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Posted by k4tzm4n (40918 posts) 2 months, 15 days ago

Poll: Comic Vine Battle of the Week VOTING: Moon Knight vs. Black Canary (280 votes)

Moon Knight 38%
Black Canary 59%
Too close to call 3%

We're now entering the third week of Moon Knight Month and it is time once again to test Marc Spector's abilities as a combatant. He's been able to defeat Green Arrow and Ra's al Ghul, but will his winning streak stop here? Will Black Canary's hand-to-hand abilities and Canary Cry keep Marvel's anti-hero down for the count? Or do you think Moon Knight's armor and skill is enough to defeat the challenger from DC? Read the rules, give it a proper amount of thought and then cast your vote!

Match Rules

  • Combatants are in character.
  • This is a random encounter (aka no prep for either team).
  • They're fighting in a generic downtown city setting. It's unpopulated, at night and all standard city lights remain on. Assume they start roughly 15 feet apart and visible. There's a fair amount of cover in the location (parked vehicles, bus stops and such). The entire area is on limits. This means alleys, rooftops, building interiors, the sewer, etc.
  • Moon Knight has his current gear. No vehicles, obviously.
  • For simplicity's sake, Black Canary is current but pre-52 feats are applicable. And no, she doesn't have a motorcycle.
  • Incapacitation, knockout or death all count as elimination. Making a tactical retreat counts as a loss, too.
  • Hey, you know what would be really cool? Treating everyone else in the debate with respect. If you think someone's saying something that just isn't true, go ahead and stick to the facts to point out why. There's no need at all to drop insults just because you disagree with someone. Seriously, this is just talking about a fictional fight, there's no need for immaturity and mudslinging.
  • If you think the poll isn't going how it should, making an informative post about why a character is being underestimated and spreading the word is far more useful than complaining. Just saying.
  • One more thing: you don't need to write an essay to be selected as the Viner Argument of the Week. Sometimes concise posts can be way more effective than a flood of paragraphs.

Viners, you have the week to research, debate and vote! This means there's no reason to vote right away if you don't have all of the info you need to make an educated decision. Check the homepage Friday for an updated article with the following:

  • Thoughts from the staff.
  • A Viner Argument for both characters (can't include scans and must be in the poll thread).
  • If we're lucky, blurbs from industry talent.

Next week, Moon Knight will enter the Batman Battle of the Month! He's already faced Nightwing and Red Hood, but if you want to make a match suggestion, let us know below or via Twitter! Want to continue celebrating Moon Knight? We've posted his Best Covers, Best Battles, he'll be the topic of tomorrow's Question of the Week, and his must read stories will be posted on Friday.

#1 Posted by MrShway88 (655 posts) - - Show Bio

Black Canary? Really?

#2 Posted by Nefarious (19806 posts) - - Show Bio

BC.

#3 Posted by Fallschirmjager (16853 posts) - - Show Bio

Dinah. Because boobs.

(argument of the week is mine)

#4 Posted by TommytheHitman (3102 posts) - - Show Bio

Do not underestimate the power of the Black Canary!

#5 Posted by patrat18 (9582 posts) - - Show Bio
#6 Edited by k4tzm4n (40918 posts) - - Show Bio

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Staff
#7 Posted by MadeinBangladesh (6655 posts) - - Show Bio
#8 Posted by AllStarSuperman (21757 posts) - - Show Bio

Dinah

#9 Posted by HushoftheWind (905 posts) - - Show Bio

Black Canary, b/c she need's a character of the month segment.

#10 Posted by tparks (4913 posts) - - Show Bio

Dinah. Because boobs.

(argument of the week is mine)

You're logic is flawless. We can end the voting now IMO.

#11 Posted by Veshark (9058 posts) - - Show Bio

Despite my love for MK, I could see a solid case being made for both sides here. Superior firepower via the Canary Cry, and arguably greater showings of MA skills goes to Dinah. But Moon Knight brings greater durability thanks to the armor, as well as a higher degree of versatility with his gear (though I'm uncertain if the 'current gear' ruling negates his past standard gear like say...adamantium darts). My lack of informed knowledge on Canary (haven't got around to reading Simone's BoP) is the only thing preventing me from casting a vote, so I'll wait and listen to what the songbird's supporters have to say.

Though if we're comparing Moony's current Shavley-designed look to Dinah's New-52 costume, I think we know who's taking that one...

