#151 Edited by VMole (620 posts) - - Show Bio
@jayc1324 said:

@vmole: Deadshot doesn't do that all the time. And he only kills people when there is money put up for it. And half the time when he's fighting batman he's not actually targeting him for money which takes away his motivation. Plus, there have been times when he has actually tried to killed batman. Those scans do nothing to disprove the times batman has dodged his bullets or the fact that batman almost never gets shot and can dodge anyone's bullets. But nice try.

What the are you even babbling about now? Batman acknowledged that Deadshot pulls his shots all the time when fighting him, and Floyd never denies it. I'm not going to take your conjecture with absolutely no basis over something that has been well established between both characters, but if you're content with sticking your fingers in your ears and ignoring what's in front of you because it doesn't fit with what you've established in your head canon, that's fine too.

#152 Posted by dagmar_merrill (7924 posts) - - Show Bio
#153 Posted by Jayc1324 (11147 posts) - - Show Bio

@vmole: Sometimes deadshot gets pissed at batman for making him miss and actually tried to kill him though. And like I said that doesnt disprove the fact that batman can easily dodge bullets. Without cover. He has even charged someone shooting at him before. He simply covered his face with his arm and the bullets bounced off of him. Snake eyes guns are useless here.

#154 Edited by medulaoblaganda (899 posts) - - Show Bio

thor vs batman who would win lool. just kidding.

#155 Posted by VMole (620 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324: Deadshot gets mad at Batman ooh, that doesn't mean that he still won't kill Batman, it just means he's pissed and will probably give Batman a few non-lethal shots to make him suffer the pain. Batman gets extra mad at the Joker because Joker said something not nice about his costume, does that mean that Batman's going to kill Joker too? No, it just means that Joker is going to suffer a few more broken bones that will magically heal by the time he fights Batman the week after because Batman has a psychological block against killing the same way Floyd has against Batman, no matter how angry he is.

I'm really getting tired of repeating myself because you keep holding on to some fan fiction-tier notion that Deadshot will ever submit himself to killing Batman when it's been well-established that he won't, so I'm not going to even bother discussing the matter with you any further.

#156 Posted by medulaoblaganda (899 posts) - - Show Bio

@dagmar_merrill: ohh i see am sorry for that dude!. i need to wear glasses to see clearly lool

#157 Posted by GraniteSoldier (7470 posts) - - Show Bio

I was indisposed with work this week, having just gotten off a 72 hour shift just a few hours ago. So, unfortunately, I totally missed the ball on this one.

Personal opinion? Too close to call, but I would have tried to format a dark horse Snake Eyes winning argument. I read through some of the arguments posted this week just now, and it seems Bats was getting credit without remembrance that many wins are done with prep or against enemies with whom he has fairly extensive prior knowledge on, which he has none of here. Doesn't matter now since the debate is over, but I would really love to see this fight!

Good one @k4tzm4n, and don't worry about the hating. You'll never make everyone happy, such is the human condition.

#158 Edited by Jayc1324 (11147 posts) - - Show Bio

@vmole: then explain why deadshot as shot at Batman's face before. He has tried to kill batman before. His fear wasn't always there

#159 Posted by entropy_aegis (15103 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324 said:

@vmole: then explain why deadshot as shot at Batman's face before. He has tried to kill batman before. His fear wasn't always there

Dude its one the core aspects of Deadshot's characters,he will not kill Batman period.

#160 Edited by Wolverine08 (40768 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324 said:

@vmole: then explain why deadshot as shot at Batman's face before. He has tried to kill batman before. His fear wasn't always there

Dude its one the core aspects of Deadshot's characters,he will not kill Batman period.

But he don't shoot the Batman's face, so he must want to kill him!

#LOGIC

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#161 Edited by entropy_aegis (15103 posts) - - Show Bio

Wait now we're comparing SE to Gorgon? LMAO,

@wolverine08 said:

@cadencev2: Say that to Saren's face!

