#1 Posted by howler412 (32 posts) - - Show Bio

I read it, didn't take it too seriously and while it didn't seem like a real Batman story, that's what elseworlds are for. So why does this series get hated on, I always see hate, but no reasons... other than it will probably go unfinished.

#2 Edited by deaditegonzo (3690 posts) - - Show Bio

Better than any other Batman story that comes to my mind. I honestly didnt know people hated. It also has one of my favourite Joker portrayals.

#3 Posted by howler412 (32 posts) - - Show Bio

I mean, I enjoyed the series a lot, I'm just wondering why it got so much hatred, I understand some people may not like the amount of sexual content in it, but that's not (IMIO) a reason to hate on it as much as some people seem to

#4 Posted by danhimself (22713 posts) - - Show Bio

probably has something to do with Batman admitting that he peed his pants

#5 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

I read it, didn't take it too seriously and while it didn't seem like a real Batman story, that's what elseworlds are for. So why does this series get hated on, I always see hate, but no reasons... other than it will probably go unfinished.

The only problem here is that THEY ARE NOT elseworlds,and I like how elseworlds have become an excuse for shit writing.

They sucked because of the villain sue Onomatopoeia,the writer was far more interested in showing us that Ono here is a better marksman than Deadshot,smarter than Batman and more devious than the Joker. The parts that dealt with Batman looked like terrible fan faction.

#6 Edited by Saren (25058 posts) - - Show Bio

I wonder what happened to those plans to finish Widening Gyre.

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#7 Posted by deaditegonzo (3690 posts) - - Show Bio

@howler412 said:

I read it, didn't take it too seriously and while it didn't seem like a real Batman story, that's what elseworlds are for. So why does this series get hated on, I always see hate, but no reasons... other than it will probably go unfinished.

The only problem here is that THEY ARE NOT elseworlds,and I like how elseworlds have become an excuse for shit writing.

They sucked because of the villain sue Onomatopoeia,the writer was far more interested in showing us that Ono here is a better marksman than Deadshot,smarter than Batman and more devious than the Joker. The parts that dealt with Batman looked like terrible fan faction.

Yep, the best thing about Batman is that he has always been better at everything than everyone.

/Sarcasm off Thats probably one of the reasons I liked this story, because Onomatopoeia actually seemed like a threat to Batman. When, in-continuity, none of Batman's villains should mean s*** to him. He fights supervillains alongside the Justice League, what the hell will Two Face do? And I like that the Joker was purely a sadistic lunatic, I hate how he is generally treated as the unstoppable evil force, he's just a crazy guy. I guess the difference between me and others is that only want to read a Batman story if he is fallible, if he and his supporting cast are humans.

#8 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

I wonder what happened to those plans to finish Widening Gyre.

Batman:Nosferatu is in the works.

#9 Posted by lolzstastic (214 posts) - - Show Bio
#10 Edited by BR_Havoc (1339 posts) - - Show Bio

I really liked both series if anything I think it's hated because its not finished and god forbid Kevin Smith dare add humor or light heartedness to Batman to balance out the dark.

#11 Posted by DecoyElite (4019 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis said:

@howler412 said:

I read it, didn't take it too seriously and while it didn't seem like a real Batman story, that's what elseworlds are for. So why does this series get hated on, I always see hate, but no reasons... other than it will probably go unfinished.

The only problem here is that THEY ARE NOT elseworlds,and I like how elseworlds have become an excuse for shit writing.

They sucked because of the villain sue Onomatopoeia,the writer was far more interested in showing us that Ono here is a better marksman than Deadshot,smarter than Batman and more devious than the Joker. The parts that dealt with Batman looked like terrible fan faction.

Yep, the best thing about Batman is that he has always been better at everything than everyone.

/Sarcasm off Thats probably one of the reasons I liked this story, because Onomatopoeia actually seemed like a threat to Batman. When, in-continuity, none of Batman's villains should mean s*** to him. He fights supervillains alongside the Justice League, what the hell will Two Face do? And I like that the Joker was purely a sadistic lunatic, I hate how he is generally treated as the unstoppable evil force, he's just a crazy guy. I guess the difference between me and others is that only want to read a Batman story if he is fallible, if he and his supporting cast are humans.

Ugh I hate that "He's not allowed to be in JLA unless he's super OP" logic. Batman can take on the threats he deals with in JLA because he's got his teammates backing him up. Read a good JLA story and you'll see that Batman doesn't outright take out threats unless they're on his level or he finds out some important weakness(which doesn't happen as often as most would think).

In his own comics his villains tend to be credible threats to him, it's just that writers have gotten into the habit making him fight multiple rogues at once. And even then it's usually show to be through strategic attacks based off his prior knowledge of his foes, which makes complete sense.

