Asura vs Goku (I know it's been done)

@VinoVash1234 said:

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: Have you forgotten he tanked a 50x supernova while getting hit by red sun radiation?

Destroy a sun? Are you joking me? Have you forgotten who Bills is? "destroys stars and planets"- BTW goku died from a planetary explosion.

i don't want to make this thread a Goku vs Superman, superman has nothing to do with this thread, i just pointed some points that you got wrong. as i'll do again. i'm not saying who will win, just correcting some of your points.

i don't know what Bills has to do with this you're making this off topic.

Superman didn't tank 50 supernova that's a big lie spread in internet by supes fanboys, did you read the issue or should i bring you the scans ? superman ran for his life while the explosion was behind him spreading at high speed. he didn't tank it. it's even stated in scans that if it touch him he will be incinerated. he saved himself for a short moment by outracing the explsion but he was already exhausted so the spaceship saved him in the last moment before he dies.

and it make no sense if Superman can tank, with no problem, 50 supernova in weak state by red sun radiation, and get knocked cold by 1 supernova at powered state by yellow sun radiation. nonsense at all.

also Cell's explosion isn't just planetary level, sure it only destroyed one planet (with density 10 times of earth) but it was the only planet around. if there was many they will be all destroyed. and let's not forget about concentrated explosions that's used all the time in DBZ, and also in DC and Marvel.

@NeonGameWave: Theres soo much wrong with your post, but im not bombarding this thread with this battle,ill pm you, or we can create another thread discussing and debunking your wank on DBZ.

You forgot to mention soo much, besides all that, you were again low-balling supes, and wanking goku, you're no better than a fanboy, so like i said, create a thread and ill discuss it there.

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: PM me if you wanna discuss this, cause theres soo much wrong with your post.

@VinoVash1234: Like what exactly? Why don`t you point it out here and now? Just simplify the points, we can do that we can create a thread Goku vs Superman.

You were the one who downgraded Goku, you said he only created one after image when he did a lot more and increased in potential during the later parts of the series, then you said I give him too much credit, you also said that his Super Saiyan forms don`t increase his attributes and you related it to Trunks taking things out of context then you downgraded Frieza to bring down Goku`s feats. You clearly are a Superman fanboy and it is evident, you have something against Goku. I`m not a Goku or DBZ fanboy, I am a fan your a Superman fanboy look at your comments and I don`t believe you 100% in regards to the Majin Dark Schneider vs Goku thread, I believe it was intentional.

@NeonGameWave said:

@VinoVash1234: Flashy? Now your arguments are getting kind of pointless, Goku creates after images, disappears completely and continues to fight at a fast rate in base form what has Superman done so evidently that suggests he is on Goku`s level in combat speed? Is it because of the Wonder Woman fight? Flash race? Infinite Mass Punch?

I always hear this argument about how Goku couldn`t even survive a planetary explosion. Many seem to underestimate the actual event and what variables could be involved in the overall circumstance, no one knows the exact destructive output of Cell`s explosion which is probably way above planetary level considering the fact that there was only one planet that suffered or endured through the explosion. Just because it destroyed 1 planet doesn`t mean it can`t destroy many more in one instant, there was only one planet that was present and Goku wasn`t far from the explosion, and he wasn`t hovering above the explosion he took it head on and many seem to forget the fact that Cell contained massive power from all of the abilities he had and that same maximum power is concentrated into an explosion, key word is self destruct which Cell did through the harnessing of energy and the blast itself was concentrated.

Aside from goku accomplishing flashy reaction speed, is there ever anything mentioning goku moving at LS or above? Didnt think so, therefore the speed of gokus reaction is all an assumption, unless you provide solid proof stating that goku has FTL reaction speed. Creates after images, disappears completely and continues to fight at a fast rate? what did you do with the scans of superman fighting darkseid, mongul, imperix and doomsday, cause superman did EXACTLY everything you stated above. If you want a scan debate, PM me, ill provide the scans again, on top of that, superman ALSO speedblitzed the entire justice league including flash (ofcourse speedblitzing the flash is PIS).

