Arrow/Dark Archer (Arrow) vs 2 Baboon

• Round 1: Unarmed.
• Round 2: Oliver and Malcolm get swords.
• Oliver, Malcolm and the Baboons are bloodlusted (Though Oliver and Malcolm will still be thinking rationally)
• Random encounter.

I'm fully aware of how strong baboons can be, and I don't see any worthwhile street leveler losing to one.

The baboons maul them while they're unarmed. I think the archers take Round 2.

If tarzan can take on a heard of baboons (a heard, Group, Family?) i would think that arrow team could take one or two.

@obtrusive: Tarzan is much better physically than either of these two.

@stormdriven: He is also a normal Human man. Oliver and Malcolm have a better chance because they are two, not one.

@urban_ninja_x: What does Tarzan being a human man have to do with anything? The dude can wrestle gorillas and lions effortlessly. Both Oliver and Merlyn have to take on a physically stronger primate, with claws and teeth sharper than the average primate.

@stormdriven: You established Tarzan as being physically superior to Oliver and Malcolm. My retort was Tarzan is a normal Human man. That would imply he's not superhuman. We know what Oliver and Malcolm as capable of, but realistically, we don't know how well 2 baboons would compliment each other in a straight-on fight.

@urban_ninja_x: Tarzan isn't just some "normal" human man. If you could wrestle a gorilla or a lion, you'd be considered superhuman, wouldn't you? Tarzan can do those things. He's far above these two in physicals, so I pointed out that they aren't comparable. And it doesn't matter how the baboons fight, considering neither Malcolm nor Oliver are going to beat either one with just their fists.

@stormdriven: Honestly, no. Every Universe has their own version of the term superhuman. It depends on which Universe we would base his strength class on. In the real world, superhuman refers to anything beyond the norm. A Texas man, I believe, lifted a 2-ton truck off a small child under an extreme condition. It's safe to say that anyone pressed into that type of situation, could very well replicate that (of course, not everyone would). I can see the two banding their skills and abilities together to trap or otherwise immobilize the baboons.

@urban_ninja_x: So because a man in our world moved a two ton truck while on an adrenaline rush, that means he can wrestle a gorilla? No real life human could ever do that. And how are the archers going to do either of those things? The baboons are just going to jump on them and maul them.

@stormdriven: Nothing is impossible. If a man can lift a 2-ton truck, it's plausible to think a man could wrestle a gorilla. We just haven't recorded an instance happening. The Archers are smart enough to lure the baboons away and trap them inside a room. That's a start, especially without weapons. Swords would decimate the animals.

@urban_ninja_x: You know why a man out wrestling a gorilla hasn't been recorded? Because that is suicide. No one is going to test that. And anyone who does anything similar to what you said doesn't actually lift up the entire car, bearing the full weight. Not to mention, lifting part of a car doesn't translate to wrestling a freaking gorilla.

That's pretty much the only way they'll win. They aren't going to win a straight up fight against two pissed off baboons. And I agree, the archers will win with swords.

@stormdriven: My example was to present the concept that normal Humans can achieve great victories in what is commonly impossible to attain. Lifting a truck, whether in full or in part, with one's own bare hands is not normal by normal standards. Being able to wrestle a gorilla or a lion is not normal by normal standards. The video of the man lifting the truck was recorded, it's an old video from the early 2000's and I'm unable to find it. Let's ignore further semantics and focus on the battle, shall we? At least we agree that, when unarmed, they could trap the baboons somewhere, and armed, could do immeasurable damage.

@urban_ninja_x: You're wrong. Just because he is supposed to be a human does not change his feats, he has feats far above that of a normal human and far above that of the two humans in this thread. You are placing real life logic on a fictional character and it is not working.

You're basically are saying that everything Tarzan has shown does not matter because you say so.

"You established Tarzan as being physically superior to Oliver and Malcolm. My retort was Tarzan is a normal Human man. That would imply he's not superhuman."

He is, his feats show that. People try and use the regular human argument in a lot of cases and it never works. It is fiction, the same rules do not apply, the characters that are human in fiction often do things impossible in real life. Regular humans dodge bullets in fiction, they lift up cars with one hand, wrestler gorillas, survive being hit by darkseid. Real life rules do not apply to regular humans in fiction, tarzans feats are far greater than your argument.

A baboon weight about a third of them and they're superhuman by real world standard.

Either could solo.

@thenaughtytitan: Please don't be huffy, my friend. Don't be so quick to judge, and I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words in my mouth. It's just a debate. I am not wrong, I simply do not look at it the same way you do.

I had said that Tarzan was a "normal Human man," yes. However, we can't really place him in the "superhuman class" because we don't know what to base his stats on. What else can we base him on? Then again, I don't remember a single moment of the old Tarzan movies having expressed him as "superhuman," but a Man of strong will and strength to handle the jungle's fiercest beasts.

