Aang and Toph vs Katara, Zuko, Azula

In this battle, Aang and Toph will take on Katara, Zuko, and Azula. Who will wn?

For this fight, Aang has airbending only. No Avatar State.

Azula is sane

Fight takes place in the Crystal Catacombs at perpetual twilight. Teams start 25 feet apart.

Victory by ko or death

Round 1: Morals on, in character (as if fighting any other enemy)

Round 2: Morals off, bloodlusted

Which team will win?

@killerwasp@kidphillip@aressword@wbr17@korraspirit@gxrevolution96@jr_avatarexpert@dextersinister@thunderbolt30@nighthunder@metaljimmor@spartankobe@jacthripper@deathhero61@primebonnick@gizmorino@saint_sophie@rijehu@myerlanski@koays@useyourname@stormdriven@justthatkid@hypnosis@pirateking@silverrings@johnfrank120@mitcheii@deranged_midget@highaccuser@abyssdarkfire@hatemalingsia@arv993@dreadpool10@batking200: @sirneko@loklegends

This is a tough one, I'd back Toph over any one of them, and Aang 50% of the time against Azula, beating the others. However, all three of them could potentially overwhelm team 1. I'll give Aang and Toph the win for now, but I could be very easily swayed.

Glad it's close

Bump

Team 1.

@dark-nihilus: both rounds? Any reasons?

Bump

With airbending only, Aang should be able to handle Zuko easily.

However, Katara or Azula individually should give him hell.

I don't see Toph beating either Katara or Azula individually at all.

I think that this in an even fight, due to Aang's beastly ability. Maybe a stalemate.

@raimundopedrosa: both rounds?

Bump

Sorry, just read the morals thing.

Round 1

Okay, so with morals on, it's pretty even, because we've seen Azula give Aang some serious hell. We know that Aang can beat Zuko with just airbending with morals on with complete ease, as we saw him floor Zuko's ass in the Sozin's Comet finale, when Aang had taken enough of Zuko's attcks and then just knocked him out with a single air blast like a boss... so, Aang wins against him... but the thing is that Azula gives him serious trouble alone when he uses just air... hell, she's given him trouble with air, poor water use, and poor earth use. So, Azula wins, I think with morals on against air only Aang, because she's far more ruthless and, unlike with Zuko, Aang has severely struggled against her with just air... even in the comics lol.

Now, Toph has a more ruthless personality than does Katara, but Katara has greater versatility, mobility, and agility... on top of that, Katara has Zuko on her team, which means that Katara need only stall Toph until Zuko burns her feet and then game over. Then she and Zuko join Azula in beating Aang.

Round 2

Aang without morals would be a serious monster, given how easily he's beaten Zuko and Toph.

Aang with morals off and airbending only honestly still could stalemate comet enhanced Zuko with swords and sane Azula together.

Katara with morals off could also be a serious monster, with how her water cuts through wood and even metal so easily... plus, she's kicked Azula's ass twice and done better against her than Toph has... plus, with that water around and how impressively Katara did against that damn serpent... Katara wins.

I think that the first fight is definitely Team 2, but the second fight could honestly go both ways.

@raimundopedrosa:

To be fair, Aang tended to rely on earthbending when fighting Azula, which Azula was able to counter pretty well. I'm not sure why he didn't use more airbending, but if he did he probably would have done better

Toph's also never really fought Azula. Azula ran from her with the Dai Li running interference, but that's about it

Round 1 is 50/50 and could go either way, leaning towards Team 1 but that doesn't mean they would win

Round 2: I say Team 1

@rijehu: any reasons?

Round 1: Aang and Katara have similiar mindsets. They are both reserved and generally caring people who won't attempt to seriously harm unless provoked. They would most likely try to disarm one another and although I am more impressed with Aang's Airbending power, katara's water bending (when sufficient amounts are available) is still a force to be reckoned with. They most likely stalemate due to not going all out. Azula and Toph are already similiar because neither minds striking first OR harming their opponents. Azula is naturally more ruthless, but Toph is just as strong willed and hot headed, while also remaing precise and tactical. I do think that it would be an interesting matchup, but because Azula has often underestimated the Aang Gang and the fact that we saw how easily and instantly Toph can encase her in a rock coffin, I say Toph would probably take her down IF Azula doesn't land lightning first and isn't too self confindent.

Round 2: With bloodlust, Aang is honestly capable of sheering flesh off of bone with his Air bending power. He soloed a smaller, but formidable volcano (Roku) with defensive bending and I can only image what bloodlusted offensive bending of that caliber would do. Katara can create strong water defenses and bloodlusted, I'm sure she would try to cut Aang apart with water blades but Aang's power will sooner or later blow away anything Katara manipulates. His agility (if even needed) would allow him to evade any attack he for whatever reason couldn't tank and he would probably suffocate Katara given the chance since he has made vacuums before. With Toph and Azula, as I said before, Azula is already ruthless so the bloodlust isn't much different with her, she will probably just spam more deadly attacks, at a much greater rate without considering collateral damage. Her lightning would be a problem for Toph if she gets it off, but Toph bloodlusted would level the area around Azula as soon as she detects her moving. The most impressive thing I have seen Azula do is break through Toph's masive earth wall with lightning, propel herself with fire, and counter a weak, although combined attacks from the Aang Gang with a fire sheild. Her speed and agility may be an attribute but Toph literally has the enitre field to her advantage. Toph can tunnel underground to evade lightning and she will still be aware of things above her. She can also shift the earth beneath Azula's feet on massive scales as we saw with the staircase to the earth palace. All it takes is for Azula to make contact with the ground and Toph can send earh rolls, waves, walls, or pillars her way that she can;t cope with. Because of Toph's precision, it is most likely she will trap Azula in an earth grip and crush her. With Aang controling the air and Toph controlling the ground, that is too much power and AOE for Team two to cope with. My opinion of course.