And what variables CAN be implemented in the event itself? Remember gohan was doing all the fighting, therefore goku died without any excuses at all. Above planetary? Have you even read the manga or seen that scan at all? King Kais planet was standing, it wasnt even destroyed, furthermore cell stated that it was capable of destroying the 'planet'- ONE planet only, back to king kais planet, note how it didnt even affect king kais planet, just everyone in it.

And yet all the harnessing resulted to one planetary destruction? Again, you see what i was talking about? You're assuming again, unless its stated, then its not true.

Also that was not Goku at his strongest during the Buu Saga his powers increase exponentially along with his durability as ki is the defining factor for attributes within DBZ and Goku`s power level raises. He is able to tank Kid Buu`s planet busting attacks just fine even after fighting him for hours in intense combat.

Stop lying. Frieza did survive a planetary explosion, he was cut by Trunks` sword, cut in half by his own attack and then the planet exploded due to the colliding forces of Goku`s attack and his as he endured through the entire explosion, he did not escape at all. He endured through the entire explosion, you do not know DBZ that well, I can tell. Your not basing your info on the manga your basing your info on scenes from the anime in regards to the fights. Frieza was even able to tank Goku`s Spirit Bomb attack even when he was greatly damaged this attack is composed of all life energy. Goku`s Kamehameha destroys every atom within the body also just like Darkseid`s Omega Beams, his attacks annihilated Kid Buu and Cell completely both who have amazing regeneration, Darkseid`s Omega Beams wouldn`t prove anything different and aren`t anything special. Also Goku`s attacks have the greater destructive output. Where are the scans? How do you know it was a 50x supernova? Goku has done these things in his base form or SSJ1 form, SSJ3 maximizes his potential and overall destructive output by 400x so Superman is going to feel a lot of pain especially since he likes to tank attacks instead of avoid them.

PROVE IT, you keep saying gokus strength, stamina, speed, durability etc etc increase as he goes up a class, yet you fail to explain how each SSJ uses up too much energy, SSJ3 slowed him down, he barely had any stamina and couldnt last half an hour in a fight.

Can you prove Frieza survived a planetary explosion, did he say he did? PROVE IT, again, assumptions, unless he stated he did, everything else is an assumption. On top of that meta frieza was cut up by a sword, a silly sword for crying out loud, King Kai confirmed that planetary attacks can kill frieza, as he specifically asked frieza to get in the ship cause his supernova attack hit the core of the planet.

No it didnt, gokus attack did not destroy the planet, it was friezas deathball that did it, yet frieza was cut up by a mountain slicing attack? Have you forgotten how goku tried to outrun the explosion of the planet? Im basing everything from the manga and the anime, as its shown, i dont care about statements, as it ALWAYS contradicts the showings. Second, on namek there was hardly any life force energy left, so what did goku power his spirit bomb with? exactly, with speck of tiny energies remaining on the planet. Kamehameha does NOT destroy atoms, was it stated or shown anywhere? Daizenshuu stated you needed to destroy cells CELLS to destroy him, with Buu you need to destroy his atoms. Cells are made of atoms which are made of electrons which are made of protons and neutrons which are further made of quarks, the only reason Buu died, it was cause his negative energy was destroyed, not just that but his ATOMS were destroyed, and it was through a spirit bomb, not the KW.

Why are you bringing Bills into this? Bills` job is to destroy planets and stars as the God of Destruction which he does in order to maintain balance within the universe, where are you getting domain from? You seriously need to do your research. Realistically Goku can and he tanked Kid Buu`s planet busting attacks so technically he does have planetary durability, how is flight speed going to help in a fight exactly? His flight speed is FTL but not his combat speed so your point does not make any sense whatsoever.

