Ben vs Gwen

@venomoushatred1001: lol i really cant believe u think this i mean what feats does ben really have besides smashing and breaking things and pummeling people , gwen has been shown capable of travelling trough and stop time she has been demonstrated as being able to with ease defeat four of bens most powerful alien forms {ultimate humungasour big chill echo echo and swampfire} in her anodite form. also she has been able to fight ultimate kevin and ben without morals and stalemate kevin{ runing away because she was trying to cure not hurt him and losing to ben because she didnt want to hurt him either as stated} and ben ad to pull out all the stops in order to beat kevin using a form that was easily beaten by gwen afterwards and the thing is she was able to do alll these things in human form with her morals on in her anodite form without morals she would utterly destroy ben , he has no alien capable of dealing with her besides X and so instead of just saying ben wins specify why and how in the name of heaven he can win against her as she has superior feats power and abilities than he does

@morgrim: they already fought and Gwen losed.

Since it's 1 AM and I'm tired Gwen. I'll give m reasoning later if needed.

@venomoushatred1001: have u not read the rest of thread

I agree with morgrim, Gwen wins. She has been shown to have a spell suited to all Ben aliens, maybe except of Way Big, even if he, in their battle has taken her by surprise. She has done a lot of things with her charms, she is basically a warper reality: she has manipulated time, energy and gravity, she has used a lot of times a large number of elemental powers and she has used matter manipulation, and she can create rock creatures and animate matter, she has used telekinesis and other mental powers, she can manipulate plants and animals and she is also a teleporter. And when she is in her Anodite form she is too powerful to be beaten by Ben.

i kinda realised how you took out bens most powerfull alien (not that it matters). Also i dont really see how gwen would win. She isnt close to as powerful as grandmother ( know most of you people are using her and not gwen) gwen isnt a full powered anodite, she doesnt have full anodite powers. And as for the many feats that she performs its not like shes able to do them all with little to no effort, it takes her preperation and a lot effort.

@RajayJB: im sorry if this offends u but what u just said was in one word crazy we all know that she does not have powers anywhere near her grandmothers level but her powers are more than enough to handle ben and also most of her incredible feats r done in human form whee her powers are greatly limited however in her anodite form what might have been difficult for her before now becomes significantly easier she has even been shown to be able to defeat four of bens most powerfull aliens in their ultimate forms with significant ease so yes gwen for the win

@morgrim: first of all that wasnt even her own mind set she was being controlled if i remember and the fact is people are compairing her to her grandmother.

you talk as if she has become this all powerfull anodite with all the powers that come with it. and considering that ultimate echo echo was able to easily take down ultimate kevin (who had the powers of every alien ben and aggregor had and she couldnt beat aggregor im pretty sure he can beat her

@RajayJB: but it was sown in an episode of ben 10 ultimate alien where she took on ultimate echo echo as well as ultimate humungasour big chill and another alien and beat all of them in her anodite astral projection form with apparent ease also she didnt beat kevin because she didnt want to she wanted to save him and even with out having to remove her morals she was able to stalemate him while in order to beat him ben had to go all out and try to kill him using a form gwen would later on easily defeat so yes gwen for the win

Bumpity Bump Bump Bump

In theory Ben should win for the same reasons Superman beats magic users. A bloodlusted Ben with Master control should be able to take her down before she goes full anodite.

@soduh2: actually her transformation is faster than his

Gwen

Gwen most powerful form is more powerful than his aliens (besides alienx) and much more versatile. she wins

@morgrim said:

@soduh2: actually her transformation is faster than his

Sometimes Ben's transformations are instantaneous and sometimes there's a sequence.

True

Gwen can revert Ben back human(she's used a spell to do that) so she can beat him. When Ben fought her she lost only coz he has used a trick to harm her. Gwen WINS.

Bloodlusted Ben speedblitzes Gwen before she realizes what happened.

what are the abilities of Anodite form again? Its been so long since Iv'e seen it.

@Owie said:

Just started watching this show last week. I think Gwen has a chance, but Ben has so much adaptability. If she stuck him in a shield, does he have anything that could get out of it?

I'm assuming you are watching Omniverse?

I was thinking ben but she has a quicker transformation mode. If ben isnt in his alien mode she wins she can easily stop him from changing. Gwen wins wit out Alien X

Is there a good reason Ben can't become an Anodite or did they just restrict to avoid making Gwen obsolete.

