#1 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

Kidman represent

Nightwing and Red Robbin

vs

IndiecomicsFTW represent

the furry hairball Ultimate Wolverine

see perfect fuzzball

Nu and Pre 52 feats for Nightwing

Nu 52 Tim Drake feats

All feats for Ultimate Wolverine

Battle takes place in a new york city street

combatants are 20 Meters apart. battle can take place in all of New York. but there is a forcefield keeping all combatants in New York city

standard Gear

win by death, Incap, KO.

Battle Begin!

#2 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw what ya think. i feel like i missed something but i may not have!

#3 Posted by oceanmaster21 (8767 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by jwalser3 (5279 posts) - - Show Bio

This should be interesting.

#5 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@jwalser3 said:

This should be interesting.

isnt it always? whenever me and Cadence show up for a debate its always interesting!

#6 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@jwalser3 said:

This should be interesting.

isnt it always? whenever me and Cadence show up for a debate its always interesting!

Or it gets ugly with my ramblings and unintentional lowballing. I been half @$$ing my last few debates. Trying to make up ground now.

#7 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560 said:

@jwalser3 said:

This should be interesting.

isnt it always? whenever me and Cadence show up for a debate its always interesting!

Or it gets ugly with my ramblings and unintentional lowballing. I been half @$$ing my last few debates. Trying to make up ground now.

oooh sweet plz tell me you aint half-a$$ing. also i actually have to stop reread my posts and fix them cuz i ramble allot so no probs there!

#8 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560: I will open this up with how the flaming T-Rex are the Bird duo putting down someone like Wolverine without getting their necks sliced?

Ultimate Wolverine is the baddest trained killer on the Ultimate Marvel roster. Even Ultimate Captain America (God bless his soul and awesomeness) never chooses to engage Wolverine in H2H as he knows he would likely not win.

So I am curious what argument can be made for the Birds here. Wolverines eat birds.

#9 Edited by Cable_Extreme (9770 posts) - - Show Bio

Can we vote yet? lol

JK, This fight will be interesting, link me when voting starts so I can read it and vote.

#10 Posted by Pr0metheus (5464 posts) - - Show Bio

Weird allowing Pre-52 and N52 feats for Nightwing but only N52 for RR?

#11 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw said:

@kidman560: I will open this up with how the flaming T-Rex are the Bird duo putting down someone like Wolverine without getting their necks sliced?

Ultimate Wolverine is the baddest trained killer on the Ultimate Marvel roster. Even Ultimate Captain America (God bless his soul and awesomeness) never chooses to engage Wolverine in H2H as he knows he would likely not win.

So I am curious what argument can be made for the Birds here. Wolverines eat birds.

easy. Nightwing is extremely Acrobatic near Spider man level (ill get to that in a sec!), Dick is a genius who thinks fast on his feat and has excellent leadership abilities

just look at his pattern of jumping and how he dodges bullets with relative ease

now as for the quick thinking part

Deathstroke may have to back me up here (for my argument!). added bonus to his agility and H2H skills

#12 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: let me get part two up my internet was being a a pain (ill edit this one!)

now for Red Robbin

Tim is also acrobatic

very good also i might add

his wings also add him some protection, now against Wolverines claws they might not last as long but they'll hold up in a pinch.

Now to take Wolverine down its easy we are going to shock him until he is unconscious

using his suit

and his Escrima sticks (i never can spell these right and im to lazy to go look it up!)

so thats one way to put him down i have a few others

#13 Posted by JayAaerow (469 posts) - - Show Bio

Why would you allow feats from New 52 and Pre with Nightwing but not Red Robin? Red Robin has some nice Pre 52 feats that can tip the scale a little XD

#14 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

easy. Nightwing is extremely Acrobatic near Spider man level (ill get to that in a sec!), Dick is a genius who thinks fast on his feat and has excellent leadership abilities

just look at his pattern of jumping and how he dodges bullets with relative ease

now as for the quick thinking part

now for Red Robbin

Tim is also acrobatic

Wolverine has shows skilled agility and martial art attacks. I do not see a huge advantage here. If one at all.

Deathstroke may have to back me up here (for my argument!). added bonus to his agility and H2H skills

Deathstroke may be a good judge of character, so is Ultimate Captain America.