Proof of this so called 50x supernova? Goku can dodge his heat vision and his heat vision drains his energy the most out of all his abilities within his power set so it wouldn`t be wise for him to do that, that is the main point, Goku is the smarter and more grounded fighter he would be able to exploit openings and he has shown before that he can counter mid fight so the heat vision wouldn`t be a problem. Goku would be able to counter or block, his combat speed is far greater, moving Maggedon`s engine is lifting strength not striking power none of that would help Superman in a fight so you bringing it up won`t prove anything. Superman is physically stronger when it comes to lifting strength not striking power, Goku is the better fighter and he is faster in combat speed. By your logic Hossein Rezazadeh would be able to beat Muhammad Ali because he can lift more the two do not relate or correspond simultaneously to each other especially in regards to a fight where your tested through skill not might.

Bills is the ONLY star buster, or have you forgotten what was mentioned in the trailer? To pit anyone on a star buster level would mean they are on bills level of power, which is BS.

Again when did Goku tank planet busting attacks from Kid Buu? if you dont remember, Kid buu was going to destroy earth with two ki blasts, the first was stopped by vegeta, the second was stopped by no-one, and if you didnt remember goku and vegetas reaction, they were traumatized, scared like hell, to the point that they couldnt outrun it. So goku even in the Buu saga had NO planetary durability what-so-ever.

Where did you get that? Deathbattle, strange how you were against that. Goku smarter? you are joking me, thats oe thing goku will never be, smart, ever, the guy barely has a brain, even krillin and piccolo have admitted that he's stupid.

Massxacceleration=Force? forgot that equation? BTW i have scans of superman punching Konvict with planet destroying force. Supermans fight with darkseid destroyed the planet, due to their strikes, so striking strength goes to superman.

Now in regards to your argument about Superman being able to tank 50x supernovas (which is not true and is exaggerated) your probably thinking of these events which are overly taken out of context by many who forget to read the texts and understand the context of what is happening within the actual story instead of taking everything as face value in regards to what is presented on the panels.

The supernova was coming at a red radiation affected superman, at light speed, superman, although out-paced it by a bit, was still hit by it, i posted the scan, he didnt die, so you have yet to prove how he will.

Striking is important in regards to a fight not lifting. The only benefits lifting might have are throwing objects, having the opponent BFR`d and etc. These are logical points but I`ve heard many individuals say that lifting strength can be considered as apart of striking power which is not true and this always happens when it comes to the New 52 Superman feat of him bench pressing the earth for 5 days without a yellow sun it is not a striking feat but a lifting feat they differ greatly. All though they are impressive feats it doesn`t mean they would actually help within a battle it comes down to striking power and combat speed not lifting strength and flight speed.

Now in regards to your argument about Superman being able to tank 50x supernovas (which is not true and is exaggerated) your probably thinking of these events which are overly taken out of context by many who forget to read the texts and understand the context of what is happening within the actual story instead of taking everything as face value in regards to what is presented on the panels.

Kili: An energy unit used by Bobbidi. When Bobbidi measured Goku`s energy during his fight with Yakon, this unit was tested. Goku`s energy level is over 3,000 kili. At approximately 200-300 kili, one can destroy 1 or 2 planets.

This information is from an official DBZ handbook which describes the situation in regards to Goku`s power level and what he is capable of. He can destroy 10-15 planets in his SSJ1 form based on his power level of 3000 which was measured through the units of kili a method used by Babidi to gauge Goku`s level of power and that level of power was 3000 which was measured by Babidi in the earlier arcs. This is not Goku at his maximum potential, it is Goku at a lower level, in SSJ3 form he would have a power level above 450 million at maximum which obviously means his power would far exceed that of what was measured in the earlier arcs, Goku can destroy over thousands or millions of planets in one concentrated attack if he really wanted to and Buu was a threat to the galaxy as he also destroyed hundreds of worlds however Goku far surpasses him by the end of Dragon Ball Z, Cell can destroy the Solar System and his power level is below Goku`s power level once he is in SSJ3 form. Superman technically has only endured through one supernova not 50x, Cell can destroy the sun with his power and can wipe out a solar system and SSJ3 Goku>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Super Perfect Cell. Goku logically, realistically, plausibly and technically should be able to produce a blast equivalent to that of 4 or more supernovas at full power in a concentrated attack.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=22411 (Page 147)

Again ive already shown and told you, supermans fight with konvict and darkseid, superman threw planet destroying punches, and his fight with darkseid destroyed a planet as a sideffect.

