Angel vs Predator

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@MisterWhisper: @Joygirl said:

Predator. Not impressed with Angel.

Angel for a number of reasons:

1) In all of the Predator movies the Predators have an advantage because their prey doesn't know what they are up against. Angel does know here. He knows everything that Dutch knew.

2) Angel, being dead, doesn't give off any heat. He doesn't have a beating heart. He doesn't breath. The Predator won't be able to detect him using any of it's usual vision modes.

3) All Yautja are trained in hand to hand combat, but they spend more time training to use their weapons and to hunt. Angel has more combat experience then the average Predator; he has fought in eleven wars (IIRC) and has trained in numerous fighting styles from all over the world. He is extremely proficient with a sword and can easily take a hit from anything but the plasma blasts, which he is more then capable of avoiding.

I think it is likely that the Predator would engage Angel in hand to hand. It's helmet won't do it any good, and he is obviously a worthy opponent looking for a fight. If a normal human is fast enough to take down a Predator with a sword, then someone who is significantly faster and more durable is more then capable of doing the same, and living to tell about it.

1) No, during the movies pretty all of the opposition was killed off rather quickly except the main protagonist who were viewed as a worthy challenge and were given a fighting chance due to the fact that the Predator wanting a equal fair which is why they disarmed themselves and tried to draw out the fight as long as possible instead of going for a quick kill. There was also a little WIS and CIS in the first movie such as mud masking Arnold's body heat and the Predator throwing him off the cliff into the water instead of fighting and killing him when he had the chance to.

2) The has a variety of visions such as Infrared, Ultraviolet, EMP, Sonar, and etc. Xenomorphs don't give off heat as well but are detectable to the Predator.

3) False, your average Predator is probably 400 - 500 years old and hunting is part of their daily routine and when they leave a planet which served as hunting grounds they spar and train until they reach their next hunting destination. In short the Predator hunts and trains almost 24/7 until they ascend to ranks of an Elder were they are no longer required to hunt since they have gained so much honor and political power in their lifespan. The Predator weapons are strong enough to tear through a tank with reinforced armor plating (2 inches of steel) with wet tissue paper and cut through the exoskeletons of xenomorphs (Drones, Warriors, Praetorians, and Queens) and the body armor of colonial marines which contains several layers of titanium, kevlar, carbon fiber, and etc.

4) Based off what I seen for Angel the Predator should take the majority since he is physically superior along with having access to a variety of highly advanced gear to dispose of Angel.

1) CIS/WIS, but Royce did the same thing that Dutch did. And don't tell me that it was non-canon, because the OP states that all of the movies can be used here. Yes, Royce also used fire to mess with it's vision, but the point is that it gave him several seconds during which he scored numerous hits. Following the logic that you just used there is a very good chance that the Predator would attempt to draw out a confrontation with Angel.

2) They aren't hunting Xenomorphs here. This thing doesn't know anything about Angel. It doesn't know that he is a walking corpse. The usual vision mode it uses is infrared. It doesn't know that Angel is coming after it, so why would it think to use anything other then what it usually does when hunting humans?

3) The average Predator. According to Mister Whisper, a Predator is considered an adult when it reaches eighty years. The thread-maker stated that the Predator is blooded, so it does have experience. You telling me that the average Predator is 400- 500 years old doesn't mesh with what he was saying, so one of you is out of the ballpark. Maybe an Elder Predator is 400 to 500 years old, but we aren't using an Elder here. I didn't say the Predator weapons can't cut Angel. That was never a question. But Angel is a Hell of a lot smarter then any Xenomorph and a Hell of a lot more experienced then any colonial marine. And you still haven't addressed the issue of his speed and reflexes.

4) If the Predator is physically superior then it isn't by much, and I've seen nothing to make me think they are faster then Angel is. And when their stats are that closely matched speed will be key.

1) Mud cannot and will never be able to cover a warm-blooded mammals body heat it isn't possible, I believe that Mythbuster did a case of this and a ruled out the possibility of mud blocking body heat, mud may cool your body temperature but it doesn't make you invisible. I never said it would be a stomp, but I do believe that a Blooded Predator could take a good majority in this fight due to being more experienced, better technology, and superior stats (I still haven't seen any scans in Angel's favor that would support the notion of him having equal stats). The Predators in the movies were Unblooded whereas the one we are using in this battle thread is a Blooded Warrior who would have had centuries of experience and combat training to hone his skills so using the movies as a reason to side for Angel is pretty ridiculous (no offense), like I said before those movies contained a certain degree of WIS and CIS for the sake of the plot along with a inexperienced hunter who had to adhere a very strict code of conduct during a hunt. As for the movie Predators Angel could probably solo all of those Predators with a degree of ease because they were anything except impressive, even their leader the Super Black Predator had trouble defeating a Unblooded Predator who had been tortured for a extended period of time.

2) I would wager that an xenomorph is much more formidable than a lot of Angel's opposition. The Predator isn't stupid enough to stick to one vision during a fight if he is incapable of seeing his foe, their are sound amplifiers in the Predator's helmet so any movement or sound would cause the Predator to switch vision modes until it has some clarity.

3) Your average Predator is a Blooded Hunter who is most likely between the ages of 300 - 500 years old, a Unblooded Hunter is considered a adolescent and isn't a skilled hunter nor a official member of a clan yet. An Elder has roughly close to a millenia of experience and honor attached to it's name and there is no need in continuing the hunt, most Elders either become mentors to the Unblooded Hunters (Broken Tusk) or become high ranking Officials in the Yautja society.

