Apollo VS. Invincible

VS.

SCENARIO:

-bloodlusted, morals off

-takes place in space and on the moon

-no BFR

-fight is to the death

who takes it and why????

nobody? not a good battle?

I just read Appolos wiki because I am not extremly familiar with him, If it takes him 60 seconds to circle the globe invincible has a speed advantage. Invincible when he started working out was a 400 tonner how strong is apollo.

tough fight but ill give it to apollo due to energy projectiles , i would mention that invincible has to hold his breath and apollo doesn't, for a space fight but invincible fought a viltrimite armada for what could've been hours so like i said tough fight.

sweet! good comments thus far guys, keep 'em comin...

Apollo.

@CitizenBane: Who is Apollo comparable to power wise, if you don't mind me asking? I don't know enough about him, and I don't want to use wikis to try and gauge his levels.

@0n1zuka: He's strong enough to duke it out with Captain Atom in a physical confrontation, durable enough to take the force of ten Hiroshimas straight to the head and still stand, and his heat vision is powerful enough to have sterilized the surface of the moon. I always thought he'd be a good match for Supreme Power Hyperion.

I would have to go with Invincible he was a 400 tonner early on in the series not to mention his race get a power increase after each battle. Also Apollo is dependent on solar power with out a supply of it he will grow weaker. Invincible doesn't depend on an outside stimuli to fuel his abilities.

@CitizenBane: Thank you, I appreciate the info.

Do you think that Mark has any chance at all, or do you see his lack of versatility, or other factors, hurting him in this match-up?

@Ms. Omega said:

I would have to go with Invincible he was a 400 tonner early on in the series not to mention his race get a power increase after each battle. Also Apollo is dependent on solar power with out a supply of it he will grow weaker. Invincible doesn't depend on an outside stimuli to fuel his abilities.

Apollo was smashing through continent-sized spaceships in his early Authority showings without breaking a sweat. He's walked through an energy blast from Captain Atom like it was nothing. I don't see how Apollo's dependence on solar power makes a difference, Mark has no way of depriving him from it. Hell, Apollo could open up a door to take the fight to the surface of the sun. If the heat doesn't incinerate Mark, a supercharged Apollo will do the trick.

Good fight, though I think Apollo still edges out with better showings and such.
 
One day, Mark. One day...

@CitizenBane said:

@Ms. Omega said:

I would have to go with Invincible he was a 400 tonner early on in the series not to mention his race get a power increase after each battle. Also Apollo is dependent on solar power with out a supply of it he will grow weaker. Invincible doesn't depend on an outside stimuli to fuel his abilities.

Apollo was smashing through continent-sized spaceships in his early Authority showings without breaking a sweat. He's walked through an energy blast from Captain Atom like it was nothing. I don't see how Apollo's dependence on solar power makes a difference, Mark has no way of depriving him from it. Hell, Apollo could open up a door to take the fight to the surface of the sun. If the heat doesn't incinerate Mark, a supercharged Apollo will do the trick.

True thats just the Invincible fan in me speaking :)

@0n1zuka said:

@CitizenBane: Thank you, I appreciate the info.

Do you think that Mark has any chance at all, or do you see his lack of versatility, or other factors, hurting him in this match-up?

Mark's powerset is basically Superman-lite minus the heat vision and freeze breath, so yeah, he's not terribly versatile nor does he have powers that would give him the edge here. I wouldn't call him stronger, tougher or faster than Apollo, more so because a morals off Apollo can door them both to the sun and amp his strength by a huge margin.

@CitizenBane: My thoughts weren't too far off the mark, but I didn't want to come in here and post while being ignorant of where Apollo stood on an overall power level. Thanks again for helping to clear that up.

its been covered but

Apollo

Apollo should win.

Mark wins.

Flying through a continent size ship?

Gallery

Flying through all layers of a planet minus the inner core is way better.

Also lol at "Doors to the sun" argument. Anyone show me a scan where Apollo Doors anyone to the sun? Nope, he never has, and only Doors to the sun by himself, which is self BFR since he needs to run away to get more power. So Mark still wins in that scenario.

Oh CitzenBane/Saren. How you ever got away with terrible arguments like that back then I will never know.

Oh, tough one, but I think Invincible might have the edge, IIRC Invincible is stronger.

Apollo blows up the continent.

