#1 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

The Kang story just ended and it was actually a much bigger ending then I was expecting.

Uncanny Avengers 22 Consequence

  • Half of Havok's body is horribly scarred.
  • Wasp and Havok are now unofficially married and have memories of being married and having a daughter together.
  • Sunfire lost his humanity and is now a celestial energy being.
  • Draken and Grim Reaper are still alive (Possibly Banshee as well).
  • Sentry is not only back from the dead, but also he believes he is the hire to Apocalypses.
  • Wonder Man is now trapped inside of Rogue as a voice in her head.

Pretty crazy stuff. Usually you don't get these kind of consequences outside of an event book. I'm actually pretty curious to see where the book goes from here.

#2 Posted by Primebonnick (3134 posts) - - Show Bio

man i hope sentry can meet up with the guardians of the galaxy or the annihilators so many possibilities for ds sentry.

#3 Posted by longbowhunter (7994 posts) - - Show Bio

Really curious what the fallout from this will entail. It was all pretty crazy. I felt the arc ran a little long but it was really good. Not looking forward to Red Skull coming back into play in the series though.

#4 Edited by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

The Kang story just ended and it was actually a much bigger ending then I was expecting.

Uncanny Avengers 22 Consequence

  • Half of Havok's body is horribly scarred.
  • Wasp and Havok are now unofficially married and have memories of being married and having a daughter together.
  • Sunfire lost his humanity and is now a celestial energy being.
  • Draken and Grim Reaper are still alive (Possibly Banshee as well).
  • Sentry is not only back from the dead he believes he is the Air to Apocalypses.
  • Wonder Man is now trapped inside of Rogue as a voice in her head.

Pretty crazy stuff. Usually you don't get these kind of consequences outside of an event book. I'm actually pretty curious to see where the book goes from here.

yeah. I mean, it managed to wrap up a huge (basically 17 issue) story line in an epic and satisfying way, AND gave us a lot of interesting developments to look forward to moving ahead.

It really was everything I would want from an event book, and without having to mess around with crossovers or tie-in issues; it really deserves to be the main Avengers book, if not Marvel's flagship book in general (which I think is what the main Avengers book should be, really).

I'm especially interested to see how this effects the team members itself.

#5 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler: I can't wait for when Hank finally meets Janet again and she's already super moved on from him because she has years of memories that never happened. Since Janet died and Hank was a Skrull the last time Hank saw her outside of when he rescued her from the microverse the last time he saw her was when they had a big fight and she stormed off which was so long ago it was even before Avengers Disassemble, and since Hank has comes back he hasn't really been able to commit to anyone other then sleeping with Tigra a few times.

@primebonnick: Yeah that's a good point. I didn't even really consider the fact that Sentry could be a cosmic character now.

@longbowhunter: Me either. The skull is a lame villain who is really over used. They should have just let the character lie for a while after Fear Itself.

#6 Posted by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: I can't wait for when Hank finally meets Janet again and she's already super moved on from him because she has years of memories that never happened. Since Janet died and Hank was a Skrull the last time Hank saw her outside of when he rescued her from the microverse the last time he saw her was when they had a big fight and she stormed off which was so long ago it was even before Avengers Disassemble, and since Hank has comes back he hasn't really been able to commit to anyone other then sleeping with Tigra a few times.

yeah, I was wondering about Hank and Jan because I wasn't really sure of their current relationship status. But also what all of this will mean for Havok and Jan, since we know that Havok has been getting Quicksilver to spy on Polaris in All-New X-Factor.

I've been pretty happy that UA as been self-contained and not part of any crossovers (the Avengers are a crossover, damnit), but if it were to crossover with another book, X-factor seems like it would be a pretty interesting one.

Also interested to see what her latest developments will mean for Rogue; will her having Wonder-man's personality help her gel with the team or further alienate her? will having his powers satiate her fans about not having Ms.Marvel's powers, or will it just tick off Wonder-man's fans and not make anyone happy? Good example of how this book uses character drama to address fan drama, too..