Please show me one of Angel's reflexes and speeds feats that are on par with running so fast that a shooter couldn't even see him and just retorted to firing wildly, side-stepping automatic gunfire at point blank range, dodging a barrage of missiles, running down a subway train, keeping pace with a accelerated sports car, and etc?

1) The point being irrelevant since in the movie it DID work and Angel actually doesn't give off any body heat. I thought I was being clear that this was my point. I have posted at several points saying that I agree that the Predator is stronger. But it is not faster then he is based on the feats you have provided. Again, I posted this earlier, but the Predator catching up with the subway shows that they can move at around 35 mph (the average speed of a subway). Angel actually did catch a speeding car on foot (one that had a several minute head start). There are also the scans that I posted above showing the speed bursts that a vampire is capable of. And there was an occasion where Angel killed a demon that had the strength and speed of one hundred men. Let's be conservative and say that it can move at 100 mph if that is true. Angel was fast enough to avoid and hit it.

2) The Predator has absolutely no idea that someone is even hunting him in this set up. He doesn't even know that he has a foe.

3) You were saying between 400 and 500 before. Why the change?

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job: Angel's best measurable strength feat from the show, IIRC, was when he threw a tank of liquid nitrogen at a demon in "Expecting". I had to estimate on how much the tank weighed; one gallon of liquid nitrogen weighs 8.345 pounds. The tank Angel threw, based on appearances, was 42 gallons. That means that with some effort Angel was able to throw a tank that weighed 353 pounds across a room at a rather large demon. It gives us a decent ball park to put him in. It would be fair to say that, based on that, Angel can lift a little over one ton under normal conditions.

Beheading a demon with a string...crushing steel pipes on a submarine..over powering demons who were ripping apart steal..and then breaking their backs bane style? Or what about Spike (whos younger and thus weaker than angel), completely crushing a reinforced steel door the size of a small bank vault? Crushing steel doors, and completely destroying steel doors with kicks?

Oh hey, things that Batman has done ;)

@TERMINATORXX said:

@nick_hero22: Predators might be durable, but they've been outsmarted by soldiers.... Arnold as a human and danny and Royce cut a Super Predators head off or whatever Predator that was that was servior to regular Predators and those humans arent even half as skilled as Angel.... I think im done with this thread...to much drama its causing....

Angel Stomps let it go guys... Regular humans have owned and outsmarted Predators, their weapons and durability might be debatable, but they dont even use their brains half the time and use em alot...

1) Unblooded Predators were outsmarted due to their arrogance and incompetence.

2) Agree, Predators are durable but they aren't invincible and can be killed if enough critical damage is done.

3) Super Predators are weak and Angel could solo the whole lot.

Angel doesn't stomp he has really no going for himself in this fight based off what I have seen.

@jwalser3 said:

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

Not a problem :)

Hmm, I don't think I have any really impressive scans of his swordsmanship. It's pretty normal for him to defeat numerous armed opponents with a sword.

@nick_hero22: Oh, both of you: there was an occasion where a starved Angel killed four vampires in the blink of an eye. Like, before any of them even knew what was happening.

@nick_hero22 said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@nick_hero22: Predators might be durable, but they've been outsmarted by soldiers.... Arnold as a human and danny and Royce cut a Super Predators head off or whatever Predator that was that was servior to regular Predators and those humans arent even half as skilled as Angel.... I think im done with this thread...to much drama its causing....

Angel Stomps let it go guys... Regular humans have owned and outsmarted Predators, their weapons and durability might be debatable, but they dont even use their brains half the time and use em alot...

1) Unblooded Predators were outsmarted due to their arrogance and incompetence.

2) Agree, Predators are durable but they aren't invincible and can be killed if enough critical damage is done.

3) Super Predators are weak and Angel could solo the whole lot.

Angel doesn't stomp he has really no going for himself in this fight based off what I have seen.

The reason I referred to it as a " Super Predator " is because I forgot the name of it, but terry told me on page 3.

It is called a berserker Predator and yes they're alot bigger, durable then regular predator and have superior weaponary than they do and in " Predators " the recent movie, Royce ended up killing it with, I think an axe, but he did have to hit it a few times to take its head off.....

Angel could also cover his self in mud and with prep he could easily get ahold of something Heavy enough to destroy the Predator... I dont see why not?

@TERMINATORXX said:

Angel could also cover his self in mud

He has no body heat...

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@MisterWhisper: @Joygirl said:

Predator. Not impressed with Angel.

Angel for a number of reasons:

1) In all of the Predator movies the Predators have an advantage because their prey doesn't know what they are up against. Angel does know here. He knows everything that Dutch knew.

2) Angel, being dead, doesn't give off any heat. He doesn't have a beating heart. He doesn't breath. The Predator won't be able to detect him using any of it's usual vision modes.

3) All Yautja are trained in hand to hand combat, but they spend more time training to use their weapons and to hunt. Angel has more combat experience then the average Predator; he has fought in eleven wars (IIRC) and has trained in numerous fighting styles from all over the world. He is extremely proficient with a sword and can easily take a hit from anything but the plasma blasts, which he is more then capable of avoiding.

I think it is likely that the Predator would engage Angel in hand to hand. It's helmet won't do it any good, and he is obviously a worthy opponent looking for a fight. If a normal human is fast enough to take down a Predator with a sword, then someone who is significantly faster and more durable is more then capable of doing the same, and living to tell about it.

