" Can I get some explanation as to why you all say Darkseid? "Simple. All-Star Superman was beaten by Kal Kent. Kal Kent is about PC Superman's level (or so I've heard). PC Darkseid smacked PC Superman around all the time. One time, even after he'd been hurt in a battle with Orion, Supergirl and Superman came and attacked PC Darkseid and he ended up just owning them both. Then in the Servents of Darkness saga, his MINIONS of Darkness took down Mordru and the Time Trapper. He was also able to teleport the planet of Daxam into a solar system with a yellow sun and made them all obey him. All-Star Superman doesn't stand a chance at all. Darkseid will slaughter him effortlessly.
" Can I get some explanation as to why you all say Darkseid? "Basically, even though he's based on Pre crisis Superman, ASS's feats don't add up to that. His greatest feat is actually something modern Superman has replicated, so he is actually in post crisis ball park.
First of all, hello, I have lurked on this board for a while.
Second: I think there is widespread misunderstanding of the nature of pre-COIE Darksied's power. He is not less powerful than people think, but he is not powerful in the way that people think.
Darkseid has never, under his own power, beaten a pre-COIE Kryptonian in a physical battle and would never have been stupid enough to make the attempt. You can watch the last episode of "Super Powers: Galactic Guardians," written by Jack Kirby, to see how such a battle might have gone down. Darkseid Omega Effects Superman, Superman shrugs, Darkseid runs away.
There is a myth on the internet that pre-Crisis Darkseid is more powerful than pre-Crisis Superman. While some myths have a basis in reality, this one does not. If you read the Great Darkness Saga (which is not, by any means, a good story) you see Darkseid wakes up after milennia hibernating, then drains the powers of:
A ton of high level magic artifacts
Only then was he able to manhandle Mon-El, and, as much of the power he stole was magical, against which Mon-El's invulnerability doesn't work, why wouldn't he be able to?
Only then is he able to fist fight Kara under a red sun, where her natural powers don't work and she only has the power granted her by an aged Highfather to let her fight with Darkseid. The fight is by no means over when the legion shows up, and breaks Darkseid's mind control over the Daxamites, whom he grabbed while under their own red sun.
Darkseid has never, ever, shown physical strength anywhere near what a pre-COIE Kryptonian can do. Neither had Orion.
The Omega Effect is dangerous as a teleportation weapon. Neither Kara nor Superman, pre-COIE, would even notice a punch from Darkseid. And Darkseid would never be stupid enough to throw that punch. The whole point of the character, and the New Gods in general, is that it's a group of people with technology so advanced they have thugs, like the Gravity Guards, and technology, like the Anti Life Equation, that is game over. The shot that hits the Anti Monitor is a great example - that is not the Omega Affect, that is not personal power, that is Apokolips Tech, a god's super-cosmic remote control put to work. That is cool, and matches up with most of Superman's greatest threats - Luthor, Brainiac - being science-based. I have no doubt pre-COIE Darkseid has a piece of tech that could make a Skyfather or even an abstract his slave or simply dead. He's smarter than Luthor and Darkseid and Doom put together and has godlike tech.
In a fistfight, morals off, pre-COIE Superman kills him and crushes his planet a trillion times a femtosecond.
All-Star Superman is not pre-COIE Superman. Pre-COIE Darkseid's strength is not in the quadrillion-tons range, i.e All Star Superman is probably stronger than he is, and, by the way, a quadrillion tons is nothing to what a pre-COIE Kryptonian can lift, but, if All Star Superman gets Death is Coming from just being in the sun, he is not walking away from the Omega Effect. But the real Superman, pre-COIE, beats the crap out of Darkseid and everyone on Apokolips, effortlessly, if PIS is off.
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