@supermandefender :
1.When did he defeated someone as powerfull being as Surfer who had and use against him all Surfer's powers?
2.Figthing with Superman isn't the same with being as powerfull/strong as him. Superman often is holding back, but sometimes, when he is desperate he is making crazy feats. Thanks to his orgin, we can assume that Supergirl can do things close to this. As we can with Thor and BRB or heralds. They aren't equal, but they have the same potential so it won't be mistake. With such a people, fights can be a prove of being stronger/more powerfull than the second person (so if Morg will defeat Surfer, Supergirl Superman or Thor BRB) with other it is only ABC logic (if they aren't clearly on other level like Tyrant>Gladiator&BRB), so BA must have feats that proves that he is as strong as Supe.
3.Surfer has many powers (like creating black holes) and feats of durability (flying into sun, surviving in black hole) that puts him above BA.
Black Adam vs. Silver Surfer
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" @supermandefender :
1.When did he defeated someone as powerfull being as Surfer who had and use against him all Surfer's powers? 2.Figthing with Superman isn't the same with being as powerfull/strong as him. Superman often is holding back, but sometimes, when he is desperate he is making crazy feats. Thanks to his orgin, we can assume that Supergirl can do things close to this. As we can with Thor and BRB or heralds. They aren't equal, but they have the same potential so it won't be mistake. With such a people, fights can be a prove of being stronger/more powerfull than the second person (so if Morg will defeat Surfer, Supergirl Superman or Thor BRB) with other it is only ABC logic (if they aren't clearly on other level like Tyrant>Gladiator&BRB), so BA must have feats that proves that he is as strong as Supe. 3.Surfer has many powers (like creating black holes) and feats of durability (flying into sun, surviving in black hole) that puts him above BA. "
Because of surfer's durability (BA shouldn't even come close to tickling him if he cant harm someone like SBP), versatility (and insanely ranged attacks) and his upgrade since Annihilation and the ability to access the energies this universe is made up of( including gravitational, electromagnetic, nuclear, psionic, mystical, quantum and extra dimensional) and the crunches( energies of the big bang) i say he wins. IF surfer fights with the best of hes abilities only semi abstracts/cosmic entities/ high scale reality warpers should be able to handle him but of course that would make his comics boring so he has to be contained. Just like flash who can seemingly get tagged by deathstroke despite have 1000 000 times FTL reflexes. even if he was day dreaming that should never had happened since he would be seeing DS as a statue moving 1 millimeter a day. but bad writing and with the boundaries of comic books aside i say Surfer wins.
@difficlus: TY how in hell can BA harm SS who is able to create an fight in a freaking black hole got true a sun like nothing withstand a blast the can destroy a planet an now SS blast do the same thing see a star going supernova make a house out of nothing SHOW ME BA doing something to even put him in SS shoes strength plz thats something SS can bus to INCALCULABLE LEVELS
Ok...here I think your a bit confused about the Silver Surfers powers...some ppl make him seem over the top. The best way to really know to Surfer is to actually get down deep into his stories. Im not saying you dont read his comics so dont get the wrong message there....i just think your misunderstand things because you didnt read the comics where they explain why Surfer travels across galaxies in seconds. You see Surfer doesnt have 10,000 times faster than light speed. No this is FALSE! Surfer sense the very start of comics flies at the speed of light and has light speed reaction time. Whenever he flies faster than light he enters hyperspace. Which is not his speed its more like a warp speed kind of like startrek when they say like warp 9. They arent really going 9 times faster than light they are just jumping space which would appear 9 times faster than light.
All the other powers you suggest he has to easily kill BA or Superman....I really suggest you read up on those certain characters and why that would not work. Again dont take this the wrong way I am not saying you dont read about BA its obvious you do because of you knowing about SBP and Kal-kent. And BA's battle with SBP.
Im just getting the slight impression somehow your thinking Surfer is on SBP's power level and thats not right. Surfer has alot of powers at his use which is his main advantage but he is no where as strong as Superman. Surfer in comics has never shown to be on such levels by strength. Surfer has been easily out powered by Thor....had a rough battle with Gladiator...(not to rough) has shown to be knocked out by the Thing, Carnage, Storm gave him problems, Spiderman had him on the ropes, tons and tons more. Surfer is problly 1 of the most inconsistent characters today and simply because of the same reason that Superman in the Silver age had problems a Good Story.