I am not comparing him to Oliver or Malcolm, nor am I trying to downplay him. When I spoke about the duo working alongside each other as one, that was to portray them as a team whose odds were better due to having two minds; this entails a means of simultaneously developing a strategy with new ideas. That's where the luring the baboons away and trapping them inside a room while unarmed came from.

I won't oblige your last paragraph.

I would not judge so quickly if you did not try and argue against fiction like it was real life, also take the italics off, it is unnecessary and annoying to read.

@urban_ninja_x said:

You compared them here, here you are shown arguing that because they are all "normal humans" they are the same strength wise when scans show otherwise.

@thenaughtytitan: Okay. I can see what you're doing. You're explicitly picking at my sentences and deliberately misconstruing them to assert your own beliefs. You're in no place to bark orders at me, I enjoy my Italics. Lastly, I'm ending out debate here. Good night!

What? I never picked out your sentences, I quoted entire posts. You lied, you got caught and now you are butthurt at me because you said dumb things. I did not "misconstrue" anything, I showed what you said and refuted it.

You started a debate with a guy who was not talking to you and you were completely wrong the entire time, bye.

@thenaughtytitan: What does Tarzan have to do with this? Yes he's probably stronger than Oliver and Malcolm, but are you saying that a character NEEDS to be at least as strong as Tarzan in order to fight a baboon? Why? It's not all about strength, Oliver and Malcolm aren't wrestlers, they prove on a regular basis that they can handle opponents much stronger than them through their skill and training. Look at Arrow's final fight with Solomon Grundy, after a quick motivational boost he was able to tank Grundy's attacks and basically manhandle him in H2H combat, outmaneuvering him and controlling the fight at every turn. This is especially impressive because Grundy was also physically faster than Oliver. Yes Oliver needed the chemicals to finish him, but that just goes to show Oliver's constant tactical awareness; Grundy was SO powerful, all the skill in the world wouldn't allow Oliver to defeat him with pure fists, so he used his martial arts to maneuver him towards the machine, then shot an arrow at it. Unless the baboons are too durable for Oliver to even injure, there's no reason why his fight with one wouldn't go exactly the same way as his fight with Grundy, which was complete domination. Malcolm is even more skilled, did you see the way he handled Brick? This guy who for three episodes was hyped up to be something so special, too superhuman for any of our heroes to handle, was downed by Malcolm in a couple moves.

@nickzambuto:

What does Tarzan have to do with this?

I responded to a guy that said "If tarzan can take on a heard of baboons (a heard, Group, Family?) i would think that arrow team could take one or two."

Urban Ninja then started that whole debate.

Unless the baboons are too durable for Oliver to even injure, there's no reason why his fight with one wouldn't go exactly the same way as his fight with Grundy, which was complete domination.

Implying the baboons would fight anything like Grundy? They're wild animals. They're going to jump on Oliver and Malcolm, biting, clawing, and tearing at their flesh. Now, Oliver and Malcolm obviously aren't stupid, so they aren't going to let that happen. But they aren't going to beat them in a fist fight. They'll lock them in a room or something, but that's it. If the baboon jumps on them, there isn't a damn thing they can do about it.

Malcolm is even more skilled, did you see the way he handled Brick? This guy who for three episodes was hyped up to be something so special, too superhuman for any of our heroes to handle, was downed by Malcolm in a couple moves.

Ted had just given Brick a beating with bronze knuckles. And Malcolm hit him a total of 7 times, and still couldn't KO him. But I fail to see what Brick has to do with anything, considering he doesn't fight like a baboon would either.

@stormdriven: I think you're seriously undermining the advangage of skill in this fight. I'm not even a fighter or tactician, but even I can think of several solutions to a baboon leaping at Oliver and Malcolm. They can grab first with their longer reach and turn it into a slam, or just punch the baboons out of the air. They can even just step out of the way. The way you frame that strategy makes it sound like the baboons are so fast Oliver and Malcolm won't even be able to react to them, despite the fact that they can react to bullets and are both beyond-casual arrow timers. They've both manhandled Mirakuru users in H2H combat, and Mirakuru users are so fast that they actually whip the air like a belt with every strike. Brick and Grundy are both way more dangerous foes than a baboon because despite not being martial artists, they're still skilled fighters, so if Malcolm and Oliver are barely even challenged by them, why would a baboon challenge them? In light of their showings against superhumans, I honestly don't see a baboon giving either Oliver OR Malcolm a hard time at all, they'd just dodge and counter everything. Let's also not forget the fact that Oliver is strong enough to snap necks with ease and break handcuffs, and Malcolm is possibly even stronger than him, he snapped Oliver's bow in half with a downward forearm chop straight through the metal enclosure, despite Oliver using the bow to block strikes from every other opponent he's faced and even block crossbow bolts among other things. So it's not even like they're THAT outclassed in raw strength.

EDIT: About Brick, it's true that Ted messed him up pretty bad beforehand, but Brick's whole thing was that he's super durable and isn't affected by pain. After Ted messed him up, Brick just came back, more surprised than really hurt, and nearly beat him to death. Then he left and gave no impression that the pain was really doing anything to him. I mean even if Brick was at 100%, do you honestly believe he would have been able to beat Malcolm?

