How badly downgraded are current cause either would solo pre 52 IMO?
Casandra doesn't exist to my knowledge. So she should solo as she is still pre 52. All though the OP could be talking about Barbra? I don't know for certain.
Shiva beat batman and Dick back when he was robin all though that takes place in the past and she ambushed batman with poison ninja stars, she fought night wing and was winning all though I have been told she had broken bones, but then she lost to Jason Todd....
I don't think Cassandra has made an appearance currently. So its Barbs and Shiva. Barbs and Shiva have in no way proven their skill can contend with Batman currently. I mean Shiva was skilled enough to judge Nightwing on his skill, but was one shotted by Red Hood who we all know is inferior to Cap. I haven't been following Barbs, but from her respect thread, I don't see anything that would help her here.
However, I think pre52 Shiva could take Steve, doubt pre52 Barbs could though.
If it was Cassandra, yeah Steve isn't winning that.
@jashro44: What issue did Shiva beat Batman and Dick? I missed it.
Nightwing #0 I believe. As I said though it takes place earlier in batman's career and she surprised him with poison.
Also, she didnt totally outclass a barely trained Dick in that fight either. He fared pretty well considering he was a rookie, and historically no one would call him a match for Shiva or any top DC martial artists.
@pokeysteve: Shiva can take Cap alone. Adding Barbara is overkill. Also, Batman has been hit in the eye with Batarangs.. I don't see why Cap wouldn't be.
Shiva can take Cap alone. Adding Barbara is overkill. Also, Batman has been hit in the eye with Batarangs.. I don't see why Cap wouldn't be.
New 52 Shiva hasn't shown that level of skill and Barbara would probably get in the way. Cap is faster than Batman. When has Batman been hit in the eye with a Batarang lol? Scan please if you get the chance.
Shiva can take Cap alone. Adding Barbara is overkill. Also, Batman has been hit in the eye with Batarangs.. I don't see why Cap wouldn't be.
New 52 Shiva hasn't shown that level of skill and Barbara would probably get in the way. Cap is faster than Batman. When has Batman been hit in the eye with a Batarang lol? Scan please if you get the chance.
And no, Barbara's not going to "get in the way." You're underestimating her.
@jashro44: If this is New 52, then losing to Todd is nothing poor. He has insane unarmed combat training from his time with the All Caste.
Batwoman is undoubtedly the most underrated of the bat family. Her sentient batarang alone should make her able to take on the likes of Venom rather easily.
@jashro44: If this is New 52, then losing to Todd is nothing poor. He has insane unarmed combat training from his time with the All Caste.
Batwoman is undoubtedly the most underrated of the bat family. Her sentient batarang alone should make her able to take on the likes of Venom rather easily.
I don't think Todd is on caps level despite that training.
And no, Barbara's not going to "get in the way." You're underestimating her.
WOW hahahaha how embarrassing for Batman! Thank you for digging that up!
Both Cap and any version of Shiva are several tiers above Babs. She has a very tactile mind and if she can communicate with her partner during the fight they'd win easy but she can't. She doesn't have the feats to suggest otherwise. She struggled against Batwoman.
@pokeysteve: She was analyzing her. When she realized she can't physically take her, she'd use gadgets. This is why she had a concussive batarang behind her back. She'd obviously know Capt is physically superior, so she'd use Explosive batarangs, etc. And with no morals, she'll go for "tactical strikes." Meaning she'll fight dirty. Now add Shiva who is, to me, superior in skill, Capt is definitely going down.
She was analyzing her. When she realized she can't physically take her, she'd use gadgets. This is why she had a concussive batarang behind her back. She'd obviously know Capt is physically superior, so she'd use Explosive batarangs, etc. And with no morals, she'll go for "tactical strikes." Meaning she'll fight dirty. Now add Shiva who is, to me, superior in skill, Capt is definitely going down.
That's what I like about New 52 Batgirl. They showcase her brains in a fight. Let's say she uses explosives though. She'll either have to wait till Shiva is clear or risk the likelihood of blowing her up. That means only one of them is engaging him at a time.
To be honest, I haven't read Shiva's New 52 appearance and am just going off of what I heard. That she wasn't as formidable as her Pre 52 self.
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