Cap never engages Wolverine in combat, he knows Wolverine has some of the best skills and training implanted in his head thanks to Weapon X.

very good also i might add

his wings also add him some protection, now against Wolverines claws they might not last as long but they'll hold up in a pinch.

Organic Metal. It a metal substance created by some mutants and is nearly indestructible. Look at Colossus Organic Metal.

1) 50 MPH Car, doesnt even budge Colossus.

2) Laser Beams just bounce off.

3) Lava? No Problem.

4) North Star Blast that send Wolverine to Maine merely knocks Peter down.

5) after knocking Thor around for 15 minuets, Hawkeye uses a Nuke Arrow to KO Peter. Nuff said.

And yet....

Cuts through like a hot knife through Butter.

It even cuts through Iron Man's insanely durable armor.

Now to take Wolverine down its easy we are going to shock him until he is unconscious

using his suit and his Escrima sticks (i never can spell these right and im to lazy to go look it up!)

I do not see that working.

1) Wolverine tanks Dazzler's best hit. These hits kill 3 Sentinels at a time.

2-3) Wolverine tanks a blast that sends him from New York to Maine! He holds on to the evidence he ripped off and recovered real quick to get back to New York in a short time.

4) Wolverine gets pumped full of lead.

5) Wolverine is hit by a Nuclear Missile that burns him to a skeleton. He then heals in that same dead and had his head separated by Nick Fury to be questioned.

6) Wolvie is blasted with heat that is hot enough to melt his steel pipe bonds, and then heals in seconds of the fight.

7) Wolvie vs shotgun to the head.

8-11) Wolverine is hit by a Semi Truck moving at high speed and dragged under. Heals in minuets.

12) Logan is ripped in half by Hulk and thrown to a mountain, he climbs the mountain to get his legs.

13) Wolvie takes a full Lightning Bolt from Storm and recovers very quickly.

14) Rogue regrows her entire arm in minuets after absorbing Wolverines power.

15-17) This Mutant has the power to destroy organic matter in seconds. Wolverine Healing Factor more than compensates.

None of this works. Why would a non lethal Electrocution work?

Seriously, the guys fights as a skeleton!

so thats one way to put him down i have a few others

Your going to need to bring more than that to done him.

#15 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw:

Wolverine has shows skilled agility and martial art attacks. I do not see a huge advantage here. If one at all.

yeah um Wolvervine is great and all but i dont see him on Nightwings Agility level

Nightwing also gets the drop on Cassandra Cain, now if you follow Cass you should know how hard it is to do that!

and Dick has been shown to have almost super human endurance, hes gone without sleep for three days and still acts normal. he says 3 to 4 hours sleep that will help

1) Durability vs Dazzler best hit. These hits kill 3 Sentinels at a time.

2-3) Wolverine tanks a blast that sends him from New York to Maine! He holds on to the evidence he ripped off and recovered real quick to get back to New York in a short time.

4) Wolverine gets pumped full of lead.

5) Wolvie is blasted with heat that is hot enough to melt his steel pipe bonds, and then heals in seconds of the fight.

6) Wolvie vs shotgun to the head.

Organic Metal. It a metal substance created by some mutants and is nearly indestructible. Look at Colossus Organic Metal

Metal conducts electricity no? so yeah the shock thing would still work as it would hardly be non-lethal to Wolvie

Cuts through like a hot knife through Butter.

i think i have posted scans that show Nightwing will hardly have to worry about that as for Tim

i know i posted this scan already but i didnt go into great detail to show you just how strong his wings are they cut through armor "forged in the fiery womb of a raging sun" so i see no reason why His wings wont hold up against Wolverines Claws especially since they arent adamantium

Game plan

we are going to use the environment to our advantage we have Grapples, and ranged weapons. we can get on top of nereby buildings and start unleashing them. if for no other reason than to slow Wolvie down. then Dick using his shear agility will drop down and engage Wolverine in H2H while Tim keeps on with those wings of his in hopes of causing wolverine to bleed out (this wont kill him) but it might throw him off his game, become unbalanced and then Nightwing can go in with the Electro-shock therapy to put the Wolverine down ad combined with the blood-loss should provide with an interesting KO

#16 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

yeah um Wolvervine is great and all but i dont see him on Nightwings Agility level

Nightwing also gets the drop on Cassandra Cain, now if you follow Cass you should know how hard it is to do that!

and Dick has been shown to have almost super human endurance, hes gone without sleep for three days and still acts normal. he says 3 to 4 hours sleep that will help

Yeah, he is agile, he is very good on endurance. For a human. Does this matter against Wolverine who is also very agile?