This is why there is not to many Surfer comics and when they do make stories with Surfer in it its not really based around him. Surfer cant telepathically attack ppl. He is not as strong as Jean or Xaiver there. Thats not one of the cosmic powers given to him by Galactus its from his own race. Surfer has been known to time travel but its not something he can do simply by deciding to go back thosands or 100's of years. It kind of happens by accident almost. Trapping ppl in his board this works on weaker level characters....like you dont see Surfer attempting this on Thor. Simply because Thor is stronger than Surfer and he will most likely break out. I dont see this happening to Supes or BA for that matter and even if he could they would just escape. Surfer can effect the emotions of humans at times I dont see this happening to BA or Superman. Transmutation fails because this has been attempted from other powerful character against BA or Superman. Surfer would have to break down they're defenses first. It wouldnt be as simple has Surfer tranmutating a human with no defenses. Surfer can become Intangible but Superman can vibrate himself so fast he becomes intangible which the Surfer hasnt done before. So it almost makes me think Superman is faster with reaction time but its hard to say.
The big problem is see is Surfers defenses and he did get a upgrade in power in annihilation but it doesnt really let us know how much. And actually if you read todays comics the Thanos Imperative Surfer is in that and he has been having some trouble. Another thing I wanna clear up about Surfer in annihilation...you say Surfer controlled the crunch and he didnt. He merely Surfed it and made a wave of its energy to kill Aegis and Tenebrous. Surfer didnt use his own power to defeat them. And it almost killed him. Prior to this encounter Surfer and Galactus fought Aegis and Tenebrous and they lost.
Now this isnt BA but notice the power. Starbreaker is moving the earth toward the sun and Superman is pulling it back and Superman is winning. This is a current Superman feat modern age. Were looking at him moving 12 sextillion tons at the most here. Pls note Surfer has shown no strength feats close to this and Superman has moved the Mageddon which is 317 times bigger than earth...so he far outshines even the Hulk or Thor in strength with these feats. Ba can easily brawl with Superman. But Ba hasnt shown he can do feats at this level though.
Notice the text here. Superman is flying inside a Double blackhole and he manages to escape....not to mention he is completely unharmed by the intense gravity of a double blackhole.
Superman speeds up to escape the double blackhole. Superman holds back his speed on earth because of fear of sonic booms and the damage it could do to earth. Light speed or faster is not a problem for Superman. Now Surfer can do this to so I dont see the big issue with Speed. And BA can easily keep up with Superman.
Superman can also go intangible as seen here. He just vibrates his body so fast like the Flash he cant be hit at all.
Here BA does more damage. And 1 final image but no intention to make Surfer look bad Im just making my point.
The point i was making was to Difficlus because he didnt decribe Surfer the right way so I was merely sharing. He was comparing Surfers feats of durability...ect ect to Superboy Prime which is a bad example and Surfer is not on such a level. The big difference between Surfer and SBP...is SBP can easily punch out of realities.
Thats alot of power....not to mention all the characters he ran threw in the DC universe. Superman was able to take down this big close to Silver age powerhouse. So its alittle hard to accept Surfer losing to the likes of Thor yet he can stomp people like Superman???? Yeah that doesnt sit to well.
1.About Surfer scans:
-Nova is no push over. He will be able to give BA a fight by himself. And Surfer curbstomped him in that battle without even trying. Remember - they aren't enemies.
-Thing with BP was PIS
-Who is that guy who killed him? This doesn't prove anything.
-Requiem is non canon.
2.About BA & Supe scans:
-Thing with Spectre is PIS or jobbing, nothing more. It doesn't prove anything. Spectre should be able to wave his hand and destroy BA.
-This scans with Supe doesn't prove anything either. BA isn't Supe. Superman's feats aren't go to BA automathicly. They don't even have similar orgins. BA isn't Supergirl (if You know what I mean) either.
3.BA & Supe feats (again)
Show me Black Adam or Cap M. surviving in black hole. If You show me CM survivng this I will accept it, beacuse they have similar orgins and (source of ) powers.
4.Reaction speed.
Surfer already showed nanosecond speed reaction he don't need his travel speed. He also searched all Earth in second. But when BA showed that speed? Keeping up with FTL guys isn't a prove on anything.