@Owie said:

Just started watching this show last week. I think Gwen has a chance, but Ben has so much adaptability. If she stuck him in a shield, does he have anything that could get out of it?

I'm assuming you are watching Omniverse?

Bennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

It takes approximately 75 years before an Anodite can master all of their powers. This may play a big role in this fight as Gwen has never been seen using her higher end matter manipulation powers.

Bump

This is kinda rediculas Ben stops time and incinerates her is he has to. If he's smart he'll rewind time and knock her out.

Gwen wins, He admits himself that the only reason he was able to beat her when they fought was because she isn't willing to hurt him, as we saw he had absolutely nothing in his arsenal that even tickled Anodites that were willing to hurt him (his Grandmother and other cousin). His only chance is Alien X, but he still needs to get the others to agree, and that can take some time, and IIRC Alien Xs power can be absorbed, Anodites can absorb energy to increase there own, and Charmcaster had a spell for power absorption which means so does Gwen.

@LordOfAllHumans said:

Gwen wins, He admits himself that the only reason he was able to beat her when they fought was because she isn't willing to hurt him, as we saw he had absolutely nothing in his arsenal that even tickled Anodites that were willing to hurt him (his Grandmother and other cousin). His only chance is Alien X, but he still needs to get the others to agree, and that can take some time, and IIRC Alien Xs power can be absorbed, Anodites can absorb energy to increase there own, and Charmcaster had a spell for power absorption which means so does Gwen.

Gwen's powerful but bloodlusted time traveling Ben wins. On the bright side though I won Dec 21 wasn't the end of the world

@AllStarSuperman said:

@LordOfAllHumans said:

Gwen wins, He admits himself that the only reason he was able to beat her when they fought was because she isn't willing to hurt him, as we saw he had absolutely nothing in his arsenal that even tickled Anodites that were willing to hurt him (his Grandmother and other cousin). His only chance is Alien X, but he still needs to get the others to agree, and that can take some time, and IIRC Alien Xs power can be absorbed, Anodites can absorb energy to increase there own, and Charmcaster had a spell for power absorption which means so does Gwen.

Gwen's powerful but bloodlusted time traveling Ben wins. On the bright side though I won Dec 21 wasn't the end of the world

She's bloodlusted too and can kill him faster than he can transform.. She has the benefit of natural powers that only rely on her to think while he must use the Omnitrix to initiate a transformation. She can just drain him of all mana before he makes a move thus weakening him or even killing him, or the easiest way is to sever his arm before he makes a move rendering him powerless and then using any method she wants to kill this now very normal boy.

@LordOfAllHumans said:

@AllStarSuperman said:

@LordOfAllHumans said:

Gwen wins, He admits himself that the only reason he was able to beat her when they fought was because she isn't willing to hurt him, as we saw he had absolutely nothing in his arsenal that even tickled Anodites that were willing to hurt him (his Grandmother and other cousin). His only chance is Alien X, but he still needs to get the others to agree, and that can take some time, and IIRC Alien Xs power can be absorbed, Anodites can absorb energy to increase there own, and Charmcaster had a spell for power absorption which means so does Gwen.

Gwen's powerful but bloodlusted time traveling Ben wins. On the bright side though I won Dec 21 wasn't the end of the world

She's bloodlusted too and can kill him faster than he can transform.. She has the benefit of natural powers that only rely on her to think while he must use the Omnitrix to initiate a transformation. She can just drain him of all mana before he makes a move thus weakening him or even killing him, or the easiest way is to sever his arm before he makes a move rendering him powerless and then using any method she wants to kill this now very normal boy.

He has master control he's just as fast he goes clockwork and insierates her

Gwen can't harm NRG or Ultimate Big Chill.

If Gwen is being serious and goes for the kill, she would win without too many problems.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

If Gwen is being serious and goes for the kill, she would win without too many problems.

Not against a blood lusted ben

@AllStarSuperman said:

@LordOfAllHumans said:

@AllStarSuperman said:

@LordOfAllHumans said:

Gwen wins, He admits himself that the only reason he was able to beat her when they fought was because she isn't willing to hurt him, as we saw he had absolutely nothing in his arsenal that even tickled Anodites that were willing to hurt him (his Grandmother and other cousin). His only chance is Alien X, but he still needs to get the others to agree, and that can take some time, and IIRC Alien Xs power can be absorbed, Anodites can absorb energy to increase there own, and Charmcaster had a spell for power absorption which means so does Gwen.