He can do Back Flips and air kicks too lol. What really sets Wolverine apart is his Speed.

1-2) Wolverine too fast for Shot Gun Owner to respond.

3) Wolverine dodges all 3 shots at point blank range.

4-5) Wolverine Speed closes the distance to this Suicide Bomber Mutant!

6-8) Wolvie hit by a Mach+ Speed Missile tanks being blasted thru walls, flips over it, and clears the blast.

9) Blitzes Russian Mob Boss.

10-11) Reacts to Quicksilver who is Mach 10+, and moving at the speed necessary to kill Cyclopes.

12) Too fast for Quicksilver to dodge again QS can go from 0 to Mach 10+ in a instant! QS also thinks and reacts faster than peak humans due to his power.

13) Wolverine blurs in front of Thing while sick with a special flu designed for him.

14-16) Logan speed blitzes a Horde of Zombies in three after Image swipes.

Metal conducts electricity no? so yeah the shock thing would still work as it would hardly be non-lethal to Wolvie.

Well I really see no reason this will work. Wolverine Healing Factor has been shown faster and better than Sabertooth who also has Adamantium Skeleton.

He was hit by a all out Lightning Bolt (Lightning Bolt > Tazers) and was still good enough to make his exit.

Here Wolverine is hit by Storm with a all out Lightning Bolt and recovers after a few seconds.

I thinkI have posted scans that show Nightwing will hardly have to worry about that as for Tim

i know i posted this scan already but i didnt go into great detail to show you just how strong his wings are they cut through armor "forged in the fiery womb of a raging sun" so i see no reason why His wings wont hold up against Wolverines Claws especially since they arent adamantium

......................... uh.............

............. Really?! Did you just say...

Wolverines Claws especially since they arent adamantium

Does that mean you never knew? Well let me educate.... Wolverine is all Adamantium baby. Also there is a huge misconception on Ultimate Adamantium to 616. It is stated in bios and handbooks as Unbreakable and the same.

Ultimate Adamantium

Alright, there is a huge ISSUE of people believing Ultimate Verse Adamantium is weaker to 616 base on NO REAL EVIDENCE!

Even Mention in his Official Bio as unbreakable Adamantium.

Yuri here is explained by Professor Cornelius (who made ultimate Wolverine Skeleton) that some parts of his Body has not been Ossified. This stands to reasons unlike 616 Wolverine who has IMPOSSIBLE Adamantium Joints Ultimate Wolvie does not. Only his Bones (except the one above) are coated. He can be with great strength ripped apart.

So lets look at this suppose Adamantium Breaking.

1-2) Both Examples of the Spine and Neck Joints being ripped apart. Not the Bones Breaking.

3-4) Again No Bones breaking, more examples of Joint area Ripping out!

So from we see, the Bones were never broken. He was pulled apart people!

Also misinformation from Wikias.

1) Hulk does not break Adamantium Tip Needle, he breaks the non Adamantium Vial part in Caps Hand.

2) Sabertooth does not break a Adamantium claw. It was always like that in its first appearance, for no explain reason. Perhaps they ran out of Adamantium.

3) This Adamantium Cage does not break, the Cage is whole and open. Did it have a Mechanize Lock that burned out? I see no damage to the cage.

4-5) Captain America's Shield was NEVER stated to be Adamantium. It was made by Henry Pym and Cap said it was Indestructible. Simple as that. His new Shield was made from Asgard Dwarven Smiths.

No Scan) Death Strike had her neck broken. Long Shot Reality Warps with his Luck Powers. No scan, Sry.

So, yes, they are Adamantium and will cut that birds wings like a cat playing with its dinner.

Here is my Game Plan

Wolverine will charge forward, see these to badly dressed heroes have peak human abilities, probably get shocked a few times, gets really p!$$ed, and this happen to the bird duo.

He heals in seconds and is on his way.

#17 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: tomorrow sorry bro but the fight is all out of me for today!