#12 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

@deaditegonzo: Ono was one of those terrible villains such as Hush,Lincoln March and Pre-52 Jason Todd who were clearly author avatars/villain sues.I can buy a villain being better than Batman/getting the upper hand on him,Prometheus is one example of such a villain,Bane is another. Ono has done nothing to prove he's on that level,it's just one writer wanking his pet character. You mention Joker and Two-face being normal crazy guys,okay agreed but what exactly are Luthor and Toyman then? why does Superman struggle against them? why does Wonder Woman struggle against Cheetah? why did GL struggle against losers like Hammond,Gold face,Tattoo man and Black Hand?

#13 Posted by Saren (25058 posts) - - Show Bio

@br_havoc said:

I really liked both series if anything I think it's hated because its not finished and god forbid Kevin Smith dare add humor or light heartedness to Batman.

There's a difference between lightheartedness and toilet humor.

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#14 Posted by deaditegonzo (3690 posts) - - Show Bio

@decoyelite: In recent history, since the New 52 in Geoff John's Justice League, sure he hasnt directly faced any of the JL's big time threats, but that was a hallmark of Batman pre-52.

And no, being able to use strategy to close the gap between a man and a godlike entity does not make sense. It is stupid even using comic book logic.

#15 Edited by Wolverine08 (45538 posts) - - Show Bio

Cacophony /Wid Gyre is one of the comics along with Ultimates 3 and Ultimatum by Jeph Loeb that are so bad, they make me laugh out loud. I would really like to know what Kevin Smith was thinking when he wrote that.

#16 Posted by DecoyElite (4019 posts) - - Show Bio

@decoyelite: In recent history, since the New 52 in Geoff John's Justice League, sure he hasnt directly faced any of the JL's big time threats, but that was a hallmark of Batman pre-52.

And no, being able to use strategy to close the gap between a man and a godlike entity does not make sense. It is stupid even using comic book logic.

Morrison's JLA, the one with the "Bat God" go read it over. Doesn't have that hallmark you speak of at all.

I was talking about him facing his own rogues none of which are god like entities. Although let's play a game, what god like entity has Batman beaten? Before you say "Darkseid" I'd like to point out that there was a massive amount of set up for that, making it a very specific scenario and not the "LOL BATMAN KILLED A GOD" situation that every paints it as.

#17 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

@decoyelite: In recent history, since the New 52 in Geoff John's Justice League, sure he hasnt directly faced any of the JL's big time threats, but that was a hallmark of Batman pre-52.

And no, being able to use strategy to close the gap between a man and a godlike entity does not make sense. It is stupid even using comic book logic.

And yet when Batman went up against Darkseid in Return of Bruce Wayne and came out on top it made far more sense than every single time Superman did the same.

#18 Edited by SmashBrawler (5978 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

I would really like to know what Kevin Smith was thinking when he wrote that.

He was high. I'm serious.

#19 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

I would really like to know what Kevin Smith was thinking when he wrote that.

He was high. I'm serious.

Haha,there goes any pretense of it being a good story.

#20 Posted by Wolverine08 (45538 posts) - - Show Bio

@smashbrawler: Wow......... dude was really smoking weed when he wrote it? I guess I can forgive him then. Just, wow.............

#21 Posted by Saren (25058 posts) - - Show Bio

Plus if you read either story, Smith's complete lack of any sense of subtlety tends to shine through. For instance, when writers portray Ivy as a seductress, she's sly, smooth and tantalizing with her sex appeal. When Smith portrays Ivy as a seductress, she's like "BATMAN COME F**K ME PLEASE".

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#22 Posted by entropy_aegis (15437 posts) - - Show Bio

Plus if you read either story, Smith's complete lack of any sense of subtlety tends to shine through. For instance, when writers portray Ivy as a seductress, she's sly, smooth and tantalizing with her sex appeal. When Smith portrays Ivy as a seductress, she's like "BATMAN COME F**K ME PLEASE".

Like I said terrible fan fiction.

#23 Edited by TDK_1997 (15060 posts) - - Show Bio

The stories get hated on because Kevin Smith made the story to look like the stupidest fan fiction ever and people think that it is an elseworld story while it wasn't but Kevin Smith just knows that much of Batman and his villains.

#24 Posted by longbowhunter (7691 posts) - - Show Bio

They do read like fan fiction I'll admit. Every character has Kevin Smith's voice and not their own. I didn't take 'em to seriously when I read 'em so I enjoyed it for the most part. I really liked the bit where Nightwing calls Batman, "Squidward".

#25 Posted by ComicStooge (13847 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, I agree with the whole bad fanfic thing...

#26 Posted by RustyRoy (13839 posts) - - Show Bio

Haven't read it yet but judging by this thread I never will.

#27 Edited by MuyJingo (2171 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't know a Batman story could be so bad. There are not any other Batman stories that compare to it in terms of awfulness.