So Arrow finally became Batman.(spoilers)

Ra's Al Ghul deemed Ollie a worthy adversary and asked him to become his successor. I've never minded how much this show draws from the Batman mythos, but this is just a carbon copy of the Ra's/Batman relationship. The thing is I wouldn't mind this if the show had led us to a point where it would seem reasonable that Ra's might ask this. What actually bothers me about this is that Ollie has done absolutely nothing to warrant such admiration from Ra's. So for me it's not a genuine plot point arising from the story, it's just a case of the writers saying "This is how it is in Batman, so let's just copy it". This is the point the show stopped borrowing/drawing inspiration from the Batman mythos and just straight up copied it without reasonable justification (He's been to face Ra's twice now and hasn't been impressive either time!). Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if Ra's now starts referring to Ollie as detective and asks him to marry his daughter.

What do you guys think?

@thebhramabull:

Or is Arrow introducing for some future Batman tv show ?

Honestly i don't watch Aroow or Arrow(whatever), 'cause i don't like that char and i almost don't know anything about him, expect that he use bow and arrows :P... I don't watch any episode. But just one question ! Are Batman villains also Green Arrow villains ?

Yeah, one of the more frustrating aspects of Arrow is how Oliver Queen is portrayed as essentially the "poor-man's Batman", not just in terms of the number of characters from the Batman mythos involved in the show, but also in how Stephen Amell depicts Oliver. The show isn't bad, but if you don't think Arrow is re-creating Batman through Green Arrow, you're delusional.

I was definitely bothered by Ra's deeming Oliver a worthy successor. I'm totally fine with them using Batman villains especially considering this is a universe without Batman, but now they're trying to turn Green Arrow into Batman.

Let the character have his own identity. I thought they were slowly trying to transform him into his comic book counterpart. Now I'm worried for the future of the show.

So where are the guys who keep claiming this is based on GA comics/Longbow Hunters? Arrow's real problem is that it has shitty writers,all they've done is take stuff from Batman's lore and copy Nolan's movies. There's not a single aspect of this show that remotely feels like it's about GA.

It's a Batman ripoff show,Guggenheim himself sees Green Arrow as a Batman ripoff, there's nothing to debate about any more.

Don't ever insult Batman again with a thread like this.

I am sure they will start making Inceptions in season 4 or 5.

Nananana ARROW!!!

I just ask myself, how the Arrownite will find a way to justify this.

Well that didn't took long...

I've been saying this since the beggining...Arrow is a bat-show, without Batman.

It sucks hard, but there's nothing that we can do, except stop watching it...

It's even worse than i thought.

This.

Every DC related TV series is nothing but a shame...i am amazed how they find enough audience not to get canceled

Guggenheim is just taking Green Arrow back to his roots as being a Batman ripoff.

Yeah and we should go live in mud houses,that's also going back to our roots,seriously what exactly is that supposed to even mean? thank you good sir for giving a brilliant apologia for plagiarism.

Arrow is about the Punisher with a bow.

I guess Batman should also start using guns,I mean it's all about going back to the roots aint it?

It's been a little Batmanish for a while now. Ollie is a better live action Batman than all live action Batman. So far.

I noticed this during Season 1, which is why I stopped watching--that and the wooden acting. As far as I'm concerned, this is the best Green Arrow adaptation we've gotten:

Okay, that wasn't meant to be taken seriously nor as an excuse for Guggenheim.

I will not try to argue against the fact that they at least SORT OF went the Batman route.

But I still enjoy the show so I don't see anything too wrong about it :/

I find that funny, because the comic Green Arrow and Punisher are pretty much polar opposites.

@xwraith: Yeah but in the TV show Ollie Queen has no sense of human and just murders bad guys.

@teerack: Even when I was watching the show, I could tell its version of Ollie was basically Oliver Queen in name only. And I fail to see how the show is at all like Mike Grell's run.

@xwraith: The TV show made me stop reading the comic because the writers from the show took over and started to turn it into the show. Oliver Queen was meant to be the heart of the justice league. He was the most compassionate and ethical member of the core DC super hero community.

@teerack: I dropped the comic after Lemire left, but I watched the first five episodes of the newest season (I stopped after that because I didn't like any of them). And I'm more excited for Lemire's new books than the new GA creative team.

Honestly, even stealing from Batman doesn't make this show any more interesting.

It's very wrong, it's like Lord Voldemort attacking Sherlock Holmes when he was baby and accidentally ends up giving Sherlock a part of his soul.

This is Batman's story EXCLUSIVELY, and I knew they would go this route the moment they introduced Ra's, Guggenheim should be sacked immediately,the writing for this season has been bad and now we know why,he's lazy and uncreative.

Still the show itself doesn't bother me as much as the fans who are perfectly willing to excuse this,some comments on other sites are astounding. Like 'Ra's al Ghul offered his place to Oliver before Batman in the comics,this is Olivers story" this person was actually attacking and insulting others for proving him wrong or "Ra's al Ghul is NOT a Batman villain"

facepalm.

Yeah only it's a GA show so Batman depictions will be not be the standards on which it is judged,how exactly is it faring as Green Arrow depiction?

Don't get me wrong, I see where you're coming from. But I mean, if the story if good enough, then this particular thing isn't that big of a deal to me IMHO.

It's pretty much been Batman with a bow for 3 seasons now.

I bet that was from Facebook, someone tried to convince me that this was a N52 story line and because of Arrow they made Ollie equal/better than Batman in terms of H2H.

Someone on the fan page got burned for saying they stole this from Batman too.

@deathstroke52 To be honest this story is not really working in Arrow, they had to came up with an extremely convoluted plot just to get Oliver to face Ra's then when Ra's fodderized and kicked him off a mountain we are suppose to believe he is a worthy candidate for Ra's replacement?