I already explained the supernova feat.

"Kili: An energy unit used by Bobbidi. When Bobbidi measured Goku`s energy during his fight with Yakon, this unit was tested. Goku`s energy level is over 3,000 kili. At approximately 200-300 kili, one can destroy 1 or 2 planets."

Again you are misinterpreting it, with 200-300 killi you can destroy 1 or 2 planets ONLY, with 3,000 goku should be able to destroy 300 planets ONE AT A TIME. This is further proven by Kid Buu who was only destroying planets, one at a time, on top of that, frieza did the same thing, he busted planets at a time, no one in DBZ has ever one shotted 200 or 300 planets altogether at once.

As for your Kanzenshuu link, ive debunked that soo many times.

"Both of these writing schemes are simply my attempt to help visually distinguish the names of the Grade forms from "Super Saiyan 2/3/4". With the Grade forms, they use Japanese numbers (ie, the kanji for the numbers along with the regular Japanese reading), while with Super Saiyan 2/3/4 they use the English numbers (or rather, they use the Arabic numerals with furigana indicating they should be read as the English words for those numbers). This distinction is of course hard to maintain when translating into English, but I figured that avoiding using Arabic numbers when referring to the Grade forms was as good a way as any. Anyway, here we go"

"Both of these writing schemes are simply my attempt to help visually distinguish the names of the Grade forms from "Super Saiyan 2/3/4"- I dont know if you missed that on purpose, he translated the forms and gave his OWN examples. He tried to Visullay distinguish the forms, the original handbook simply gave the Japanese numbers, and they use the Arabic numerals with furigana.

@NeonGameWave: You misinterpret things A LOT.

Note how everything to do with goku was all an ASSUMPTION, thats the problem with goku wanking, theres never ANY concrete evidence, just hypothetical assumptions derived from a singular feat accomplished by one character and then further exagerating it by using character a) vs b) logic, thats all DBZ logic is. In my own opinion, gokus combat speed is supersonic-hypersonic like supermans. He can ONLY bust jupiter sized planets, ONE AT A TIME. His durability is planetary, and he has a brain the size of a pea.

Asura takes it IMO. Don't remember much from DBZ.

@VinoVash1234: Second, on namek there was hardly any life force energy left, so what did goku power his spirit bomb with? exactly, with speck of tiny energies remaining on the planet.

I'm not trying to join this debate but it was stated that Goku was drawing energy from other near by planets IIRC.

@VinoVash1234: I already provided a link as to why Goku and the DBZ characters fight at light speed, your just ignoring the facts and your just making assumptions in regards to Goku`s abilities, provide the scans if you must but what solid evidence is there in regards to Superman being able to match Goku?

I already provided the scans and link. Kai assumed it would but it didn`t happen, it was shown in the anime and manga how many times am I`m going to have to repeat myself? A silly sword? Trunks sword is not an ordinary sword the same damage inflicted through sharp weapons is not the same as destructive force, its the same with Wonder Woman she can tank blasts find but she is usually harmed by sharp objects its just the nature of the attack that is being inflicted that affects durability differently. You just downgrade Frieza again.

Did you even read the manga or watched the anime? It did destroy the planet and Kai along with everyone else.

I said Goku`s attack along with Frieza caused the planet to explode, planet Namek. What are you talking about, Frieza destroyed Planet Vegeta. That is not the point, the point is the destructive output of the attack Goku`s attacks usually extinguish cells or atoms. Yet you ignore my points about the destructive output being able to actually dispose of Buu temporarily the point is the destructive force and what it can do.

Bills is not merely a star buster he is far above that. Power levels matter its not simply pitting characters against each other and Goku`s SSJG rivals Bills, your very biased. Cell is capable of star busting and so is Frieza, he was confirmed as being the strongest character in Z history and I know about the movie but I will not reveal it here since it would be spoilers but your point is rather pathetic.