All fair points, but I think you forgot about Zuko being on team 2

@arcus:

I am sorry man. I really did forget about him. I'm posting between classes on campus so forgive me. Team 2 may take it in Round 1 then. Even with Zuko though, Round 2 goes to Team 1 due the massive amount of pwer, precision, tactics, and the massive area over which they can be applied.

@rijehu: how dare you not be completely focused on debating about made up characters instead of real life... :)

Thing is, he almost convinced us Zuko was a non-factor in this fight. Good signs of a good post from a logical debater.

@arcus: I know right haha

@symbolism: Thank you man!

@rijehu: Dude, no problem.

You, MetalJimmor and Arcus are best darn debaters for A:TLA and LoK I've seen so far. I have competition, yo.

@symbolism: Thanks!

Round 1: Team 2 wins.

Round 2: Team 1 wins.

Round 1 is a toughie, due to Aang's jobbing. But I could see Katara or Zuko being the first to fall. It's really a toss-up.

Round 2, Aang tears the flesh off their bones while Toph buries them. c:

Round 1, Zuko takes out Toph by burning her feet and Azula beats Aang since she tends to be more powerful when his morals are on (though morals off, he'd slaughter her), with Katara securing their victory.

Round 2, Katara bloodbends and Zuko and Azula help secure the victory.

@raimundopedrosa:

There's no full moon for bloodbending

Zuko will have a much harder time burning Toph when he's not surprising her

Bump

wait what? zuko's fighting sane azula equally after he learned from the dragons. don't overrate toph and aang so much, remember how sokka, aang and toph can't even grab a hold of non-bending azula with just 2 dai lee earthbenders.

katara team wins this zuko and katara or any 2 combination of the team will already give aang and toph an extreme diff or can even already beat them, adding another one is really bad.

Azula evaded one attack from Toph and some weak attacks from Aang (like, ridiculously weak/small scale), with the help of the Dai Li. Plus all she was doing was running, not fighting.

The way I see it, at the end of season 3:

Aang > Katara >= Toph > Azula (sane) > Zuko >= Azula (not sane)

Aang can take Katara, but Toph cannot take both Zuko and Azula.

So team 2 wins, high difficulty.

For both rounds?

Bloodlust does not change much, everyone will just fight with more ferocity (except for maybe Azula, who arguably never holds back).

I'd say bloodlust changes things a good bit for Aang, who holds back the most of any of them

Team 1

Yeah but that is balanced out by Azula, who is the only 1 who aims to kill at all times. Furthermore, airbending has been shown be somewhat ineffective when it comes to killing people (besides choking someone, like Zaheer showed).

What do you mean it's balanced out by Azula? Bloodlust means they'll all be willing to kill

Meaning Aang won't hesitate to use this kind of power. Even if it's just for a ko, that's all he needs

Didn't Aang cut a buzzard in half when he was in the desert?

@arcus: It means 2 people on both teams get a boost (Azula is not counted because she is the only one out to kill/bloodlusted at all times), so it balances out.

You can argue that Aang benefits the most from bloodlust, but he is still not dealing with Katara faster than Toph loses to two high-tier benders at the same time. And Aang cannot deal with 3 benders, even while bloodlusted, if he is limited to air. His biggest strength is his immense versatility as the avatar.

Also, Katara bloodlusted has access to blood bending and ice spikes, so she is the one with the most killing potential. People in Avatar tank rocks to the chest all the time, but ice spikes are shown to be deadly for people.

@sirdrprofessor:: I don't remember that?

What if it was Toph vs Katara and Aang vs Azula and Zuko?

Something like that

Not entirely clear what happened to the buzzard wasp

@arcus said:

What if it was Toph vs Katara and Aang vs Azula and Zuko?

Something like that

Not entirely clear what happened to the buzzard wasp

Duo deals with Aang and then piles Toph. Katara can arguably defeat Toph by herself. I think she can.

That Buzzard was just ko'ed it seems to me.

Team 2. I can see this fight playing out similarly to how the other one did at the end of book 2.

@cpt_nice said:

@arcus said:

What if it was Toph vs Katara and Aang vs Azula and Zuko?

Something like that

Not entirely clear what happened to the buzzard wasp

Duo deals with Aang and then piles Toph. Katara can arguably defeat Toph by herself. I think she can.

That Buzzard was just ko'ed it seems to me.

We don't really see what happens. Either way a solid showing of power.

Azula and Zuko's lack of defense would be a problem for them against a bloodlusted Aang.

For both rounds?

No blood bending cause no full moon

Bump