Gwen's powerful but bloodlusted time traveling Ben wins. On the bright side though I won Dec 21 wasn't the end of the world

She's bloodlusted too and can kill him faster than he can transform.. She has the benefit of natural powers that only rely on her to think while he must use the Omnitrix to initiate a transformation. She can just drain him of all mana before he makes a move thus weakening him or even killing him, or the easiest way is to sever his arm before he makes a move rendering him powerless and then using any method she wants to kill this now very normal boy.

He has master control he's just as fast he goes clockwork and insierates her

You don't seem to understand, he doesn't start this battle with an alien form, he is Ben, as it is Ben vs. Gwen. She can use her powers before he can activate his omnitrix, because her powers are part of her, which means he will be dead before he can even transform. Master control allow him to cycle through his changes instantly but he still has to activate the omnitrix to go from human to alien and in that instant she can cast a spell, drain his lifeforce, or sever his arm.

@LordOfAllHumans:How would she kill him?

only a few ways are possible before he transforms, Ben is not too far in reaction speed he's dogged lasers as a kid and teen.

@AllStarSuperman: Her anodite form outclasses all of his aliens except Alien X who is not allowed. She would just teleport any one of the into space or a different dimension for a bfr.

@Hondo_ said:

@LordOfAllHumans:How would she kill him?

only a few ways are possible before he transforms, Ben is not too far in reaction speed he's dogged lasers as a kid and teen.

He can't dodge spells, as shown when she was casting them on him even in alien forms, and he can't dodge her directly absorbing his mana, not to mention she can cause her mana constructs to simply materialize without using blasts, and it's pretty well known that even as kids that Gwen is smarter, has faster reflexes and is better skilled in fighting than he is, and as they got older he got better but so did she so the margin stayed the same.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: Her anodite form outclasses all of his aliens except Alien X who is not allowed. She would just teleport any one of the into space or a different dimension for a bfr.

It doesn't matter his thinking is just as fast ias hers

@LordOfAllHumans: Well she may be faster and such but I think I'd just like to mention the advantage he has over her

Experience (He's been going Hero a lot longer than Gwen has and has consistently fought opponents)

Luck (Sorry I couldn't help myself but Ben is extremely Lucky on some occasions, it is also said that when Ben is in danger the omnitrix will transform him into an alien automatically [this happened a couple of times in the original series]

Street Smart (While Gwen may be smarter in some areas Ben takes the cake in combat, he's consistently shown his unorthodox combat methods to surprise Gwen and even work)

@AllStarSuperman: He can't counter being teleported. All she has to do is be close to him which he will probably accomplish for her. Plus she has telekinesis so make him do what she wants. So hold him in the air really still and poof, mana world.

@AllStarSuperman said:

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: Her anodite form outclasses all of his aliens except Alien X who is not allowed. She would just teleport any one of the into space or a different dimension for a bfr.

It doesn't matter his thinking is just as fast ias hers

Actually it's not, as it's been known and shown since Ben 10 that she is several times smarter than him, and she mastered the Omnitrix as a child when she had it, and was better at using it than he was. So her brain operates a lot faster than his.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: He can't counter being teleported. All she has to do is be close to him which he will probably accomplish for her. Plus she has telekinesis so make him do what she wants. So hold him in the air really still and poof, mana world.

@LordOfAllHumans said:

@AllStarSuperman said:

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: Her anodite form outclasses all of his aliens except Alien X who is not allowed. She would just teleport any one of the into space or a different dimension for a bfr.

It doesn't matter his thinking is just as fast ias hers

Actually it's not, as it's been known and shown since Ben 10 that she is several times smarter than him, and she mastered the Omnitrix as a child when she had it, and was better at using it than he was. So her brain operates a lot faster than his.

To both of you he still has time travel and jetray totallyflys in space and no Gwen did not have all million aliens she's smarter yes does she think faster no

@LordOfAllHumans: Oh yeah. Your right.

@AllStarSuperman: So wat they said also

@Hondo_: Sorry, but PIS is not really a usable factor.

