CaV King-Stranglehold da first (SS) VS ThunderGodsWrath (Thor)

@King-Stranglehold da first -Silver Surfer

ThunderGodsWrath -Thor

• Morals Off
• Standar Gear
• No Prep
• Since they both have fought many times before, there is lots of knowledge on each other
• Fight takes place here
• No people are in the city

Hmmm...Lets see. So Who's gonna go first?

@King-Stranglehold da first said:

Hmmm...Lets see. So Who's gonna go first?

Me

@King-Stranglehold da first:

To start things off. I will begin with some of Thor's feats.

Strength/Striking

1. Thor moving island easily
2. Thor knocking Odin to his knees
3. Thor hitting Exitar's amour so hard that it puts a hole through his amour, and shakes the whole planet
4. Thor, and Beta Ray Bill lifting Asgard
5. Thor hitting Nul into space ( Amped up Hulk, with Mjolnir hammer )
6. One-shotting Angrier ( Amped up Thing with Mjolnir hammer )
7. Thor dents pure admantium
8. Beta Ray Bill, Thor's equal ( Slightly weaker ) Destroys a planet

Durability

1. Tanks a blast from the Dark Avengers & UFO's
2. Tanks planet exsplosion
3. Tanked blast from Silver Surfer while weakened by World Tree
4. Survies being eaten at by killer flies by Glory, and being crushed
5. No harm being in the sun
6. Tanks being phased through by Vison's arm
7. Tanks an exsplosion, while he was alread uncouncious
8. A blow that would shatter a diamond from Rogue makes Thor blink

Abilites/Powers

1. Made a storm in Asgard that reached all the way too Earth
2. Has Anti-Blast that is as powerful as a star
3. God Blast can hurt Galactus, destroy Celestials dome, and push back Classic Juggernaut
4. Absorb, and ridirect attacks 10x more powerful or 100x
5. Transmution
6. Molecure Manipulation
7. Control over the Earth
8. Teleport
9. Control any sort of weather
10. Make tidal waves
11. Produce AOE attacks
12. Put his whole body in electricity
13. Make powerful winds, and tornadoes
14. Block at planet decimating blasts with his storms
15. Heat & cold resistant

TravelSpeed/ReactionSpeed

1. Fly from earth to sun in a matter of seconds to throw Sentry's dead corpse into the sun
2. Said by himself, and Hela to be as fast as the lightning he commands
3. Reacted to Phoenix Jean Grey who shot a blast at him from behind, just about to hit him, and he turns around and counters it
4. Catches the Wreckers crowbar just inches away from his head
5. Saves Rulk before he drops in blackhole
6. Flew 3 times speed of light
7. AVX confirmed Mjolnir can move twice the speed of light ( In space it has moved 3 times the speed of light )
8. Took out a group of eniemes members by telling Mjolnir to do it

My turn is done. Your turn !

Okay here are my two cents.

Since morals are off, SIlver Surfer will not be holding back. Silver Surfer not holding back is a very dangerous person. He can almost take out anyone with ease, we all saw what he did during Annihilation. Silver Surfer and Thor fought many times, BUT one should take note that they mostly fought before Silver Surfer got his awesome upgrade(pre Annihilation) and Silver Surfers pre Annihiliation fights with Thor, Silver Surfer usually held back...Well because he is a pacifist and that is what makes him less of a dangerous character.

But their more recent right, SIlver Surfer was still being a pacifist while Thor was being the aggressor. Hell...In the fight Silver Surfer was worried about Thors wound and yet Thor still wanted to fight. Yes we know Thor holds back sometimes, BUT ON MORTALS.

Silver Surfer is NO MORTAL. And from the fights I seen between the two, Thor is always the aggressor. Now lets get rid of Silver Surfers pacifist. Lets just turn it off... :)

Silver Surfer has MANY ways to defeat Thor...The list are endless. Cosmic awareness,phasing,brf,transmutation,speed, durability,energy blast,etc. I'm not going to get into it much.

If Silver Surfer truely wanted to end Thor, he'll just open a black hole in Thor's face. :)

Gallery

Oh and one should note that feat comes well before Silver Surfer's upgrade.

Now we rarely see Silver Surfer fight at full force. But whe he does he is a complete beast and almost unstoppable. The people that SIlver Surfer and Thor fought are sometimes really powerful. We can argue who fought the more powerful people. Thor fought Glory in Chaos War, Glory was really powerful. But Thor was only amped once for that fight and he was almost killed. Still an impressive fight.

Now during Annihilation...SIlver Surfer was holding his own against TWO Galactus level beings, he was really hurt after the end, but he wasn't even ko'ed or killed. Unlike Thor who was almost killed with his fight with Glory.

Those are my 2 cents for now...Your turn.

EDIT:Oh I see you went before me..