#18 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio
#19 Posted by oceanmaster21 (8767 posts) - - Show Bio

this is good

#21 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: a few things first

Too fast for Quicksilver to dodge again QS can go from 0 to Mach 10+ in a instant! QS also thinks and reacts faster than peak humans due to his power.

Quicksilver is without a doubt one of the worst written speedsters in the history of speedsters. QS cant dodge Wolverine but the Wolverine gets torn in half by the hulk. those feats dont stack up!

Here Wolverine is hit by Storm with a all out Lightning Bolt and recovers after a few seconds.

do you really think storm was going for the KO with that bolt? just asking

Wolverine dodges all 3 shots at point blank range

Nothing Nightwing hasnt done before

here he fights a wolverine like Character except for the healing factor. seems to have no problem dodging him or his Explosive rounds and to give you a hint on how fast this guy was

so Wolverines on again off again Super human agility (but still somehow gets torn in half by the hulk?) doesnt exactly worry me

Does that mean you never knew? Well let me educate.... Wolverine is all Adamantium baby. Also there is a huge misconception on Ultimate Adamantium to 616. It is stated in bios and handbooks as Unbreakable and the same

So, yes, they are Adamantium and will cut that birds wings like a cat playing with its dinner.

Another Common Misconception is that Adamantium can cut through anything, it can not it is merely unbreakable

shields still there even though Wolverine gives the ole claws a try. and Armor built in a raging sun> Guardians/ Vindicators Shield! (much as i hate to admit it!)

Wolverine will charge forward, see these to badly dressed heroes have peak human abilities, probably get shocked a few times, gets really p!$$ed, and this happen to the bird duo.

I fail to see that happening as we are on the roof and Tim can Fly. gonna have to give me a little more detail than that!

#22 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

Quicksilver is without a doubt one of the worst written speedsters in the history of speedsters. QS cant dodge Wolverine but the Wolverine gets torn in half by the hulk. those feats dont stack up!

Actually they stack up fine. first Scan QS is moving and Wolverine merely sees and reacts to him. Second time makes sense when we see the Zombie Feat of killing entire room of zombies in 3 after image claw attacks. we have feats of him dodging 3 gunshots at him from point blank range. He has insane speed burst and reaction time.

do you really think storm was going for the KO with that bolt? just asking

Yes I do. Wolverine was being voice manipulated by Sinister at the time and Storm needed to take him down from killing the team.

Also even if it was weak Bolt, Lighting bolt of that size >>>>> all the Tazers your team is packing.

Nothing Nightwing hasnt done before

Big Difference is Wolverine has been drawn and shown as a Blur or after image in some feats. He also has reacted to a Mach 2+ Missile by flipping off it before it could travel a little over 200 yards. That is calculable speed reaction.

Aim Dodging of Nightwing does not measure up.

here he fights a wolverine like Character except for the healing factor. seems to have no problem dodging him or his Explosive rounds and to give you a hint on how fast this guy was

Except, this guy also has no Adamantium Bones, Claws, or all the combat skill implanted in his head on top of 100 years of developed skill.

Actually that guy is nothing similar other than being vastly inferior and yet giving Red Robin issues.

so Wolverines on again off again Super human agility (but still somehow gets torn in half by the hulk?) doesnt exactly worry me

What does Agility (the ability balance and do flips) have to do with Durability (the ability to endure damage)?

Another Common Misconception is that Adamantium can cut through anything, it can not it is merely unbreakable

shields still there even though Wolverine gives the ole claws a try. and Armor built in a raging sun> Guardians/ Vindicators Shield! (much as i hate to admit it!)

Lets see, I have posted feats of the durability for Organic Metal, which has insane durability feats, yet Wolverine cuts through that easy. Yet Tim's dinky metal cape that shows none of the same durability is suppose to be superior because it was forged in a raging sun? So what? It is heat resistant. Certain Tiles can resist the heat of atmosphere re entry, while steel melts, but steel is way stronger. Forged in a raging sun means nothing but heat resistant if it has non of the same durability feats of Colossus Organic Metal.

I fail to see that happening as we are on the roof and Tim can Fly. gonna have to give me a little more detail than that!

Ok, the fight goes exactly like this.

Wolverine standing around a small area and takes out a whole group of Mutant Brother Hood. Probaly smiling to himself like he does here.