@UltimateHero0406:It's not PIS, the Omnitrix is an A.I that cares about its handler that's why on some occasions he gets the wrong aliens but it's actually the Omnitrix choosing the aliens for ben (Happens in alien force and the original series)

@Hondo_ said:

@UltimateHero0406:It's not PIS, the Omnitrix is an A.I that cares about its handler that's why on some occasions he gets the wrong aliens but it's actually the Omnitrix choosing the aliens for ben (Happens in alien force and the original series)

Yes it actually knows what's best

@Hondo_ said:

@LordOfAllHumans: Well she may be faster and such but I think I'd just like to mention the advantage he has over her

Experience (He's been going Hero a lot longer than Gwen has and has consistently fought opponents)

Luck (Sorry I couldn't help myself but Ben is extremely Lucky on some occasions, it is also said that when Ben is in danger the omnitrix will transform him into an alien automatically [this happened a couple of times in the original series]

Street Smart (While Gwen may be smarter in some areas Ben takes the cake in combat, he's consistently shown his unorthodox combat methods to surprise Gwen and even work)

She has been fighting just as long as he has, and when they were children proved that she can use the omnitrix better than he can just like she can do magic better than Charmaster, because where they need experience she has natural talent in just about anything she wants to master.

Luck? Not really luck, it's his show, that's called PIS, and even if we accept it as luck, she has magic which is better than luck because it's the conscious control over the forces that govern luck and such.

Street Smart? That is something attributed to Kevin. He is from the same suburb as she is, there is nothing street about him, he is more reckless than she is and prone to not following any path of logic what you are calling street smarts falls more in line with his "luck"

I still don't see how these minor personality traits will help against a blood lusted energy manipulating, witch that can potentially warp reality with a thought. He still has to activate his omnitrix at the start of the battle, she has several ways to take him down before he can do that, like teleport him into the Sun.

@LordOfAllHumans said:

@Hondo_ said:

@LordOfAllHumans: Well she may be faster and such but I think I'd just like to mention the advantage he has over her

Experience (He's been going Hero a lot longer than Gwen has and has consistently fought opponents)

Luck (Sorry I couldn't help myself but Ben is extremely Lucky on some occasions, it is also said that when Ben is in danger the omnitrix will transform him into an alien automatically [this happened a couple of times in the original series]

Street Smart (While Gwen may be smarter in some areas Ben takes the cake in combat, he's consistently shown his unorthodox combat methods to surprise Gwen and even work)

She has been fighting just as long as he has, and when they were children proved that she can use the omnitrix better than he can just like she can do magic better than Charmaster, because where they need experience she has natural talent in just about anything she wants to master.

Luck? Not really luck, it's his show, that's called PIS, and even if we accept it as luck, she has magic which is better than luck because it's the conscious control over the forces that govern luck and such.

Street Smart? That is something attributed to Kevin. He is from the same suburb as she is, there is nothing street about him, he is more reckless than she is and prone to not following any path of logic what you are calling street smarts falls more in line with his "luck"

I still don't see how these minor personality traits will help against a blood lusted energy manipulating, witch that can potentially warp reality with a thought. He still has to activate his omnitrix at the start of the battle, she has several ways to take him down before he can do that, like teleport him into the Sun.

As I said she can't teleport him fast enough and say she can if she through him into the sun the Omnitrix would turn him to heat blast

@LordOfAllHumans:The Sun is tooooo far, she's shown difficulty transporting people large distances even in her current incarnation that may be too much.

@AllStarSuperman said:

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: He can't counter being teleported. All she has to do is be close to him which he will probably accomplish for her. Plus she has telekinesis so make him do what she wants. So hold him in the air really still and poof, mana world.

@LordOfAllHumans said:

@AllStarSuperman said:

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@AllStarSuperman: Her anodite form outclasses all of his aliens except Alien X who is not allowed. She would just teleport any one of the into space or a different dimension for a bfr.

It doesn't matter his thinking is just as fast ias hers

Actually it's not, as it's been known and shown since Ben 10 that she is several times smarter than him, and she mastered the Omnitrix as a child when she had it, and was better at using it than he was. So her brain operates a lot faster than his.

To both of you he still has time travel and jetray totallyflys in space and no Gwen did not have all million aliens she's smarter yes does she think faster no

To you, he has to activate his omnitrix to do any of this, she can take him out before he can do that. Part of being smart means you can take in and organize information faster than people you are smarter than, so yeah it means just that, as she was basically a prodigy and he is average at best, actually he's kind of dumb and fails a lot, he can think quick on his feet but she is just as battle prone so her already higher than average intelligence should still make her faster at that too, since she is also physically faster than he is because she is a very capable gymnast in the first show and black belt by the second one, which means she never stopped training and remained his superior in everything from brains to braun.