5.Any showings in which Surfer was hurt by Thing level guys is pure PIS since he fought in black hole (what can't be PIS because it is objective feat).
6.Surfer can attack anyone withTP since Power Cosmic coming from astral plane and he already defeated powerfull being (some demon) by this.
7.I am not sure about time travel, but I agree aobut traping in board and thing with Crunch.
8.Show me BA resisting molecule manipulation. Not fighing againt people who can use it, but clear mm-resist.
ok i respect ur opinion but most of the scans u posted for surfer is PIS. come on talk about bad writing. If anything i say stalemate. and yes surfer's telepathy is like Xavier because he once used to it make every one of earth realize how humanity was destroying itself (creating world peace briefly), not once but twice. If anything he does intangible and BA cant hurt him or goes invisible by bending the EM spectrum around him, BA cant fight what he cant see. don't rule out cosmic awareness so he's gonna know all about BA or any weakness he has. And as i said its not like there gonna show him with unlimited strength over powering Thor or something even though he can clearly do that. Its the power of the plot. Thor and Superman have limits on their strength while surfer theoretically doesn't because he should be able to be as strong as he wants to be while it is a part of his power set and according to Comicvine rules they are fighting at the best of their ability. He should also be as durable as superman if not higher (i think superman was knocked out by a supernova while surfer just brushes he's shoulders and flies away) and has survived being dashed to pieces and pulled himself to. so what if Supes can vibrate his atoms that not going to help him with someone who is intangible. As far as i know BA can't do that. SO what if Superman escaped a blackhole (and he was putting some effort)? and with the transmutation well we don't know if it could work because the power cosmic could be more powerful that the source they were using for the transmutation. Adam may be as durable when it comes to impact forces (like superman's punches etc) but it doesn't mean he will survive a Blackhole or supernova or the force of a neutron star unfrazed. As for the hyperspace thing he has being shown to move FTL while in normal space and he was dodging planets and asteroids etc. Yes surfer needs to put people on his board and fly FTL to the future so yea my bad, BA can time travel using Isis's powers." @spidey 15: Did you notice my question marks. If you understand the thought I am sending its not a bad image. I dont use that scan to say Surfer is weak by any means because I know that Panther has no chance even his attempt to do so was badly written. They only thing that can excuse them in that image is Panther had the power cosmic at the time to summon the strength to hold Surfer in place. But sense Surfer could easily go intangible and not even have to worry about breathing ect...i dont see how that should happen to the Surfer. The point i was making was to Difficlus because he didnt decribe Surfer the right way so I was merely sharing. He was comparing Surfers feats of durability...ect ect to Superboy Prime which is a bad example and Surfer is not on such a level. The big difference between Surfer and SBP...is SBP can easily punch out of realities. Thats alot of power....not to mention all the characters he ran threw in the DC universe. Superman was able to take down this big close to Silver age powerhouse. So its alittle hard to accept Surfer losing to the likes of Thor yet he can stomp people like Superman???? Yeah that doesnt sit to well. "
In the end i say at least a stalemate. I just can't see someone with so many powers (time travel, soul/emotional manipulation, telepathy, superhuman senses, seeing through time, telekinesis, energy/matter manipulation, invulnerable, incalculable strength and speed, cosmic awareness and so many more) at his disposal losing. Especially if that person is supposed to be fighting at the best of their ability. I mean BA is a badass no doubt but it just doesn't make sense to me. Surfer is horribly inconsistent but fighting to the best of his abilities im sure he can win. SS 7/10 assuming both are at their peak.
" I'll still stick with Black Adam on this........7/10 Surfer puts up a damn good fight. BA has that just pure ruthlessness badass in him and I believe he can get the win but not without taking some damage first. "I doubt that BA can make more physical damage than black hole.
really i explain about SS being able to use hes power cosmic to bus hes strength to INCALCULABLE LEVELS an about being knockout if they rite a comic with SS using hes full power who in earth will stop him they call that balance unlike BA he gets hes power FROM THE DAM GODS an some how hes able to bet THOR A REAL GOD COME ON thats bad writing an still my question was not answer how can u hurt something the can withstand blast the can destroy a planet an how BA can survive
?
