fight..

BOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!! The Engine Core goes!!!!

goal is achieved. I win.

haha .. your members won't even get to launch attacks to finish the mission :D

no .. not really .. because u couldn't even get past my strategy :D

@mikep12:

so... as cosmic said .. we are done here.. u can start the voting :)

Votes! @ssj_god@cosmicallyaware1

@lukehero@pr0metheus@wyldsong@deathhero61@dextersinister@wolverine08

ok.. tagging few more :)

@those_eyes@easternwind@kidman560@kingant27@oceanmaster21@jedixman@princearagorn1

@cosmicallyaware1 and @ssj_god alright so yall both have 1 character i hate and 1 i love

i hate Superdork and Martian Manblunder but i love Gladiator and Nate Grey. and i both know of you very well... hmm ill re-read more in depth

after re-reading im going with CA1 for the win here... his strategy and his explanation of how his team would execute said strategy gave me the feeling his team would take the majority here.

@kidman560:

umm .. ok .. just one question ..as per you.. how would his members go past the hostage barrier?

Going for @cosmicallyaware1

@deathhero61:

please tell how .. because i'm seriously struggling to understand how his heroes gonna harm innocents when rules clearly says he can't

@ssj_god: It was more for the debate than the conditions. Like he said in the PM a talented debater can have "meh" characters or conditions and win a debate.

@ssj_god i think that was a weak defense in the first place... you had Nate Grey, Thor, and Dr Fate who all have amazing defensive abilities (plus you had 1 hour prep to put them up). and you went with hostages? i say this as a friend, i think you could have done better. but assuming his team cares about hostages, boom tubeing and Sersi's illusions both could fix that problem. especially with perfect team work.

@deathhero61:

?!! .. i asked as per you how his heroes gonna harm innocents ? .. because he have to harm innocents to destroy the engine core .. and op clearly says heroes with morals on can not harm innocents .. did you read it? .. beause i kept innocents as hostage around the engine core

does not really matter if you think it was weak strategy or not .. it is a working strategy.. i do not need to show off if his heroes could be held at one place.. please say as per you.. what he did that said that his heroes can harm those innocents... and please don't say how it could be solved.. because that was my opponent's work.

dude, As I stated...............you violated the OP with that strategy.

Thor bring in people as "hostages".....these stated "innocents"....ARE CLASSIFIED AS MINIONS. What else would they be huh? and the OP clearly stated NO SUMMONING MINIONS. sorry if you don't see it that way, but it is what it is. So that....as your key to success......crumbles your whole strategy basically. Argue it all you want, won't change that you presented a flawed plan.

Let's ask other though shall we? Are the "innocents" classified as "minion summoning"?

tagging for votes as well then:

@iragexcudder@allstarsuperman@veshark@wyldsong@comicstooge@heraldofganthet@tomlikesfries@rikr2@sovereign91001

@boschepg@i_like_swords@New_World_Order@tparks@frozen@darkseid1006@pierpat@cdiddyman911@cjdavis103

@thetruebarryallen@dondave@lvenger@joygirl@wolverine08@jashro44

votes if you will please............

@cosmicallyaware1:

Thor bring in people as "hostages".....these stated "innocents"....ARE CLASSIFIED AS MINIONS. What else would they be huh? and the OP clearly stated NO SUMMONING MINIONS. sorry if you don't see it that way, but it is what it is. So that....as your key to success......crumbles your whole strategy basically. Argue it all you want, won't change that you presented a flawed plan.

Let's ask other though shall we? Are the "innocents" classified as "minion summoning"?

what? random people from outside does not classify as 'summoned minions'.. thor is bringing them there personally .. he is not summoning them .. i'm perfectly alright asking others about it.. (-_-)

and not only those people are there .. those sith guards are held there as hostage aswel (-_-)

This about sums up my thoughts from what I read, though love and hate is too strong a word for the characters, more like mild indifference for my tastes.

