Asgard vs LOTR Evil army (READ)

If the entire Asgardian army and all its members came to Middle Earth and found that everything good had been annihilated and that evil had won, who would win in this epic battle.

Evil army has all of their leaders from respective factions (Sauron, Saruman, Azog, Bolg, Nazgul and Witch King). Mordor, Isengard, Rhun, Haradrim, Easterlings, Corsairs, Moria.

Asgard has all of its heroes (Odin, Thor, Destroyer, Sif, Warriors Three and Loki)

Asgard receives a days prep time to outfit Minas Tirith with their own artillery and defences and can also use the Tesseract.

Sauron has the one ring and will not hesitate to use its full power.

The Tesseract cannot be used in battle.

Morals are off and both sides are bloodlusted.

Movie versions of both sides.

Who will win?

@The_Knight_Rhoden:

Thor, Odin and Loki with tessaract solo. Tesseract would wide out the armies of middle earth.

What the f**k is this.

This.

Thor solos maybe.

Odin solos

with tesseract Asgard stomp

Would it really be that bad of a stomp? Even against the one ring and all of the dark armies of Middle Earth?

Very well, if you do insist I edited the post so that Asgard can't use the Tesseract in battle but can only use it to outfit Minas Tirith.

So this is Movie Asgard?

Asgard wins.

Yes, with its full army and power. (NO IN BATTLE TESSERACT HOWEVER)

So if someone kill sif they are screwed cause the Witch king would just keep killing them seeing as he can not be killed by any male.

@the_knight_rhoden: I think some people might have been thinking it was comic Asgard

I stated it in the OP though, the second last line. Comic Asgard would be like saying Galactus vs Aunt May.

@the_knight_rhoden: yeah I saw, people don't always read the op fully

On a side note, how do I keep track of all the thread posts going on? They never show up in my notifications unless someone quotes me.

Movie Asgard is featless.

@the_knight_rhoden: I don't really know of a way other than just watching the thread

That is really annoying.

@mandarinestro: not really. Thor, Odin, and others have feats, and we got to see the military in action in Thor 2 @the_knight_rhoden: yeah a little bit

LOTR imo you can't kill/destroy Sauron without destroying the one ring in Mount Doom...no amount of magic can do it either. Otherwise Gandalf would have done it among others. But for safe measure is this humanoid Sauron just for a defeat or Sauron eye of Sauron/full power Hobbit leading into LOTR era?

Plus movie versions, going with LOTR here.

The battle takes place on Middle Earth Thor can go flying a throw the ring in the mount. Well movie version Asgardian cound´t being taken down by shot guns and they have 5 tons strenght and space ships.

You can destroy Sauron's physical form however, and just because movie Gandalf couldn't do it doesn't mean movie Thor or Odin can't. In Sauron's case it'll be easy to defeat him when he's wearing the ring already. Sauron draws his power and life force from the ring, so if Thor or Odin was to damage him enough he would be forced to use all of the ring's power thus rendering it obsolete now that all of Sauron resides in his physical form, then a killing blow from anyone would be sufficient. Plus this is humanoid Sauron meant for a defeat, not Eye of Sauron which poses no real threat to begin with since he has to act through his servants the Nazgul.

@black_arrow: Ok, but how would the Marvel team know this exactly? lol

@the_knight_rhoden said:

@fallingcliffs said: LOTR imo you can't kill/destroy Sauron without destroying the one ring in Mount Doom...no amount of magic can do it either. Otherwise Gandalf would have done it among others. But for safe measure is this humanoid Sauron just for a defeat or Sauron eye of Sauron/full power Hobbit leading into LOTR era?

Plus movie versions, going with LOTR here.

You can destroy Sauron's physical form however, and just because movie Gandalf couldn't do it doesn't mean movie Thor or Odin can't. In Sauron's case it'll be easy to defeat him when he's wearing the ring already. Sauron draws his power and life force from the ring, so if Thor or Odin was to damage him enough he would be forced to use all of the ring's power thus rendering it obsolete now that all of Sauron resides in his physical form, then a killing blow from anyone would be sufficient. Plus this is humanoid Sauron meant for a defeat, not Eye of Sauron which poses no real threat to begin with since he has to act through his servants the Nazgul.

Gandalf The White was very powerful, movie Thor isn't that impressive really. He can fly and all but pails compared to the comic version(then again so does Gandalf)

The physical form I agree, but at his most powerful without knowledge of how to destroy the ring won't be easy. If it's just normal Sauron, big difference then. Will probably lean Marvel team, if Eye of Sauron I'd go LOTR though. The nazgul can't be beat by men I forgot about that. Still, EOS sauron is a threat cause he can't be killed physically...and no male can kill the nazgul, witch king even if they are possessed by sauron.

