#1 Posted by Trinity00 (2504 posts) - - Show Bio

Bruce Banner wants to teach the fantastic 4 a lesson so he prepares for 30 days before he attacks the base

Scenario & Rules

Bruce Banner is allowed to use the Hulk

Bruce Banner is Blood Lusted but the F4 are not

Susan is not allowed to create any force fields inside Bruce's or Hulk body or block out his oxygen supply.

Battle takes place in the baxter building.

#2 Posted by Almighty_Darkseid (1724 posts) - - Show Bio

fan 4 wins, bruce banner dies horrifically

#3 Posted by Trinity00 (2504 posts) - - Show Bio

)BUMP)

#4 Posted by Almighty_Darkseid (1724 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlueLantern1995 said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

fan 4 wins, bruce banner dies horrifically

disagree...Bruce Banner is a genius and if he wants to and he can create all sorts of gamma based weapons to defeat them or he could create a gamma bomb...their are a million ways for Banner to win.

all of the fan 4 are genius as well, 4 genius minds against 1? 4 wins

#5 Posted by Trinity00 (2504 posts) - - Show Bio

(bump)

#6 Posted by yodagod (2285 posts) - - Show Bio

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

@BlueLantern1995 said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

fan 4 wins, bruce banner dies horrifically

disagree...Bruce Banner is a genius and if he wants to and he can create all sorts of gamma based weapons to defeat them or he could create a gamma bomb...their are a million ways for Banner to win.

all of the fan 4 are genius as well, 4 genius minds against 1? 4 wins

Reed is the only genius. Sue is gifted but Johnny and Ben are barely average. Not to mention that Banner is second only to Reed on all Marvel Earth, and he gets a month prep while the others do not. Banner wins. Easily.

#7 Posted by LockOmally (66 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

@BlueLantern1995 said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

fan 4 wins, bruce banner dies horrifically

disagree...Bruce Banner is a genius and if he wants to and he can create all sorts of gamma based weapons to defeat them or he could create a gamma bomb...their are a million ways for Banner to win.

all of the fan 4 are genius as well, 4 genius minds against 1? 4 wins

Reed is the only genius. Sue is gifted but Johnny and Ben are barely average. Not to mention that Banner is second only to Reed on all Marvel Earth, and he gets a month prep while the others do not. Banner wins. Easily.

Your not wrong when you say second to reed (although doom is arguable and pym,stark foster are close). But I think you are wrong about jhonny and ben, they are piolts and besides that being around geniuses 24/7 some of that stuff has to rub off.

Now I agree with you there is a BIG chance for banner to win. But to be the devils advocate and say the FF has a pretty good survival chance when you think about it. Reed has batman like prep for most situations. Tony gets power hungery has a plan, Superskrull comes to earth a bunch of plans for that, Doom starts shit, HE CAN ANNIHILATE HIM (though he chooses not to). Hell he even has 4+ plans to send galactus away. Im pretty sure he has a few back ups for Banner and the hulk.

However It would probably be VERY difficult. Hulk alone would give them a Hell of a time, But to add banners genius.

Well damn...while writing this my opinion has flipfloped so much im not sure who...wanna say banner but reeds to push over...so...No idea lol

#8 Posted by yodagod (2285 posts) - - Show Bio

@LockOmally said:

Your not wrong when you say second to reed (although doom is arguable and pym,stark foster are close). But I think you are wrong about jhonny and ben, they are piolts and besides that being around geniuses 24/7 some of that stuff has to rub off.

Now I agree with you there is a BIG chance for banner to win. But to be the devils advocate and say the FF has a pretty good survival chance when you think about it. Reed has batman like prep for most situations. Tony gets power hungery has a plan, Superskrull comes to earth a bunch of plans for that, Doom starts shit, HE CAN ANNIHILATE HIM (though he chooses not to). Hell he even has 4+ plans to send galactus away. Im pretty sure he has a few back ups for Banner and the hulk.

However It would probably be VERY difficult. Hulk alone would give them a Hell of a time, But to add banners genius.

Well damn...while writing this my opinion has flipfloped so much im not sure who...wanna say banner but reeds to push over...so...No idea lol

Ben is a world class pilot and Johnny is good at many things from mechanics to playboying. None of it makes either of them geniuses or even smart. You just need good eyesight and reflexes to be a pilot. And intelligence doesn't just rub off. No reverse osmosis intellect from Reed to Johnny or Ben. In fact the opposite has been shown both in real life and the comics. They rely so heavily on Reed's intellect they become slower.