1) No, during the movies pretty all of the opposition was killed off rather quickly except the main protagonist who were viewed as a worthy challenge and were given a fighting chance due to the fact that the Predator wanting a equal fair which is why they disarmed themselves and tried to draw out the fight as long as possible instead of going for a quick kill. There was also a little WIS and CIS in the first movie such as mud masking Arnold's body heat and the Predator throwing him off the cliff into the water instead of fighting and killing him when he had the chance to.

2) The has a variety of visions such as Infrared, Ultraviolet, EMP, Sonar, and etc. Xenomorphs don't give off heat as well but are detectable to the Predator.

3) False, your average Predator is probably 400 - 500 years old and hunting is part of their daily routine and when they leave a planet which served as hunting grounds they spar and train until they reach their next hunting destination. In short the Predator hunts and trains almost 24/7 until they ascend to ranks of an Elder were they are no longer required to hunt since they have gained so much honor and political power in their lifespan. The Predator weapons are strong enough to tear through a tank with reinforced armor plating (2 inches of steel) with wet tissue paper and cut through the exoskeletons of xenomorphs (Drones, Warriors, Praetorians, and Queens) and the body armor of colonial marines which contains several layers of titanium, kevlar, carbon fiber, and etc.

4) Based off what I seen for Angel the Predator should take the majority since he is physically superior along with having access to a variety of highly advanced gear to dispose of Angel.

1) CIS/WIS, but Royce did the same thing that Dutch did. And don't tell me that it was non-canon, because the OP states that all of the movies can be used here. Yes, Royce also used fire to mess with it's vision, but the point is that it gave him several seconds during which he scored numerous hits. Following the logic that you just used there is a very good chance that the Predator would attempt to draw out a confrontation with Angel.

2) They aren't hunting Xenomorphs here. This thing doesn't know anything about Angel. It doesn't know that he is a walking corpse. The usual vision mode it uses is infrared. It doesn't know that Angel is coming after it, so why would it think to use anything other then what it usually does when hunting humans?

3) The average Predator. According to Mister Whisper, a Predator is considered an adult when it reaches eighty years. The thread-maker stated that the Predator is blooded, so it does have experience. You telling me that the average Predator is 400- 500 years old doesn't mesh with what he was saying, so one of you is out of the ballpark. Maybe an Elder Predator is 400 to 500 years old, but we aren't using an Elder here. I didn't say the Predator weapons can't cut Angel. That was never a question. But Angel is a Hell of a lot smarter then any Xenomorph and a Hell of a lot more experienced then any colonial marine. And you still haven't addressed the issue of his speed and reflexes.

4) If the Predator is physically superior then it isn't by much, and I've seen nothing to make me think they are faster then Angel is. And when their stats are that closely matched speed will be key.

1) Mud cannot and will never be able to cover a warm-blooded mammals body heat it isn't possible, I believe that Mythbuster did a case of this and a ruled out the possibility of mud blocking body heat, mud may cool your body temperature but it doesn't make you invisible. I never said it would be a stomp, but I do believe that a Blooded Predator could take a good majority in this fight due to being more experienced, better technology, and superior stats (I still haven't seen any scans in Angel's favor that would support the notion of him having equal stats). The Predators in the movies were Unblooded whereas the one we are using in this battle thread is a Blooded Warrior who would have had centuries of experience and combat training to hone his skills so using the movies as a reason to side for Angel is pretty ridiculous (no offense), like I said before those movies contained a certain degree of WIS and CIS for the sake of the plot along with a inexperienced hunter who had to adhere a very strict code of conduct during a hunt. As for the movie Predators Angel could probably solo all of those Predators with a degree of ease because they were anything except impressive, even their leader the Super Black Predator had trouble defeating a Unblooded Predator who had been tortured for a extended period of time.

2) I would wager that an xenomorph is much more formidable than a lot of Angel's opposition. The Predator isn't stupid enough to stick to one vision during a fight if he is incapable of seeing his foe, their are sound amplifiers in the Predator's helmet so any movement or sound would cause the Predator to switch vision modes until it has some clarity.

3) Your average Predator is a Blooded Hunter who is most likely between the ages of 300 - 500 years old, a Unblooded Hunter is considered a adolescent and isn't a skilled hunter nor a official member of a clan yet. An Elder has roughly close to a millenia of experience and honor attached to it's name and there is no need in continuing the hunt, most Elders either become mentors to the Unblooded Hunters (Broken Tusk) or become high ranking Officials in the Yautja society.

Please show me one of Angel's reflexes and speeds feats that are on par with running so fast that a shooter couldn't even see him and just retorted to firing wildly, side-stepping automatic gunfire at point blank range, dodging a barrage of missiles, running down a subway train, keeping pace with a accelerated sports car, and etc?

1) The point being irrelevant since in the movie it DID work and Angel actually doesn't give off any body heat. I thought I was being clear that this was my point. I have posted at several points saying that I agree that the Predator is stronger. But it is not faster then he is based on the feats you have provided. Again, I posted this earlier, but the Predator catching up with the subway shows that they can move at around 35 mph (the average speed of a subway). Angel actually did catch a speeding car on foot (one that had a several minute head start). There are also the scans that I posted above showing the speed bursts that a vampire is capable of. And there was an occasion where Angel killed a demon that had the strength and speed of one hundred men. Let's be conservative and say that it can move at 100 mph if that is true. Angel was fast enough to avoid and hit it.