#12 Posted by GraniteSoldier (7539 posts) - - Show Bio
#13 Posted by nigravirum1 (144 posts) - - Show Bio

Black canary is possibly the best hand-to-hand fighter in all of the DC universe. Her feats are unmatched by anyone including Batman. She has been trained by the best, so in a hand-to-hand fight, Moon Knight is buttered toast. Now on the other hand, Marc is also skilled with the weapons he usually carries. So he's not completely alone to fight a simple hand-to-hand fight. But let us not forget Dinah's most powerful weapon she carries... Her sonic scream. Her sonic scream has enough power to knock large opponents off their feet. If Moon Knight is in close proximity to Canary when she let's off that scream, it's over. He will be demolished by the power of the scream alone. But let's say for a minute that Moon Knight manages to avoid her scream and cripple her throat before she can blast it out. Let's say he delivers some pretty hard hits to her. Will this be enough to take down Canary? No, it won't. She's been known to take the most brutal beatings possible and still get up to dish out some more. If you don't believe in her toughness just listen to Roy Harper's (Arsenal) own words: "When I was little, I used to think, of the three, Ollie was the toughest. I was wrong." So in the end I give this to Black Canary ftw!

#14 Edited by Jonny_Anonymous (33083 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n: I was wondering, when you say current gear do you mean only the stuff that he has used so far in the current run or does he get things like his flechette guns? He has used them an awful lot in the past and I would say they are standard to his gear say maybe a sonic batarang is to Batmans?

#15 Posted by patrat18 (9582 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Sure. "Black Canary? Really"?

#16 Posted by Saren (25620 posts) - - Show Bio

Black canary is possibly the best hand-to-hand fighter in all of the DC universe. Her feats are unmatched by anyone including Batman.

What?

@veshark said:

But Moon Knight brings greater durability thanks to the armor, as well as a higher degree of versatility with his gear

Moon Knight's current suit is only armored in some places for some bizarre reason, so I suppose the fact that only about 40% of his body is at risk of being broken by the Cry is some consolation. Dinah has better reflex showings for anything Spector's going to throw at her.

Moderator
#17 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (33083 posts) - - Show Bio

@patrat18 said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Sure. "Black Canary? Really"?

  • [WITH OBJECT] Develop or present (a theory, policy, or system) in further detail:the theory was proposed by Cope and elaborated by Osborn

    MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
  • 1.1[NO OBJECT] Add more detail concerning what has already been said:he would not elaborate on his news

    MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCESSYNONYMS
#18 Posted by k4tzm4n (40918 posts) - - Show Bio

@patrat18 said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Sure. "Black Canary? Really"?

That's not elaborating. Point is this doesn't express who you're rooting for at all. Saying "really?" at the choice obviously implies you think it's unfair, but doesn't clarify who you think has the odds stacked against them.

Staff
#19 Posted by patrat18 (9582 posts) - - Show Bio

@patrat18 said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Sure. "Black Canary? Really"?

  • [WITH OBJECT] Develop or present (a theory, policy, or system) in further detail:the theory was proposed by Cope and elaborated by Osborn

    MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
  • 1.1[NO OBJECT] Add more detail concerning what has already been said:he would not elaborate on his news

    MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCESSYNONYMS

Agreed. I would like to start by saying Black Canary? Really? I end my case.

#20 Posted by patrat18 (9582 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18 said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@patrat18

@mrshway88 said:

Black Canary? Really?

Care to elaborate...?

Sure. "Black Canary? Really"?

That's not elaborating. Point is this doesn't express who you're rooting for at all. Saying "really?" at the choice obviously implies you think it's unfair, but doesn't clarify who you think has the odds stacked against them.

Don't mind me man, i'm trolling before i go to work.

#21 Posted by dondave (36619 posts) - - Show Bio
#22 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (33083 posts) - - Show Bio

@saren said:

@nigravirum1 said:

Black canary is possibly the best hand-to-hand fighter in all of the DC universe. Her feats are unmatched by anyone including Batman.

What?

@veshark said:

But Moon Knight brings greater durability thanks to the armor, as well as a higher degree of versatility with his gear

Moon Knight's current suit is only armored in some places for some bizarre reason, so I suppose the fact that only about 40% of his body is at risk of being broken by the Cry is some consolation. Dinah has better reflex showings for anything Spector's going to throw at her.

I asked Declan Shalvey why they reduced the armor and he said something along the lines of "He either did it so his suit was lighter and easier to move or he did it because he's a total masochist. Whatever seems more likely"

#23 Edited by Omnicrono (1787 posts) - - Show Bio

@nigravirum1 said:

Black canary is possibly the best hand-to-hand fighter in all of the DC universe. Her feats are unmatched by anyone including Batman.

......?

#24 Posted by CaptainMarvel4Ever (2137 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice to see Black Canary get some love :)

Online
#25 Posted by detective38 (178 posts) - - Show Bio

Canary fights on a level with shiva and has a metahuman ability. without prep time mk couldnt be prepared for that

#26 Posted by i_dont_like_comics (770 posts) - - Show Bio

Black Canary, b/c she need's a character of the month segment.

that's a very subjective reason.

#27 Posted by SupBatz (1729 posts) - - Show Bio

New 52 Black Canary is pummeled. Pre-New 52 Dinah may stand a chance.