Because, their ki level was diminished their abilities don`t work the same as comic characters their power stems from their ki level and they were drained of course they would be intimidated. Goku literally did tank Kid Buu`s blasts throughout the entire fight and when Kid Buu attempted to destroy the earth his power was diminished.

In combat not outside of combat!!! Like seriously what are you talking about? He is smarter when it comes to fighting did I say normal everyday life, a person might not be good at one thing but they excel at another stop downgrading Goku.

Nope. Striking goes to Goku he has generated strikes that caused destruction to the planet his fights with Vegeta and Frieza prove that and he was only in SSJ1 form. Superman has to accelerate when striking. Goku is also the better fighter and is faster in combat speed he would have the edge.

Your a liar! Where`s the proof in regards to it being a 50x supernova? He still was flying for his life he did not face the entirety of the explosion.

Goku`s fights usually threaten to destroy the planet if we were not to be careful so it isn`t impressive and where is the so called scan that you speak of? Prove that their strikes destroyed planets instead of claiming.

No you did not, you didn`t explain anything at all and your accusing me of assuming? Where is the proof in regards to this so called 50x supernova that you keep going on about?

A concentrated attack, there is a difference and the point is its overall destructive output, Kid Buu obviously was destroying one planet at a time however he was travelling to each planet if there were to be a group of planets together Goku`s overall power would be able to destroy those planets. Goku is no longer at a level of 3,000 kili he is at a greater level at the end of Z and also why would it say 1-2 planets? It can`t simply be referring to one at a time, it means the power is enough to destroy 1 or 2 planets at a time simultaneously. It also basically means Goku could destroy planets 15 times the size of earth due to his destructive output, he has enough power to do that.

Frieza was targeting different planets, if the planets were aligned together of course he would destroy them, he want to prove his superiority by traversing the universe and conquering planets. Cell is an confirmed Solar System buster.

You didn`t debunk anything other than blindly point out a translation in regards to the Super Saiyan forms and what they were meant to be. Their the same, these are Akira`s words being translated and you can`t apply that situation to what I have provided in regards to kili, what did you debunk exactly? Cell is an confirmed Solar System buster it is even confirmed throughout the handbook, the words were accurately translated stop downgrading and being ignorant. If your not aware it was different ideas Akira had form the Super Saiyan forms and the fact that Cell`s energy bullet is mentioned as being able to destroy the Solar System says something and this attack is Cell`s Solar Kamehameha .

Page 147

Super Saiyan Grade Five (Strongest Form)

An aura with sparks like flashes of lightning and an upright, combative hairstyle are the distinguishing features of this, the strongest Saiyan warrior! One's personality also becomes aggressive; even the ordinarily gentle Gohan started to enjoy battle! Its power is enough to push back even Cell's energy bullet, which had enough force to blow away the Solar System!

Son Gohan

Gohan's true power that had lain dormant finally awakens! He transforms through his extreme rage towards Cell, who tormented Goku and the others with his Cell Juniors, and even destroyed No.16! His personality does an about-face; the strongest Super Saiyan, he easily battles Cell!

[red text] Everything's super!! Declare this invincible Saiya-Power!!

[picture of SSj Gohan, from right after Cell beats him up and knocks him into the mountain...in other words, not SSj2 Gohan, though they're implying it is] Outraged at the cruelty of Cell and the Cell Juniors, Gohan finally transforms!

@VinoVash1234 said:

@NeonGameWave: You misinterpret things A LOT.

Note how everything to do with goku was all an ASSUMPTION, thats the problem with goku wanking, theres never ANY concrete evidence, just hypothetical assumptions derived from a singular feat accomplished by one character and then further exagerating it by using character a) vs b) logic, thats all DBZ logic is. In my own opinion, gokus combat speed is supersonic-hypersonic like supermans. He can ONLY bust jupiter sized planets, ONE AT A TIME. His durability is planetary, and he has a brain the size of a pea.