Its really not just Saren, it was most of the Batman argument. Am I to believe we cannot compare characters in a fight unless they come from the same Universe now? Thats a freaking lame Battle Forum to me :/

Snake Eyes may not beaten Clay Face, or whatever, but why does he have too? He has beaten Storm Shadow, if we count the IDW inter company crossovers then Decipticons, and more super human Joes. Why is he inferior to Batman who has losses to guys way lower than Clay Face? Batman has a hard time with guys like Madhatter, Riddler, ect. Doubt any of those cooky villains would last a day in the Joe verse.

Anyway, its sad. DC is "more establish" Universe, and for many people on the Vine that equals a auto win. Which is why we get nothing but the same lame crap Marvel vs DC matches all the time :/

But it's true,Batman has faced off against a whole variety of characters,there is literally nothing SE brings to the table that Batman has not seen. The Hatter and Riddler are not physical villains,how the heck are you using them in this particular context? for the record Hatter has taken down the Doom Patrol and the New Gods of Apokolips used his technology to spread the Anti-life equation. The Riddler has been mostly played up for laughs he wasn't a villain for a long time until recently in Zero Year in which he blacked out Gotham and is using Dr Death's toxins to kill the entire city,if these guys showed up in the Joe universe they'll slaughter entire cities.

Snake-Eyes was clearly the winner of this fight, but another solid wank for Batman.

If you say so,shame you couldn't prove it when it mattered.

@k4tzm4n said:

I must say, I'm really, really tired of seeing the QQ after the voting is said and done. There's a reason I leave the community voting segments open for so long, but apparently, no one seems to really get it. You want to know why? It's so you can spread the word, not just leave it for the regular crowd to debate longer. Spreading the word to friends and more is far more effective than making some petty post when the dust has settled. Why didn't people bring this to Snake Eyes fan pages and such? If you want to see someone win, work for it. Batman isn't undefeatable. Hell, he lost to X-23 last month, didn't he?

And as long as you can prove it'll be a good fight, what else really matters? Start having fun instead of getting mad about a freaking segment on the internet about fictional characters fighting. Seriously, this exists so we can have a good time with fellow fans, spread knowledge and even learn. Leave the kindergarten crap out of it, please.

@dark_cloud_ said:

Snake-Eyes was clearly the winner of this fight, but another solid wank for Batman.

Yeah, because thinking Batman could beat Snake Eyes in a good fight is totally far fetched, right?

Well some of us appreciate and enjoy the fights. One of the weak arguments the always comes afterward is all the whiners talking about how people vote for Batman no matter what because he is popular. If you look at the posts, it becomes pretty clear that there are just as many people that will vote against Batman simply because they hate the character. Snake Eyes vs Batman was a good fight. But in the end it went to Batman because he has the edge in experience, intelligence, and gear. I would be willing to wager that if you put Batman against someone he could beat soundly, you would still have 30% or more go to that character simply out of Bat hate. So while there are some BatGod worshipers, there are just as many BatHaters.

Pretty much,there are more irrational Batman haters here than Batgod worshippers.

Batman skates by on his reputation once again, nobody is surprised at this result I imagine. Batman the peak human who performs at an often superhuman level was matched against an honest peak human and spite stomped, nothing new to see here.

Batman is not written within the proper parameters often enough to take this battle seriously, either he is a peak human and needs to be written in that manner, or he sneaks away from superhumans on a regular basis and "tags speedsters" sadly he gets away with a bit of both.

Same goes for like 90% peak humans,it's fiction.

#162 Posted by Devil_Driver (112 posts) - - Show Bio

Same goes for like 90% peak humans,it's fiction.

Sorry but there is a difference, between slight exaggerations, say aim dodging for example and sneaking away from/tagging superhumans. Either he is written according to the abilities he should have, or if we are to accept his high showings vs superhumans in the argument against snake eyes or anyone else for that matter then the battle was spite all along, you cannot have it both ways especially when part of the argument against snake eyes, was in fact, that he did not have the vast array of super powered threats to test himself against, as they don't exist in his universe.

To be clear I have no hate for Batman, he is a well developed character with a long history, in fact I own and enjoy most of his new 52 run, especially his battle against the court of owls, I just feel as I stated there needs to be a clear line between what is acceptable for a man with his stats, and what is not, so that when he goes up against fellow peak humans we don't have people jumping out and screaming "Batman did x against superman and the flash so what chance does snake eyes have!?"