This guy sums it up@savageslayer: I agree with this guy.

Asgard

Maybe they do interrogation.

Where would you put the ring in power compared to the Infinity Stones?

Thor went directly against the Aether

Four or five Einherjar are able to subdue one of the Kursed. 10 thousand of them would be no easy force to defeat

@ black_arrow: lol im not sure interrogation would work on sauron, saruman and the nazgul.

@fallingcliffs: I agree but I don't see anyone from the LoTR side being able to hurt Thor or Odin

@ trionace: hmm physically perhaps, I agree though since thor, odin wont be able to harm the nazgul either. Unless they bring the female Thor :-P

The movie versions of both Gandalf and Thor are utter weaklings.

Only the Witch King can't be killed by men, the other Nazgul have no such protection, plus your arguement faces a classic fallacy.

1)The Witch King never expected to encounter someone as powerful as Thor or Odin, or even normal Asgardians for that matter when he claimed no man could kill him.

2)Its quite possible that he was very delusional when he claimed those words as he never once met Aragorn in battle when he had Anduril, neither did he meet Legolas in battle.

3)Narsil cut Sauron himself, the Witch King is nothing compared to him, he would easily fall to it, and Mjolnir is both far more powerful and wielded by someone who is at least 100x stronger than a normal man which Aragorn was.

4)The Witch King showed no real feats in the movie aside from breaking Gandalf's staff and movie Gandalf is pathetic compared to movie Thor.

That's actually a fine point, Thor is the only person in the Marvel Universe to have directly fought and defeated an infinity stone merged being. Even after full power blasts from the Aether hit him he still got back up and comfortably continued the fight.

The asgardian army would indeed be no easy task to defeat, I also stated in the OP that asgard has a full day to outfit Minas Tirith using the Tesseract with anything they need. This includes the artillery we saw in Thor: TDW which wasn't properly utilized due to the dark elves launching a sneak attack. Asgard won't be sneak attacked this time, they know that the dark forces are coming.

@ The Knight_Rhoden:

It is true that both are weaker, but I would say of the two Gandalf at least has some impressive feats. Thor ehh I wasn't impressed by anything he did really to be honest.

What fallacy would that be exactly? Because I still don't see how Thor or his team would kill the nazgul honestly, the rest isn't fallacy it's fact if you read the books and watched the movies which even confirmed that no man can kill the witch king. There is also no proof of any man killing a Nazgul either unless you have some sort of proof? It doesn't matter how powerful Thor and Odin are in this case against the WK especially, unless they're female. I don't think the WK is delusional, why would he state a false element like "No man can kill me" I'm pretty sure as I said, the book elaborates more on this. Aragorn while a badass wouldn't do much to him either.

I would say the WK is actually more powerful than Narsil, notice once Narsil cut off a "mortal Sauron" mind you, he was corrupted immediately by it...some soldier, Aragorn however showed FAR stronger will...Narsil is weak compared to both Aragorn and WK.

It sounds like you're defending Mjolnir or already have a set winner, which as the OP yourself not supposed to do. The ghost army would solo Asgard if you want to go wtih Mjolnir being more powerful than Sauron's power...since you can't kill the undead spirits of middle earth by mere magic.

Actually, that was part of the extended edition which was said to be non-canon so I'm not even going to count that really. But again, same can be said for Thor he was garbage in the movies.

Asgard

Asgard.

Destroying a huge section of Jotunheim using his hammer was quite impressive. Plus his lightning attack in the Avengers against the chitauri which killed 2 leviathans and a whole bunch of ships was also impressive.

The shockwave from him hitting Malekith was enough to create a huge crater and destroy all the glass on the surrounding buildings.

Aragorn is half-elven being the descendant of Elros Tar-Minyatur, he isn't really a man.

If we go by that, Thor should also be able to kill him as he is asgardian, plus of godly heritage.

He specifically says that no MAN can kill him, meaning he believed that ordinary men did not possess the power to slay him as Merry's blade and arm got hurt upon stabbing him.

The Witch King has a physical form and a spirit form, Thor may not be able to kill the spirit form but he sure as hell can destroy the physical form which also happened when Arwen called upon her magic to cause the Bruinen ford to rush towards the Nazgul. Their physical forms were destroyed but their spirits escaped to find new bodies and mounts.

I'll once again say that the Witch King did not account for someone as powerful as Thor or Odin being in his universe.

My defending Mjolnir is not due to taking a stance but wanting to point out the fallacies in your arguement. If you provide me with logical arguements which counteract mine I'll gladly 'put the laptop down'.