You misinterpret. You say Superman has tanked 50x supernovas and that he can survive it all at once, your a liar and then you say Superman is faster than Goku in combat speed when you barely provided information for your case your using all assumptions I actually backed up my points with scans and info. Its not ABC logic its the principle of DBZ it doesn`t work the same as a comic would in regards to principle and it fits within the context of how ki is used. You got it all wrong. Goku far surpasses Superman in combat speed, Superman needs to accelerate in order to reach those speeds he doesn`t simply or naturally just go all out and it depends on his energy reserves as well as how close he is to the sun, Goku can do much more, Frieza destroyed Planet Vegeta which is 10x the size of earth with just a power level of 530,000 and your telling me Goku can`t do much more by the end of Z? Especially when he concentrates his attacks more than often so he won`t destroy the planet? He destroy planets 10-15 size of the earth at a power level of 3,000 and his power level is far above that in SSJ3, if Cell can destroy the Solar System then Goku is more than capable and the attack would harm Superman anyway. Stop downgrading Goku, he`s not the brightest but he is clever and really intelligent when it comes to fighting a area where Superman is actually lacking.

@NeonGameWave: Are we going to continue this here?

No you didnt, as far as i remember you provided kid goku dodging lightning, master roshis moon busting feat and solar flare, all of which i debunked, therefore your base line for the assumption no longer exists, you dont have a baseline anymore, i specifically asked you to provide a solid concrete proof of goku stating and showing FTL combat speed, yet you failed to do so, bringing up the same logic, character a) beats b) therefore he can do the same.

Prove to me trunks sword is not an ordinary sword, you havnt proved any side of it, just assuming everything as you go along, prove to me trunks sword is not a normal sword, words wont cut it.

As for Frieza, PROVE IT, you havnt shown anything to suggest frieza didnt escape that blast, while i don, King Cold himself admitted the destruction of a planet would kill frieza, where is YOUR proof, unless you wanna say frieza has a better durability than goku, good luck with that.

What are YOU talking about? you realise that it was friezas deathball that was destroying the planet not goku and friezas attack colliding, or have you forgotten how goku was travelling around the planet in search for a spaceship?

Again PROVE it, you havnt proved that gokus attacks are on an atomic or electronic scale, if they were how comes they didnt finish cell and buu of? Assuming again, with no proof.

I know the plot of the new movie, where did you get that BS from? the trailer and kanzenshuu both state that Bills is a STAR and PLANET buster, come back anyday when friexa or cell actually bust stars, instead of assuming lies that only Bills is capable of, so according to your logic, frieza and cell rival Bills? Powerlevels BS It has never proven anything to much with the series itself, its contradictory and full of lies, anyone can assume ANYTHING with powerlevels, even beyond the showings of a character themselves. Daizenshuu has itself debunked the use of powerscalling, watch Derek Padulas video, the author of Dao dragonball.

Now you're making lies up as your going along, when did their Ki diminish? if you havnt watched that fight, they had no signs of stress, distress, weakness or loss of energy, they wanted to fight Kid buu head on, who shot TWO ki blasts, both scaring and frightening to both goku and vegeta, you have nothing to debunk that, theres no special meaning behind it, it happened and its a solid proof.

Smarter at fighting? how could one be smarter at fighting? fightings physical. Do you understand what you're saying? Fighting does not require calculations, you simply fight, how does fighting prove ones intellect? Show me ONE proof of goku demonstrating any forms of intellect, heck show me him strategicing any forms intellect whilst in his battles. Im NOT donwgrading him, im simply NOT OVERESTIMATING him, like you and several other fanboys have done so.

Striking goes to Goku? Please, stop it with your lies, show me his fists generating planetary strikes, heck show me his fists shattering a planet, Where is the proof with vegeta and frieza? the last time i checked their strikes were'nt even causing earthquakes, let alone destroying a planet. I can actually show supermans strike destroying a planet unlike you whos simply assuming given only a few feats and by powerscalling without on panel evidence as to do so.

I sent you the scan already, it was 50x keplers supernova, even though he was affected by red radiation. I never said he was fully hit by it, i said by a BIT, again misinterpreting my words.