2) The Predator has absolutely no idea that someone is even hunting him in this set up. He doesn't even know that he has a foe.

3) You were saying between 400 and 500 before. Why the change?

1) It is very relevant since it has to do with the writers and directors limited knowledge on the subject of thermal imaging, mud doesn't have body heat plain and simple (it's false). I believe that most subways travel between 45 - 60 mph, this subway train was stated to have made no stops during it's course so there could be a possibility of it traveling much faster than normal. Can you post the scan of him catching the vehicle and exactly how fast was it accelerated because in the scans I posted for the Predator the speed of the sports car is pretty evident in the art itself since when the car crashed the driver flew out several feet and was killed on impact. Statements done mean anything unless their is actually facts and evidences, Angel could have been over exaggerating this demons capabilities so some feats of it's strength and speed would be nice.

2) The sound amplifiers in his helmet will alert him to Angel's position which will prompt the Predator to adjust it's vision modes.

3) There is no change, a Blooded Hunter is around that age (300-500 to be more accurate).

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3 said:

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

Not a problem :)

Hmm, I don't think I have any really impressive scans of his swordsmanship. It's pretty normal for him to defeat numerous armed opponents with a sword.

@nick_hero22: Oh, both of you: there was an occasion where a starved Angel killed four vampires in the blink of an eye. Like, before any of them even knew what was happening.

What are the average reflexes of a Vampire in the Buffy Universe, because Predators have been able to blitz Xenomorphs who can evade and dodge bullets from Colonial Marine weaponry to a degree.

@nick_hero22: 1) No, you're missing the point. Angel doesn't have any body heat. I don't see how you aren't getting the point I am trying to make. It doesn't matter if it shouldn't have worked in the movie. Most subway trains have a max of 65 mph, but they almost never travel at that speed for both safety purposes and because of curves in the track. No I can't because it happened in the show. Angel wasn't the narrator during the encounter. The story was being told in the third person, from an omniscient POV.

2) Sound amplifiers. This is the first you are mentioning them. Also, just saying, vampires are kind of good at sneaking.

3) Do the Predators have the opportunity to become blooded when they become adults?

@nick_hero22: 

1) Mud cannot and will never be able to cover a warm-blooded mammals body heat it isn't possible, I believe that Mythbuster did a case of this and a ruled out the possibility of mud blocking body heat, mud may cool your body temperature but it doesn't make you invisible. I never said it would be a stomp, but I do believe that a Blooded Predator could take a good majority in this fight due to being more experienced, better technology, and superior stats (I still haven't seen any scans in Angel's favor that would support the notion of him having equal stats). The Predators in the movies were Unblooded whereas the one we are using in this battle thread is a Blooded Warrior who would have had centuries of experience and combat training to hone his skills so using the movies as a reason to side for Angel is pretty ridiculous (no offense), like I said before those movies contained a certain degree of WIS and CIS for the sake of the plot along with a inexperienced hunter who had to adhere a very strict code of conduct during a hunt. As for the movie Predators Angel could probably solo all of those Predators with a degree of ease because they were anything except impressive, even their leader the Super Black Predator had trouble defeating a Unblooded Predator who had been tortured for a extended period of time. 

 It happened in multiple movies..and in the comics. It doesn't matter if mythbusters and real world science says its crap..it happened. not that it matters...angel doesn't give off heat..hes a dead. Predators arent  more experienced...their tech was beaten by regular humans with proper training, and their stats are quite inferior not only to angel.but to the people angel have beaten. You're right...they dont have equal stats. Angel is superior in every way. durability, speed, agility, reflexes, strength, durability... The only difference between a regular predator and a blooded one is that they  actually had a kill. Just one. You completely made up this centuries worth of fighting stuff. Even elite predators  retire after a few decades. And out of their entire race..only 15% of them are Elite. A super black predator was nearly shanked to death..and another was beaten to death once his tech became useless (could detect body heat)...but.....k  Also...those guys werent unblooded.

2) I would wager that an xenomorph is much more formidable than a lot of Angel's opposition. The Predator isn't stupid enough to stick to one vision during a fight if he is incapable of seeing his foe, their are sound amplifiers in the Predator's helmet so any movement or sound would cause the Predator to switch vision modes until it has some clarity.  

3) Your average Predator is a Blooded Hunter who is most likely between the ages of 300 - 500 years old, a Unblooded Hunter is considered a adolescent and isn't a skilled hunter nor a official member of a clan yet. An Elder has roughly close to a millenia of experience and honor attached to it's name and there is no need in continuing the hunt, most Elders either become mentors to the Unblooded Hunters (Broken Tusk) or become high ranking Officials in the Yautja society. 

Please show me one of Angel's reflexes and speeds feats that are on par with running so fast that a shooter couldn't even see him and just retorted to firing wildly, side-stepping automatic gunfire at point blank range, dodging a barrage of missiles, running down a subway train, keeping pace with a accelerated sports car, and etc?    

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3 said:

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

Not a problem :)

Hmm, I don't think I have any really impressive scans of his swordsmanship. It's pretty normal for him to defeat numerous armed opponents with a sword.

@nick_hero22: Oh, both of you: there was an occasion where a starved Angel killed four vampires in the blink of an eye. Like, before any of them even knew what was happening.