The ghost army is NOT evil, they are deserters which were cursed by Isildur to remain damned to the mountains, they are not a part of the evil army as they fought on the side of good.

The Knight Rhoden: My mistake, I know they look evil though lol but cursed is the right word so allow me to correct myself. I worded it wrong...I however just to clarify didn't say or mean that they're apart of Sauron's army. I worded it wrong.

That was probably his best feat honestly I agree with Thor, however also keep in mind Gandalf(the white) also did pretty impressive feats for movie version I mean, sure he wasn't anywhere near as powerful as he should have been but he did do some nice things I know you mentioned the EE with the Witch king breaking his staff, but if I recall correctly Gandalf also broke Saruman's staff and was uneffected by a fireball summon from Saruman before Grima killed him. Aside from fighting and defeating a Balrog and also especially my favorite freeing Theoden from quite a distance away and hurting Saruman in the process via reverse spell, he also disabled Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas instantly when they drawed their weapons on him. To me there is one similarity between Gandalf and Thor, without their weapons(staff and hammer) there's little they can do. I'm sure you'd agree there.

Gandalf also has some shockwave feats of his own, in Hobbit 2 he pretty much destroyed(or nearly) where Sauron's spirit/necromancer was. He's also broken huge bolders with his staff, created blinding lights. He's a wizard though his powers work differently. Thor's powers come from Mojolnir and Odin. Gandalf's are of his own maia heritage/wizard race. Outside of him coming back which Eru did(God) of LOTR.

Aragorn is not half elvish, he's a man. I don't know where you got that from. This is false.

Being a godly heritage means little, Gods can be defeated. Thor's been punked by Hulk with his own hammer before.(a few times) But if you're going to say that, Gandalf is a maia who are immortal angels essentially race of LOTR mythos. Sauron is also the same but went the other direction.

The stab from Merry distracted him yes but also nearly fried off Merry's arm in the process lol. When she stabbed him though, nothing happened to her.

Yes, the physical form while can be destroyed or defeated doesn't mean the WK's spiritual form is gone, as far as I'm concerned as a big LOTR fan only two ways WK goes down, A. by a females hand or B. by someone destroying the ring killing Sauron and thus killing the Nazgul, Witch King etc that he's controlling.

I'll have to disagree, if you're talking movies versions I feel WK is more powerful then Thor and Odin in their movie universe. I'd also go with Eye of Sauron being more powerful then all of them, but since that version's not being used here...

That's the thing there aren't any fallacies, I'm posting a logical case as seen in the movies of these characters.

That is not true. Aragorn, after examining Eowyn in the Houses of Healing of Minas Tirith : "Here there is a grievous hurt and a heavy blow. The arm that was broken has been tended with due skill, and it will mend in time, if she has the strength to live. It is the shield-arm that is maimed; but the chief evil comes through the sword-arm. In that there now seems no life, although it is unbroken."

@ Leito it is true we're talking about the movie here. And it was obvious as shown on screen.

I'd have to disagree, technically speaking asgardians are strong, but they still struggle with their enemies quite a lot in the movies. He also said this was movie version so, it isnt necessary a stomp it'd say it'd be a close call with the gods playing a major part in it.

This seriously LOTR isn't that strong guys.

The ring would have no impact on Thor, there's a reason Thor his hammer picks Thor .

The only factor here is the death army . There's no known way to kill them .

Thor can fly but ...

They live on for EVER , so they win .

No one else has feats for living for ever .

@beingfatissupercool: .....That logic smh

LotR was going for the semi-believable side of fantasy. Marvel Asgard is a whole other story. lol!

Thor solos and literally can one-shot everyone and their pets. Smaug and the Balrog might take a couple hits if they were in this.

Loki takes a little longer, but can also kill everyone and their pets by out-smarting them.

Odin can fry everyone from the tower and it's over in like 2 minutes.

The Destroyer could solo everyone and maybe just take a little longer against Sauron.

Sif and Warriors 3 could probably beat all the ME leaders with good fights, but still favoring the Asgardian Side.

defending Minas Tirith might seem tricky against that many baddies, but they certainly don't need Tesseract powered weapons. the One Ring has never really shown it's full power. Sauron knocking piles of elves and men around like rag dolls was just him being himself. the Witch King and Saruman only have a couple of magic feats, which were cool, but not nearly enough to stand up to the likes of the Norse gods.

I'd even go as far as to say that the Asgardians only need to send down their ground troops with those awesome glowy weapons they have. and Thor could show up without Mjolnir halfway through the battle to make sure things were doing alright.

i love LotR, but movie Asgard is a few magnitudes above Middle Earth as far as... everything goes. lol

Ok, for the dude saying the ring would have no effect on Thor or anyone from Marvel? Incorrect. The ring corrupts and effects EVERYONE. There is NOBODY immune to the ring's power. Regardless of good or bad.