Gokus fights threaten the planet? show me that happening ONCE at the very least, you're lying blatantly, with no proof. The only time a planet has ever been destroyed in DBZ was by ki blasts, never physical force alone, ill send you a scan of superman fighting darkseid, and his fight with konvict, PM.

You ARE assuming, look above, you starting implying gokus physical might is a threat to the planet without concrete evidence. 50x supernova? ill PM you.

again PROVE IT, Kid Buu did destroy planets one at a time, it happened, and it cannot be debunked, its a concrete feat, if he could destroy planets at a time, why didnt he simply blow up the star, which makes up 99% of the solar system? NO ONE in DBZ has ever one shoted multiple planets, its all in YOUR head, you are assuming again, without evidence, show me anyone one shoting multiple planets all at once. I said goku could destroy planets rivaling jupiter in size, Jupiter’s diameter is 11.2 times larger than Earth. In other words, you could put 11.2 Earths side-by-side to match the diameter of Jupiter. And Jupiter’s volume is even bigger. It would take 1321.3 Earths to fill up the volume of Jupiter. In terms of surface area, Jupiter is 121.9 times bigger than the Earth. That’s how many Earths could be flattened out to cover the surface of Jupiter, heck even i placed goku higher than you, BTW one planet AT A TIME, feats beat assuming, and you have no proof that its multiple planets all at once.

" IF the planets"- notice the word 'IF', thats all you ever do, use 'ifs' and 'maybes', prove to me frieza can. Cell is NOT a solar system buster, hyperbolic statement, not to mention that would put him above kid buu and Bills.

"Both of these writing schemes are simply my attempt to help visually distinguish the names of the Grade forms from "Super Saiyan 2/3/4". With the Grade forms, they use Japanese numbers (ie, the kanji for the numbers along with the regular Japanese reading), while with Super Saiyan 2/3/4 they use the English numbers (or rather, they use the Arabic numerals with furigana indicating they should be read as the English words for those numbers). This distinction is of course hard to maintain when translating into English, but I figured that avoiding using Arabic numbers when referring to the Grade forms was as good a way as any. Anyway, here we go"

.again, i dont know if you are doing this on purpose bu the UPLOADER of the information is personally translating the numerical stats posted BY akira toriyama, in short= "Both of these writing schemes are simply MY attempt to help visually distinguish...., Akira NEVER wrote any of that, the uploader/ user of kanzenshuu was giving examples to better clear things.

Its power is enough to push back even Cell's energy bullet, which had enough force to blow away the Solar System!- again, i dont know if you are doing this on purpose, but the uploader, you know the user, much like you and i, he is a member of kanzenshuu, HE is giving examples to better explain things to you, it was NEVER Akira Toriyama.

Kanzenshuu is a website, much like comicvine, there are users there much like you and i, one of the users in the forums TRANSLATED the daizenshuu by giving HIS OWN examples, note how the original SSJ graded were in japanese they were not released in english, so a user roaming around the forums decided to translate it by giving his own examples....GET IT?

@VinoVash1234: You keep ignoring my arguments, lets take this to another thread it doesn`t make sense to have a logical discussion within a totally unrelated thread and you ignored my points every time lets just take it somewhere else and I will address it there.

@NeonGameWave: @NeonGameWave said:

You misinterpret. You say Superman has tanked 50x supernovas and that he can survive it all at once, your a liar and then you say Superman is faster than Goku in combat speed when you barely provided information for your case your using all assumptions I actually backed up my points with scans and info. Its not ABC logic its the principle of DBZ it doesn`t work the same as a comic would in regards to principle and it fits within the context of how ki is used. You got it all wrong. Goku far surpasses Superman in combat speed, Superman needs to accelerate in order to reach those speeds he doesn`t simply or naturally just go all out and it depends on his energy reserves as well as how close he is to the sun, Goku can do much more, Frieza destroyed Planet Vegeta which is 10x the size of earth with just a power level of 530,000 and your telling me Goku can`t do much more by the end of Z? Especially when he concentrates his attacks more than often so he won`t destroy the planet? He destroy planets 10-15 size of the earth at a power level of 3,000 and his power level is far above that in SSJ3, if Cell can destroy the Solar System then Goku is more than capable and the attack would harm Superman anyway. Stop downgrading Goku, he`s not the brightest but he is clever and really intelligent when it comes to fighting a area where Superman is actually lacking.

i never said he completely tanked it, i further elaborated on it, if you skipped it.