#163 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis : Prove it when it mattered? Lmao. Your comment is baseless. Unless you're blind or completely stupid, you'd have seen my claims were backed-up with evidence. Your Batwanking friends, those who I challenged that disagreed with me and even gave Batman more credit than he deserved? Couldn't post one single scan to prove me otherwise. Next time, I suggest reading the whole thread thoroughly.

#164 Edited by halovsmarvel (99 posts) - - Show Bio

this outcome was complete bull crap

#165 Posted by jashro44 (20566 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis : Prove it when it mattered? Lmao. Your comment is baseless. Unless you're blind or completely stupid, you'd have seen my claims were backed-up with evidence. Your Batwanking friends, those who I challenged that disagreed with me and even gave Batman more credit than he deserved? Couldn't post one single scan to prove me otherwise. Next time, I suggest reading the whole thread thoroughly.

What scan do you even want? Striking feats?

#166 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Snake-Eyes use a chi-enhanced palm-strike to Storm Shadow's forehead which brought him down. I want a scan of Batman doing the same move, with the same result, without using chi. But the two people I asked for, refused.

#167 Posted by ComicStooge (12447 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Snake-Eyes use a chi-enhanced palm-strike to Storm Shadow's forehead which brought him down. I want a scan of Batman doing the same move, with the same result, without using chi. But the two people I asked for, refused.

Bruce has better feats than that, though. He doesn't need to use the same move considering he knows moves that are a lot better.

#168 Posted by jashro44 (20566 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Snake-Eyes use a chi-enhanced palm-strike to Storm Shadow's forehead which brought him down. I want a scan of Batman doing the same move, with the same result, without using chi. But the two people I asked for, refused.

Can I see this scan for comparison? Or are you talking about this cartoon?

#169 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge : Doesn't matter if he has better feats than that. That's not the point of me asking.

@jashro44 : The cartoon movie, yes.

#170 Edited by jashro44 (20566 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge : Doesn't matter if he has better feats than that. That's not the point of me asking.

@jashro44 : The cartoon movie, yes.

Well people have said the punch didn't even kill storm shadow. Sure it knocked him out but batman has some various 1 hit techniques to....Do you want to see scans of those techniques or batman's striking strength?

#171 Posted by Avilon (112 posts) - - Show Bio

There were some pretty good arguments but Batt's arguments were the better.

#172 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Okay, I guess I have to be clearer on my request. So here goes... I want a scan of Batman, performing the same technique as Snake-Eyes, with the same result that Snake-Eyes had, without the use of chi. That means, the result of Snake-Eyes' attack, was that a wave of chi was sent forth, from the strike of Snake-Eyes' palm to Storm Shadows' forehead.

#173 Posted by jashro44 (20566 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Okay, I guess I have to be clearer on my request. So here goes... I want a scan of Batman, performing the same technique as Snake-Eyes, with the same result that Snake-Eyes had, without the use of chi. That means, the result of Snake-Eyes' attack, was that a wave of chi was sent forth, from the strike of Snake-Eyes' palm to Storm Shadows' forehead.

That is impossible since you want a scan of batman performing the feat without chi. I haven't seen batman do that even with chi admittedly, but he has done techniques that are as effective as that.

#174 Edited by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Thank you. That was the response I wanted. Batman can't do that. Super_Buck and MonsterStomp were absolutely wrong and therefore Batwanked.

#175 Posted by jashro44 (20566 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Thank you. That was the response I wanted. Batman can't do that. Super_Buck and MonsterStomp were absolutely wrong and therefore Batwanked.

I think this is a misunderstanding. I think they were trying to prove that batman punches harder.

#176 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : They weren't, they meant exactly what they said.

#177 Posted by ComicStooge (12447 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : Thank you. That was the response I wanted. Batman can't do that. Super_Buck and MonsterStomp were absolutely wrong and therefore Batwanked.

Continuously going on about 'Batwanking' is a good way to get banned, dude. It's kinda antagonizing.

#178 Posted by Saren (25578 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't really mind the whining about Batman. It's by far the most rewarding part of the experience for me.