Also Saren's arguments are weak? I've seen it all now.

Flying Lightspeed through 9/10s of a denser than earth planet > blowing up a content wide space ship.

Deal with it.

@sirfizzwhizz: It's a bit weak to call out an user that can't defend himself any more. Besides no one on this thread pointed out that Mark flew through a planet, the only thing that they said is that he was 400 tonner, so unless Citizenbane read Invincible, he couldn't know that.

@sirfizzwhizz: Flying through the planet's core after the black laser had already blown a hole through it?... Ok...

Flying through the core of the planet, in which the combined force of their impact was enough to completely level Obliterate a entire continent and survive it's insides and even survive the actual explosion. Which is 1.5 if not 2x times stronger than earth.

@dygoboy: Flying through the core after it had been destabilised by the laser (one of them even admits they wouldn't survive if the core had been stable) and FTL flight taking them quite far from the blast radius, as seen when they emerge on the other side of the planet...

Not nearly as impressive as you're making it out to be, mate.

@burningmartian: epic fail at context.

The laser is the size of a human fist, and made no previous hole for a three human size bodies to fly through. Mark, Thaddeus, and Omni Man still full bodily at light speed plowed through all the layers of a denser than earth planet, with only the core being taken care of by said fist size laser.

Also they were caught up in the planet blast in high orbit, and Mark was still fighting Viltrumites after that.

Trumps anything Apollo done. But hey, haters going to hate.

@sirfizzwhizz: Hypocrisy never helped an argument, mate, your own scan dug the grave for that arguement. If you look past the horrendous paint job, you'll see the black impact crater is sufficiently large enough to allow passage to 3 humanoid size bodies.

Hater? Lol, I have no personal investment in this battle, even though it is a Wildstorm character. After all, I never said Apollo wins, did I? Just pointing out faulty feats where I see them.

@sirfizzwhizz:

Anyone show me a scan where Apollo Doors anyone to the sun? Nope, he never has, and only Doors to the sun by himself, which is self BFR since he needs to run away to get more power. So Mark still wins in that scenario.

Since you asked so nicely:

Gallery

To be clear: with the benefit of three years of Invincible comics since my last posts on this thread, I think Mark has some clear paths to victory because he probably has a lot more stamina than Apollo does and doesn't need to recharge. Your "the space laser only destroyed the core" argument is specious; the destruction of the core destabilized the whole planet and set it on a path to disintegration. But Apollo dragging Mark to the sun is an instant win simply because Mark would burn alive, and I can easily question any consistency in Mark's strength and fighting prowess given that Kirkman took him from "fights Viltrumites after blowing up a planet" to "beaten up and raped by Anissa". I don't even think that's a fair argument, I'm just saying it to annoy you.

Oh CitzenBane/Saren. How you ever got away with terrible arguments like that back then I will never know.

I always thought it was my vibrant sexuality.

By the Chew-Force, Saren has returned!

@saren: ha, I knew if anyone can get you to come back it be my comment :)

While true the destabilizing the core, the issue is the time frame. Mark and crew were only dozens of feet behind the laser, hardly time for the laser to affect the whole planet, only compromising the core in that time frame, and by science that is questionable, leaving them still flying through the solids of said planet to the core fine.

As for the sun, it would wreck Mark as exposure to plasma heats cause smart atoms to break down. Stated in bio, though he can tank flash instants of heats that high with little damage.

Yes that comment on Annisa does annoy me. You still know what buttons to push. Touché

"By science"? If you destabilized a planet's core --- any planet --- the outer layers of the planet's structure would instantly collapse inwards to fill the void. Long story short, you would either not have a planet anymore, or you would have a much smaller rock calling itself a planet. There is no such thing as "only compromising the core" in that scenario because the rest of the planet will not be able to maintain its integrity without the core. It will all collapse, and it will do so instantaneously, because there is literally nothing else for it to do.

Seconded.

@saren: Nice to see you back here :)

Out of curiousity, why were you gone so long? School?

@captain_batman_ftw: One of several reasons, all of them boring.

@saren: speed is the factor your ignoring here. The world would be still at Lightspeed or near to it. Destabilize the core of a planet would not be instant or close to Speed of Light at all by the time the rest of the planet is affected from the chain reaction that takes some time to it to spread out from the core.

Cmon man...