I agree that Reed has counter-plans for most things, (especially) including Hulk, and maybe even Banner. But Banner really thinks outside the box, and he knows all of these people very well. And Reed's plans fail as often as not. His counter-plans for Doom have blown up in his face a few times. Magneto and Namor at least twice each. Johnny was actually the one who saved their a$$es when Sue was going to be sacrificed so Galactus couldn't figure out her invisibilty. And we know how well his plans went for Civil War and WWH. All that said, Reed is better than anyone at thinking, inventing, and working on the fly so they shouldn't be just counted out. But Banner gets a month, his own tech, and Hulk, plus whatever craziness he creates during prep, plus who knows what on the fly. He's shown that he can hang with the best of them as well. I mean that's all he did for a while. So unless Reed's auto-deus-ex-machina kicks in, Banner should have this.

#9 Posted by CerberusPrime3k (950 posts) - - Show Bio

Wasn't Banner able to make a force-field that could take hits from Juggernaut? I think He could make something crazy that could negate Johnny's flames or block sue or something like that.

#10 Posted by LockOmally (66 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod said:

@LockOmally said:

Your not wrong when you say second to reed (although doom is arguable and pym,stark foster are close). But I think you are wrong about jhonny and ben, they are piolts and besides that being around geniuses 24/7 some of that stuff has to rub off.

Now I agree with you there is a BIG chance for banner to win. But to be the devils advocate and say the FF has a pretty good survival chance when you think about it. Reed has batman like prep for most situations. Tony gets power hungery has a plan, Superskrull comes to earth a bunch of plans for that, Doom starts shit, HE CAN ANNIHILATE HIM (though he chooses not to). Hell he even has 4+ plans to send galactus away. Im pretty sure he has a few back ups for Banner and the hulk.

However It would probably be VERY difficult. Hulk alone would give them a Hell of a time, But to add banners genius.

Well damn...while writing this my opinion has flipfloped so much im not sure who...wanna say banner but reeds to push over...so...No idea lol

Ben is a world class pilot and Johnny is good at many things from mechanics to playboying. None of it makes either of them geniuses or even smart. You just need good eyesight and reflexes to be a pilot. And intelligence doesn't just rub off. No reverse osmosis intellect from Reed to Johnny or Ben. In fact the opposite has been shown both in real life and the comics. They rely so heavily on Reed's intellect they become slower.

I agree that Reed has counter-plans for most things, (especially) including Hulk, and maybe even Banner. But Banner really thinks outside the box, and he knows all of these people very well. And Reed's plans fail as often as not. His counter-plans for Doom have blown up in his face a few times. Magneto and Namor at least twice each. Johnny was actually the one who saved their a$$es when Sue was going to be sacrificed so Galactus couldn't figure out her invisibilty. And we know how well his plans went for Civil War and WWH. All that said, Reed is better than anyone at thinking, inventing, and working on the fly so they shouldn't be just counted out. But Banner gets a month, his own tech, and Hulk, plus whatever craziness he creates during prep, plus who knows what on the fly. He's shown that he can hang with the best of them as well. I mean that's all he did for a while. So unless Reed's auto-deus-ex-machina kicks in, Banner should have this.

If it seemed like I was arguing for anything close to a genius I apologize that was not what I was going for. Im arguing that they are smarted then average like you stated . Take a second and think about it, What does been pilot? Anything from planes to ships which travel the cosmos. They both have become skilled mechanics helping reed put his inventions together. Not to mentioned the general knowledge they have amassed on their adventures and the off hand facts they learn from living with multiple geniuses. Just to recap not arguing that they are world class intellects, far from it. just saying they arnt your average pleb.

I agree with just about everything from your second point. Wouldn't be surprised if reed won but yes Banner is in a VERY good postion.

#11 Posted by isaac_clarke (5448 posts) - - Show Bio

How in god's name does he not win this under these conditions without prep?

#12 Posted by Saren (25269 posts) - - Show Bio

Funnily enough Reed still has a chance to solo even with one-sided prep for Banner, he was prepping on the fly against the Marquis of Death.

I'll say Banner wins though.

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#13 Posted by BringnIt (3809 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't really think Banner is the second smartest person in Marvel, but he should be able to pull this off without toooooo much difficulty.

#14 Posted by Iamlovewithin500 (1028 posts) - - Show Bio

Banner could win.Now if Reed knew that he  and his team were going to be attacked or set up by banner,and they both had prep.. realistically speaking 
 
 
Reed's prep>>> anything Banner's cooking up atm 
 
If the F4 don't see an attack  coming,then yes there is a humongous chance Bruce could and most likely would defeat them.

#15 Posted by karetaker (1565 posts) - - Show Bio

he could go hulk and still win.he will use the prep to get madder than he ever has before by injecting the chemical that causes anger in massive amounts into his body.then he stomps the world away.and breaks trion jugs knees after he punches a hole through time :)....anyway hulk wins

#16 Posted by Kinasin_ (1141 posts) - - Show Bio

Bruce.