Moderator
#179 Posted by ComicStooge (12447 posts) - - Show Bio
@saren said:

I don't really mind the whining about Batman. It's by far the most rewarding part of the experience for me.

You're literally the Darth Sidious of the Vine, dude.

#180 Edited by MonsterStomp (16692 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 : They weren't, they meant exactly what they said.

That's not what I meant at all. So you DID in fact misunderstand. I don't know how the original conversation went down but that's far from what I meant.

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#181 Edited by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge : I'm not continuously going on about it, although it does feel good to be right and knowing they were wrong.

#182 Posted by godzilla44 (2934 posts) - - Show Bio

Glad batman won I actually thought he could win this fight

#183 Posted by Saren (25578 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge : I'm not continuously going on about it, although it does feel good to be right and knowing they were wrong.

I don't even know why people travel to faraway lands or find religion or start new enterprises when such self-realization is able for free on the ComicVine forums.

Moderator
#184 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@saren : Congrats, you made me chuckle.

#185 Posted by entropy_aegis (15103 posts) - - Show Bio

Same goes for like 90% peak humans,it's fiction.

Sorry but there is a difference, between slight exaggerations, say aim dodging for example and sneaking away from/tagging superhumans. Either he is written according to the abilities he should have, or if we are to accept his high showings vs superhumans in the argument against snake eyes or anyone else for that matter then the battle was spite all along, you cannot have it both ways especially when part of the argument against snake eyes, was in fact, that he did not have the vast array of super powered threats to test himself against, as they don't exist in his universe.

To be clear I have no hate for Batman, he is a well developed character with a long history, in fact I own and enjoy most of his new 52 run, especially his battle against the court of owls, I just feel as I stated there needs to be a clear line between what is acceptable for a man with his stats, and what is not, so that when he goes up against fellow peak humans we don't have people jumping out and screaming "Batman did x against superman and the flash so what chance does snake eyes have!?"

Yeah I agree that's stupid,Batman is definitely a street level character.

@entropy_aegis : Prove it when it mattered? Lmao. Your comment is baseless. Unless you're blind or completely stupid, you'd have seen my claims were backed-up with evidence. Your Batwanking friends, those who I challenged that disagreed with me and even gave Batman more credit than he deserved? Couldn't post one single scan to prove me otherwise. Next time, I suggest reading the whole thread thoroughly.

You're on a warning aren't you? I guess you're itching to be banned. You want a scan of Batman one shotting somebody with a precise strike? there's plenty of those,the reason no one's posting them is cause it's common knowledge, and the feat you keep mentioning isn't even from the comics,so what the f*ck are you complaining about?

#186 Edited by Saren (25578 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark_cloud_: There wasn't humor intended, it was just an extension of the earlier view on the voting thread that you have an awfully self-important approach to a fictional fight between fictional characters. Oh, and by the way, stop calling people "Bat-wankers" or employing different forms of the always entertaining and never piteous noun "Batwank" as much as you possibly can. If you have a problem with this outcome, there are far more civil ways to address it.

Moderator
#187 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@monsterstomp : Then what did you mean? You never tried to explain, or explain well enough to have validity. All you really did was say, "Batman can do that because he's Batman." I'm not taking a shot at you, I'm sincerely curious.

@entropy_aegis : Not that I know of, and why would I be banned? If there are plenty of scans out there of Batman doing precise strikes, good. If there are plenty of scans out there, then why hasn't either posted one? Shouldn't be that hard to do, eh? But my request was for a scan of Batman doing the same technique as Snake-Eyes as two other debaters claimed he could do. Now that I know he can't, and they couldn't, I was right and I'm done with it. I've forgiven and forgotten (until someone brings it up again). Other than that, I'm not complaining about anything. You responded to one of my posts, so I replied back. Was that bad?

@saren : Intended or not, it was humorous to me. Self-important approach to fictional fights? You've basically described just about everybody on here, dude. I'm no different than anyone else. I've not counted how many times I've used Batwank, but I'm more than sure it's not nearly as much as the word "fanboy" has been thrown around. I've been civil, but good grammar kills things, so I can see how it might look.

#188 Posted by Wolverine08 (40768 posts) - - Show Bio

BATWANKERS!