What are the average reflexes of a Vampire in the Buffy Universe, because Predators have been able to blitz Xenomorphs who can evade and dodge bullets from Colonial Marine weaponry to a degree.

Oh, you mean that thing we have been arguing about for several pages now? I would like you to provide the average speed of a Xenomorph.

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job: Angel's best measurable strength feat from the show, IIRC, was when he threw a tank of liquid nitrogen at a demon in "Expecting". I had to estimate on how much the tank weighed; one gallon of liquid nitrogen weighs 8.345 pounds. The tank Angel threw, based on appearances, was 42 gallons. That means that with some effort Angel was able to throw a tank that weighed 353 pounds across a room at a rather large demon. It gives us a decent ball park to put him in. It would be fair to say that, based on that, Angel can lift a little over one ton under normal conditions.

Beheading a demon with a string...crushing steel pipes on a submarine..over powering demons who were ripping apart steal..and then breaking their backs bane style? Or what about Spike (whos younger and thus weaker than angel), completely crushing a reinforced steel door the size of a small bank vault? Crushing steel doors, and completely destroying steel doors with kicks? Right like i said..the predator isnt stronger than angel.

Those are unimpressive the Predator has been able to send a military vehicle that was carrying several people flying through the air with a punch, throw a decapitated head to hard that it knocked over a military vehicle with several people on-board, and pry open a reinforced steel door and bend it with utter ease.

Those are unimpressive

  Predator has been able to send a military vehicle that was carrying several people flying through the air with a punch,

"Something shimmering and heavy hit Nikolai's side of the truck with a force that cracked metal, and in that splitsecond before the truck overturned and they all went spilling out onto the ground. "

throw a decapitated head to hard that it knocked over a military vehicle with several people on-board, and pry open a reinforced steel door and bend it with utter ease.   

Gallery

Gallery

Wow I'm surprised Job hasn't put a revolver in his mouth and pulled the trigger since Silver handed him his ass on a silver platter [no pun intended] a while ago.

I think the Predator is stronger than Angel but, as far as I can tell, it doesnt make any difference....

@jwalser3 said:

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

Really? You got the nerve to call me a troll for bringing up TERMINATOR, but yet you brought up my pic about me wearing the leather jacket and the sunglasses which was also irrelevant to this thread? Get out of here.

@kemevilwineveering said:

Wow I'm surprised Job hasn't put a revolver in his mouth and pulled the trigger since Silver handed him his ass on a silver platter [no pun intended] a while ago.

Flagged

@Job: I'm specifically curious about the age at which they generally do that.

@TERMINATORXX said:

@nick_hero22: Predators might be durable, but they've been outsmarted by soldiers.... Arnold as a human and danny and Royce cut a Super Predators head off or whatever Predator that was that was servior to regular Predators and those humans arent even half as skilled as Angel.... I think im done with this thread...to much drama its causing....

Angel Stomps let it go guys... Regular humans have owned and outsmarted Predators, their weapons and durability might be debatable, but they dont even use their brains half the time and use em alot...

You can just leave then if you want it to stop!

Angel wins.

Angel wins...

@The Stegman said:

Angel wins.

This...

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job: Angel's best measurable strength feat from the show, IIRC, was when he threw a tank of liquid nitrogen at a demon in "Expecting". I had to estimate on how much the tank weighed; one gallon of liquid nitrogen weighs 8.345 pounds. The tank Angel threw, based on appearances, was 42 gallons. That means that with some effort Angel was able to throw a tank that weighed 353 pounds across a room at a rather large demon. It gives us a decent ball park to put him in. It would be fair to say that, based on that, Angel can lift a little over one ton under normal conditions.

Beheading a demon with a string...crushing steel pipes on a submarine..over powering demons who were ripping apart steal..and then breaking their backs bane style? Or what about Spike (whos younger and thus weaker than angel), completely crushing a reinforced steel door the size of a small bank vault? Crushing steel doors, and completely destroying steel doors with kicks?

Oh hey, things that Batman has done ;)

As for Batman - in his case it's PIS/CIS. He is human who is on par with elite athlete - he can bunch press 1000 pounds - if you believe those videos, there are people who can lift even more weight http://www.bench-pressing.com/bench-press-world-records

Now show me those people crushing steel in one hand, kicking down metal doors, or destroying reifnorfced steel doors only with their bare hands. No human can do that. So Angel feats are legit

Angel fuhsho. Glover beat a predator.

Oh Why bump a thread that brings back bad memories.

@Picard said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job: Angel's best measurable strength feat from the show, IIRC, was when he threw a tank of liquid nitrogen at a demon in "Expecting". I had to estimate on how much the tank weighed; one gallon of liquid nitrogen weighs 8.345 pounds. The tank Angel threw, based on appearances, was 42 gallons. That means that with some effort Angel was able to throw a tank that weighed 353 pounds across a room at a rather large demon. It gives us a decent ball park to put him in. It would be fair to say that, based on that, Angel can lift a little over one ton under normal conditions.

Beheading a demon with a string...crushing steel pipes on a submarine..over powering demons who were ripping apart steal..and then breaking their backs bane style? Or what about Spike (whos younger and thus weaker than angel), completely crushing a reinforced steel door the size of a small bank vault? Crushing steel doors, and completely destroying steel doors with kicks?