Are you purposely ignoring the feats i posted? stop being ignorant. Its NOT the principle of DBZ, its simply YOUR principle, so dont make up lies like that. And accelerate? you are talking about flight speed, do you even know what combat speed is? How is flight speed remotely related to combat speed? Like i said, Jupiter sized planets, thats not good enough for you?

@NeonGameWave: And how many times have i said that? ill tell you what, you start the thread, and ill make the first post, ill keep the post short and brief, the first post will cover combat speed.

@VinoVash1234 said:

@NeonGameWave: And how many times have i said that? ill tell you what, you start the thread, and ill make the first post, ill keep the post short and brief, the first post will cover combat speed.

I`m not going to waste my time with a person who throws around insults and accusations.

@NeonGameWave: Insults and accusations? WHEN?

Like i said, create that thread, and if you provide more feats, you win, that should be easy for you right? to give you a brief example, create the thread and ill post the first post.

@VinoVash1234: Many times. This is you:

1. You have a grudge against his all time rival.

2. I see it, you always make Goku out to be the winner in every fight against any comic book character of any standard on Comicvine.

3. Your giving Goku too much credit.

4. Your a fanboy and I don`t like Goku wank.

The debate itself wouldn`t be a problem and I considered it but the problem is the person behind it in regards to who I am debating, you ignore my points and then twist them to suit your own ends saying how that that I`m basing Goku`s combat speed on panel design I can say the same for Superman and his contradictory feats, then you say 50x supernova and now your lying about it saying he barely tanked it or that he was running away from it, I`m the one who debunked your nonsense and brought it to your attention, I hate repeating myself over and over again especially when the evidence is so blatantly obvious.

Okay this has gone far enough what does Superman has to do with a Asura vs Goku thread?@god_spawn could you please handle this? I do not like where this is going and it is bond to turn into a flame war.

@NeonGameWave: From your post, name me one that no one would think to accuse you of, point 2 is the truth, i yet to see otherwise.

Point 1- read your first EVER post to me, clearly you have a grudge against him.

point 3- no lie there, absolute truth.

Point 4- somewhat true

"he supernova was coming at a red radiation affected superman, at light speed, superman, although out-paced it by a bit, was still hit by it, i posted the scan, he didnt die, so you have yet to prove how he will."

GOKU WINS.

RACOB HAS SPOKEN.

@Racob7 said:

GOKU WINS.

RACOB HAS SPOKEN.

Popeye murks them Both :D

@VinoVash1234 said:

@NeonGameWave: From your post, name me one that no one would think to accuse you of, point 2 is the truth, i yet to see otherwise.

Point 1- read your first EVER post to me, clearly you have a grudge against him.

point 3- no lie there, absolute truth.

Point 4- somewhat true

"he supernova was coming at a red radiation affected superman, at light speed, superman, although out-paced it by a bit, was still hit by it, i posted the scan, he didnt die, so you have yet to prove how he will."

1. I don`t have a grudge. I wouldn`t read his comics or have him as one of my favourite characters and I knew you were going to bring up my first post yet you fail to realize, I was addressing the general points of the Superman fans but more so fanboys that I have come across and I brought it up because you said Goku got owned by Superman based on Screw Attack`s lying video.

3, No its just your bias opinion and grasping at straws.

4. Interesting.

50x supernova vs supernova, there is a huge difference!! Dying what are you talking about? I`m addressing your bold face lying claim about him tanking 50x supernovas and he barely managed to tank one also he wasn`t at the center of the explosion he was at a good distance although it is impressive due to him tanking red sun radiation doesn`t make it out to be what you claimed it to be, your lying and exaggerating don`t dodge.