#23 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw:

Actually they stack up fine. first Scan QS is moving and Wolverine merely sees and reacts to him. Second time makes sense when we see the Zombie Feat of killing entire room of zombies in 3 after image claw attacks. we have feats of him dodging 3 gunshots at him from point blank range. He has insane speed burst and reaction time.

right Nothing Nightwing cant do. and Quicksilver cant dodge Wolverine + Wolverine getting torn in half by the hulk =

spoiler

no no no no no!

Except, this guy also has no Adamantium Bones, Claws, or all the combat skill implanted in his head on top of 100 years of developed skill

right no all he did was train and spend his whole life (after Dick left the circus!) plotting to kill him right sounds pretty easy to me!

Lets see, I have posted feats of the durability for Organic Metal, which has insane durability feats, yet Wolverine cuts through that easy. Yet Tim's dinky metal cape that shows none of the same durability is suppose to be superior because it was forged in a raging sun? So what? It is heat resistant. Certain Tiles can resist the heat of atmosphere re entry, while steel melts, but steel is way stronger. Forged in a raging sun means nothing but heat resistant if it has non of the same durability feats of Colossus Organic Metal.

and yet they couldnt cut through Guardians shields. and as you say 616 Adamantium = Ultimate Adamantium

Ok, the fight goes exactly like this.

Wolverine standing around a small area and takes out a whole group of Mutant Brother Hood. Probaly smiling to himself like he does here.

dude those are no namers? not two of the top 5 Martial Artist in DCU (well actually maybe not Tim, naw he beats Damian) yeah top 5) and again my team is on the roof currently throwing sh!t at wolverine. so first off ^ that aint happening, Second off we know he has a healing factor, (yes they will hit him!) and that hes fast.

btw just so you know his wings drew blood from TRIGON (you know the demon, devouer's whole worlds ect ect...) so i actually stand by my statement that a good wing clip can well cut wolverine in half well because Hulk did it so why not?

accuracy of Dick Greyson!

#24 Posted by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

right Nothing Nightwing cant do. and Quicksilver cant dodge Wolverine + Wolverine getting torn in half by the hulk =

This is such poor logic. Show me Nightwing reacting to characters who are moving at clear super speeds or moving at super speed. As for Hulk, what does Hulk tearing Wolverine apart have to do with anything?

right no all he did was train and spend his whole life (after Dick left the circus!) plotting to kill him right sounds pretty easy to me!

So he is a nobody, with no official legit training mention other than "this guy trained in his mother basement for years" as statement?

At least Wolverine was highly decorated fighter in WW2 and was the stated best assassin in the world by Black Widow, Fury, and Xavier. See the street cred?

and yet they couldnt cut through Guardians shields. and as you say 616 Adamantium = Ultimate Adamantium

What does 616 Guardian's durability of shields have to do with Tim's featless metal wings?

dude those are no namers? not two of the top 5 Martial Artist in DCU (well actually maybe not Tim, naw he beats Damian) yeah top 5) and again my team is on the roof currently throwing sh!t at wolverine. so first off ^ that aint happening, Second off we know he has a healing factor, (yes they will hit him!) and that hes fast.

Actually I am pretty sure the top 5 are like Karate Kid, Richard Dragon, Cassandra Cain, Conner Hawk, Mocking Bird, Shiva, Batman, and others. I really doubt the Robins are anywhere near that pecking order.

btw just so you know his wings drew blood from TRIGON (you know the demon, devouer's whole worlds ect ect...) so i actually stand by my statement that a good wing clip can well cut wolverine in half well because Hulk did it so why not?

How does cutting Trigon, who has no feats of skin durability vs razor edge slashing weapons, compare at all to Hulk who RIPPED and not SLASHED Wolverine apart?

Rip....Slash.... do you see the difference?

accuracy of Dick Greyson!

Thats nice. Wolverine killed a bear once.

I think he was hungry.....

Also a nice strength feat. He holds up the weight of a charging Grizzly with one arm and slashes it away with the other.

Why does Team Robin win again?

#25 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw:

This is such poor logic. Show me Nightwing reacting to characters who are moving at clear super speeds or moving at super speed. As for Hulk, what does Hulk tearing Wolverine apart have to do with anything?

if wolverine is so fast how did the hulk even catch him. just asking

What does 616 Guardian's durability of shields have to do with Tim's featless metal wings?

hardly featless as i have shown

again if these "featless" wings were so easily broken wouldnt they have snapped when they brushed against the armor? just saying. and Trigons Durability is so much more than Adamantium its sad you have to ask that. and if Adamantium cant cut through Guardians shields there is more than enough proof that it wont be able to cut Tim's wings either

So he is a nobody, with no official legit training mention other than "this guy trained in his mother basement for years" as statement?