#7 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler said:

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: I can't wait for when Hank finally meets Janet again and she's already super moved on from him because she has years of memories that never happened. Since Janet died and Hank was a Skrull the last time Hank saw her outside of when he rescued her from the microverse the last time he saw her was when they had a big fight and she stormed off which was so long ago it was even before Avengers Disassemble, and since Hank has comes back he hasn't really been able to commit to anyone other then sleeping with Tigra a few times.

yeah, I was wondering about Hank and Jan because I wasn't really sure of their current relationship status. But also what all of this will mean for Havok and Jan, since we know that Havok has been getting Quicksilver to spy on Polaris in All-New X-Factor.

I've been pretty happy that UA as been self-contained and not part of any crossovers (the Avengers are a crossover, damnit), but if it were to crossover with another book, X-factor seems like it would be a pretty interesting one.

Also interested to see what her latest developments will mean for Rogue; will her having Wonder-man's personality help her gel with the team or further alienate her? will having his powers satiate her fans about not having Ms.Marvel's powers, or will it just tick off Wonder-man's fans and not make anyone happy? Good example of how this book uses character drama to address fan drama, too..

I hope they don't have any cross overs. I think the way they have been doing it works great where they show up in other books but they dont have them crossing over in their books like how the unity squad was in Cable and X-Force, Gambit, and All-New X-Men without it effecting UA.

I really wish they would post a new image that shows the Avengers command structure since it's evolved past the circle they showed in Avengers a year ago. In Avengers A.I. when Cap was busy he told his team to take orders from Havok so I think Havok might be right under Cap and Iron Man in terms of rank.

#8 Edited by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

I hope they don't have any cross overs. I think the way they have been doing it works great where they show up in other books but they dont have them crossing over in their books like how the unity squad was in Cable and X-Force, Gambit, and All-New X-Men without it effecting UA.

yeah, I totally agree actually.

I really wish they would post a new image that shows the Avengers command structure since it's evolved past the circle they showed in Avengers a year ago. In Avengers A.I. when Cap was busy he told his team to take orders from Havok so I think Havok might be right under Cap and Iron Man in terms of rank.

I'm a bit curious, but I haven't followed Hickman's book since before Infinity, so I really only care about UA and Mighty Avengers at the moment. That's two solid and distinct Avengers teams/books right there, so the rest seem a bit superfluous/redundant to me.

But I have heard that Stark and the other Illuminati members are now wanted by Cap' as fugitives, so I could see the balance of leadership not involving him at all going forward, since Havok's already leading one team, Falcon's slated to be leading the other, and Cap' himself will still around to help both of them.

#9 Posted by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler: There is so much story in New Avengers and Avengers. Secret Avenger and Avengers Undercover are also really self contained and drastically different from anything else marvel is doing so I couldn't say reading any Avengers title makes any other one redundant.

With what's happening with Nick Fury Sr. I think Cap will end up taking a role similar to him and just be playing the big picture game. I really hope with his future war room success they give him a promotion to Colonel Rogers.

#10 Posted by The_Titan_Lord (7201 posts) - - Show Bio

man i hope sentry can meet up with the guardians of the galaxy or the annihilators so many possibilities for ds sentry.

#11 Edited by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: There is so much story in New Avengers and Avengers. Secret Avenger and Avengers Undercover are also really self contained and drastically different from anything else marvel is doing so I couldn't say reading any Avengers title makes any other one redundant.

yeah, I wasn't really thinking of Secret Avengers or the Illuminati when I said that.. they seem different enough to be their own distinct thing. Like Avengers spin-offs with their own particular directions and themes..

I guess I just never saw the appeal of the so-called main book, Avengers or Avengers World, when there was already UA and all the others.

Most of the characters were in other books or other teams anyway, and seemed largely interchangeable. And the character interactions (best thing about the Avengers) seemed sparse and dull; it just seemed like a vehicle for big events with no real character of it's own.

"With what's happening with Nick Fury Sr. I think Cap will end up taking a role similar to him and just be playing the big picture game. I really hope with his future war room success they give him a promotion to Colonel Rogers"

I haven't been following Original Sin (outside of Mighty Avengers and UXM), but that was pretty much what I was picturing. Havok and Falcon each leading one of two main teams, with Cap' facilitating from behind the scenes..

#12 Posted by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler: Avengers World is one of the most social avengers books there is, and it's more a squeal/continuation to the last volume of secret avengers then the current volume of secret avengers is. Not to spoil things but Avengers world just got really exciting bringing the Next Avengers to the present time. Every issue is full of fun conversations between characters who can't get the spot light in Avengers like Cannon Ball and Shang Chi.