Honestly, there isn't really a point to getting this specific about the scientific details and trying to plot timeframes and schedules of disintegration. It's giving a level of thought and consideration to comic book science fiction that is really not warranted because it is comic book science fiction. The writer's intent is fairly unambiguous --- Nolan and Allen went to great lengths to bring the Space Racer to the battle because they needed him to destabilize the planet's core. The destruction of the Viltrumite homeworld clearly would not have been possible without him. If the heavy lifting of destroying the core was something Mark and his allies could have done themselves, they would not have needed the Space Racer at all. Additionally, it is almost explicitly stated that they could not have done anything to the planet without the destabilization of the core --- Thaddeus says that if they hit the planet after the core restabilizes, they will die instantly. Not fail, not weaken to an insufficient degree ---- they would just go splat. That is rather contrary to the idea that they are strong enough to smash through all those layers without the contributing effect of the core destabilizing.

I am also not sure how you decided they were flying at the speed of light, but it's irrelevant.

@saren is back! Hail the king!

@saren:

Honestly, there isn't really a point to getting this specific about the scientific details and trying to plot timeframes and schedules of disintegration. It's giving a level of thought and consideration to comic book science fiction that is really not warranted because it is comic book science fiction.

So I cornered ya then? I mean, I get what your saying here, but at the same time, you cannot disprove my view.

The writer's intent is fairly unambiguous --- Nolan and Allen went to great lengths to bring the Space Racer to the battle because they needed him to destabilize the planet's core. The destruction of the Viltrumite homeworld clearly would not have been possible without him. If the heavy lifting of destroying the core was something Mark and his allies could have done themselves, they would not have needed the Space Racer at all.

Yes, HOWEVER you again forget key facts and context. Thaddeus also stated he needed Allen, and Tech Jacket with them to do the feat.

"All of you with me now!"

Guess what?

"Reach the planet all at the same time."

Allen and tech Jacket got caught up, and Thaddeus was proven wrong right there. He said he needed all of them, but he clearly did not. He also never stated they "would" die on impact. he stated they "could" which means he was unsure. In short, Thaddeus was being safe, and clear to me that Kirkmen who has no clue of the science involve was as well leaving it open ended. Also your logic here....

Additionally, it is almost explicitly stated that they could not have done anything to the planet without the destabilization of the core --- Thaddeus says that if they hit the planet after the core restabilizes, they will die instantly. Not fail, not weaken to an insufficient degree ---- they would just go splat. That is rather contrary to the idea that they are strong enough to smash through all those layers without the contributing effect of the core destabilizing.

The fact the core would re stabilize in a fraction of time, shoots down the last part of your counter. Meaning the science used in this comic already disproves your own view of the writers intention. Its clear the writer's understanding of BS science is that the core would not blow up the planet at all, unless the team crash through the already disrupted core, and they had only a fraction of lightspeed before the core re stabilize. Crashing through all layers of the planet minus the core would not blow up a planet. They had to bust out the destabilize core and core only.

Science wise that makes sense? Nope, but none of your own logic applies to the writers intent that the fist size laser...

... was needed only to destabilize the core, and the team had to bust through layers of said planet at matching speeds before it destabilize.

I am also not sure how you decided they were flying at the speed of light, but it's irrelevant.

I think since you mention it, it must be relevant for ya.

All Viltrumites are Faster than light.

Fact.

"faster, faster." and the fact Omni man had to drag Mark up to their speed shows thay are moving at top speeds. Also the stated laser is a laser that they kept pace with, and add to that again the picture shows one flash in a instant.

Hardly Mach 10 you know...

In all, the evidence is Kirkmens intent seems clear. Now while we are on the subject, why is Apollo's feat better? All he did was fly through couple feet of steel ship, through the hollow inside and out the other to compromise it. How is that a feat?

Gallery

Pretty weak sauce I mean.

Well damn.

Saren ftw.

Saren ftw

Saren vs SFW, lol

T4V

The eternal struggle of personalities and views for 5 years running now.

lol

Unless Apollo can move in comparable speeds of covering 10 lightyears worth of distance within the timeframe of just 2 weeks, plus the fact that a hollow ship as wide as a continent is nowhere comparable to plowing through a whole planet which is x1,25 the size of earth (even if the core was destabilized moments prior)... I'd think Mark would take this handedly.