1.Titles means nothing. Gennis-vell has no title and he re-create a universe (BA probably will defeat Thor, I am unsure)." really i explain about SS being able to use hes power cosmic to bus hes strength to INCALCULABLE LEVELS an about being knockout if they rite a comic with SS using hes full power who in earth will stop him they call that balance unlike BA he gets hes power FROM THE DAM GODS an some how hes able to bet THOR A REAL GOD COME ON thats bad writing an still my question was not answer how can u hurt something the can withstand blast the can destroy a planet an how BA can survive
2.Not only can, Surfer already proved that he can defeat BRB wih his bare hands.
@supermandefender said:
" @Thepowercosmic: You obviously are extremely mistaken by your writing or you just have no idea about BA whats so ever. "
I am waiting for BA's feats.
@supermandefender:
1.About Surfer scans:
-Nova is no push over (black adam is?). He will be able to give BA a fight by himself. And Surfer curbstomped him in that battle without even trying. Remember - they aren't enemies.
-Thing with BP was PIS (no just bad story telling....he gained the same powers as Surfer in that scan so it explains him able to hold the Surfer but Surfer should have been able to escape a headlock without trying) He can phase out.
-Who is that guy who killed him? This doesn't prove anything.
-Requiem is non canon. ( I dont see where your problem with the story is but ok true its not part of main story line)
2.About BA & Supe scans:
-Thing with Spectre is PIS or jobbing, nothing more. It doesn't prove anything. Spectre should be able to wave his hand and destroy BA. ( not PIS...Spectre wasnt after Adam he was after Shazam...and his attacks never really bothered the Spectre)
-This scans with Supe doesn't prove anything either. BA isn't Supe. Superman's feats aren't go to BA automathicly. They don't even have similar orgins. BA isn't Supergirl (if You know what I mean) either. Here you have a good point and I agree with you. But Superman himself has said he doesnt have to worry about holding back his attacks so much.
3.BA & Supe feats (again)
Show me Black Adam or Cap M. surviving in black hole. If You show me CM survivng this I will accept it, beacuse they have similar orgins and (source of ) powers. They havent from what I am aware of but neither has Superboy Prime. I know you cant be suggesting Superman or Supergirl are the only 1 in Dc that are capable of this? And that logic doesnt make Sense because Superman has be outmatched and sped by BA before. Thor has no speed of light feats besides Classic Thor throwing his hammer fast but im sure he could escape a blackhole also.
4.Reaction speed.
Surfer already showed nanosecond speed reaction he don't need his travel speed. He also searched all Earth in second. But when BA showed that speed? Keeping up with FTL guys isn't a prove on anything. Will if you cant use prove of him moving with FLT characters then I dunno what to show you. Surfer Ive only seen once move at nanosecond reaction. Superman has done this plenty of times. BA has been able to keep up with Supermans combat speed. I dont see Ba not being able to hit Surfer if he can hit Superman.
5.Any showings in which Surfer was hurt by Thing level guys is pure PIS since he fought in black hole (what can't be PIS because it is objective feat).
(yes I agree...its just Surfer has way to many inconsistent moments like this....he even outshines Superman with inconsistent moments and thats alot.) This is why Wizard change Surfer from number 1 to number 3.) They have Thor number 1 and Superman number 2. I kind of think thats crap......and think Thor should be number #3 and Surfer number #1 after his upgrade. 6.Surfer can attack anyone withTP since Power Cosmic coming from astral plane and he already defeated powerfull being (some demon) by this. For all purposes leave out the astral plane it gets way to confusing and its not 1 of Surfers power sets. IN Thy name was just confusing when they were talking about the astral plane. It makes it seem like Surfers astral force can attack weak minded beings. Like he killed a creature that was full of rage but then stalemates with a creature that is intelligent. But beats him physically so I find that retarded. Plus Ba can enter the Astral plane also.
7.I am not sure about time travel, but I agree aobut traping in board and thing with Crunch. You agree with me here or someone else?
8.Show me BA resisting molecule manipulation. Not fighing againt people who can use it, but clear mm-resist.
If I find some ill be sure to show you. But Im sure he does because Darkseid's powers have transmutation ability and they fail on Superman level characters and new gods. BA is on the level or higher than new gods. Surfer's ability of transmutation are not going to be higher than Darkseids so by default Id say Adam could resist them. Plus Black Adam has transmutation ability also....only beings like Spectre I have seen capable of affecting BA.
