Avatar Wan vs P'li

In this battle, Wan, the first Avatar, will battle the combustion bender P'li

Don't worry, this should be a fair match, because Wan only has firebending. No Avatar State

Fight takes place where Wan fought Vaatu. Starting distance 50 feet.

Round 1: in character

Round 2: bloodlusted

Which firebender will win?

Bump, any thoughts?

P'li uses Wan for target practice.

@a1l_s2a3m4e5n: so you don't think Wan has a chance? Why not?

@killerwasp@kidphillip@aressword@wbr17@korraspirit@gxrevolution96@jr_avatarexpert@dextersinister@thunderbolt30@nighthunder@metaljimmor@spartankobe@jacthripper@deathhero61@primebonnick

Wan is the first official bender. The first official avatar. How isn't this a stomp?

Remember he only has fire bending

Mhh i'm not sure if he has a defense against this and p'li was pretty accurate with her shots as well. Granted she didn't necessary hit anyone important, but she did hit people though and did love the aoe it left as well.

Wan was extremely durable, it's entirely possible he could tank a shot if need be

I think he could also use some defensive moves, when they were breaking into the Chus' he made a fire wall around himself, and that was without any training

i'm not seeing him tanking a shot, i can see him living and aoe, but not a direct hit.

Considering the amount of punishment he took vs Vaatu I wouldn't be surprised if he could, but I suppose an argument could be made that he couldn't too

Because he wasn't as powerful as P'li without the other elements and the avatar state, which he doesn't have here. P'li annihilates him.

P'li one shotted a dragon when she connected. Wan's best option is avoidance more than anything (which is how most people didn't just outright die to P'li).

A dragon with zero durability feats. That easily seemed to be her highest feat though. Kai survived a direct hit iirc with a slight air shield protection. Tenzin also blocked one of her blasts. She had some power, but her blasts aren't as strong as Combustion Man's, and Zuko blocked one of his blasts

@arcus:

Well it one shotted Tonraq after a ice shield, and lin (she couldn't fight back after one) through a earthwall.

So after wan gets hit and flies back, what's stopping p'li from sending a few more blasts his way?

1. Wan is much more durable than Tonraq and Lin, as seen in his fight with Vaatu

2. We've seen firebending block combustion attacks before-Zuko vs Combustion Man-who says Wan couldn't do it here?

3. What's stopping Wan from using his own attacks?

Wan got training from a dragon, but P'li one shotted a dragon. Still Wan has better fire bending feats so i say he wins.

@primebonnick: any particular feats you think were better?

see, wan has never faced a combustion bender before, so he wouldnt be prepared to counter it.

@knightofzero: Conbustion is just one new attack, it's not like it's something completely foreign to Wan

I think P'Li in a very tough fight. Wan sticks in this because he had impressive durability, as well as solid agility and better overall Firebending.

However P'Li has a huge advantage in her Combustion bending. It gives her an undeniable edge in raw power (though Wan's Firebending is exceptionally impressive as well) and it is much more difficult to react to and block in comparison with traditional Firebending. We should also not forget that despite limited showings P'Li has showcased very good defensive Firebending on two occasions, and is not too shabby in agility either.

The limited cover is just too advantageous to P'Li and quite frankly the only way she has ever been defeated was for multiple opponents to distract her with a coordinated attack. On his own I don't think Wan can make it with so little cover. He can dodge and block a few blasts but eventually it will catch up with him.

P'Li 7/10

Agreed on P'Li for a majority in a challenging fight. Good explanations provided above.

@lunacyde:

Do you see Wan's durability being a factor?

@arcus it would be something new to him. his only experience with bending at all is the traditional large fireball from his hand attack, where as pli can basically cause things to explode with her mind. Unlike others in avatar who have heard about this technique and know exactly how to counter it, wan is going to be caught completely off guard.

while wan is durable and even managed to fight of vatuu, but pli managed to take out a dragon in 1 hit and is a much faster attack then normal firebending

@knightofzero: Wan faced a greater variety of threats in the spirit world than most benders could imagine. I think it's safe to assume he's pretty adaptable

Pli

@norrinboltagonprime21: what do you think gives her the win?

Do you think he would stand a better chance with more cover?

Having better cover wouldnt make a difference. he is restricted to fire bending which is pretty much useless since fire has never been useful against P'li, it simply warms her as seen when Zuko's dragon tried roasting her. The only way to beat her is to stun her (thats do-able with earth bending which wan doesn't have here).

Wan wont do well with better cover either, that just gives him a longer life span in this battle.