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#189 Edited by MonsterStomp (16692 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark_cloud_ said:

@monsterstomp : Then what did you mean? You never tried to explain, or explain well enough to have validity. All you really did was say, "Batman can do that because he's Batman." I'm not taking a shot at you, I'm sincerely curious.

I meant exactly what Jash said. I was comparing striking feats. The chi thing was nothing but a basic knockout technique, which wasn't even effective immediate. Batman can knock someone out fairly easy via the use of brute force, pressure point or nerve strikes. Just because of a mere wave of chi, its special? Storm didn't even move when Snake face palmed him. All this bickering over that? Wow.

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#190 Posted by ComicStooge (12447 posts) - - Show Bio
#191 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (23830 posts) - - Show Bio

I always find it funny when people go out of their way to hate on fictional characters and label others with gross generalizations such as "wankers" and "fanboys".

You don't like Batman? Fine, pay the characters no mind - but don't come into Batman related threads just to spew nonsense with that sad use of rhetoric some users call arguments.

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#192 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@monsterstomp : Look, ease off the whole Batman can do everything attitude and read my reasoning with an open-mind. The chi thing was not a basic knockout technique nor was the mere wave of chi so common that anyone could do it; it was as effective as it was supposed to be and that was the whole point in Snake-Eyes using it. I'm not sure if you watched the entire scene or even the movie, but your assumption was that Batman could do that very technique, and when I asked you for proof, you pretty much shrugged and walked away as if it wasn't important enough to debate. Sure, Batman can use brute force against anyone, use pressure pointa or nerve strikes; know that they are not the same as using chi-enhanced strikes. Chi enhanced his strength and made him stronger, arguably faster. Batman has never been able to generate chi. I just don't get how this was so below you that you felt the need to ignore my request. Other than that, I'm done with the conversation. I was granted what I wanted to know by someone else, but it's your choice whether you want to keep this going. /peace sign/

#193 Posted by Wolverine08 (40768 posts) - - Show Bio
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#194 Posted by MonsterStomp (16692 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark_cloud_: I still don't think you understand. I'm not saying Batman can generate chi, I'm saying Batman could replicate a simple knock out manoeuvre like the one in that video. It was a simple face palm with a bit of life force in it. Stop over exaggerating the feat. Batman backhanded Nightwing and knocked him the f**k out without all that chi drama. Snake Eyes charged up and palmed Storm in the head which didn't even knock him down straight away. What is more impressive?

  1. A backhand that knocked Nightwing out?
  2. Or a fully charged face palm that didn't even knock Storm down?

I'll go with the one hit knock out.

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#195 Posted by Dark Cloud™ (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@monsterstomp : *sighs* I give up. I'm sorry - I thought you could differentiate between a normal strike and a chi-based strike, but I was wrong and I apologize for putting you on the spot. I'm going away from this thread now since it's becoming more senseless to stay and try to get you to understand it better. Have a good night, MS.

@dccomicsrules2 : I expected nothing new from you, DCCR. Lol.

#196 Posted by MonsterStomp (16692 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark_cloud_: There was no difference to begin with. Chi never added anything to Snake Eyes. Snake failed to one shot a weakened Storm with a chi amped attack. Batman flawed Nightwing and many others with a single hit. Just because its chi, doesn't make it special without feats to reinforce it.

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#197 Posted by Saren (25578 posts) - - Show Bio

I think its sad that the Viner of the argument for Batman is really another way of saying, "Anything Not DC or Marvel is flat out weaker than Image, IDW, Dark Horse, ect....."

Great argument, and mindset.

Moderator
#198 Posted by PunyParker (9426 posts) - - Show Bio

@medulaoblaganda said:

@punyparker: sooooooooo!! does that mean he can't be beaten? i can list street level characters that can burst is ass.

wolverine

x 23

captain america barely

spider man

agent venom

deadpool

electra

power man

daredevil

and

shang chi

Bolded ones are debatable.

Agreed.

#199 Posted by Jayc1324 (11147 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: I'm not an expert of deadshot but I have most definitely seen him aim at Batman's head and pull the trigger. And batman dodged.

#200 Posted by Erik (32077 posts) - - Show Bio