Archers. Yes, baboons are probably stronger, but they have joints/eyes that can be hurt, plus the archers could work together and the baboons probably won't.

Why would a baboon stand any chance against a fighter as skilled as The Arrow?

I already debated this, you should read the thread. Your argument is that a human can't beat a creature it's physical superior, but did you forget about Brick and Flash and all the Mirakuru soldiers? Skill and experience trumps all.

@navajaz: Whats up with all these "Arrow vs baboon", "2 baboon", "3 baboon, a cow, 8 chicken and the farmer's wife" threads?

So instead of debating you're doing to just devalue Arrow's feats "plot"? I've got news for you, every single that that has ever happened in a fictional story is "plot", I don't see why the show having a narrative means the feats aren't acceptable.

Arrow used his equipment against the Flash yes, but a lot of that fight was still close quarters, Oliver successfully outmaneuvered Barry and forced him into taking a punch. Since Flash is 1,000x more dangerous than a baboon, that counts.

Oliver manhandled Grundy in CQC at every turn, he was only overwhelmed in their first encounter because his fists just couldn't deal any damage, and EVENTUALLY Grundy got one hit in which was enough. In their second encounter, all Oliver needed was a pep talk and he tanked Grundy's attacks, then stomped him.

Archers.

@justthatkid: So you're one of those users who get debated into a corner, and instead of saying "hey you might be right after all", you just counter by saying everything the character ever did was PIS without actually knowing what PIS means. Maybe you shouldn't be on the battle forums.

1. I never said any of this, a debate was started by some guy saying feats do not matter because tarzan is technically human.
2. Did not read passed the first sentence
3. how about using paragraphs, nobody likes a blob of text
4. bye

@nickzambuto:

They can grab first with their longer reach and turn it into a slam, or just punch the baboons out of the air.

They're just going to catch a charging baboon? What will they do when the baboon grabs them back? Or writhes around angrily? They aren't going to hold a physically superior animal with just their hands. It isn't happening. And punching a baboon is just going to piss it off even more.

They can even just step out of the way. The way you frame that strategy makes it sound like the baboons are so fast Oliver and Malcolm won't even be able to react to them, despite the fact that they can react to bullets and are both beyond-casual arrow timers.

Actually, I have said twice that Oliver and Malcolm could avoid them. It's pointless to bring up the rest of that because that would mean Oliver wouldn't have been bull rushed by Grundy when he went to save Roy. You're the one making it out to Oliver and Malcolm somehow matching two baboons in a straight up fight, which is nonsense.

They've both manhandled Mirakuru users in H2H combat, and Mirakuru users are so fast that they actually whip the air like a belt with every strike

You have an odd definition of manhandled, considering neither has done so. I don't even know what the second have of that sentence is supposed to mean.

Brick and Grundy are both way more dangerous foes than a baboon because despite not being martial artists, they're still skilled fighters, so if Malcolm and Oliver are barely even challenged by them, why would a baboon challenge them?

Brick and Grundy don't look to maul there opponents and tear them apart with claws, do they? And if Oliver is barely challenged by Grundy, why was Grundy tossing him into walls and kicking him into columns? Oliver's hits did nothing more than move Grundy. As for Brick, he'd already taken a beating from Ted, and when he faced Malcolm, he barely even put up a fight.

Let's also not forget the fact that Oliver is strong enough to snap necks with ease and break handcuffs, and Malcolm is possibly even stronger than him, he snapped Oliver's bow in half with a downward forearm chop straight through the metal enclosure, despite Oliver using the bow to block strikes from every other opponent he's faced and even block crossbow bolts among other things. So it's not even like they're THAT outclassed in raw strength.

Any average person can snap another's neck, it's not some feat that's special or impressive. When did Oliver break handcuffs? I don't remember him doing that. And that metal enclosure is just a thin strip of metal covering the wooden handle, so he didn't have a lot of metal to go through. And they're really not all that close in strength, unless you want to tell me that Oliver can wrestle leopards and crocodiles.

About Brick, it's true that Ted messed him up pretty bad beforehand, but Brick's whole thing was that he's super durable and isn't affected by pain. After Ted messed him up, Brick just came back, more surprised than really hurt, and nearly beat him to death. Then he left and gave no impression that the pain was really doing anything to him. I mean even if Brick was at 100%, do you honestly believe he would have been able to beat Malcolm?

No, I don't think he would have beaten Malcolm, but that's not the point. You tried to make Malcolm's victory out to be something more than it was, leaving out context. The fight may have played out differently for all we know, but it's definitely a lot more than just "Malcolm beat him in a couple hits."

If you're not going to say anything don't waste my time trying to be smart, it doesn't work for dumbasses.

Lol, calling me a dumbass after you did not understand the conversation. Good job buddy, I know you're embarrassed right now but its going to be okay.