@a1l_s2a3m4e5n:

Blocking firebending blasts is a standard firebending skill, it doesn't make firebenders immune to fire attacks. Blocking one big attack is different from blocking multiple attacks

@arcus: Yes, without a doubt.

She said, and i quote "ive waited 13 years to feel this warm". And even so Wan cant come out to fight her head on, if he does he goes boom, he'll be too busy docking and hiding from her combustion blasts, so i dont see how he's going to deliver multiple fire blasts. P'li wins this.

@a1l_s2a3m4e5n:

Yeah, I know what she said. Lin Beifong was able to attack her head on, and Wan is far stronger and more durable than Lin

YEAH...but she was blown to sh*t and Suyin Befong had to attack P'li from behind in order to kill her.

plus Lin was wearing and iron suit.

I hate it when I come to a new thread and somebody has already said everything I had to say.

@a1l_s2a3m4e5n: and Wan's taken repeated blasts from Vaatu without any protection and been fine

I was only pointing out that even in a suit of amour Lin suffered severe damage. i'm not saying she's as durable as Wan. But P'li still wins.

@a1l_s2a3m4e5n: I know, I was just pointing out that Wan has tanked arguably greater attacks and stayed standing

Bump

Wan by a very very small margin

Wan = 1st = No challenge.

I wanted to address this. While the dragon has no durability feats I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that, judging by it's size and the durability shown by similarly large animals like Appa and the saber tooth moose lion, dragons are a fair bit more durable than a normal human. The fact that taking down a dragon was a legendary achievement worthy of a unique title should also be considered, and P'li effortlessly downed that dragon.

Also that airbending is ridiculously powerful defensively. A lot more than you'd suspect with a shield of air, anyway. Korra blocked a point blank explosion in Zaofu with an air shield, and we saw Aang blocking Combustion Man's massive explosions using air shields. For whatever reason air is just REALLY good at blocking explosions. Much better than earth, water, or fire at any rate.

As for the fight, I'd give it to P'li after a lengthy battle. Wan MIGHT be able to tank a few hits, but he'll be starting off at a disadvantage as he won't expect a beam of doom shooting from his opponent's forehead. That dragon's fire blast was huge, pretty close to what Wan fires off, and was easily blocked by P'li which suggests she can block Wan's attacks just fine. Wan also has never faced a skilled bender in his lifetime, where as P'li has made a career out of fighting master benders. That should be taken into consideration.

@metaljimmor:

Fire's pretty good against explosions too, Zuko used it vs Combustion Man and Mako bent an explosion around himself in Season 2

@beyondergod: @thevivas: any reasons?

@arcus:

Zuko was blown back by the blast even with blocking. Aang's wind blast actually blew the explosion back and allowed him to propel himself to safety. And while Mako and Zuko have both survived explosions thanks to their firebending, Korra was able to outright no sell her explosion and protect the people beside her simultaneously.

Air is a way more defensive element than fire. Those air barriers are much stronger than people give them credit for.

Besides that, Kai was still knocked unconscious by the blast even with blocking it. He only survived because he lucked out and landed out of P'li's view and was saved by a lucky tree branch. Even Tenzin was hurt by P'li's blast through his defense, and Tenzin is a much more powerful airbender than Kai. Meanwhile Tonraq and Lin were both badly injured through their defense, and I don't think anyone would argue earth has weaker defenses than fire given the best defensive techniques in the series have always been earth related.

I also can't remember Wan ever blocking an attack with his fire shield before.

@metaljimmor:

I'm not sure he's ever blocked an attack that we've seen, he hasn't had many chances . However, if Zuko can do it, I don't see why Wan, (who's stronger than pre-dragon Zuko) couldn't

@arcus:

He had a fair few chances against Vaatu where a solid fire shield could've come in handy. Early on in the video you linked we see him trying to avoid and tank Vaatu's blasts while holding the power of fire inside him. Even if his fire shield isn't strong enough to block Vaatu's beam, you'd expect him to at least try.

It's been 10,000 years since Wan's time. There's a good chance new techniques have evolved since then, so assuming Wan knows every technique to the same level as modern benders doesn't quite work.

@metaljimmor: a fire shield is gonna be far more effective at blocking firebending than concussive energy blasts

@arcus:

Perhaps, but even a weak shield is better than nothing at all.

Plus P'li's blasts are mostly concussive energy with very little actual fire involved. In an explosion it's not the fire that gets you, it's the shockwave ripping through your body and turning your organs into goop.