Oh hey, things that Batman has done ;)

As for Batman - in his case it's PIS/CIS. He is human who is on par with elite athlete - he can bunch press 1000 pounds - if you believe those videos, there are people who can lift even more weight http://www.bench-pressing.com/bench-press-world-records

Now show me those people crushing steel in one hand, kicking down metal doors, or destroying reifnorfced steel doors only with their bare hands. No human can do that. So Angel feats are legit

Actually those are all things that are completely within the usual scope of high end street level characters (Batman, Captain America, Cassie Cain, Daredevil, etc). I mean, Captain America and Batman both have done those things on numerous times.

@Ferro Vida said:

@Picard said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Job: Angel's best measurable strength feat from the show, IIRC, was when he threw a tank of liquid nitrogen at a demon in "Expecting". I had to estimate on how much the tank weighed; one gallon of liquid nitrogen weighs 8.345 pounds. The tank Angel threw, based on appearances, was 42 gallons. That means that with some effort Angel was able to throw a tank that weighed 353 pounds across a room at a rather large demon. It gives us a decent ball park to put him in. It would be fair to say that, based on that, Angel can lift a little over one ton under normal conditions.

Beheading a demon with a string...crushing steel pipes on a submarine..over powering demons who were ripping apart steal..and then breaking their backs bane style? Or what about Spike (whos younger and thus weaker than angel), completely crushing a reinforced steel door the size of a small bank vault? Crushing steel doors, and completely destroying steel doors with kicks?

Oh hey, things that Batman has done ;)

As for Batman - in his case it's PIS/CIS. He is human who is on par with elite athlete - he can bunch press 1000 pounds - if you believe those videos, there are people who can lift even more weight http://www.bench-pressing.com/bench-press-world-records

Now show me those people crushing steel in one hand, kicking down metal doors, or destroying reifnorfced steel doors only with their bare hands. No human can do that. So Angel feats are legit

Actually those are all things that are completely within the usual scope of high end street level characters (Batman, Captain America, Cassie Cain, Daredevil, etc). I mean, Captain America and Batman both have done those things on numerous times.

With is PIS/CIS because they are humans. Someone who can bunch press less than half of a ton won't be able to crush steel or kick down a steel door. It is physically impossible. Cassie Cain is especially ridiculous because she is just a small girl not muscle bound men

@Picard: They are humans in comic books. Batman has kicked through bullet proof glass and Cap has destroyed a cargo truck by throwing his shield through it (lengthwise, end to end). This is the kind of thing that they guys have always done. The only real explanation is that they are physically above their handbook entries, which is probably the case since handbook entries seem to be inaccurate a lot of the time.

@Picard: They are humans in comic books. Batman has kicked through bullet proof glass and Cap has destroyed a cargo truck by throwing his shield through it (lengthwise, end to end). This is the kind of thing that they guys have always done. The only real explanation is that they are physically above their handbook entries, which is probably the case since handbook entries seem to be inaccurate a lot of the time.

@Job said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Picard: They are humans in comic books. Batman has kicked through bullet proof glass and Cap has destroyed a cargo truck by throwing his shield through it (lengthwise, end to end). This is the kind of thing that they guys have always done. The only real explanation is that they are physically above their handbook entries, which is probably the case since handbook entries seem to be inaccurate a lot of the time.

oh please......Cassie has dodged sniper bullets while blind folded after the gun went off...and its been stated 50 times that she is only "baseline" human and has no super speed.

Actually, the exact opposite was stated; that she could do things that Bruce Lee and Usain Bolt did at the same time and that is what made her meta human. Once again, you are either lying or mistaken.

@Job said:

Captain america has hurt people hulk and thor struggled to put down.

Using his unbreakable shield that can absorb and store kinetic energy so that it can strike with super human force.

@Job said:

And i've seen batman trade blows with someone who punched superman into space. Its called PIS.

You are the first person to mention that. Those things that Spike and Angel have done that Batman has also done, though? They are consistent and in-character. If Batman can master 127 fighting styles and hold eleven degrees, then it doesn't require much of a stretch to think that MAYBE he's stronger then most humans should be. But then again, you only accept that sort of thinking when it works in your favour. Now choose your responses carefully, because if you give me any of that rude crap that you have given everyone else in this thread I will flag you. And eventually you will be banned again, Spike.

@CitizenBane said:

Predator. Not impressed with David Boreanaz.

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

@TERMINATORXX said:

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

There is no way that a physical encounter between these two be be easy for either party.

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

There is no way that a physical encounter between these two be be easy for either party.

Their have been scans supporting those claims of Angels durability and skills and Predators have been taken down by weaker, less skilled oponents in comics and medias.

@TERMINATORXX said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

There is no way that a physical encounter between these two be be easy for either party.

Their have been scans supporting those claims of Angels durability and skills and Predators have been taken down by weaker, less skilled oponents in comics and medias.

Angel has been cut by normal bladed weapons. His "durability" is that there are only two ways to kill him, and Predator's tend to favour decapitations as well so that isn't out of the realm of possibility. And in terms of skill (without knowing more specifics) the Predator could be at LEAST as skilled as Spike (based on how old blooded Predator's could be and how much time they spend training), on top of having superior strength (based on feats). If Angel wins it is from utilizing his speed, which I still believe is better.

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

There is no way that a physical encounter between these two be be easy for either party.

Their have been scans supporting those claims of Angels durability and skills and Predators have been taken down by weaker, less skilled oponents in comics and medias.