Like I mentioned before I personally give this fight to Surfer. But it all depends because Black Adam has Divine Powers these are powers he can access at times like telekinesis, phasing, invisibility, time travel, possession! ( i have a hard time seeing him do this but he can take control of others bodys) Ba also has been known to match power with divine creatures and overpowering them. But he doesnt seem to me he can access this at any point. But if he does he can beat Surfer. Just like how he can beat Superman when he does this.
Indeed, though he rarely shows it. Im sure once he sees surfer isnt being phased by his physical attack he'll turn to mystical energy. then hold out while he gets extra wisdom for the battle to learn how to defeat SS. But Cosmic awareness can do this much quicker. thats why SS gets 7/10. Not sure if he can possess he's body, Surfer has insane resistance to that type of stuff. I wouldnt count it in." @Thepowercosmic: BA can access Divine powers. This can let him take control of the Surfers body. Plus he has been able do alot more. Ba has more powers then just Superman level powers but thats what he is known for. "
EDIT: wait does BA have access to Isis's powers? if not then im in bigger favour to SS for a win because it takes away all he's divine powers.
i dont see BA taking control over SS body maybe for like 1 sec no more an im not saying BA is weak but SS power is too much for BA he said to nova to destroy the sun like it was nothing he destroy a planet will fighting morg an survive a blast from galactus this are thing the put SS way out of BA capable of doing." @Thepowercosmic: BA can access Divine powers. This can let him take control of the Surfers body. Plus he has been able do alot more. Ba has more powers then just Superman level powers but thats what he is known for. "
Only characters like Spectre take down Ba in when he is using divine powers.
Surfer is powerful but he is not on the same levels as Prime or characters like that. His strength even fails to Superman. But Surfer can access more power so its unknown if Surfer will be able to access enough power ot take him out normally with brute force. If BA accesses his Divine force its not a problem. But you cant consider a what if situation so Im leaving out BA using his Divine force.
I give it to Surfer but like 6 out of 10 in a fair fight. I think Surfer will zip around him avoiding attacks here and there and blasting him with cosmic bolts until he accesses even power to take him down. In a fair straight up brute force battle tho Surfer will lose.
Not to mention Surfer is pretty naive he let Thanos trick him into killing half a species by accident. Surfer had no clue what Thanos was up to....now BA is not as smart as Thanos but he is pretty smart.
Surfer will not personally know much about BA besides he is able to pick up on the magical energies around him and in him. Magic has also been very harmful to Surfer....it almost seems he has a similar weakness to it like Superman. No idea if this will play as a downfall for him but I dont think it will because Surfer fights around with the IMP as well as Superman messes with Mxy. I think they both have some defense for it but Magic def. seems to be there downfall.
Plus Surfer got a upgrade so we have no idea how he will fair against Thor in another fight until we see it. If Surfers defenses went up dramatically or not. The only character that comes close to comparing this is Surfer beating BRB and thats not Thor. But it does show can beat BRB tho.
1.BP needed to defeat Surfre than. Headlock? Really? To someone who doesn't need air? IT is the worst PIS I've ever saw. THis, Rulk and Firelord losing to Spider-Man.
2.
a)So I don't see why You putted it.
b)Ok, but how often Thor says "It is immposible! No one did in the past!" about catching Mjolnir? For example Count Nefaria did it, before issue with Bor (I am not talking about throwing). Also, writers don't always know what they are doing. Thor was saying such a things about many people and he is almost always holding back. Surfer said in the past that he nvere saw being as powerfull as... Ronan (lol) what will mean that Ronan>Galactus... Cap Marvel has similar orgin. His feats will be fine for me.
3.
a)Thing with black hole isn't only speed feat. I more care about durability here. And with Thor... I am not sure. He once had gravity of Neutron Star on him IIRC, but I am not sure what with bh.
b)I forgot to say it here (I've mentioned this on other thread) that it doesn't go to people who are clearly on other level. Tyrant for example curbstomped Thanos, Glaidator, Morg, Surfer, etc. None of them give him a real fight (Thanos showed good durability there, but he was able to hurt him only with his orb and we know that Thanos can survive shots from Odin, so it doesn't prvoe anything). In other hand, BA was really tested by some people in that fights. He is a very powerfull being, but to defeat Supe/Surfer he need better outside feat I think. Like Blue Marvel or Sentry for example. This was a clear battle, not only strength contest. Such a contest can be a prove (Herc and Thor did that in the past).