The main Avengers books told half the story for the last event and is very much the Space Avengers book so it's kind of important if you wanted to follow infinity, and know what's going on in cosmic marvel.

#13 Posted by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: Avengers World is one of the most social avengers books there is, and it's more a squeal/continuation to the last volume of secret avengers then the current volume of secret avengers is. Not to spoil things but Avengers world just got really exciting bringing the Next Avengers to the present time. Every issue is full of fun conversations between characters who can't get the spot light in Avengers like Cannon Ball and Shang Chi.

to be fair, i haven't read AW, so I'm not going to judge it. But this does make me wonder why bother having characters in the "main" Avengers book if you aren't doing anything with them?

The main Avengers books told half the story for the last event and is very much the Space Avengers book so it's kind of important if you wanted to follow infinity, and know what's going on in cosmic marvel.

I dropped Avengers just before Infinity precisely because I wasn't interested in reading another sprawling crossover event touted as relevant from a book that can't be bothered to make me care about the characters. Hickman had my attention for 14 issues only because I was intrigued by the possibilities presented by having such a large, all-star cast with so many of my favorite characters, but in 14 issues he couldn't make me care about any of them.

To my mind, that's the opposite of what an Avengers book should do, especially one being billed as the "main" book.

To be fair, the cosmic side of the MU has never been one that particularly interested me, but in an Avengers comic I'm generally up for anything. I just don't think it's a lot to expect that the characters who are on the Avengers at the time will be relevant to whatever that is. Hickman didn't do that, not for me anyway; for me his book was not the main Avengers book.

#14 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: Avengers World is one of the most social avengers books there is, and it's more a squeal/continuation to the last volume of secret avengers then the current volume of secret avengers is. Not to spoil things but Avengers world just got really exciting bringing the Next Avengers to the present time. Every issue is full of fun conversations between characters who can't get the spot light in Avengers like Cannon Ball and Shang Chi.

to be fair, i haven't read AW, so I'm not going to judge it. But this does make me wonder why bother having characters in the "main" Avengers book if you aren't doing anything with them?

The main Avengers books told half the story for the last event and is very much the Space Avengers book so it's kind of important if you wanted to follow infinity, and know what's going on in cosmic marvel.

I dropped Avengers just before Infinity precisely because I wasn't interested in reading another sprawling crossover event touted as relevant from a book that can't be bothered to make me care about the characters. Hickman had my attention for 14 issues only because I was intrigued by the possibilities presented by having such a large, all-star cast with so many of my favorite characters, but in 14 issues he couldn't make me care about any of them.

To my mind, that's the opposite of what an Avengers book should do, especially one being billed as the "main" book.

To be fair, the cosmic side of the MU has never been one that particularly interested me, but in an Avengers comic I'm generally up for anything. I just don't think it's a lot to expect that the characters who are on the Avengers at the time will be relevant to whatever that is. Hickman didn't do that, not for me anyway; for me his book was not the main Avengers book.

To be fair Avengers World is also based around the idea of the Avengers working with heroes from around the world like the Avengers of China, and the Black Knights New Enforcers, lots of characters who aren't in The Avengers book, but people have missed seeing. Plus like I said it is more a squeal to Secret Avengers and teases what's in store for Taskmaster in the future, and brings the Next Avengers to the NOW. I think that Hickmen has done a really good job developing new relationships in the main book with such a massive cast. Thor and Hyperion have grown into great friends. We've got to see the insane limits of Mainfold's powers. Shang has mentored various members and helped pass on some of his wisdom. Cap and Iron Man hate each other. Cannon Ball and Smasher have fallen in love and started to date. Spider-Man hasn't been around since Peter regained control of his body. Spider-Woman is a cosmic hero and has grown very close to Black Widow. Captain Marvel has distanced herself from everyone after losing her memories. Bruce Banner figured out the Illuminati has reformed. Bruce Banner has become Cap's go to smart guy. There is so much going on and he really manages to use all of the characters he's cast, but there is a limit to how much you can fit into one book, so I'm glad we get to see mostly characters without their own solo title in Avengers World.