#17 Posted by TDK_1997 (14456 posts) - - Show Bio

Bruce Banner wins.

#18 Posted by Trinity00 (2504 posts) - - Show Bio

What has bruce done with prep?

scans please.

#19 Posted by VercingetorixTheGreat (2823 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod: Hank Pym>Bruce Banner

#20 Posted by yodagod (2285 posts) - - Show Bio

@VercingetorixTheGreat said:

@yodagod: Hank Pym>Bruce Banner

Not according to Reed. And Banner has better feats IMO.

#21 Posted by Trinity00 (2504 posts) - - Show Bio

what has banner done with prep?

#22 Posted by VercingetorixTheGreat (2823 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod: What did Reed say? He was probably just flattering him or something.

#23 Posted by Yurtigo (16 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk always wins

#24 Posted by Bo88gdan (4393 posts) - - Show Bio
@TDK_1997 said:

Bruce Banner wins.

#25 Posted by Sci_Fi_Rulez (1059 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

@BlueLantern1995 said:

@Almighty_Darkseid said:

fan 4 wins, bruce banner dies horrifically

disagree...Bruce Banner is a genius and if he wants to and he can create all sorts of gamma based weapons to defeat them or he could create a gamma bomb...their are a million ways for Banner to win.

all of the fan 4 are genius as well, 4 genius minds against 1? 4 wins

Reed is the only genius. Sue is gifted but Johnny and Ben are barely average. Not to mention that Banner is second only to Reed on all Marvel Earth, and he gets a month prep while the others do not. Banner wins. Easily.

#26 Posted by Killemall (18244 posts) - - Show Bio

Banner wins, also you dont have to put morals off for Banner , as far as the ongoing Hulk series is concerned Hulk is the good guy and everytime he gets calm he turns into banner who's a psyco criminal .

#27 Posted by ALMIGHTY (596 posts) - - Show Bio

2 Words, Ultimate Nullifier.

#28 Posted by yodagod (2285 posts) - - Show Bio

@VercingetorixTheGreat said:

@yodagod: What did Reed say? He was probably just flattering him or something.

I have to apologize. The instance I was thinking of was a what if. Crap in a hat. However, I'm fairly sure that Banner is the only one of Marvel's geniuses said to have an immeasurable intellect. In Incredible Hulk volume 2 #312 a child psychologist states it. Tony's was once stated at 270 I believe. Reed's has never been mentioned in 616, but in most other continuities is also around 270 (pre-cosmic bombardment). Ultimate FF has it at 267. Peter Parker's was stated as 250 once and 270 once both in 616. I've never seen Pym's, and I've never seen anyone above Reed or that magic 270, except Banner. The implication being that Banner was originally the top human brain in Marvel until Reed's intellect was increased by the cosmic rays. So I'll still stick with Bruce being second only to Reed.

#29 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke said:

How in god's name does he not win this under these conditions without prep?

#30 Posted by VercingetorixTheGreat (2823 posts) - - Show Bio

@yodagod: According to Mavel database they both possess level 6 intellegience but Hank is also regarded as scientist supreme of earth by eternity. Most people rank Hank above Bruce though. I would say marvel wise

1. Reed Richards

2. Dr. Doom

3. Hank

4. Bruce

5.Tony stark

#31 Posted by yodagod (2285 posts) - - Show Bio

@VercingetorixTheGreat said:

@yodagod: According to Mavel database they both possess level 6 intellegience but Hank is also regarded as scientist supreme of earth by eternity. Most people rank Hank above Bruce though. I would say marvel wise

1. Reed Richards

2. Dr. Doom

3. Hank

4. Bruce

5.Tony stark

True, but i think many people are swayed by the scientist supreme thing, and that title doesn't necessarily make him the smartest. Reed is certainly smarter. Hank himself asked why Eternity didn't choose one of the others. He happens to be the most available and consistent, even though he's not the most mentally stable himself. Being "whatever" Supreme in Marvel doesn't necessarily mean the "best", smartest, or most powerful. Just the best choice at the time. Dr Strange was Sorcerer Supreme but Margali Szardos, Sis Neg, Kulan Gath, and a few others were probably more powerful and had more magical knowledge/ability, and several were a match for him i.e. Baron Mordo.

Just hero rankings, I'd say it's Reed, Bruce, Tony, Hank, and Beast for top five. If you include villains (and stay with "human" characters)...Reed, Bruce, Doom, Mad Thinker, Leader, Tony, then Pym. Incidentally, Stark and Pym are pretty much interchangeable IMO, though I think Hank actually has superior feats.