At least Wolverine was highly decorated fighter in WW2 and was the stated best assassin in the world by Black Widow, Fury, and Xavier. See the street cred?

right. hold on

ok now that i am back

this is Raymond pay special attention here RAYMOND

same Raymond that used to DODGE SPEEDING TRAINS as a kid, so yeah if that counts as his moms basement then i guess you could say that!

How does cutting Trigon, who has no feats of skin durability vs razor edge slashing weapons, compare at all to Hulk who RIPPED and not SLASHED Wolverine apart?

wait did you just say Trigon has no skin Durability. wait... really?

hes trigon did you think his skin was as soft as a babies?

#26 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

if wolverine is so fast how did the hulk even catch him. just asking

Same reason why Superman gets hit by guys who are barely faster than Mach speeds much less than FTL. Also Wolverine had any reason to dodge? He has the Healing Factor and Adamantium Skeleton. He never knew he could be ripped in half at that point.

Also Hulk has tagged Hyperion and Ultimate Captain America. I guess they are slower than Nightwing to cause they were tagged by Hulk? Is that your best strategy?

hardly featless as i have shown

again if these "featless" wings were so easily broken wouldnt they have snapped when they brushed against the armor? just saying. and Trigons Durability is so much more than Adamantium its sad you have to ask that. and if Adamantium cant cut through Guardians shields there is more than enough proof that it wont be able to cut Tim's wings either

It not sad as you NEVER shown me proof of Trigon having stronger than Adamantium Skin I showed the proof of Organic metal vs Adamanitum claws. You showed me nothing still. Last time I check, Adamantium is shown and stated Unbreakable. Those wings, are not.

So he is a nobody, with no official legit training mention other than "this guy trained in his mother basement for years" as statement?

At least Wolverine was highly decorated fighter in WW2 and was the stated best assassin in the world by Black Widow, Fury, and Xavier. See the street cred?

right. hold on

ok now that i am back

this is Raymond pay special attention here RAYMOND

same Raymond that used to DODGE SPEEDING TRAINS as a kid, so yeah if that counts as his moms basement then i guess you could say that!

Speeding Trains!? Like 60 MPH? That is not fast lol. Nor is this guy agility a showing of skill in a fight. He is good at dancing, so what?

Here is some skill showings against skilled opponents.

Wolverine fights the New X-Team as a Dnager Room sim. Xavier input alot of work into that accurate program that Wolvie decimates in seconds. Everyone other than Storm on that team is experience fighter to boot.

How about a small military force.

Flashback Battle of Wolverine vs Iraqis naked. They were all ghosted by Wolverine.

Here is a man with H2H training skill and feats through many Ultimate X-Men books.

Wolverine holds back in a fist fight with Cyke.

How about a physical superior foe?

Wolverine fights She Hulk, easy win.

wait did you just say Trigon has no skin Durability. wait... really?

hes trigon did you think his skin was as soft as a babies?

Do you have any proof it is harder than Organic steel? I am waiting.

#27 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

Same reason why Superman gets hit by guys who are barely faster than Mach speeds much less than FTL. Also Wolverine had any reason to dodge? He has the Healing Factor and Adamantium Skeleton. He never knew he could be ripped in half at that point.

Same reason why Superman gets hit by guys who are barely faster than Mach speeds much less than FTL. Also Wolverine had any reason to dodge? He has the Healing Factor and Adamantium Skeleton. He never knew he could be ripped in half at that point.

Also Hulk has tagged Hyperion and Ultimate Captain America. I guess they are slower than Nightwing to cause they were tagged by Hulk? Is that your best strategy?

im sorry but by this logic Tim Drake is several thousand times FTL because Trigon stopped Wally West

with a Gesture. because Wally couldnt hit him but Tim Did. you see what i am getting at? we both know that Wolverine doesnt go Mach 10. we both know Wolverine doesnt even go Mach 1 (which is 770 mph)

oh and as for Trigons durability he destroyed the JLA

Speeding Trains!? Like 60 MPH? That is not fast lol. Nor is this guy agility a showing of skill in a fight. He is good at dancing, so what?