How else would we have known that Sunspot has developed a fetish for older women, and is in love with Maria Hill??? The Avengers title also has a lot of time travel stuff in it and is teasing the return of Ultron and Unworthy Thor. Not to mention it introduces lots of new characters like Star Brand who is one of the coolest new characters marvel has made in a long time. It also brings about lots of new developments like the fact there is now an Evil Bruce Banner from an alternate earth on in our world(Who is also a Hulk).

IDK I think Infinity was done really well. New Avengers and Avengers are similar to how FF and Fantastic Four used to be where you don't need to read both to follow along but if you do read both it gives you more insight. The check list for Infinity was done really well because it didn't have a ton of cross overs. Even if you don't read the event you can follow along fine and understand "Okay Thanos is attacking earth" and "Okay robots are killing everyone and all the races need to unite Annihilation style"

The official checklist only had three titles in it, and to be honest Avengers and New Avengers are sister titles and I think would be a shame to read only one and not the other like I think it would be a shame to just read Fantastic Four without FF, but isn't needed. It's not like it was civil war or something where it's just all over the place.

#15 Posted by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

To be fair Avengers World is also based around the idea of the Avengers working with heroes from around the world like the Avengers of China, and the Black Knights New Enforcers, lots of characters who aren't in The Avengers book, but people have missed seeing. Plus like I said it is more a squeal to Secret Avengers and teases what's in store for Taskmaster in the future, and brings the Next Avengers to the NOW. I think that Hickmen has done a really good job developing new relationships in the main book with such a massive cast. Thor and Hyperion have grown into great friends. We've got to see the insane limits of Mainfold's powers. Shang has mentored various members and helped pass on some of his wisdom. Cap and Iron Man hate each other. Cannon Ball and Smasher have fallen in love and started to date. Spider-Man hasn't been around since Peter regained control of his body. Spider-Woman is a cosmic hero and has grown very close to Black Widow. Captain Marvel has distanced herself from everyone after losing her memories. Bruce Banner figured out the Illuminati has reformed. Bruce Banner has become Cap's go to smart guy. There is so much going on and he really manages to use all of the characters he's cast, but there is a limit to how much you can fit into one book, so I'm glad we get to see mostly characters without their own solo title in Avengers World.

that actually sounds pretty cool. is that all happening in Avengers World? That sounds cooler than what Avengers was doing..

The thing with Infinity, for me, was that when it was announced, I was already reading Avengers and New Avengers, but I was pretty on the fence about both. So the prospect of getting a third related book by a writer who had yet to impress me just seemed not worth it. I dropped Avengers and kept on with the Illuminati, which did get better, but still felt as though I was missing too much of the rest of the story.

And then there was Mighty Avengers, which in 12 issues has had 8 that were tie-ins to stories I wasn't reading, and still never felt like I was missing anything. And it had more cool character interactions in the first 3 issues than Avengers had in 14. Between the great character interactions in that book and Remender providing epic, event-style stories in a self contained regular series, it just made Hickman's whole approach seem bloated and superfluous.

At this point I've read 36 of Hickman's Avengers comics, that's 36 chances to make me care about his stories, and besides a few cool plots for Namor, Strange, and Black Panther, very little of it has seemed very interesting.

But if it's true that Avengers World is more centered on different characters and needn't be tied to Hickman's books to enjoy, then maybe I'll check it out. I was pretty interested in the cast, originally..

#16 Posted by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler: No most of what I talked about was what's happened in Avengers. What's happening in Avengers world is the focus on characters like the Black Knight and the Next Avengers. Heroes you don't get to see very often anymore while also putting the spot light on Avengers that don't have their own books(Shang, Manifold, Smasher, Cannonball, Sunspot, Falcon, etc.).

I was on the fence a lot to with New Avengers for a long time, but then right after Infinity shit just got crazy. It's at this point now where at the end of every new issue I'm blown away and need to take a few minutes to take it all in and think about how intense it all is.

I think they are worth reading this is how I would rank the current Avengers books in terms of quality.