@King-Stranglehold da first:

Tho is also very powerful. He was affored up to fight Demorge the god eater. You know a being who fights, and eats beings like Set, Chthon. People on this site always underrestimate Thor, because they don't know his true power. Funny thing is, Thor is not even at his full potential yet. Odin asked Gaea if they could have a kid together so that the kid could surpass Asgard itself. So, right off the bat Thor is the son of argurably the most powerful Skyfather in Marvel, Odin, and Gaea the Elder Gods who are said to be more powerful than Skyfathers. Thor has hurt being's as powerful as Odin, and even Surtur, so he will definetly put the hurting on Silver Surfer in a morals off fight.

You keep saying Thor holds back on only mortals. It is not true. Thor considers people like Hulk, Gladiator, and others mortals too. Want to know why? Because Thor is a god, and see's himself above everybody else on earth, from his arrrogant ways. Here is a scan of Thor saying to Gladiator that he's done holding back on him. Now tell me. When since was Gladiator a moral? Last time I check, he was a part of a race called the Shi'ar from a next planet. Which makes him an alien to th e human race, and non mortal.

Thor morals on

Thor morals off

Thor also doesn't kill beings unless there Frost Giants, and trolls. Thor didn't even try to kill Sentry. After the guy killed many Asgardians, Loki, and destroyed Asgard. Now tell me who is a pacifists now?

Silver Surfer has many ways to defeat Thor? Well Thor has many ways to defeat the Silver Surfer. Thor can god blast him, anti-blast him, use winds from 1000 worlds, BFR him to the Microverse like he did Wasp in Secret Invasion. Or straight up beat the crap out of the Surfer physically. The Surfer is not on Thor's level physically unless he does amping. How is durability a way to defeat Thor? I guess by speed, you meant speed blitz him? That won't work seeing how Thor is described as being extremely fast many times, and has kept up with the Silver Surfer just as much times. Cosmic Awarence won't work, because Thor doesn't have any weaknesses, or so has been shown in Marvel Comics. Thor can teleport probably even better than the Silver Surfer, so I doubt that BFR will work. Thor has had his body phased into the ground by Kitty Pryde before, and he got out of it, so I doubt that will work. Thor has transmuting abilites too, like he used on Dynamo. So it's higly likely Mjolnir will negate it. Energy projection is actually literally the only thing pretty much that can actually be used to defeat Thor. Even opening a black hole won't work, because Thor would just escape the black hole by teleporting.

Silver Surfer does fight powerful beings, but so does Thor. Silver Surfer probably fights more powerful beings on a regular basis, but if you compare the strongest beings Thor fought alone with the strongest beings the Silver Surfer fought alone, than you will find out that Thor has fought stronger. Thor has taken on the whole fourth Celestial group, which consisted of 9 Celestials alone, after Odin was killed. But Thor was only fighting 4 Celestials. He even managed to hurt them by throwing the inmeasurable Odin Sword through them. The Odin Sword is so heavy that Odin couldn't caculate how heavy it was, and Thor threw that through a Celestial. He also destroys the pillars Aresirem was standing on. Causing him to topple to the ground. So, now tell me. Who fought the more powerful beings?

@ThunderGodsWrath:

I completely know what Thor is capable of and I know that he is sometimes underrestimated on this site, but I can too say we have never seen SIlver Surfer at his true potential. I know about his fight with Demorge the god eater, but didn't he need help?

But you should note that Silver Surfer took on Mephisto in his OWN REALM.

Mephisto in his own realm has enough power to take on Galactus(though he lost, but still).

Silver Surfer fights Mephisto in his realm again, but most of the fight is off panel.

Gallery

Also SIlver Surfer was given the power Galactus. And Galactus>both Gaea and Odin. Its been debated on how poweful elder gods are. And if you bring up Chaos War, you should note that Gaea only unlocked Hercules true potential. She didn't amped him to fight the Chaos King. During Hercules: Prince of Power, Cho goes around collecting artifacts that has a lot of power. Once he gathered them all he became becomes omnipotent. He then used that power to bring Hercules back to life and gives all his powers to hercules.

Chaos War 01

Member Killemall proved this all to me. So again Gaea did not amp Hercules when he fought Chaos King. The same Chaos King who absorbed 98% of the Marvel multiverse. So it can be argued how strong Gaea really is...

1. Of course Hulk is a mortal. And of course Thor would be done holding back on Gladiatir, because Gladiator is a physical match for Thor.

2. Who is that guy that Thor is fighting in those two scans?

3. You're incorrect on Sentry's part. Thor DIDN'T NEED to kill the Void, because he reverted back to Bob and also Bob said he wanted to die. Thor even said he wanted Bob to pay for his crime. Why would Thor killing Bob would have made it easier for Bob. But Thor did kill him when the Void came back and was a danger for everyone again.

4. A. Godblast would be a bad idea since it would drian Thor. Thor uses all his energy for that one attack. That would only be a last resort for Thor. And Thor has to charge it I believe and SIlver Surfer is way too fast.