Here is some skill showings against skilled opponents.

lets see Wolverine as a kid doing that. ill save you some trouble they dont exist.

btw Dick jumps onto a Speeding Bullet Train

lands perfectly (now i know those go over 100 mph easily!)

now as for Dicks Agility (again)

this is tight quarters agility something i dont see wolverine doing/ replicating but i encourage you to prove me wrong

so the way i see it. is Wolverine goes in for the kill and then Nightwing uses the many many more forms of Martial arts he has learned to destory Wolvie. btw this guy down here is Invulnerable when he concentrates (and he appears to be concentrating pretty hard no?) so why is Wolverine any different?

good agility feats for Tim and Dissolving acid breathed from a Meta-human doesnt disolve his wings. huh? so his wings cant be dissolved, cant be broken by Armor forged by Trigon, Can make a guy who soloed the entire JLA bleed? it isnt looking good for Wolverine right now.

sorry but it is common for every wolverine that once they go feral they forgot all forms of Martial Arts in such. Nightwing and Tim will stay disciplined and practiced throughout the fight. together they will take Wolverine chop him into little bits and such. btw i really dont see Wolverine tagging Tim either

cuz you know he easily catches rockets fired and then dispenses with them just as easily

#28 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560:

im sorry but by this logic Tim Drake is several thousand times FTL because Trigon stopped Wally West

with a Gesture. because Wally couldnt hit him but Tim Did. you see what i am getting at? we both know that Wolverine doesnt go Mach 10. we both know Wolverine doesnt even go Mach 1 (which is 770 mph)

First off, who has not tagged Flash? Everyone from Deathstroke to Batman has tagged Flash lol. At least Quicksilver is only Mach 10+ and not FTL! Big difference of realistic reaction times lol.

Wolverine Reaction and Combat Speed is indeed over Mach 1. He has the feats to back it. Mach 2+ Missile that covers barely 50 yards is Above Mach 1 in itself. Wolverine killing a room of Zombies with After Images of his Claws. Wolverine reacting and getting the Jump on Quicksilver twice. Wolverine in general out moving other super beings.

Yeah Wolverine is so slow. I mean, its not like he has a Healing Factor that eliminates his pain and tirdness that keeps him from moving beyond peak human speeds... oh wait!

oh and as for Trigons durability he destroyed the JLA

...Who cares? how does this help your argument of him against sharp razor weapons on his skin? He reality Warps, big deal. The Magician has the same power. He is a Grade A reality warper who actually manage to overwhelm Phoenix Jean.

Yet Wolverine owns him with a cut to the throat.

How does Trigun beating the JL with his Reality Warping power relate to his durability vs those weak metal wings?

lets see Wolverine as a kid doing that. ill save you some trouble they dont exist.

btw Dick jumps onto a Speeding Bullet Train

lands perfectly (now i know those go over 100 mph easily!)

now as for Dicks Agility (again)

this is tight quarters agility something i dont see wolverine doing/ replicating but i encourage you to prove me wrong

I really do not care to prove you wrong. Wolverine is very agile for a fighter, he does not specialist in dancing like the bird duo are. Seriously this is a fight, not a dance off pr free running contest. You do not see MMA or UFC doing back flips do ya?

Its about landing hits, countering attacks with the least effort, and overpowering the opponent when they tire out. Something Wolverine has in spades.

so the way i see it. is Wolverine goes in for the kill and then Nightwing uses the many many more forms of Martial arts he has learned to destory Wolvie. btw this guy down here is Invulnerable when he concentrates (and he appears to be concentrating pretty hard no?) so why is Wolverine any different?

So he will simply punch and kick.... thats it?

This guy can fight a 50% Hyperion. Your strategy is to punch and kick him?

good agility feats for Tim and Dissolving acid breathed from a Meta-human doesnt disolve his wings. huh? so his wings cant be dissolved, cant be broken by Armor forged by Trigon, Can make a guy who soloed the entire JLA bleed? it isnt looking good for Wolverine right now.