  1. Secret Avengers
  2. Avengers Undercover
  3. New Avengers
  4. Avengers World
  5. Avengers
  6. Uncanny Avengers
  7. Mighty Avengers

#17 Posted by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

I was on the fence a lot to with New Avengers for a long time, but then right after Infinity shit just got crazy. It's at this point now where at the end of every new issue I'm blown away and need to take a few minutes to take it all in and think about how intense it all is.

it's true that New Avengers has gotten a lot more interesting in recent months in recent months, I'll give you that. And the character developments, dynamics, and interactions, while sparse, have been more satisfying than a lot of the issues leading up to them.. it's just such a slow build for how many issues actually engage me. But I can at least see why people like it.

I think they are worth reading this is how I would rank the current Avengers books in terms of quality.

  1. Secret Avengers
  2. Avengers Undercover
  3. New Avengers
  4. Avengers World
  5. Avengers
  6. Uncanny Avengers
  7. Mighty Avengers

wow, I don't think I could ever be bothered to keep up with that many Avengers books. Of the ones I've read, this is how I would rank them in terms of enjoyment:

  1. Uncanny Avengers (for story, character moments, plot twists, art, and overall epic-ness)
  2. Mighty Avengers (a close second for storytelling, character interactions, and fun; only not tied for first because of the art)
  3. New Avengers (I like this book for it's premise, and how it develops Namor, Strange, and Black Panther, but not a lot else)
  4. Avengers (nothing interesting happened for 14 issues)

I haven't read the other current books, so I really can't say about them. I have been pretty interested in Secret Avengers actually, but every time I check out a preview the art makes it seem not worth it. Maybe I'll get to it.

That said, for most of the time I've been reading Avengers comics, I was pumped if there was even one book that I was really engaged with, so that there's at even two completely distinct Avengers books I'm excited by is still pretty cool by me.

#18 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

@oldnightcrawler: What?! I think Secret Avengers has the best art out of all marvel and dc titles right now. o.O

I'll agree the whole first year of the avengers run was just boring as hell.

I said quality but I really just meant how much I enjoyed them.

You know since I've only ever talked to you about Avengers and X-Men I'm guessing team books are your favorite? You should really try secret avengers but you should also try out The Superior Foes of Spider-Man. It's arguably marvel's best team book.

#19 Posted by oldnightcrawler (5010 posts) - - Show Bio

@teerack said:

@oldnightcrawler: What?! I think Secret Avengers has the best art out of all marvel and dc titles right now. o.O

from what I've seen, I do like the storytelling and pacing of the art -love the color palate, I just find the surface style looks kinda rushed and kind of unfinished. maybe it's just a style thing, but every page I see looks like it could have been way more finished looking with not much more effort, and for some reason I just find it off-putting.

@teerack said:

You know since I've only ever talked to you about Avengers and X-Men I'm guessing team books are your favorite? You should really try secret avengers but you should also try out The Superior Foes of Spider-Man. It's arguably marvel's best team book.

I tend to read more team books in general, yeah. They're just more likely to have more of my favorite characters, but I read solos (and non-superhero comics) as well.

Superior Foes is a book I only read the first few issues of, but I liked it enough that I decided it would be worth it to make myself wait for the trades. Reading trades is just more enjoyable reading, and since I don't know the characters very well, it's easy to not get too curious about what I'm missing in the monthlies like I do with other characters.

#20 Posted by Psy_chrometer (160 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree. This book is kind of crazy. I never thought that Sunfire would become a celestial lame lame lame. Banshee is back but he became sort of evil again. Im very dissappointed in Havok and Wasp. He was meant to be for Polaris and not Wasp. I truly dont like her. Sentry should have stayed dead. And why no one mentioned about Proffessor x brain? This red guy need to go. I want Xavier to be back and help out the XM because this team seem to be lost ever since they lose a really good leader. There was no better leader then Xavier. Look at how lost they are. And some joining with the Avengers was a huge mistake. I only wish for Scarlet Witch to wake up and return to where she belong....with the mutants. Is her place and right now they need her.

#21 Posted by HAWK2916 (2157 posts) - - Show Bio

Uncanny Avengers is the best book out there right now in my opinion

#22 Edited by Teerack (7624 posts) - - Show Bio

I really don't like how Rogue's powers are back to being broken. I find it uncreative and distasteful when they give characters the same old problems they have already gotten past. Like when they had Magneto re-cripple Xavier back when he was able to walk again the first time.