B. BFR wouldn't work. SIlver Surfer has teleportation too. He has done it many times and has traveled to many dimensions.

C. Physical combat doesn't really matter to Silver Surfer. Silver Surfer has shown to be more durable than Thor and shown way better durability feats than Thor. Also when Thor head butted Silver Surfer Thor was bleeding, while there was only a dent on Surfers head which went a way. Can Thor survive a black hole to the face? Because a Blood lusted Silver Surfer would do that.

Here is just one of the many Silver Surfer durability feats. Here he takes physical hit from Galactus that smashes him against a wall.

Gallery

So yeah Thor is not putting him down especially if Surfer is bloodlusted. Surfer takes hits and blasts from Galactus all the time. What's so special about Thor besides maybe the Godblast.

Also not trying to low ball Thor with this one, I like Thor but... Lets compae both Silver Surfer and Thor holding back against Hulk. When Thor holds back against Hulk he usually struggles. I'm not going to post scans out of respect for Thor.

But here is when Silver Surfer holds back against. Here he takes Hulk’s best shot, and then comments on how he pity’s the Hulk.

Gallery

And Hulk is physically stonger than Thor. So again a physical fight with Thor wont matter.

D. Silver Surfers phasing abilities is way above Shadowcats ones. Shadowcat is just a mere mutant...Also Thors physical hits can just go through Silver Surfer. So you can just count that out.

E. Thor barley uses transmuatation and I his ones don't seem as on the same league as Silver Surfers. Surfer was able to rebuild a whole city. That;s how far his transmutation goes. And its debatable if Thors hammer will counter it.

F. Black Hole would work...What I notice is Thor has to swing his hammer to teleport. He's not going to be able to because he's going to be in a black hole and Thor has not shown he can survive in a Black hole. And inside a black hole I believe gravity will be crushing him.

5. Thor fight 4 Celestial feat is good. I have used that feat tons of times for Thor. But again Silver Surfer fights people on Galactus level all the time. And the thing is like you said, Thor had Odins sword.

Anyways here is a way better feat from Silver Surfer...

This is what happens when the multiverse is at stake...When the multiverse was going to get ripped apart, Silver Surfer goes all out. He decides to 'kill' the person trying to do it.

Gallery

Rick even states he has never "seen" the Surfer act this way. This shows two things that surfer never goes all out. Also Rick points out that Surfer can beat Genis with a thought. And I believe Genis Vell was one of the most powerful beings in Marvel at that time

Also how will Thor keep up with Surfer? Surfer is too fast for him. You can argue that Thor can travel at light speed. I have argued that to, but Thor's reaction speed isn't so good.

Surfer's speed is going to be a big problem for Thor especially since Surfer has no morals in this match.

I'm tired...:)

@King-Stranglehold da first: I will post something tomorrow.

Nice debating both of you

@ThunderGodsWrath said:

@King-Stranglehold da first: I will post something tomorrow.

Take your time. :)

I'm really liking this debate.

@Fernando072295REBORN said:

Nice debating both of you

Thanks and I just watched your newest video you uploaded.

@King-Stranglehold da first:

haha thanks >_< Don't be a surfer vid comes up soon from all those scans posted up top. :P

@Fernando072295REBORN: Thanks ! Remember to vote when it's done.

@King-Stranglehold da first said: I'm enjoying it too.

@ThunderGodsWrath: sure thing.

@King-Stranglehold da first: Let's just take this too the voting now.

@ThunderGodsWrath said:

@King-Stranglehold da first: Let's just take this too the voting now.

Sure.

Let the voting begin !

Let the best man win. :)

BUMP...

King.

Bump. :)

Lets see some votes.

hmmm. I'll read through the argument again and give you both an answer tomorrow. Very nice job again by the way.

Know what? Screw it, I'm doing this right now.

Aight first off, I liked the scans posted by both of you. Pretty even debate, and I'd pretty much call it a split. BUT since their has to be a winner here goes:

The impression I got is that Thor has more than enough at his disposal to put Surfer down. Surfer didn't quite match up in raw power like ThunderGod'sWrath's scans suggested. That said, Surfer was hardly a slouch. However, in my opinion, King had a bit more strategy behind his posts. Thunder did well using Thor's heavy feats, but I wasn't quite as convinced that the fight would turn out in Thor's favor. Also, the black hole attack is pretty hard to get past. If Surfer opened it up on Thor's face, it would become a matter of surviving it instead of escaping it. Now, I think the debate would have had a few mores shifts in the lead had it been longer, but for the brief battle you guys waged, I feel that @King-Stranglehold da first: gets this. No disrespect whatsoever, just my opinion, and I'd like to see the opinion of some other voters also. In any case, well done both of you, hit me up if either want to do a CaV sometimes ^_^

Stranglehold