I hate topics like LOTR because people in majority on here aren't familiar with the mythos or how the ring of power works....SMH

Aragorn IS half elvish! Look it up! This is the reason he was able to resist the sway of the ring and master the palantir.

I respect your tenacity in trying to defend the Witch King but he isn't Thor level powerful. Thor was depicted as being a match for the mortal version of movie Sauron who we saw batter ranks of infantry away, Thor can do the same as we saw in his movies.

We've seen in the movie a Witch King who says no man can kill him but who hasn't really faced anyone truly powerful or shown any real feats to begin with (except breaking Gandalf's staff). Thor in his movies was shown to be able to solo squads of enemies all by himself to the point where he alone is quite the threat to armies.

The Witch King was never shown to be a threat to entire armies by himself, in fact him and 8 of his buddies got beat by Aragorn alone, and the WK alone was never shown to charge an army head on and prevail. Thor did that in Thor 1 and prevailed while killing a huge balrogesque creature in the process.

WK would slay Sif and the Warriors Three most likely, but would not stand the test of going head on against Thor.

Thor vs Sauron would be a much more interesting match.

Much did happen to her, as she had to go to the house of healing and be healed for her grievious wounds.

Eye of Sauron can do nothing! He has to act through his servants and acts as some kind of morale damper to the free peoples, this will not work against the Asgardian soldiers who are far more experienced, brave and have faced far worse odds before.

This is in no way a stomp of any kind, this will be a very close battle and the Asgardians will probably lose most of their army, but we must also account for the fact that the Asgardians have outfitted Minas Tirith with their own artillery and defences.

@ The Knight Rhoden: No he is NOT half elvish. His ancestors have mated with Elves here and there, there it's a gene thing that's been carried down through centuries at best he has a small % within him but not nearly enough to be considered "half" and I just looked it up nothing confirms that so he's again MAN. Has nothing to do with palantir, elves, man etc. Anyone can be corrupted by the ring. Nobody resists the ring or I should say is immune to it's power...not even elves as we saw with Galadrial (arguably the most powerful elf) BARELY resist the urge to take it but admitted she'd be corrupted. So that's nonsense, Gandalf also didn't want it for the same reason.

I'm not saying the WK is Thor level but Thor also is very weak compared to his comic book version, it's so obvious. Not to mention far slower combat speed, still I'll remain on my stance still I don't see Thor, Loki etc hurting the WK. If they had the female Thor, sure but since they're all males last time I checked I don't see WK going down easy. The mortal version of Sauron can be defeated(though not killed in essense) Sauron is more or less a demi god immortal only killed once the ring is destroyed in mount doom. So say for example, if Thor were to smash the ring it would do absolutely nothing...

The WK would can take an army and he even killed the king Theoden with relative ease. It also depends on the army too. Still, unless there's a girl present I don't see the WK going down, can he be stabbed, slowed down? Sure, but killed? Nope. Not by man and we also have no evidence of this.

I don't know what would happen if Thor went up against the WK, Gandalf couldn't do anything against him so not sure Thor would. Plus both are weaker in movie form remember.

Thor vs. mortal Sauron yes. Eye of Sauron would own Thor, as you can't kill him...only one way so random encounter, Thor isn't doing much there.

Her injuries were minor at best not fatal, that's not really much most of the soldiers survived had some bruises, minor injuries.

Actually, he can do something as he controls others and forms armies on top of being an immortal demi God, so if you're going to say that then Marvel team can do nothing to eye of sauron either!

@the_knight_rhoden: Whom are you addressing?

@The_Knight_Rhoden:

Close call, but Asgard still emerges Victorious.

She falls to her knees holding her right arm (the one holding the sword) after she stabs the Witch King through his helmet.

On another aspect, the One Ring had no effect whatsoever on Tom Bombadil (yes, I know, he does not appear in the movies...)

@mjolnirson: Sauron solos, the warriors three aren't even good, like what. Saurons one of the strongest lotr gods, saruman is also a god, Sauron could easily take Odin and Thor and saruman could take destroyer sif and Loki

@noah_ouellette: I agree that I think Thor and Loki team here are overrated a bit.

@Leito:Was about to say there's a lot of stuff in the books that were left out or weren't really touched upon, for the most part however everyone and anyone is capable of being corrupt by the ring. But on her stabbing WK, yes but she wasn't fatally injured per-se. The damage done to Merry was obviously worse.

@fallingcliffs: jeez someone understands