@ssj_god:

1. please by all means, ask other's (viners) opinion about the subject (summon minions classification)...give shout outs..........I bet you will be surprised at what they say
2. I would not classify SITH as "innocents".......lol.......once again, feel free to ask others opinion

regardless, as it stands now the vote count is:

cosmicallyaware1: 4

ssj_god: 0

@deathhero61: @kidman560: @wyldsong: thanks for the votes guys, much appreciated. If any of you have a thought on the topic "Thor and the summoning minions / innocents hostage situation" could you drop your opinion for ssj_god please?

@cosmicallyaware1 snags a vote.

thanks bro.

and bump.

@ssj_god: @cosmicallyaware1: Thread close tomorrow evening.

@ssj_god: @cosmicallyaware1: @mikep12: I'll read and vote. Gotta eat first.

@cosmicallyaware1: Has my vote just in pure betting Debating skills however @ssj_goddid very well and had a decent stradegey but the humans were basickly minions but it was a good plan and deserves a little more credit than given. But Cos 1 has my vote but great job to both

@cosmicallyaware1: Looks like a good one. I'll come back and vote when I get a chance to read. If I haven't voted by the end of the day, send me a reminder so I don't forget.

@cosmicallyaware1:

LOL at Sersi turning 75% of the ship into Kryptonite! That's messed up... but my question to you gentlemen is when did Thor become the taking hostages type? I mean, when Beta Ray bill went on his single minded mission of vengeance against Galactus, Stormbreaker disavowed him for his selfish, and vindictive actions on her behalf, thus seeing him (at least temporarily) as "unworthy".

What's to stop Mjolnir from likewise disavowing the Odinson for such a cowardly act, and thus GREATLY reducing the offensive and defensive capabilities of @ssj_god's team (especially since Orion has already blown the engine core)?

@ssj_god: @mikep12:

the vote count currently is:

cosmicallyaware1: 5

ssj_god: 0

@tparks: cool, man...thanks. whatever happened to oy_the_billy_bumbler?

@oceanmaster21: thanks bro, appreciate the vote

Like I told ssj_god........strategy full of holes. Just wasn't plausible on some key elements. So, just for clarification....is that a vot for the cosmicallyaware1?

@heraldofganthet:

What you are saying is 100% true, but that's not what you're suppose to vote on. You vote on whatever is presented here. I don't think CA1 ever made that points about the Magic Hammer disowning Thor for being a coward. I asked the same question in another thread; "Are we supposed to ignore the mistakes of a debater." The answer all of the other voters gave was, yes. Unless that debater is breaking clear cut rules or gifting non exist powers to his characters or objects, unless the opponent pointed out the mistake, then it should be ignored.

@mikep12: @cosmicallyaware1: @ssj_god:

Damn. I felt like SSJ was winning. You're team even seemed more powerful. Post 37 when you went for the hostage taking. Damn, you seemed to have screwed up. I have no problem with you using sneaky tactics, but you seem to have broken the rules of minion summoning. Anytime you are including anybody that isn't already there, you are summoning something. If the innocents were already there in the battlefield, sure they wouldn't count as minions.

yeah .. well this is good enough for me .. no one really cared about explaining.. yes i didn't cared much on feats except nate and dr. fate .. because he really didn't had any counter for the hostage situation.. and i really didn't think personally bringing some random people could count as summoning minions.. aside that .. it's ok .. i'm really good at offense .. i really don't feel safe on defense though :D

yeah .. could've gone for straight cut fight .. because he didn't used much of a tactics.. just went for straight fight .. but.. as i said .. didn't cared for giving other feats because he really didn't had counter for hostage situation :)

@ssj_god:

he really didn't had counter for hostage situation

why put the effort in countering something that you don't have to? and if it helps, I wouldn't mind playing the defense and let you try the offense in a rematch, I almost suggested that at the beginning....I was fine either way.

u didn't had ANYTHING on that to put effort on :D

and .. it's ok .. don't need to prolong a round.. this is already long enough :D .. i'm not out yet.. we'll see if we meet again :)

@ssj_god: @cosmicallyaware1: My vote goes too CA1

It was a very difficult decision as I felt that SSGod however cowardly his strategy was :D may be able to actually pull it off.