Angel has been cut by normal bladed weapons. His "durability" is that there are only two ways to kill him, and Predator's tend to favour decapitations as well so that isn't out of the realm of possibility. And in terms of skill (without knowing more specifics) the Predator could be at LEAST as skilled as Spike (based on how old blooded Predator's could be and how much time they spend training), on top of having superior strength (based on feats). If Angel wins it is from utilizing his speed, which I still believe is better.

Good point.

@TERMINATORXX: Thank you.

@Ferro Vida: No need to than me, if you're right your right.

Actually, the exact opposite was stated; that she could do things that Bruce Lee and Usain Bolt did at the same time and that is what made her meta human. Once again, you are either lying or mistaken. 

Gallery

Using his unbreakable shield that can absorb and store kinetic energy so that it can strike with super human force. 

You are the first person to mention that. Those things that Spike and Angel have done that Batman has also done, though? They are consistent and in-character. If Batman can master 127 fighting styles and hold eleven degrees, then it doesn't require much of a stretch to think that MAYBE he's stronger then most humans should be. But then again, you only accept that sort of thinking when it works in your favour. Now choose your responses carefully, because if you give me any of that rude crap that you have given everyone else in this thread I will flag you. And eventually you will be banned again, Spike.

 But then again, you only accept that sort of thinking when it works in your favour. Now choose your responses carefully, because if you give me any of that rude crap that you have given everyone else in this thread I will flag you. And eventually you will be banned again, Spike.

@TERMINATORXX: You were polite and reasonable. That's hard to come by, as Job is proving with every post.

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX: You were polite and reasonable. That's hard to come by, as Job is proving with every post.

His scans are debatable though along with everyone elses argument.

@TERMINATORXX said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX said:

@CitizenBane said:

@CitizenBane said:

Predator dies.... Angel is alot stronger and would snap the Predators head in half and kill it easily.

Fixed.

There is no way that a physical encounter between these two be be easy for either party.

Their have been scans supporting those claims of Angels durability and skills and Predators have been taken down by weaker, less skilled oponents in comics and medias.

Angel has been cut by normal bladed weapons. His "durability" is that there are only two ways to kill him, and Predator's tend to favour decapitations as well so that isn't out of the realm of possibility. And in terms of skill (without knowing more specifics) the Predator could be at LEAST as skilled as Spike (based on how old blooded Predator's could be and how much time they spend training), on top of having superior strength (based on feats). If Angel wins it is from utilizing his speed, which I still believe is better.

@Joygirl said:

Predator. Not impressed with Angel.

I wasn't impressed with Mike Harrigan (Predator 2)...he killed a Predator. Royce (Predators) wasn't exceptional either....killed a predator (a couple maybe...can't really remember). Dutch was pretty good...but nothing that spectacular...killed a predator.

Angel has killed all manners of Demons and such. There's no reason to believe he's suddenly outclassed here.

@Ferro Vida said:

@Picard: They are humans in comic books. Batman has kicked through bullet proof glass and Cap has destroyed a cargo truck by throwing his shield through it (lengthwise, end to end). This is the kind of thing that they guys have always done. The only real explanation is that they are physically above their handbook entries, which is probably the case since handbook entries seem to be inaccurate a lot of the time.

I don't talking about some handbook I'm talking about scans from comics showing that Batman can at best bench press 1000 pounds. Those are physical limitations created by authors, and then they disregard those limitations and say that Batman is capable of superhuman feats. They want to eat the cake and have it too. Also comic or not, you need some reasonable explanation of humans doing superhuman things - for exemple in novel I currently reading Wayne of Gotham, Bruce is wearing exoskeleton that increases his physical capabilities, in TDK movie he was using special device to bend rifle barrel. None of those devices were used in comics as far i know... And what you said about Batman trening - no, kung-fu trening don't give you superpowers...

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22: 1) No, you're missing the point. Angel doesn't have any body heat. I don't see how you aren't getting the point I am trying to make. It doesn't matter if it shouldn't have worked in the movie. Most subway trains have a max of 65 mph, but they almost never travel at that speed for both safety purposes and because of curves in the track. No I can't because it happened in the show. Angel wasn't the narrator during the encounter. The story was being told in the third person, from an omniscient POV.

2) Sound amplifiers. This is the first you are mentioning them. Also, just saying, vampires are kind of good at sneaking.

3) Do the Predators have the opportunity to become blooded when they become adults?

1) I'm not missing any points mud doesn't cover body heat, if you take the time to research thermal imaging you would know that mud making Arnold invisible had a degree of WIS. Are those modern subway train laws and regulation because those events in Predator: Concrete Jungle took place in New York during the 80's, I'm not very familiar with the regulations during that time. The scan makes it very clear that the train was making one route so that could have impacted it's speed to it's projected destination, the subway had been in travel far longer than the Predator getting on-board which is clearly evident since their was a confrontation brewing between the passengers on-board.

2) This is evident in the movies, you can see the Predator zooming in with it's helmet from long distances and recording conversations and listening to them.

3) A Predator because blooded after it kills it's first xenomorph and marks it's helmet with it's clan symbol which signifies that it has attained the rank of a Young Blood.

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3 said:

@HBKTimHBK:Because Terminatorxx is a troll.

@Job: And didn't a Predator rip threw a steel door, take out a helicopter mid air, and push over that military truck?

@Ferro Vida said:

@jwalser3: I posted a video a few pages back that had the scene of Angel reacting to and catching a crossbow bolt that was fired at his back from three feet away. That's one of his better speed feats. He was also able to catch up to a speeding muscle car that had had a several minute head start.