But that's the thing,this story itself IS the problem, not only has it been stolen,it's not even been executed properly. Ra's has no reason in the world to want Ollie as an heir and Ollie has no reason in the world to even be tempted by his offer, the only reason it even makes SOME sense is because characters on Arrow change their attitudes,motivations and personalities on a whim for the most nonsensical and retarded reasons,which itself has been a huge problem throughout this show's history but has been taken to intolerable levels this season,John Diggle is the only one who has escaped this curse and that's because they dont bother to use him properly. Ra's al Ghul and Batman have a particular relationship,just like Batman/Joker,Doom/Reed,Luthor/Supes, Moriarty/Sherlock etc. This is blatant theft.

@the_kidd said:

@entropy_aegis said:

Still the show itself doesn't bother me as much as the fans who are perfectly willing to excuse this,some comments on other sites are astounding. Like 'Ra's al Ghul offered his place to Oliver before Batman in the comics,this is Olivers story" this person was actually attacking and insulting others for proving him wrong or "Ra's al Ghul is NOT a Batman villain"

facepalm.

I bet that was from Facebook, someone tried to convince me that this was a N52 story line and because of Arrow they made Ollie equal/better than Batman in terms of H2H.

Someone on the fan page got burned for saying they stole this from Batman too.

@deathstroke52 To be honest this story is not really working in Arrow, they had to came up with an extremely convoluted plot just to get Oliver to face Ra's then when Ra's fodderized and kicked him off a mountain we are suppose to believe he is a worthy candidate for Ra's replacement?

Yeah,saw some similar comments on IGN,I would respond but I honestly have no desire to engage with someone that ignorant. Ra's has never even mentioned Queen.

Exactly Batman and Ra's are tailored for each other and their relationship has been constantly reinforced over the decades, for Batman proving himself to Ra's directly or actively is only part of the dynamic. Batman at his core is a power fantasy,he can sit in his couch and do nothing and still be worthier to Ra's,it's just who he is,Oliver is not that's why Ollie has always offered an interesting contrast to him,it even goes down to their families. Even Batman's parents are depicted as saintly figures while Ollie's have been subject to one controversy or other.

It's really sad.

I kinda enjoyed that show, but now i stopped watching it. And it's not even because they are trying to make a Batman show. "Arrow" is jist really poorly made. Sorry to say that.

As for now, it's the worst Superhero Tv show out there. Oh, no, sorry, Agents of Shield is even worst.

But the fact that they are not EVEN trying to pretend they want to make this Green Arrow but Batman is really humiliating.

Lol can we at least wait to see how this plays out before losing our heads?

I mean I get the "stole it from batman aspect"(a little bit anyway) but all this "sack Guggenheim" stuff is a little off the rail even for comic book fans given its a plot point that was literally just given to us at the end of an episode with nothing else added. For all you know next episode Oli gets thrown off another cliff while Ra's looks down shouting "Lol JK about League of Assasins". I mean I'm more bothered by the knee jerk reaction then the plotpoint and I'm someone who didn't even like when Ra's called Tim Drake "detective".

Since Batman is not in this universe then why is Ollie not right to be the heir? And what if in a Batman show, the writers "stole" a Green Arrow story. I bet nobody would be saying that the show is stealing ideas.

@deathstroke52: the thing is a batman show would never steal green arrows stuff, because batman has his own interesting characters and stories. He doesn't need to steal green arrows villains or stories, or copy his movies.

Not only has this season been sh*t, but they've officially jumped the Bat.

It hadn't bothered me until now as I don't considered the guys used so far full Bat villains. Even the LoS are okay, it's fine having Ra's as he is a global threat so having him didn't seem bad, but creating this relationship between the two which has always been between Batman and Ra's is... well, it's just bad.

They are officially relying on the Batman Mythos too much, it's undeniable.

Nyssa rape, Damian Queen and snapping the Arrow here we come.

Still more faithful and interesting than gotham

Wait what? Ollie is not right because it's not HIS story, Batman existence has no bearing,it's not right because it's a ripoff,it's not right because it doesn't belong to him, and to make it worse the execution has been terrible.

Batman writers aren't going to steal anything from GA please.

Next season he will be showing off his trophy room in his arrow cave. Where he parks his arrow car next a giant coin.

So its going to hit mainstream media at some point.

Green Arrow in Smallville was a proxy for Batman too, the main thing its that they let him be Green Arrow a lot of times, they knew how not to mix both characters and stay away of the Batman Mythos.

They understand to leave Batman mythos alone as much as they can, besides build the character as his own character, they didnt copy NOLAN BATMAN, Arrow isnt only a copy of Batman its a copy of Nolan Batman, a copy with an smaller budget, lesser actors, less imagination, less respect for the source material and a long etc...., the funny thing its that people who hates or dislike Nolan, loves Arrow almost as a rule.

Isnt Nolanizing Green Arrow, its taking everything they can from the film franchise, some one call Liam Neeson, since Nolan Batman has being Taken by a lesser network.

Besides his fan base that its the most annoying people in the world.

Oh boo hoo, its an enjoyable show.

It isn't even enjoyable anymore.

Exactly. Season 2 was terrific. Season 3 has been extremely poor.

I was going to give the show a try but after hearing alot of negative reactions I am not sure I will bother...

@teerack said:

You haven't watched passed the first season then. Oliver stopped killing after the events of the first season.

How has the execution been terrible?

@playswithsquirrels: I have. Just because he's stopped killing people that doesn't wipe away his death toll :P Oliver still has no sense of humor and is way too serious. The biggest issue with the show is he ISN'T Oliver Queen he's some bland android with his gear and money.