Batman vs Fantastic 4

" @spidey 15 said:

" @Doc X said:

" @rbysjti said:

" @Shadey said:

" @Sherlock said:

" @Shadey: Nope Bats beats all them "

Ummm no he's not beating any of them in prep esp. Panther and Doom just no. "

Batman would really lose here. Mr fantastic is also a genius.  I wonder why those Batman fanboys don't debate on Batman vs Storm thread. "

Reed is a genius but Batman isnt too far behind,However when it comes too tactics Batman is second to none,and Reed doesn`t even come close,So when it comes to battle field wits that goes to Batman,hands down "

But Reed is not alone.... he has his teammates and i will say it again... Sue is the key...=] "

I beleive Batman would use his stealth skills to take out Sue first,considering she posses the biggest threat,IMO "

8 hours of prep time is too much for Reed Richards. Honestly, the way his super genius brain works and how quickly it can work is like giving an average genius inventor a few months of prep.

With her invisibility she can...

• ... render herself invisible
• ... render others and other objects invisible
• ... make walls, the floor, or the celling, invisible so she can see through them
• ... sense other things that are invisible and make them visible 

FF4

any member of the ff4 by them self would beat batman

" FF4 "

The FF. Seriously, Reed would be able to learn all of Bats tricks and gadgets and make ones to answer the problem. 

" @Doc X said:

" @spidey 15 said:

" @Doc X said:

" @rbysjti said:

" @Shadey said:

" @Sherlock said:

" @Shadey: Nope Bats beats all them "

Ummm no he's not beating any of them in prep esp. Panther and Doom just no. "

Batman would really lose here. Mr fantastic is also a genius.  I wonder why those Batman fanboys don't debate on Batman vs Storm thread. "

Reed is a genius but Batman isnt too far behind,However when it comes too tactics Batman is second to none,and Reed doesn`t even come close,So when it comes to battle field wits that goes to Batman,hands down "

But Reed is not alone.... he has his teammates and i will say it again... Sue is the key...=] "

I beleive Batman would use his stealth skills to take out Sue first,considering she posses the biggest threat,IMO "

I think this depends on the location...=] "

" @Doc X: you need to read up on sue, how stealth can batman be in the baxter building? The Security there is unlike anything Bruce has ever seen. 24hrs prep is not enough to study up on both the team and the building. If bats can cloak sue can detect him other than full cloaking how can he get to them undetected? Thing and Human Torch I will give you those two are pretty much cannon fodder for this battle. But Reed, who is impervious to the weaponry bats has, and Sue, who can manhandle bats by herself, bats can't handle.
 

With her invisibility she can...

• ... render herself invisible
• ... render others and other objects invisible
• ... make walls, the floor, or the celling, invisible so she can see through them
• ... sense other things that are invisible and make them visible 

"

" @Doc X: Yeah, I respect your opinion too. But i'm not saying Reed is a better tactician or that he'll be better prepared. I'm saying your math/logic is wrong. If the FF has 8 hours of prep time, assuming they use all that time to study Batman, as Batman is using all of his time to study the FF, then every member of the FF will have 8 hours of prep time, where as Batman having to divide 24 hours will only be able to devote 6 hours to each member. You say that each member of the FF will have 2 hours, that would only be correct if they needed to take turns studying Batman.  
The scenario is set up to give the FF a number of advantages.  
1. Theres four of them. On top of the fact that there ate four of them, its not like artificial one shot team ups. They've been a team for a long time, and do have extensive experience working together. 
2. They have super powers. He has fought people with superpowers before. But it's still a factor, especially when you consider the whole brain bubble thing. 
3. Prep Time.  Like I said, the FF in fact has more prep time dedicated to each opponent...and if you broke it down to People Prep Hours, they have 32.  
 
Batman is a brilliant tactician, and is extremely intelligent. Richard is more intelligent, but not as good of a tactician. I tend to think the FF will take it. But thats not to say Batman won't be pulling some sneaky shit. "

" any member of the ff4 by them self would beat batman "

FF

" @Doc X: Cool, I just want to know how you think he could beat them. Be specific, I ran through plenty of different scenarios in my head and I just don't see a way past Sue. I've got him beating Thing 9/10 times, Human Torch 7/10 times, Reed 6/10, but Sue I haven't seen a way he could reasonably beat her. "

" @WeaponX510 said:

" batman makes superman look like a bitch....he owns FF "

Batman has been powered by PIS everytime he has face Superman. "

Sue solos

" Sue solos "

" @Night Thrasher: They know his tactics to a point,even as smart as reed is,there`s no way they could know he`s Bruce Wayne,but he knows exactly who they are, and is it possible for Batman to make googles that show Sue`s body heat even if she is invisible "

" @Sherlock said:

" @Shadey: Nope Bats beats all them "

Ummm no he's not beating any of them in prep esp. Panther and Doom just no. "

" @Doc X: Sue is Invisible  to all forms of tracking.No body heat, no energy signal, no nothing. Completely invisible. Says so in her profile. "

" @Doc X said:

" @Night Thrasher: They know his tactics to a point,even as smart as reed is,there`s no way they could know he`s Bruce Wayne,but he knows exactly who they are, and is it possible for Batman to make googles that show Sue`s body heat even if she is invisible "

If some high school boy was able to figure it out, Reed would be able to as well. Also, why would Sue not have them shielded for the 8 hours of prep? That kind of thing is easy for Sue. Even if Batman can develop a device to see Sue while invisible, how would he know exactly where to find them to use it? Even then, they get a shield.  "

" @Doc X: Not saying they're not willing to engage, they just know his tactics and how he likes the element of surprise. That being said Sue, Reed, and Ben won't let their guards down. Johnny on the other hand can be caught slipping. And don't forget Sue has been trained in hand-to-hand combat by Iron Fist so she's no slouch in one on one scenarios. "
 
 
The Not willing to Engage part was for Erik
Hand to Hand...Lol

" @Doc X: You certainly aren't getting this. The FF have 8 hours as a team to study him. Either they can study together, or separately. Either way, each person on the team studies 8 hours as the team studies 8 hours. They're the same thing. Assuming Batman studies each member of the FF for an equal amount of time he'll studies each for 6 hours. So the reality is that Reed is studying Batman for 8 hours, while Batman is studying Reed for 6.  "

The win goes to the Fantastic Four.  I can see Batman taking out Thing and Torch but thats it.

" The win goes to the Fantastic Four.  I can see Batman taking out Thing and Torch but thats it. "

FF, the team is too much to Bat handle

Batman can pull this off if he's careful. 
 
The F4's identities are public knowledge, whereas Batman's is secret. Most people don't even know that he exists, i.e. he's "urban legend" status. This would make it way easier for Bats to study the F4, because everyone knows where to find them and who they are. The F4 has no idea who Batman is, or where his base is. That gives Batman a big advantage in the prep area. Already, there's a way for Batman to win (assuming both sides are going for the kill).   

Bats nukes the Baxter building with the nuclear device he has in the Batcave: 
    
 
Batman has also bought Kryptonian tech off of Supergirl that can rewrite genetic code instantly, so he could use this to disable the F4's powers: 
    
    
Bats has also made his own suit of powered armor that basically duplicates all of Superman's powers (this was when Supes lost his powers and asked Batman to stand in for him for a brief period of time): 
    
    
Batman also has his own boomtube gauntlet (and flying saucer), which he could use to teleport out of the battle if things get too risky: 
    
 
So, I'd say Bats has a very good chance at winning.

" @erik said:

" @Doc X said:

" @Night Thrasher: They know his tactics to a point,even as smart as reed is,there`s no way they could know he`s Bruce Wayne,but he knows exactly who they are, and is it possible for Batman to make googles that show Sue`s body heat even if she is invisible "

If some high school boy was able to figure it out, Reed would be able to as well. Also, why would Sue not have them shielded for the 8 hours of prep? That kind of thing is easy for Sue. Even if Batman can develop a device to see Sue while invisible, how would he know exactly where to find them to use it? Even then, they get a shield.  "

If thats your argument then there at a stale mate F4 aren`t willing to engage, Batman would wait in the Shadows to engage "

" Batman can pull this off if he's careful. 
 
The F4's identities are public knowledge, whereas Batman's is secret. Most people don't even know that he exists, i.e. he's "urban legend" status. This would make it way easier for Bats to study the F4, because everyone knows where to find them and who they are. The F4 has no idea who Batman is, or where his base is. That gives Batman a big advantage in the prep area. Already, there's a way for Batman to win (assuming both sides are going for the kill).   

Bats nukes the Baxter building with the nuclear device he has in the Batcave: 
    
 
Batman has also bought Kryptonian tech off of Supergirl that can rewrite genetic code instantly, so he could use this to disable the F4's powers: 
    
    
Bats has also made his own suit of powered armor that basically duplicates all of Superman's powers (this was when Supes lost his powers and asked Batman to stand in for him for a brief period of time): 
    
    
Batman also has his own boomtube gauntlet (and flying saucer), which he could use to teleport out of the battle if things get too risky: 
     So, I'd say Bats has a very good chance at winning. "

FF, Sue solos sorry Batman):

" @TheBatman586:  The fight takes place in Gotham and no one in the DC universe is aware of the FF identities. On the other hand, several people have been able to discern the identity of Batman with relative ease and Reed makes all those crafty little detectives look like children if all their brain power was combined. I do not think it is any exaggeration at all that Reed could figure out Batman with nothing but a notepad, a pen and 1 or 2 rumors of Batman. Reed also has extensive training with martial arts as well.  Ben and Sue are also expert fighters, though there is no way that Batman is getting within kicking range of Sue. If Batman gets to know everything about the FF then it is safe to assume that the FF gets that same benefit unless stated otherwise. Reed will have counter-measure upon counter-measure for Batman.  "

" @Doc X:  You do realize that his entire argument is based off of NOT reading your OP right? "

lol. so the bat factor against the reed factor? batman is bad a$$, but reed can accomplish much more with more prep.