Gallery

Here are some other speed feats from the comic (the first one is of Spike, but Angel can do anything Spike can do).

Thank you for actually showing me stuff :). Not going to lie the first one didn't impress me that much. But the last one did. I will say he is fast. As for skill with a sword how is it?

Not a problem :)

Hmm, I don't think I have any really impressive scans of his swordsmanship. It's pretty normal for him to defeat numerous armed opponents with a sword.

@nick_hero22: Oh, both of you: there was an occasion where a starved Angel killed four vampires in the blink of an eye. Like, before any of them even knew what was happening.

What are the average reflexes of a Vampire in the Buffy Universe, because Predators have been able to blitz Xenomorphs who can evade and dodge bullets from Colonial Marine weaponry to a degree.

Oh, you mean that thing we have been arguing about for several pages now? I would like you to provide the average speed of a Xenomorph.

They are very fast and agile, like I said before they can bullet time to a certain degree. I more of a Predator expert but somewhat familiar with xenomorphs capabilities. I believe that I posted a quote of a xenomorph drone being able to kidnap a person and evade gunfire from Colonial Marines (Synthetics).

Would the outcome be any different if this were an Elite Predator? Because, honestly, I thought Elites and Blooded Predators were the same thing lol

@Picard said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@Picard: They are humans in comic books. Batman has kicked through bullet proof glass and Cap has destroyed a cargo truck by throwing his shield through it (lengthwise, end to end). This is the kind of thing that they guys have always done. The only real explanation is that they are physically above their handbook entries, which is probably the case since handbook entries seem to be inaccurate a lot of the time.

I don't talking about some handbook I'm talking about scans from comics showing that Batman can at best bench press 1000 pounds. Those are physical limitations created by authors, and then they disregard those limitations and say that Batman is capable of superhuman feats. They want to eat the cake and have it too. Also comic or not, you need some reasonable explanation of humans doing superhuman things - for exemple in novel I currently reading Wayne of Gotham, Bruce is wearing exoskeleton that increases his physical capabilities, in TDK movie he was using special device to bend rifle barrel. None of those devices were used in comics as far i know... And what you said about Batman trening - no, kung-fu trening don't give you superpowers...

But you have no problem accepting that Bruce Wayne can master 127 fighting styles and earn 11 degrees over the course of fifteen years? The comics are not supposed to be realistic. And for the record, he stated that he could leg press 1000 lbs, not bench press. At least, if we are talking about the same scan.

@Job: Don't worry, I'm not going to bother replying to your post other then to say that I have been arguing that Angel wins this fight. Like really, of all the people to direct your trolling energies towards, probably shouldn't be the ones who agree with you on the outcome.

@nick_hero22 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@nick_hero22: 1) No, you're missing the point. Angel doesn't have any body heat. I don't see how you aren't getting the point I am trying to make. It doesn't matter if it shouldn't have worked in the movie. Most subway trains have a max of 65 mph, but they almost never travel at that speed for both safety purposes and because of curves in the track. No I can't because it happened in the show. Angel wasn't the narrator during the encounter. The story was being told in the third person, from an omniscient POV.

2) Sound amplifiers. This is the first you are mentioning them. Also, just saying, vampires are kind of good at sneaking.

3) Do the Predators have the opportunity to become blooded when they become adults?

1) I'm not missing any points mud doesn't cover body heat, if you take the time to research thermal imaging you would know that mud making Arnold invisible had a degree of WIS. Are those modern subway train laws and regulation because those events in Predator: Concrete Jungle took place in New York during the 80's, I'm not very familiar with the regulations during that time. The scan makes it very clear that the train was making one route so that could have impacted it's speed to it's projected destination, the subway had been in travel far longer than the Predator getting on-board which is clearly evident since their was a confrontation brewing between the passengers on-board.

2) This is evident in the movies, you can see the Predator zooming in with it's helmet from long distances and recording conversations and listening to them.

3) A Predator because blooded after it kills it's first xenomorph and marks it's helmet with it's clan symbol which signifies that it has attained the rank of a Young Blood.

1) Yes missing the point, since Angel isn't using f@cking mud here. I feel like I'm talking to a wall. If you want to look up the average speed of a subway in New York in the 80s then please, go ahead. If not then there is no reason to think that a modern Subway is anything but faster then one.

2) Okay, so he has to activate this feature. Again, if he doesn't know he is being hunted then why on Earth would he do this?

3) How old are they when this typically happens?

@nick_hero22: Okay, so they can evade gunfire. That isn't anything out of the ordinary for street level characters.

@TERMINATORXX said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@TERMINATORXX: You were polite and reasonable. That's hard to come by, as Job is proving with every post.

His scans are debatable though along with everyone elses argument.

His scans are fine, his debating is not.

Per the OP Dutch will be updating Angel on the predators capabilities. Angel also has Wesley and Cordelia aiding him with prep for the fight. The Predator has no chance here. Wesley has access to too much magic, artifacts and enchancements which he is proficient in. They can also reach out to Spike, Gunn and the two slayers Faith and Buffy for help.

Wesley once gave Angel a type of dust that when he blew it into a demons face it froze him in his place. Angel has too much of an advantage here.

I still like angel over Preds in a fight without prep. wont be easy though but he takes him

I said that they reach adulthood at 80 or so not their average age. To them 80 is about our 18.