4.This is ABC logic and You have read too many comics (I am sure about that) to belive that. For example: Surfer and Gladiator have nanosecond reaction, but they've lost some battles in the past that they shouldn't. Like against Cannonball or Black Panther. Quicksilver was blocked by far slower people. As were Makkari, Thor or Sentry. It doesn't automaticlly prove that their opponents are as fast as them. Of course other issue is with energy/matter/reality manipulators with great durability like Thanos, Void or Proteus, who just don't need such a speed because it is easier to control very powerfull and fast being by xxx manipulation, than attack it by brute strength (like what Thanos did to Fallen One). But BA don't also have feats that proves that he is better energy/matter manipulator than Surfer to say that he don't need his speed here.
5.He also fights more inteligent now, but according to rules of battles he have to use his best abilities here, so he have to use speed, black holes, TP, etc.
6.He shouldn't if he want to win it. ;) I belive that Surfer can win it by TP, but not only by this.
7.With You. I've only seen each of this things one time. And a) he don't have Crunch energies in this battle & b)That Gennis-Vell was much weaker than Black Adam so it shouldn't be an issue here.
8.You should already know that I will say that Superman =/ BA =/ other people's powers ;) Also I have a scan in which Superman was affected by molecular disruptor (very low level), but I've never seen him reflecting mm.
9.When did BA possesed someone as powerfull as Surfer (with all things about astral plane)?
10.Surfer's cosmic awareness told him about Gladiator's weakness. Thanos was talking with him about philosophy, this was really good trick You know, because he didn't have to lie about his ideas. Thor is just very pwoerfull, so I doubt that Surfer showed somekind of weakness. Mjolnir is just powerfull enough to resist Surfer.
11.BRB and Thor are like Cap M and Black Adam. Thor just have better fighting skills for me.
Travels half a million light years in seconds
Crosses universe
Dodges Galactus blast
Nanosecond reaction times
Surfer is able to mentally calculate the trajectory of a being in mid teleportation(not just moving fast, actually teleporting) and attack it upon its arrival)
travels to every capital on earth.
Can travel to any dimension he’s been to.
He is way too fast and if bloodlusted he will just speedblitz.
" @czarny_samael said:Did You read whole post?Cap Marvel & Black Adam are slightly on Supes lvl strenght. And Supes is far above BRB & Thor. BA takes this in a good fight. "" BRB and Thor are like Cap M and Black Adam. "
1.BRB and Thor have the same powers. Both have similar orgins, they are like copy to each other, that is why once feats can go to the other.
The same thing is with BA and CM, but not to BA and Supe.
2.This isn't Supe vs. Thor, but Surfer vs. BA. BA don't have a feats that Supe has. And Surfer has more power than Thor. Until I will see CM/BA surviving in black hole, Surfer is winning this by creating black hole.
" @Funcake said:" @czarny_samael said:Did You read whole post? 1.BRB and Thor have the same powers. Both have similar orgins, they are like copy to each other, that is why once feats can go to the other. The same thing is with BA and CM, but not to BA and Supe. 2.This isn't Supe vs. Thor, but Surfer vs. BA. BA don't have a feats that Supe has. And Surfer has more power than Thor. Until I will see CM/BA surviving in black hole, Surfer is winning this by creating black hole. "Cap Marvel & Black Adam are slightly on Supes lvl strenght. And Supes is far above BRB & Thor. BA takes this in a good fight. "" BRB and Thor are like Cap M and Black Adam. "
I thought Adams was more like Beta Ray Bill and Thor was like WW.