But then CA1 came in with how fast his team could act and preventing that from ever coming to that so that is why he has my vote.

haha .. that had nothing to do with preventing my strategy... he just said random people from outside counts as thor's summoned minions .. that's it .. his team didn't do anything on that at all :D

@ssj_god: actually I feel stupid telling you this (you have just debated In this thread after all) but you will realise that he explicit stated that Orion would boom tune there instantly and blast through the door he even pointed out that when you got their Orion would already be their so yeah he did.

orion can not boom tube inside the room.. op cleared that for us .. and .. no .. incase u didn't read .. i said superman will encounter orion outside the room and provided feats for that .. so orion being in the room before thor arrived never really happened :D

@ssj_god: fine but you still can't just stroll in and enter sonar they still had too fight and CA1 Turing the ship into kryptonite made it clear that Orion would win

@mikep12: @ssj_god:

the vote count currently is:

cosmicallyaware1: 6

ssj_god: 0

thor used dimension travel .. they'll come back right into the room .

i gave enough feat for nate grey using tp on sersi.. to prevent her turning the ship into kryptonite .. which in my honest opinion .. he couldn't counter at all (not that it's even possible for sersi to stop nate) ... i did not made any mistakes on these parts :)

wow u're still counting .. how naive :D

that...doesn't really make sense.

Don't be childish. And continuing to state how you think the battle went is irrelevant at this point. Take into considertation the critisim, look at how could've done better, analyze opponents work......and hopefully take something away from it that makes your next match better

I am always down to do CaV matches, if you want a rematch of any kind......

hey .. i never said anything out of context here on how i think battle went if u see .. i just checked them on my entries of post writings...... look .. i didn't had any doubt head on i had the advantage .. but since i was defending, i went for easier tactic.. and u rather attacked straight forward .. not much to analyze that...

and on the CAV .. yeah .. looks good .. but i'm currently due on a tourney's final match's reply post and another CAV's reply post .. and i think u do know how lazy i can be on replying posts :D

hey .. why the heavy environment? chill out :D

@cosmicallyaware1: Before you start any other CaV just remember we still have that one planned ;)
@ssj_god: Im actually through arguing and now that you mention it your whole plan was resting on them people and they actually count as a summon so that should never have been allowed in the first place.

@lukehero:

What you are saying is 100% true, but that's not what you're suppose to vote on. You vote on whatever is presented here. I don't think CA1 ever made that points about the Magic Hammer disowning Thor for being a coward. I asked the same question in another thread; "Are we supposed to ignore the mistakes of a debater." The answer all of the other voters gave was, yes. Unless that debater is breaking clear cut rules or gifting non exist powers to his characters or objects, unless the opponent pointed out the mistake, then it should be ignored.

Gotcha. And I thank you for this information, as this is the first CaV I've ever participated in, and was thusly unaware of this crucial detail. Thanks again!

@cosmicallyaware1:

Like I told ssj_god........strategy full of holes. Just wasn't plausible on some key elements. So, just for clarification....is that a vot for the cosmicallyaware1?

Yes sir. No door that's not made of Radion is going to last long before Orion's wrath. He blows the engine core and sends Kryptonite fragments flying everywhere. It's all downhill from there, IMO...

@heraldofganthet: thanks for the vote of confidence and vote man, greatly appreciated..

Just so ya know pal,

as this is the first CaV I've ever participated in

this is a tournament matchup (in a bracket elimination system). A CaV (Challenger a Viner) is a match where one user challenges another, and debate in a more private forum. Check out these links to some CaV's to get an idea....

if ya wanna do one to get the hand of it just let me know, I would be happy to do one with ya!

@mikep12: seeing as my opponent was offended last time I did this, I only tagged you this time....

the vote count currently is:

cosmicallyaware1: 8

ssj_god: 0

I would say that pretty much wraps it up huh?

@cosmicallyaware1@ssj_god Yep!

COSMICALLYAWARE1 WINS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Btw, there was really no need for the tag as I can monitor everything you post if I made the thread)

Yeah Mike, cool feature any time someone hits my thread I get a notification now. :D

I noticed this as well recently. Still can't break the habit of tagging though.lol....

@cosmicallyaware1: Me too :p