Your feats for the wings still pale to Colossus Organic Metal, but lets say they are better than Adamantium (cough cough, bs, cough) and Wolverine cannot cut through them. He will still take out Nightwwing with ease and then Grap Red Robin and run him through.

sorry but it is common for every wolverine that once they go feral they forgot all forms of Martial Arts in such. Nightwing and Tim will stay disciplined and practiced throughout the fight. together they will take Wolverine chop him into little bits and such. btw i really dont see Wolverine tagging Tim either

Wow, so much wrong here. First off, this is Ultimate wolverine, I never seen him go Feral. Second off, how are you chopping him into bits? Why are you chopping him to bits? Not only is it no possible to "chop" him to bits, it is out of character. He can be pulled apart, but would they know to do that? Could they have the strength to do it before being stabbed int he face?

cuz you know he easily catches rockets fired and then dispenses with them just as easily

Neat. I think I am ready for votes. Wolverine feats are just way to much in durability, speed, and Wolverine kills people. He has no morals about it in the Ultimate Universe.

If wolverine can take down Ultimate thing, She Hulk, Iron Man, and Sabertooth, I see no way for the Bird Duo with their ballerina skills surviving.

I just do not see the Robins comparing to Ultimate Logan here.

#29 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: hey bro i wont be able to do some serious debating for a little bit so do you want to call it or wait 2 days?

#30 Posted by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: hey bro i wont be able to do some serious debating for a little bit so do you want to call it or wait 2 days?

We can call it. I think we hit most of the important points.

#31 Edited by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio
#33 Posted by dondave (38889 posts) - - Show Bio

This was a horrible debate

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#34 Posted by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkazrael999: being 16 and male i think i am invincible and therefore sarcasm doesnt really bother me if you really need to make someone your punching bag im pretty good at it cuz it doesnt bother me.

#35 Posted by WarBlade539 (4753 posts) - - Show Bio

Allright, kudos to both parties for awesome debates. I like how both parties played to each of their characters individual strengths and weaknesses. And it was a great job countering each other arguments too.

To be fair, I though it was a losing battle for @kidman560. Not that I thought his arguments were subpar, not at all, but it's just that I don't see the Birdies taking down 1610 Logan here. And @indiecomicsftw did a decent job destroying Kidman's points.

However to be fair, Indie was just going on about posting stats after stats and scans after scans. I would advice you to focus more on countering your opponents points than just posting scans. My vote, however, goes to Indie.

But a piece of advice, it was getting a bit hostile there for a moment. Sarcasm was thrown, left-n'-right. The reason Comic Vine is so awesome because we don't get into fights with other users so I would respectfully advice you guys to be a bit more civil next time.

#36 Posted by homicidalmaniac (8256 posts) - - Show Bio

@indiecomicsftw: You get my vote.@kidman560,you use some out of contexts/non-cannon feats.Indie had the better side of debate.

#37 Posted by WarBlade539 (4753 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkazrael999: being 16 and male i think i am invincible and therefore sarcasm doesnt really bother me if you really need to make someone your punching bag im pretty good at it cuz it doesnt bother me.

It's not about being able to take sarcasm or hostility. It's about being civil to one another.
And a false sense of invincibility is usually the cause of downfall, son. Just giving some friendly advice.

#38 Posted by IndieComicsFTW (3252 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkazrael999: Actually me and @kidman560 are real cool with each other. I did not feel the debate heated up at all. We jibe each other with sarcasm. Thats just a inside thing we do.

#39 Edited by kidman560 (7578 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560 said:

@darkazrael999: being 16 and male i think i am invincible and therefore sarcasm doesnt really bother me if you really need to make someone your punching bag im pretty good at it cuz it doesnt bother me.

It's not about being able to take sarcasm or hostility. It's about being civil to one another.

And a false sense of invincibility is usually the cause of downfall, son. Just giving some friendly advice.

oh plz i am driving we are way past that. although i live in Houston and i did kind of flip sh!t when my Car kind of, sort of, you know Hydroplaned. that was fun

and me @indiecomicsftw are tight. it was fine besides if i felt like he actually meant any of it i would be "offended" but i doubt it so maybe thats a thing with me idk

#40 Posted by WarBlade539 (4753 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkazrael999: Actually me and @kidman560 are real cool with each other. I did not feel the debate heated up at all. We jibe each other with sarcasm. Thats just a inside thing we do.

Cool. My vote goes for you though.

#41 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7925 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll vote but I'll do it reluctantly.

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