#28 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (33083 posts) - - Show Bio
#29 Edited by Owie (3697 posts) - - Show Bio

Moon Knight does have some potential resistance against sonics.

Here, in an older version of his suit, he has an anti-sonics device in his cowl that produces a white noise to negate the effect of someone using a sonic scream-style attack right in his ear. Who knows if he still has this since he keeps changing his armor (but why would you take something like this out?). On the other hand, Dinah's cry is more than just a headache-producing scream, it has real physical destructive power, so this device may not help enough to shrug off the effects of her scream anyway.

And here, Crossfire blasts Moon Knight and the Thing with a massive "mind warping" sonic wave device. The Thing can't take it, but Moon Knight endures his way through the blast to tackle Crossfire. This is not due to an anti-sonics device, just his pure mental endurance.

But, that being said, Canary is probably a fair amount better than Marc in H2H. I suppose he has a shot if he uses some kind of gas or explosive crescents or something like that. His armor is better than hers, but doesn't cover enough to fully protect him from strikes. And he's got the overall damage soak to ignore some of her attacks. But Marc's chances are not necessarily looking good here.

#30 Edited by jashro44 (20849 posts) - - Show Bio

What skill feats does black canary have? I haven't read much with her, but I've heard people say shes a top tier fighter...The only feat I recall is fighting bronze tiger which is pretty impressive. Does she have anything else?

#31 Posted by G_leno (991 posts) - - Show Bio

If they weren't in character, Canary would take this as if she just screamed at him with the intent to kill from the get go he would go down, but I think that as she tends to use it as a last resort, Moony can deal with her before the sonic scream comes out to play.

Moon Knight wins 7/10

#32 Posted by HigorM (3737 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going to side with Black Canary here, and not just because she's a great character with even greater looks, but because I believe she got what it takes to bring the Moon Knight down for good.

She possess a powerfull weapon, powerful enough to shatter objects, disorient opponents and as more recently revealed, even shatter skulls and liquefy bones, which she won't hesitate on using, from different distances, not only offensively but also as a deffense to avoid being hit by the dangerous gear MK is packing. Dinah is also an expert martial artist, considered to be one of the seven best fighters in the DC Universe, something that can be proved with her combat feats and training with other top martial artists.

So basically, Black Canary possess superior ranged (through Canary Cry), something that her enemy can't properly avoid. He will get hit eventually, and even with his pain tolerance, the effects are devastating. Even if he survives the strike, he won't be on pair with her fighting skill, so she is pretty much covered on both ways. He will find himself in a fight he can't win.

As for Moon Knight's gear, Dinah is more than capable of dodging his strikes, not to mention the possibility to use her Canary Cry to fly.

That's the scenario I can picture in my mind, although having a strong and solid opponent, with high levels of pain tolerance and great gear at disposal, in the other side we have a top martial artist with the ability to screams the enemy away.

#33 Posted by Joygirl (19522 posts) - - Show Bio

...Is this for real? Canary can end this in mere seconds with a canary cry if she wants to. Even if she decides to play it safe and go toe-to-toe with Marc, she's one of the most skilled physical combatants in the entire DCU. The crescent darts won't hit her, she's dodged better. Moon Knight's greater strength won't be enough to bring her down, it may even work against him -- if she decides he's in any way inhuman she's all the more likely to let loose with the scream.

#35 Posted by k4tzm4n (40918 posts) - - Show Bio

@joygirl said:

...Is this for real?

No, it's not. You're dreaming.

Staff
#36 Edited by Saren (25620 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

What skill feats does black canary have? I haven't read much with her, but I've heard people say shes a top tier fighter...The only feat I recall is fighting bronze tiger which is pretty impressive. Does she have anything else?

She's crushed Green Arrow and Merlyn easily on a few occasions. She's also defeated White Canary, who killed the Twelve Brothers in Silk, and during that fight it was revealed that Dinah knew techniques only a handful of people knew existed. In the original BOP run she beat Wonder Woman in a sparring match. Reflex-wise she's caught arrows and (in one scan whose origin I've never been able to track down) she's melted bullets with her Cry after they were fired. There's a bunch of other stuff but I'll have to read BOP again to remember what it was.

Moderator
#37 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (33083 posts) - - Show Bio

@joygirl: Well as shown above the Cry may hurt Moon Knight but it won't be as affective as she would hope

#38 Edited by Joygirl (19522 posts) - - Show Bio

@jonny_anonymous: Certainly enough to turn the tide when she'll probably beat him in h2h anyway.

#39 Edited by MidknightStar (11 posts) - - Show Bio

I will have to say Moon Knight.