I never seen BA or CM in a black hole. But BA must be durable the same as Supes if he can go h2h with him." @Funcake said:
Did You read whole post? 1.BRB and Thor have the same powers. Both have similar orgins, they are like copy to each other, that is why once feats can go to the other. The same thing is with BA and CM, but not to BA and Supe. 2.This isn't Supe vs. Thor, but Surfer vs. BA. BA don't have a feats that Supe has. And Surfer has more power than Thor. Until I will see CM/BA surviving in black hole, Surfer is winning this by creating black hole. "
No, he don't have to." @czarny_samael said:
I never seen BA or CM in a black hole. But BA must be durable the same as Supes if he can go h2h with him." @Funcake said:
Did You read whole post? 1.BRB and Thor have the same powers. Both have similar orgins, they are like copy to each other, that is why once feats can go to the other. The same thing is with BA and CM, but not to BA and Supe. 2.This isn't Supe vs. Thor, but Surfer vs. BA. BA don't have a feats that Supe has. And Surfer has more power than Thor. Until I will see CM/BA surviving in black hole, Surfer is winning this by creating black hole. "
"
Nor Hulk, nor Wonder Man are as durable as Thor, Namor isn't as durable as Hulk, Spider-Man isn't as durable as Venom, etc.
Real "proves" writer narration, sometimes heroes thinking (but not often and rather about speed than anything else) and objective feats (like destorying something big, going into something that can destroy other very big objects, etc.)
For example:
You could see a scan in which Surfer is thinking how fast he must move.
Other feat is Superman flying in black hole, or narration that is saying that Gladiator and Hyperion unleashed enough power to destroy a planet.
Some poeple can "share" objects because they are perfectly equal to some people or they have similar powers and orgins (like Supergirl with Superman, BA with CM or Thor with BRB)..
" @Funcake said:Venom is above Spiderman. I remeber that he was always gets outmuscled by Venom. BA can easily keep up with Supes. Thats a little different.
No, he don't have to. Nor Hulk, nor Wonder Man are as durable as Thor, Namor isn't as durable as Hulk, Spider-Man isn't as durable as Venom, etc. Real "proves" writer narration, sometimes heroes thinking (but not often and rather about speed than anything else) and objective feats (like destorying something big, going into something that can destroy other very big objects, etc.) For example: You could see a scan in which Surfer is thinking how fast he must move. Other feat is Superman flying in black hole, or narration that is saying that Gladiator and Hyperion unleashed enough power to destroy a planet. Some poeple can "share" objects because they are perfectly equal to some people or they have similar powers and orgins (like Supergirl with Superman, BA with CM or Thor with BRB).. "
" @czarny_samael said:1.Spidey wa able to goe toe to toe with him." @Funcake said:Venom is above Spiderman. I remeber that he was always gets outmuscled by Venom. BA can easily keep up with Supes. Thats a little different. "
No, he don't have to. Nor Hulk, nor Wonder Man are as durable as Thor, Namor isn't as durable as Hulk, Spider-Man isn't as durable as Venom, etc. Real "proves" writer narration, sometimes heroes thinking (but not often and rather about speed than anything else) and objective feats (like destorying something big, going into something that can destroy other very big objects, etc.) For example: You could see a scan in which Surfer is thinking how fast he must move. Other feat is Superman flying in black hole, or narration that is saying that Gladiator and Hyperion unleashed enough power to destroy a planet. Some poeple can "share" objects because they are perfectly equal to some people or they have similar powers and orgins (like Supergirl with Superman, BA with CM or Thor with BRB).. "
2.This is only one example and You didn't deny others. There are hundreds of examples like that.
the point is we need feats here, not because he can go toe to toe with superman means he is as durable. there different types of durability. those from impact forces, transmutation, temperature extremes, gravitional forces etc. so dont go on saying that. we use feats here. Its called the manhattan effect. here's an extract from a thread here. :
"What if Wyldsong has telepathy or can read minds? Just because he hasn't done it before doesn't mean he can't do it. He may not have the feats to back it up, "but" what "if" he really can? It's possible, I mean, he did state what so and so was going to say before they said it."
And we see where this train of thought starts run it's course to, and eventually I end up beating Galactus in some battle thread in the future...
You see, good arguments aren't won with "if". You need facts to back up your case, and of course the feats or the characters showings in the comics are what we have to go on, in other words, those are our facts. This is what justifies losses and wins in these theoretical debates, because if not, then the "ifs" go on forever:
"Well just because you haven't seen Mr. Y do so and so, doesn't mean he can't."
"Well just because Mr. Y might be able to do so and so, then Mr. Z might be able to do so and so, disabling Mr. Ys so and so."
"But just because you haven't seen Mr. Y do so and so, and Mr. Z might be able to do so and so, doesn't mean Mr. Y couldn't do so and so, beating Mr. Z."
See just because Black Adam may be able to or if he can doesnt mean he will.
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