Yes Black Canary was trained by the Bat himself so her hand2hand skills are monstrous. Yes she has a very nice weapons arsenal at her disposal and her sonic scream has its pluses. But let not forget that before Moon Knight put on the cloak of Khonshu he was a top level assassin. That on top of the fact that he lost his natural mind and went completely crazy makes him a very unpredictable and dangerous opponent. He may not have the complete armor he used to have but he's been through plenty of battles being quite able to take some damage and like it. I mean a man who fights crime at night wearing a white costume has to be some type of crazy.

#40 Posted by johnny_blaze (539 posts) - - Show Bio

"She's crushed Green Arrow easily"-Fighting someone who isn't trying to fight you or catching someone by surprise isn't impressive. And her beating WW in a sparring match sounds like PIS.

#41 Posted by jashro44 (20849 posts) - - Show Bio
#42 Edited by RageEx2 (105 posts) - - Show Bio

Man, this is ridiculously close in my opinion. Black Canary has the advantage in hand to hand combat and her Canary Cry (which, let's be honest, Moon Knight can't defend against), but let's all try and remember that she is severely lacking in her arsenal. Moon Knight's armor will allow him to hold his own in close up fights long enough to disengage, and his reflexes and accuracy are high enough to slice bullets in half with his throwing crescents, allowing him to take Dinah down from a distance. Good match up!

#43 Posted by Jphu8414 (3634 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Moon Knight but the Canary cry rips him apart

#44 Edited by Saren (25620 posts) - - Show Bio

@johnny_blaze said:

"She's crushed Green Arrow easily"-Fighting someone who isn't trying to fight you or catching someone by surprise isn't impressive. And her beating WW in a sparring match sounds like PIS.

Oliver was trying to fight her, insofar as he even implied that Dinah shouldn't try and fight him because his year with Natas had made him her superior in fighting skill. Dinah then beat him in two moves. I'm not sure why that's the point you're questioning, though --- Dinah has always been considered a fighter on a tier clearly above Green Arrow. In the same series, she stalemates Kobra right after he easily stomps Ollie. Beating Wonder Woman in a sparring match obviously involved Diana holding back on her strength and speed --- Canary even notes that Wonder Woman could flick her to Pluto if she felt like it --- but as a contest of skill it's not really that unusual. Wonder Woman has sparred with Batman several times, and Batman has defeated her in those sparring matches as well on one or two occasions. It's more notable because Dinah detects flaws in Diana's fighting style during the match and then uses those flaws against her to win.

Moderator
#45 Edited by Alex_Reos (22 posts) - - Show Bio

Does this count for current armor?(JK) I mean, Moon Knight could best Ra's Al Ghul and Green Arrow, both formidable foes up close and GA from a ranged area... So why can't MK use his crescent-darts and disable her, run up and whack her with his nunchaku/truncheon and face-stomp her... Then walk away victorious, 3 times in a row...

#46 Edited by asjmooney (147 posts) - - Show Bio

I have to go with Canary on this one.

She is easily one of the most experienced and skilled hand to hand combatants in the DCU and with the canary cry in her arsenal (and this being a random encounter) I think she'll easily take the edge.

Close or long range the canary cry is a brutal power that has taken down some of the DCU's biggest power houses and up close in personal will send Moon Knight running back to Konshu with his moon tail between his legs.

Team Dinah all the way on this one!

#47 Posted by Deathstroke52 (404 posts) - - Show Bio

I love Canary.

#48 Posted by Shawnbaby (10665 posts) - - Show Bio

This one is shaping up to be a close one. And I think That's as it should be.

H2H Wise I'd say Canary has a large skill advantage. Canary Cry is an obvious advantage for Dinah...and that fact that it is not an apparent ability is another advantage.

I am tempted to give the speed edge to MK...due to his recent Bullet slicing feat....which shows incredible speed and accuracy. Most street Levellers can dodge bullets, many of them deflect them, not many can actually slice one in half with a thrown weapon. He also likes to tank damage if it will get him within striking range. That could work for or against him here if she utilizes the scream....it all depends on how much gusto she puts behind it....But Moon Knight's ability to push past the pain is pretty spectacular compared to other unpowered Street Levellers.

Either way the poll goes...I'll be satisfied as long as it stays close like this.

#49 Posted by TDK_1997 (14718 posts) - - Show Bio

I am going to side with DInah here.

Both Moon Knight and Canary are skilled fighters but on a lot of ocassions Canary has impressed me way more than Marc has ever impressed me. She has some pretty solid feats that put her as one of the best fighters in DC and she will give Marc Spector a helluva fight if they go h2h and even if MK uses ranged attacks she can dodge,it ain't something she has never done and cannot do again.

Also in the same time she posseses a great range weapon that gives her the advantage in this fight,the Canary Cry. A weapon that can put a person down,shatter bones or disorient people if they have armor,as Marc has in this fight. Basically the canary cry and her hand to hand skills give her the win here,a hard battle but she will win it.

#50 Posted by comicace3 (4820 posts) - - Show Bio

BC